• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Classroom Of The Elite: Intel Upgrades/Downgrades + More Abilities

Messages
7,118
Reaction score
1,963
This CRT is simple, just fixing intel ratings

Arisu;
This should warrant Analytical prediction and Information analysis for Arisu (although it's not combat applicable)
And also Accelerated Development because of the grandmaster as a kid feat (Training: Intelligence and Other)
I'm also not sure if this can warrant Photographic Memory

This would also scale to Takuya and Ichika due to them being white roomers and having better cognition than her

Ibuki;


Nanase and Riku are gifted

This also implies that Nanase and Riku will lose their genius intelligence ability in their power and ability section




Ayanokouji;

Paralysis Inducement - (Paralyzed Nagumo with fear temporarely due to his willpower)

Resistence to;

Analytical Prediction & Information Analysis (During his confrontation with Tsukishiro and Shiba, Ayanokōji demonstrated the ability to adapt and evolve in real time under full analytical pressure. Both opponents possessed prior knowledge of his combat tendencies, decision-making patterns, and physical capabilities, allowing them to anticipate his actions with high accuracy. Tsukishiro in particular was capable of advanced behavioral analysis and “cold reading,” predicting movements by interpreting habits, timing cues, micro-adjustments, and established fight patterns. Despite this, Ayanokōji was able to continuously adjust mid-engagement by deliberately breaking and reconstructing his own behavioral data in real time. He introduced movement patterns that were not recorded in his White Room data set, effectively generating new habits, timing structures, and combat rhythms on the fly. This forced his opponents’ predictive models to become less reliable as the fight progressed, as his actions no longer followed consistent or previously observable patterns. In essence, rather than being constrained by his known data, he actively created unpredictable variables during combat, allowing him to counter opponents who relied heavily on pre-formed analysis and pattern prediction)

This would also scale to Tsukishiro (the cold reading part) as he was also countering Ayanokouji's cold reading
 
Last edited:
E.G Arisu makes sense, since being able to visualize a 3d image of a massive island for an extended time, while also predicting the movements of a dozen students, making strategies, and issuing orders is a level of cognitive multitasking beyond what a regular genius could accomplish.
 
I disagree for the E.G upgrade

I don't see Arisu being E.G, matter of fact I don't see even Ayanokoji as E.G but I'll leave that for now.....

Not only her visualizing the entire island is shaky at best, but there is literally zero statement of her visualizing the entire island, visualizing an island map in 3d inside you head is a typical thing a cartographer does, and professionals who work with spatial data which is the GIS and terrain mapping are highly trained in spatial visualization so basically the exact cognitive ability required to translate 2D contour into a 3D mental landscape, basically nothing "extraordinary" here

Also as for the chess part, not only japan doesn't even have a GM, but also it's mostly the representative of their best field in japan, and it is only stated that they were "professionals" not Super gm, or even gm, fm or even cm can still be considered professional, and since the anime canonicity has been accepted and can be used as a visual support, We can truly see how Arisu and Ayanokoji playing chess in the anime which to be quite frank, I can probably beat the both of them

So yeah, count me as disagree
 
I disagree for the E.G upgrade

I don't see Arisu being E.G, matter of fact I don't see even Ayanokoji as E.G but I'll leave that for now.....
Ayanokouji literally fits the criterias for it, for you to disagree you would need to rework the criterias for E.G as a whole
Not only her visualizing the entire island is shaky at best, but there is literally zero statement of her visualizing the entire island, visualizing an island map in 3d inside you head is a typical thing a cartographer does, and professionals who work with spatial data which is the GIS and terrain mapping are highly trained in spatial visualization so basically the exact cognitive ability required to translate 2D contour into a 3D mental landscape, basically nothing "extraordinary" here
"Though she was only looking at the map in her tablet, Sakayanagi could indeed see the uninhabited island three-dimensionaly"

Edit: She is also taking into account, terrain, jungle, bushes and everything required for her to simulate the paths of 400 to 500 students along with other stuff

