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Sub-Relativistic Naruto?

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Umm no Toneri using the technique was in slow motion but the extension speed of the sword wasn't in slow motion.

Non-Bias said:
It went just as fast as the first one did
Click to expand...
I've already provided a calc to disprove that the sword moved as fast as the first one so please try and disprove it as I nor anyone will accept a blanket statement like "It went just as fast as the first one did"
 
Teufel Dunkelheit said:
Umm no Toneri using the technique was in slow motion but the extension speed of the sword wasn't in slow motion.
Non-Bias said:
It went just as fast as the first one did
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I've already provided a calc to disprove that the sword moved as fast as the first one so please try and disprove it as I nor anyone will accept a blanket statement like "It went just as fast as the first one did"
How was Toneri using the technique in slow motion but the extension speed wasn't when that's part of the technique? If you'll notice, the scene speed up immediately after Naruto blocked the attack, which means that it wasn't going as slow as you're saying.
 
I took another look and the only time it was in slow motion was after Naruto had hit Toneri with his Rasengan. The scene never sped up after naruto blocked the attack.

Think of it like this a character by using hand signs has a technique which can travel at light speed but that doesn't mean that the hand sign speed of the character is lightspeed as well. It's just the technique that's lightspeed.

Once again if it was in slow motion (which it wasn't) then this would be thrown away just like how luffy being lightspeed because of dodging the Pasifista laser was. As both use things to provide a dramatic effect.
 
Teufel Dunkelheit said:
I took another look and the only time it was in slow motion was after Naruto had hit Toneri with his Rasengan. The scene never sped up after naruto blocked the attack.
Think of it like this a character by using hand signs has a technique which can travel at light speed but that doesn't mean that the hand sign speed of the character is lightspeed as well just the technique.

Once again if it was slow (which it wasn't) then this would be thrown away just like how luffy being lightspeed because of dodging the Pasifista laser was. As both use things to provide a dramatic effect.
Click to expand...
Umm no Toneri using the technique was in slow motion but the extension speed of the sword wasn't in slow motion.

^You're backtracking. Previously you said the above and now you're saying that it was only in slow motion as Naruto hit him with his fist?

When Toneri launched his attack at Naruto when he was charging toward him, all it did was slow it down and show that Naruto transferred all his energy into his hands. Immediately after that, the scene sped up and you can that the extension speed was just as fast as the first time he used it.

If it wasn't in slow motion, why did it suddenly become a lot faster compared to when he initiated the attack when it was launched at Naruto?
 
Wait the first sentence was a mistake on my part. I took a proper look at the scene and neither were in slow motion. The only time it was in slow motion was after Naruto had hit Toneri with his Rasengan

I don't know where you got the fact that it was in slow motion as the scene never sped up. To prove that the extension speed was the same as the first one it should've traveled the diameter of the moon in an instant so no.

It never became faster. Also when the hell did the extension speed ever become faster as that's the only thing needed here.

Also this doesn't didprove my calc so it stands the second sword is not as fast as the first one.
 
A question: How many meters away from Toneri was Naruto when blocking the attack, and how many meters did he have to move in order to block it?
 
Antvasima said:
A question: How many meters away from Toneri was Naruto when blocking the attack, and how many meters did he have to move in order to block it?
Click to expand...
The assumed distance was 100 meters so minus 7.5 meters from that and you get 92.5 m.

And Naruto never had to move to block it. Toneri's sword extended straight towards naruto and naruto simply charged towards the sword with a Rasengan in hand.
 
Well, if the sword extended 92.5 meters, and Naruto only moved 7.5 meters to block it, shouldn't the speed required be 3475/(92.5/7.5) km/s?
 
Not really Naruto never moved to block the sword.

I can actually explain it properly here but it just this the sword if it was truly mach 10000+ than it would've travelled around 300 meters (3X the entire distance between naruto and Toneri) in the same amount of time it took naruto to move one step. But since naruto was able to make at least 10 steps before his rasengan collided with the sword we can easily say that the extension speed of the first sword is far higher than that of the second sword.
 
Alternately, Naruto simply turned much swifter by the time of the movie?
 
True but I assumed Naruto to be the highest end of Hypersonic+ whiles in base when in reality the should be low end Hypersonic in base but even if he was mach 25 in base and even if he got 10 times faster in yhe movie it still wouldn't be enough to make the sword mach 10000+.
 
I prefer to simply measure how far Naruto moved in relation to the attack distance, and calculate his speed from that, rather than use assumptions about his speed to measure his speed. It seems like circular logic.
 
Ok I'll try and post another calc about that later. Although that's clearly gonna be harder than the previous calc.

But assumptions are needed in a calc.
 
We can't assume a speed level in order to calculate said speed level. The relation between the distance of Toneri's attack and the distance Naruto moves in order to block it is another matter.
 
Well, I think that the sword extension was likely of similar speed. What I am interested in is how far Naruto moved in relation to the distance that the sword had to extend. That way we can calculate Naruto's own speed level, by dividing 3475 km/s with the relative size of the two distances.
 
Wait wait I got this it seems that I'm the person that misunderstood. But now I got this.

When assuming naruto's speed to be mach 25 we would get the speed of the sword to be around mach 308.

And when assuming the sword's speed to be mach 10000+ we can scale naruto's speed from that and get around mach 825.

One of them has to be assumed since we don't know the exact speed of either. But I got this. I should probably edit my previous calc as well. But wait for a few hours and I'll have both calcs ready.

