A leper naga against a summoner maiden (Ras Nsi vs Weiss Schnee)

[Peppersalt43]

Maximillian von Weiss : 7
Cursed Warlord : 0
Incon : 0

8-A versions used (Second key Weiss used)
Speed equalized
Fight takes place in the Grand Canyon, 20 meters apart

Also a lot of what Ras can do can be seen in this series of conversations

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Following, will respond later

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Okay, so does anyone know how we treat spell slots in vs threads? Because technically Ras only has a few spell slots to work with

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I am not staying in this thread because I don't want to answer questions on VS threads.

Spell slots are a vague representation of stamina with shifting amounts across the years. In-universe, that's not an actual slot and high end wizards can just continue to cast spells for days on end with zero rest or break. Ras isn't quite that, granted, but I simply mean to show that spell slots aren't really an actual lore thing.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Ah okay so there really isnt an argument to be made that Ras can run out of spell slots in a vs thread then?

 

[Antoniofer]

It is possible to ran out of spells, but how many times can be casted depends of how were the spells prepared before hand.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

It is possible to ran out of spells, but how many times can be casted depends of how were the spells prepared before hand.

Aye, though I don't know if that sort of spellcasting was kept around after 3.5e. Vancian Spellcasting mechanics basically stated that casters prepared their spells beforehand and were basically only limited by how many they remembered. I don't bring it up much as I haven't seen that mentioned since some time ago, but were we to use this, it would be moreso based on Intelligence rather than Stamina.

EDIT: To clarify, Vancian spellcasting mechanics were very explicitly how things worked in 3e and prior, where you would need to prepare the same spell multiple times if you intended to use it multiple times. However, in current editions this design focus has shifted to an implicitly stamina-based spellcasting "meter" so to speak, as seen with Emirikol's scan above.

 

[Antoniofer]

I can't confirm how spellcasting worked after the Spellplague or the Sundering, I haven't read that far into the novels.

Btw, are Ras Nsi's spell kind of meh beyond evocation ones? Few have a considerable long casting time or have limited range, 40 meters at most compared to Weiss' hundreds of meters, and that is only Chill Touch. Most useful one is Polymorph I believe, and Weiss do not seems to have resistance to it (although I believe she can dodge or block).

 

[Ss3micah]

Not sure what to say right here
What's the Strat on Ras Nsi

 

[Peppersalt43]

Not sure what to say right here
What's the Strat on Ras Nsi

Summons ghouls and cast spells. Most of his mind control spells (Like Geas or Suggest) are single target so it should be fine for a summoner

 

[Ss3micah]

What about that Immortal 4

 

[Peppersalt43]

What about that Immortal 4

Also a lot of what Ras can do can be seen in this series of conversations

So according to @Mr._Bambu, it is unknown how applicable his Immortality is. And even if it is, Weiss can probably just freeze him in a block of ice or get her minions to restrain him

 

[Mr. Bambu]

So according to @Mr._Bambu, it is unknown how applicable his Immortality is. And even if it is, Weiss can probably just freeze him in a block of ice or get her minions to restrain him

Aye. TL;DR Ras Nsi is only mentioned in a module where it's known he was constantly coming back from the dead, but during the module it's been disabled by Acererak. So we have no idea how often it works, if there's catches, nada.

I should note ghouls have Paralysis based on touch. We actually have a really ******' well made ghoul page for D&D if you really want the full scoop on those guys.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

I should note ghouls have Paralysis based on touch. We actually have a really ******' well made ghoul page for D&D if you really want the full scoop on those guys.

Does it work through forcefields?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Does it work through forcefields?

Works through Mage Armor, so yeah, I suppose.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Works through Mage Armor, so yeah, I suppose.

Hmm...it is a con save though...is that taken as an automatic paralysis or is it something that can be resisted?

 

[Antoniofer]

Summons ghouls and cast spells.

And how often does he summons ghouls? Going by the Animate Dead spell, it require time and raw materials (corpses or bones), something that can't be find in the Grand Canyon.

Does it work through forcefields?

Contact is required, so is possible to defend against; Mage Armor helps in these cases, but is not guaranteed immunity. A saving through is possible, but that does not mean Weiss resists it if she has no resistance.

Although, don't think a ghoul stand a chance against Weiss or her summonings that seemely, it would be even easier to defeat if Weiss can perform AoE attacks.

 

[Ss3micah]

So what's Mr Zombie's Go-To Strat?
Cause Weiss can just start off with ranged dust attacks, AoE attacks or summons
Plus she clearly has the better field control and versatility advantage

 

[Peppersalt43]

So what's Mr Zombie's Go-To Strat?

Try to summon ghouls, get them all killed due to his opponent, and resort to spells

Plus whenever needed, he can just use one of his mind control spells to get Weiss to stand still (It gets dispelled when she gets hurt and can't be used to) or dispell her summons.

 

[Ss3micah]

Try to summon ghouls, get them all killed due to his opponent, and resort to spells

Plus whenever needed, he can just use one of his mind control spells to get Weiss to stand still (It gets dispelled when she gets hurt and can't be used to) or dispell her summons.

