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Monster Hunter Alatreon Powers Revision

Sigilavox

He/Him
401
210
Alatreon's profile has a few powers and abilities that it shouldn't have, I think. Also Iceborne moveset additions.

TL;DR:
  • Remove Air Manipulation, Smoke Manipulation, Acid Manipulation, Poison Manipulation, and Biological Manipulation.
  • Add Organic Manipulation (Can spit globules and streams of oil that can be ignited to burn foes).
  • Change the justification for Body Control to (Can shift between three elemental active states to alter its moveset and elemental defenses, albeit not at will).
  • Change the justification for Heat Manipulation to (Can drastically alter the temperature of its environment passively and through Escaton Judgement).
Certain powers are given to it based on the fact that other elder dragons have them, but this reasoning is unsupported.

Table: Elder Dragon Source | Powers
Kushala DaoraAir Manipulation
ChameleosBody Control
Smoke Manipulation
Acid Manipulation
Poison Manipulation
Biological Manipulation
Teostra/LunastraExplosion Manipulation
Heat Manipulation

The source for Alatreon having the powers of the other "True Elder Dragons" (i.e. Kushala animation skeleton) originates, as far as I can tell, from a single statement on the Monster Hunter wiki's Alatreon page that was originally added on May 1, 2011 to replace a statement previously mentioning its possible evolutionary relation to Kushala due to similarities in design.

"It is said that it has the abilities of all the True Elder Dragons..."

^ the statement

There was no citation for this statement, and no literature had come out at the time describing Alatreon with such terminology. There continues to be no official basis for this statement, as nothing in gameplay nor in statements from CAPCOM (be it through lore book or dev diary) suggests that it has the powers of other elder dragons, only that it is incredibly powerful on its own, controls most/all of the elements, and it happens to share certain animations with certain elder dragons. The Monster Hunter wiki statement has since added Vaal Hazak, Velkhana, and Namielle, with no evident reason given except for that they share skeletons.

While the VS Battles Profile doesn't have abilities for Alatreon from the latter three elder dragons, I'm wondering if anyone else thinks the above powers should be removed, at least with the justifications currently used in its profile, since it doesn't seem reasonable for these traits to be expected from any kind of Alatreon in VS matches.

Caveats:
I think that Alatreon still has Heat Manipulation as of Iceborne, with its Escaton Judgement and Active States afflicting its surroundings with a hot or freezing atmosphere, and its nova could be described as an explosion so I could see Explosion Manipulation staying on there.

Incidentally, Escaton Judgement should be included as a notable technique, and I'm happy to draft a paragraph describing it, if need be.

It should probably have Organic Manipulation (oil) due to it being able to spit globs of oil that sticks to the ground and can be set alight with its fire attacks. Said oil inflicts Waterblight and inflicts water damage so it could be described as having Water Manipulation, but I'm not sure about that considering it's very specifically oil.

The Elemental Active state order warrants description as well, considering it's fixed in the following order(s):

Fire Active --> Dragon Active --> Escaton Judgement --> Ice Active ~and~ Ice Active --> Dragon Active --> Escaton Judgement --> Fire Active

I'm happy to describe that as well.

I'm very new here, so please let me know the general philosophy around discussions like this.
 
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Seems fine. Alatreon's page seems to have a lot of scaling to Chameleos for abilities with no good reasoning as for why.

I'd recommend including detailed reasonings onto the page when implementing edits.
 
Yeah, the abilities being shared from the other elder dragons was something I wanted to go over in the theoretical ability CRT I alluded to, so this is good

I don't remember where but I remember Escaton Judgement being described as an immense shockwave, it might have been the actual event tutorial, may have just been something else, but either way it would probably count as an explosion (And I feel Escaton Judgement should be noted as an attack on their AP considering it can outright oblitherate hunters normally capable of withstanding their attacks)
 
Yeah, the abilities being shared from the other elder dragons was something I wanted to go over in the theoretical ability CRT I alluded to, so this is good

I don't remember where but I remember Escaton Judgement being described as an immense shockwave, it might have been the actual event tutorial, may have just been something else, but either way it would probably count as an explosion (And I feel Escaton Judgement should be noted as an attack on their AP considering it can outright oblitherate hunters normally capable of withstanding their attacks)
Yeah, Escaton Judgement is Built Different. It's like Sapphire of the Emperor and White Fatalis' Big **** You Dragon Nuke.
 
I don't remember where but I remember Escaton Judgement being described as an immense shockwave, it might have been the actual event tutorial, may have just been something else, but either way it would probably count as an explosion (And I feel Escaton Judgement should be noted as an attack on their AP considering it can outright oblitherate hunters normally capable of withstanding their attacks)
Yeah, it's called an "elemental shockwave" in the Alatreon Dev Diary, though it makes a very explosion-like sound and effect in fire active.

Noteworthy is that EJ doesn't care what armor you wear. It's not even like Lunastra's nuke which does red-health damage based on fire resistance, it just straight-up sucks your health right out of your pool at absurd speeds right through your armor. Probably just counts as Heat Manipulation to such a great extent that hunter defenses are useless, but impressive, nonetheless.
 
From my understanding currently, the "possess the powers of all other true elder dragons" or whatever was mostly just in reference to the fact that it possesses all elemental affiliations, which means it can use flames like Teostra, winds like Kushala, Water and lightning like Namielle, etc. I don't think it was for the stuff like Chameleos' active camo and whatnot lol
 
It doesn't have any Kushala powers, just all the elements, from game information. The "true elder dragon" quote is a citationless statement made on the wiki from a time when there wasn't any official information about Alatreon aside from the game data, which doesn't mention any such thing.
 
Not that this is the thread to have that discussion, but I don't really think that's an applicable feat to dragon element since any creature can be agitated by overproduction of most natural products and the discomfort accompanying that.
 
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