Although it would really help if someone could tell me exactly how many steps naruto made before his rasengan collided with the sword.
 
That is the relevant part, yes. We preferably need some screen captures.
 
May I ask why we are even trying to calc. Naruto's speed, when we havn't even agreed on the legitimacy of the Mach 10000+ sword? Shouldn't we first establish that the sword is or isn't Mach 10000+ and then build from that?
 
Well, what is the general considered size of the Naruto Moon then?
 
Most people assume that the size of the Naruto Moon is the same size as Earth's moon because there is no evidence that its any smaller.

However considering that that Naruto Planet is bigger than Earth, then the Naruto Moon should also be bigger.
 
Well, then I think that the estimated speed of the sword is a lower bounds estimate.
 
Let me just clear something out here. Naruto can't have mach 10,000+ reactions from charging in front of Toneri's sword.

Had he done something like this however.

Kurome-gif2


If he had done something like this and had moved 1 meter and dodged the sword we could say that he has mach 100+ reactions in base.
 
Didn't he block the attack with his arm? Nevertheless, it is entirely possible that he will end up with a lower required speed than the maximum that he is already listed with after we have divided the sword speed with the relative distance size.
 
Nope he already had the Rasengan formed and in hand before the attack had reached him. And what he did was simply charge forward towards the sword which was headed straight for him. If we do the calc assuming that the sword was truly mach 10,000+ for base naruto's speed (travelling speed) I can get around mach 825. And naruto was listed as being mach 4000+ in his Asura mode so this would still be an upgrade for naruto's base speed.
 
Couple of things:

Firstly, what Rasengan? I'm pretty sure it was his bare hand amped with Bijuu chakra...

Secondly, I'm pretty sure it qualifies as reactions since even though he did just charge he was able to prepare his attack ("charge up" his hand) while the sword was extending towards him. If he didn't have an equivalent reaction speed to the attack speed of the sword he would have just ran into it head first without forming his attack since he wouldn't have been able to react fast enough and amp. his arm and block.
 
FinalBattleX01 said:
Couple of things:
Firstly, what Rasengan? I'm pretty sure it was his bare hand amped with Bijuu chakra...

Secondly, I'm pretty sure it qualifies as reactions since even though he did just charge he was able to prepare his attack ("charge up" his hand) while the sword was extending towards him. If he didn't have an equivalent reaction speed to the attack speed of the sword he would have just ran into it head first without forming his attack since he wouldn't have been able to react fast enough and amp. his arm and block.
Click to expand...
The yellow one. I don't know what it's called but it's the same one he used through out the fight. And if it was his bare had then he most definitely doesn't get reactions from it as he already had his hand held out. And the speed taken to amp his hand with energy would've been instantaneous.

We don't know how fast he can form a Rasengan. And judging by how it looked it was instantaneous or close to it. And finally it doesn't count as reactions as his hand was already held out.

I could probably calc how long it takes to form a rasengan from this as well.
 
He apparently wouldn't have had to move nearly as far as the sword would during the extension.
 
All right. Should we end this discussion then?
 
The time it took the sword to move 92.5 Meters would be 0.000026618705035971 seconds if it truly moved at 3475 km/s and thus we have the time frame for Naruto moving the 7.5 (if he ran ten steps) meters which is 0.000026618705035971 seconds as both starting moving at around the same time.

Thus we get Naruto's speed to be mach 828.69634340223269829845744001005 and him forming the rasengan would likely take 0.0000026618705035971 seconds or half this as he formed it in the time it took him to make one step.

And whether we end this discussion or not it's fine either way by me but just know that Naruto's base speed, in the movie, can be calced if the speed of the sword is truly 3475 km/s.
 
Hmm. Well, okay, it can continue if you wish then. So, what do you all think? Should we adjust Naruto's base speed to Mach 829?
 
I'm pretty sure it was his arm, not a rasengan.

My point about the reaction speed is not that he moved his hand in the way of the beam, but that he was able to see the beam coming towards him, think about his best option to survive and transfer his entire cloak to his arm (which wasn't instanteneous iirc). Hence, he reacted to it appropriately. If he didn't have the reaction speed to deal with it then the sword would have just smashed into him before he even thought of "charging up" his arm, regardless if he could have tanked it or not. Tbh one might even argue that he did in fact move his arm to intercept the beam since even after Toneri fired it he was still sprinting (and moving his arms back and forth) and then he held his arm out to block.

Endind the discussion? So, what is the verdict, is the sword Mach 10000+ or no?
 
@ Antvasima: I don't really mind either way but do you accept the calc. This was assuming that the sword was 3475 km/s.

Now if we do a similar calc assuming base naruto's speed to be mach 25 or 8500 m/s. And similar to the previous calc timeframe for naruto travelling the 7.5 meters would be 0.00088235294117647 seconds and thus we have the time frame for the sword moving 92.5 meters which is 0.00088235294117647 seconds as both starting moving at around the same time.

And here speed of the sword is mach 308.33333333333353888888888888903.

@ FinalBattleX01: You don't need to have mach 10,000+ reaction to see an attack coming from 100 meters away similar to how an attack that requires a character to move 1 meter to dodge, which is fired from 100 meters away, then the character would only need 1/100 of the speed of the projectile to successfully dodge the attack you'd only need 1/100 of the speed of the attack to see it.
 
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