Did you check the scan?
Also as for the chess part, not only japan doesn't even have a GM, but also it's mostly the representative of their best field in japan, and it is only stated that they were "professionals" not Super gm, or even gm, fm or even cm can still be considered professional, and since the anime canonicity has been accepted and can be used as a visual support, We can truly see how Arisu and Ayanokoji playing chess in the anime which to be quite frank, I can probably beat the both of them
LN is the primary canon lol, so the anime while yes it can be used, the LN is the original source

And again, the LN states that they bring the top of the world and geniuses in every field, so the chess players Ayanokouji has fought is the highest rank for chess, which Arisu is above
 
Edit: She is also taking into account, terrain, jungle, bushes and everything required for her to simulate the paths of 400 to 500 students along with other stuff

Did you check the scan?
How does this warrant her being extraordinary genius though? People who who work with spatial data literally have this ability, and did she really simulate the paths of 400 to 500 students though? I don't see any of that in the scan, so like i said before, this is shaky at best


LN is the primary canon lol, so the anime while yes it can be used, the LN is the original source

And again, the LN states that they bring the top of the world and geniuses in every field, so the chess players Ayanokouji has fought is the highest rank for chess, which Arisu is above
Which almost none of their chess pgn are showed, therefore we use the anime visual as a support to canonicalize their movement

And again, the LN states that they bring the top of the world and geniuses in every field, so the chess players Ayanokouji has fought is the highest rank for chess, which Arisu is above
"These are people who left the stage due to problems in economics, psychology, and other fields, despite their ability to represent Japan, or even the world."

These are proof enough that the players ayanokoji fought isn't the highest rank of chess, that sentences alone prove their potential rather than proving they were definitely world class. The key idea here is lost potential, and definitely not a precise ranking.
 
I don't see Arisu being E.G, matter of fact I don't see even Ayanokoji as E.G but I'll leave that for now.....
I mean Zetsu kind of covered this already but there aren't really grounds to claim Ayanokouji himself isn't an extraordinary genius but I will focus on Arisu here given that is the aim of the CRT.

Not only her visualizing the entire island is shaky at best, but there is literally zero statement of her visualizing the entire island
Yes there is lol, it was included in the OP and here it is again.
visualizing an island map in 3d inside you head is a typical thing a cartographer does, and professionals who work with spatial data which is the GIS and terrain mapping are highly trained in spatial visualization so basically the exact cognitive ability required to translate 2D contour into a 3D mental landscape, basically nothing "extraordinary" here
This is a severe reduction of the circumstances on your part so I will correct this. Arisu wasn't just "imagining the map in 3D based on a 2D tablet display, rather she was taking the 2D map and converting it into usable 3D information with terrain etc so she could calculate the paths/arrival times of the students across the map. She was using this information to coordinate multiple groups and give orders to them in real time. The tablet maps are also NOT LIVE, they offer a static image at the time you create it, meaning that not only is she keeping track of the 3D model but also the live locations of all the people.
How does this warrant her being extraordinary genius though? People who who work with spatial data literally have this ability, and did she really simulate the paths of 400 to 500 students though? I don't see any of that in the scan, so like i said before, this is shaky at best
I mostly covered this above but the maps she had were 2D and static so the only way she gets data about the paths students take is calculating it in her head. This is also pretty clearly established in the scans in the OP. The scan verbatim says she ran simulations in her head with the information using the 3D model she visualized to figure out where everybody is and where they are moving. The size of the island was also established in the OP to further emphasize this, no cartographer is accurately visualizing 35 km^2 and keeping track of live movements of hundreds of people in their head at once.

Also the 400-500 students is an estimate since we don't know the exact number. 3 years with a max of 160 students = 480. Then subtract any expulsions prior to this and the real number is likely around 450.