The way I see it

Zombie man tries to get his home boys out and fight
While that's happening, Weiss can easily just spawn a Glyph under him and propel him into the air and then bind him up with Restrain Glyphs

She can then barrage him with high aerial maneuvering high speed combos or blast him to bits with continuous dust release

 

[Peppersalt43]

bind him up with Restrain Glyphs

He can teleport

Also what about this

Plus whenever needed, he can just use one of his mind control spells to get Weiss to stand still (It gets dispelled when she gets hurt and can't be used to) or dispell her summons.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

He can teleport

Also what about this

His teleportation requires movement, it's done via Misty Step

And his mind control stuff is super limited in range

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Wait no, dimension door is the one that requires movement

 

[Ss3micah]

He can teleport

NO JOKE LOLOL
I had to look up how Misty step works
Anyways, he can definitely use it to escape Restrain Glyphs then but then I also realized that his Teleportation is 30 Feet which also translates to 9.1 Meters. Weiss's AoE attacks covers WAYYY more distance than that so even if he managed to get free from the restraints with teleportation, he would still be well within Weiss's AoE range

Not to mention the added bonus that Weiss can easily close a 20m starting gap distance due to high speed mobility movements with glyphs
Point is Teleportation does little to save his Undead Skin

 

[Antoniofer]

Plus whenever needed, he can just use one of his mind control spells to get Weiss to stand still (It gets dispelled when she gets hurt and can't be used to) or dispell her summons.

I believe commanding stuff like "let you hit by me or my creatures to killing you" would qualify as suicidal and would end the spell. Also, not sure if Weiss' summonig would be considered a spell to be counterspell.

 

[Peppersalt43]

I believe commanding stuff like "let you hit by me or my creatures to killing you" would qualify as suicidal and would end the spell. Also, not sure if Weiss' summonig would be considered a spell to be counterspell.

Wait what? So drop your weapons or surrender is a suicidal command

 

[Ss3micah]

Also what about this. Plus whenever needed, he can just use one of his mind control spells to get Weiss to stand still (It gets dispelled when she gets hurt and can't be used to) or dispell her summons.

Yeah...........
Untop of literal shit range, Weiss would just need to AoE once to easily counter this or just used ranged dust attacks
They can easily cover the 20m starting distance while Suggestion only has a range of 9.1 meters
Also assuming Weiss got hit by this what would actually happen here? Would she just like give up, stop fighting and go home AND THATS ASSUMING THAT GIVING UP IS REASONABLE WHEN SHE IS LITERALLY HERE TO WIN?

 

[Peppersalt43]

Yeah...........
Untop of literal shit range, Weiss would just need to AoE once to easily counter this or just used ranged dust attacks
They can easily cover the 20m starting distance while Suggestion only has a range of 9.1 meters
Also assuming Weiss got hit by this what would actually happen here? Would she just like give up, stop fighting and go home AND THATS ASSUMING THAT GIVING UP IS REASONABLE WHEN SHE IS LITERALLY HERE TO WIN?

He also has Geas which has a 60 foot range and has different restrictions

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[WeeklyBattles]

Ras also has Hold Person but that isnt even guaranteed to work given her fight with Marrow

 

[WeeklyBattles]

He also has Geas which has a 60 foot range and has different restrictions

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"You can issue any command you choose, short of an activity that would result in certain death. Should you issue a suicidal command, the spell ends."

 

[Peppersalt43]

"You can issue any command you choose, short of an activity that would result in certain death. Should you issue a suicidal command, the spell ends."

Which begs the question, does telling someone to dispell their summons or stop using a specific attack count as suicidal? Also this

Wait what? So drop your weapons or surrender is a suicidal command?

 

[Ss3micah]

He also has Geas which has a 60 foot range and has different restrictions

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This is better than Suggestion but stil falls short
60 Feet is 18.3 meters so guess what... Weiss still starts out of its Range and again she can more than easily cover that range with Dust attacks, AoE attacks or just bust out her Warrior Summon to deal the damage (which she can teleport by the way)

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Which begs the question, does telling someone to dispell their summons or stop using a specific attack count as suicidal? Also this

No but telling them to allow you to kill them would. Disarming as a suggestion is a super common tactic in D&D but weiss doesnt need her weapon to use glyphs so that wouldnt hinder her too much, and it only takes a few seconds for her to be able to summon her summons so even if they're dispelled she can just bring them back

 

[Antoniofer]

One can ask to drop the weapon, or stop using a particular attack, but to command to not dodge or defend against creatures that are going to kill you is pretty suicidal. Plus, the spell has limited range and a casting time of 1 minute, dout he will have the chance to do anything with that spell.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Oh yeah the casting time too, that makes it borderline useless lol

 

[Ss3micah]

He also has Geas which has a 60 foot range and has different restrictions

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Also from what I'm reading here:
While the creature is Charmed by you, it takes 5d10 psychic damage each time it acts in a manner directly counter to your instructions, but no more than once each day. A creature that can't understand you is unaffected by the spell.

Even while under its effects, Weiss can still act against Mr. Zombie so long as she is willing to take some damage and then there is the question of if Weiss would even understand Mr. Mummy in the first place to be affected by this spell

 

[Ss3micah]

casting time of 1 minute, dout he will have the chance to do anything with that spell.

Oh hell
Yeah, he gets owned before that spell takes off

 

[Antoniofer]

Even while under its effects, Weiss can still act against Mr. Zombie so long as she is willing to take some damage and then there is the question of if Weiss would even understand Mr. Mummy in the first place to be affected by this spell

I undertand that Nsi talks common, that would be fine to understand each other.

 

[Peppersalt43]

Alright so I checked Blindness Deafness and it both lacks range and casting speed

However, Blight is instantaneous to cast and if I recall, it does the same type of damage as finger of death (Necrotic Damage) so take that as you will

It still lacks range but at least it's not getting outpaced

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[Ss3micah]

Alright so I checked Blindness Deafness and it both lacks range and casting speed

However, Blight is instantaneous to cast and if I recall, it does the same type of damage as finger of death (Necrotic Damage) so take that as you will

It still lacks range but at least it's not getting outpaced

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Lack of Range (9.1 meters) severely kills the usefulness of this move when its being used against someone who has myriad ranged options