Also as for the chess part, not only japan doesn't even have a GM, but also it's mostly the representative of their best field in japan, and it is only stated that they were "professionals" not Super gm, or even gm, fm or even cm can still be considered professional, and since the anime canonicity has been accepted and can be used as a visual support, We can truly see how Arisu and Ayanokoji playing chess in the anime which to be quite frank, I can probably beat the both of them
Which almost none of their chess pgn are showed, therefore we use the anime visual as a support to canonicalize their movement
Zetsu already answered, but to the point about using the anime to see specific moves made this is an incredibly flimsy argument. First the anime just shows random positions out of context for the most part and it is impossible to get an accurate estimate of chess rating from this. Plus, EVEN if we could use the anime to estimate their ratings and we assume the estimate we get supports your claim we still can't use that. In the event the anime were to show Arisu to have a lower rating it would no longer be "accurate" to the LN primary canon which says she is a master of chess. Either way the anime is far too unreliable to estimate a rating like that, especially if it makes both Ayanokouji and Arisu out to be amateurs.

In short no matter what the anime shows, if it contradicts the LN we can't use it. Since the LN says she is a master the anime must either prove that or we can't use it.

"These are people who left the stage due to problems in economics, psychology, and other fields, despite their ability to represent Japan, or even the world."

These are proof enough that the players ayanokoji fought isn't the highest rank of chess, that sentences alone prove their potential rather than proving they were definitely world class. The key idea here is lost potential, and definitely not a precise ranking.
Lastly what kind of argument is this? It's one line totally out of context with what it means. This line is talking about how they will prioritize ability in hiring instructors over their personality or other factors. Basically they want the most qualified people even if they are eccentric. It also says these people are skilled enough to represent even the world in their areas of expertise.
 
If you really want to disprove EG, then prove that an IRL human can create a 3d model of a 2d map in their mind, and do that for a long time, while calculating how fast each student is moving and identifying their locations (while they are constantly moving), while also giving out orders to your minions

What Sakayanagi did is far beyond what an IRL human can do in terms of cognitive ability, and so it qualifies her for EG.
 
Yes there is lol, it was included in the OP and here it is again.

does it really says visualizing the entirety of the 35,000,000 m^2 island including 400 to 500 students, though? Strictly speaking, no. The text says she can see "the island" three-dimensionally, but cognitively, she likely are not rendering every single tree, blade of grass across the entire landmass simultaneously.
This is a severe reduction of the circumstances on your part so I will correct this. Arisu wasn't just "imagining the map in 3D based on a 2D tablet display, rather she was taking the 2D map and converting it into usable 3D information with terrain etc so she could calculate the paths/arrival times of the students across the map. She was using this information to coordinate multiple groups and give orders to them in real time. The tablet maps are also NOT LIVE, they offer a static image at the time you create it, meaning that not only is she keeping track of the 3D model but also the live locations of all the people.
IRL humans can do this, this is a highly specialized cognitive skill, in which Arisu does qualify as a genius which I have no problem with. this does represents the absolute limit of human spatial intelligence and deductive reasoning, this can still be found in military strategists, and navigators, or people who mainly works with spatial data, seeing a 2d map in a 3d simulation is a standard requirement for topographer mapping and military recon. experienced cartographers, orienteers, and search-and-rescue commanders can look at flat 2D contour lines or topographic maps and instantly see the elevation, steepness, and dips in their mind's eye. Their brain automatically extrudes the flat lines into a 3D landscape , a tactical expert use established parameters to run a simulation inside their head, like a real military commander knows that a squad carrying heavy gear moves at roughly 3 km/h on flat ground, but that speed drops by half if they are moving up a 15 degree incline through a forest and by looking at the 3D mental terrain and knowing where the squads started, the commander's brain calculates the timeline and plays their progress forward.

I mostly covered this above but the maps she had were 2D and static so the only way she gets data about the paths students take is calculating it in her head. This is also pretty clearly established in the scans in the OP. The scan verbatim says she ran simulations in her head with the information using the 3D model she visualized to figure out where everybody is and where they are moving. The size of the island was also established in the OP to further emphasize this, no cartographer is accurately visualizing 35 km^2 and keeping track of live movements of hundreds of people in their head at once.

Also the 400-500 students is an estimate since we don't know the exact number. 3 years with a max of 160 students = 480. Then subtract any expulsions prior to this and the real number is likely around 450.
I need some convincing of the fact that she kept track of 450 students at all times, not just analytical prediction and information analysis which i can agree they can be added, since the map is a static image like you've said, If she were truly keeping track of everyone at all times without looking at a live screen, she would need a constant stream of new sensory data. Without that data, a human brain no matter how cognitively "superhuman" cannot update a target's position if that target suddenly changes their mind, trips, pauses to rest, or turns around, and if what you said is true, this would make her literally nigh omniscient, not just extraordinary genius.

what is actually happening is she looks at the static map, takes the last known starting positions of the groups, and hits "play" on her own little mental calculation, she isn't actually seeing the people move in real time, she is calculating exactly where those people ought to be based on their speed and objectives.

given these conditions, I can agree either her being Nigh-omniscient, or just adding Analytical prediction and Information analysis, you choose.

This scan proves they are using a live tech feed to track people, not just pure mental simulation, and she is using analytical filtering to make sense of it. The key phrase here is "GPS signatures." she isn't relying only on a static tablet map and raw brainpower to guess where people are, she is looking at a digital static map display that provides actual, live tracking data via GPS.


This scan actually proves it was an analytical prediction all along. The character points out that over 12 days, the terrain has changed because hundreds of people have been walking across it. "There were more than a few paths where you could clearly make out people's footprints made since the storm." Arisu would just "know" where everyone is. but she is looking at the physical evidence left behind on the map or the terrain. By looking at where the paths have been worn down and where the footprints are fresh, she can deduce which routes are heavily trafficked and which are abandoned.


Zetsu already answered, but to the point about using the anime to see specific moves made this is an incredibly flimsy argument. First the anime just shows random positions out of context for the most part and it is impossible to get an accurate estimate of chess rating from this. Plus, EVEN if we could use the anime to estimate their ratings and we assume the estimate we get supports your claim we still can't use that. In the event the anime were to show Arisu to have a lower rating it would no longer be "accurate" to the LN primary canon which says she is a master of chess. Either way the anime is far too unreliable to estimate a rating like that, especially if it makes both Ayanokouji and Arisu out to be amateurs.

In short no matter what the anime shows, if it contradicts the LN we can't use it. Since the LN says she is a master the anime must either prove that or we can't use it.
This is pretty selective but if that is how that works, then I won't go further



If you really want to disprove EG, then prove that an IRL human can create a 3d model of a 2d map in their mind, and do that for a long time, while calculating how fast each student is moving and identifying their locations (while they are constantly moving), while also giving out orders to your minions

What Sakayanagi did is far beyond what an IRL human can do in terms of cognitive ability, and so it qualifies her for EG.
I already made my case here,I need some convincing, but regarding irl can do it or not, sure ig, I'll use 7 apa citations so hopefully these will help

Annan, V., & Pylyshyn, Z. (2006). Dynamics of target selection in Multiple Object Tracking (MOT).

Doran, M. M., & Hoffman, J. E. (2010). The role of visual attention in multiple object tracking: Evidence from ERPs. Attention, Perception, & Psychophysics).

Hasselmo, M. E., & Stern, C. E. (2015). Current questions on space and time encoding.

Moser, E. (2014). Mapping your every move. BrainFacts.

Parish, E. (2014). UK based neuroscientist wins Nobel Prize for work on the brain's "inner GPS".

Scholl, B. J. (2009). What have we learned about attention from multiple-object tracking (and vice versa).

Shepard, R. N., & Metzler, J. (1971). Mental rotation of three-dimensional objects.

Decades of cognitive research show that the brain’s parietal lobe takes flat 2D maps and instantly extrudes them into dynamic 3D mental environments, specialized neural structures act as a permanent mental GPS to maintain this layout for hours without cognitive burnout and the brain uses a visual attention mechanism called MOT to assign subconscious mental index pointers to individuals and this is allowing the average person to accurately predict movements and track the real-time locations of people constantly moving targets at once, this is pretty well documented neurological reality.

I already made my case, I most likely won't reply further, I'll just wait for others,
 
Last edited:
Back
Top