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to be fair ichibe did state that after ressurecting he would take time for his full power to come back
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Kenpachi Zaraki VS Shigekuni Yamamoto Genryusai
- Thread starter TauanVictor
- Start date
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 15,245
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I was about to point out this. Also Ikko may got sealed because he was a biggest hollow like Grimmjow.
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I don't know what you're implying here but there is no evidence zaraki can resist ichibe's conceptual manipulation that steals 100 years ...
This part is your headcanon as barragan got even stronger than before due to the hogyoku amp from Aizen...
Don't even try to downplay prime yama below barragan ,it's crazy to even mention it
Yhwach treated yama like trash ?
Lmao this is crazy , quincy base is not = shinigami base ...
Yhwcah is even crazier cause he doesn't have a volstanding , his base = full power 100%...
Shinigami ability starts with base let's say = 5 % power
Shikai = 10 % power
Bankai = 100% power as bankai is a 10 times increase...
Yhwach went out of his way to reduce yamamoto's power form 100% to a mere 5% or 10 % if yama was in shikai..
And beat yama like this , yhwach 100% vs yama 10 % but you think yhwach treated him like trash
...Get your fact right , YAMAMOTO at 100% bodied the f*** out of a full power yhwach that had the almighty
This is not true as ichibe's ultimate move was never used on ikimikidomoe...
SS Ichigo had also once removed a causal ichibe's ink that covered his zangetsu name...
It gets interesting when ichibe steals 100 nights ...
And transforms your very being into black and erases you from existence...
I don't care for ichibe vs zaraki so I won't touch this again even if you reply...
He doesn’t need infinite stamina when none of them can harm him. Kenny will just walk through the army no diff and smack Yama.
With what feats can zaraki just smack yama ?
I don't like repeating myself but you're forcing me ...
YAMAMOTO slapped a full power yhwcah with the almighty ...
While yama was even holding back.
Hikone best statement was his reiatsu became like the dead yhwcah up above , that's like becoming as strong as the reio's husk ...
Which doesn't matter cause a full power base yhwach who yamamoto beat up , blatantly stated that he was superior to the reio's husk...
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What's FRA
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For Reasons Above
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Oh cool
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How about the fact that he is stronger than the guy who broke out of said conceptual hax via pure strength? “No evidence” lmao. It’s called wilful ignorance on your part.
No. Ikomikidomoe considered Novel Grimmjow to be weaker than the VL Barragan Iko knew despite Grimmjow having surpassed Espada Barragan by a huge margin. This combined with Yoruichi having gotten hilariously weaker after a century of doing **** all and Barragan being lazy as hell once he became God King ages ago, it’s blatantly obvious he got weaker.
Where did I even do this? Let’s not put words in my mouth just because you can’t formulate an actual counter to what I said.
Yes. He literally stole the man’s Bankai, cut him in half and proceeded to obliterate both halves. How do you think he didn’t treat Yama like trash?
So a bunch of headcanon and a waste of time to read. Go get scans to prove that RJ doubles base Yama and this site doesn’t accept x10 Bankai multipliers without a statement for that specific Bankai.Yhwcah is even crazier cause he doesn't have a volstanding , his base = full power 100%...
Shinigami ability starts with base let's say = 5 % power
Shikai = 10 % power
Bankai = 100% power as bankai is a 10 times increase...
Yhwach went out of his way to reduce yamamoto's power form 100% to a mere 5% or 10 % if yama was in shikai..
And beat yama like this , yhwach 100% vs yama 10 % but you think yhwach treated him like trash
Get your fact right , YAMAMOTO at 100% bodied the f*** out of a full power yhwach that had the almighty
RG = Gotei. Considering that plenty of captains outperformed members of the RG sans Ichibe, Ichibe > Yama as he has to make up the disappointing gap between Captains and the other RG. Then there is him also being called the pinnacle of Shinigami or some shit by Yhwach and Yhwach actually trying against Ichibe even though he embarrassed Yama.
An actual lie lmao. Ikomikidomoe was renamed, meaning Ichibe used his Bankai on him, aka more effort than was required to slap around a stronger Yhwach than the one that clapped Yama.
No he didn’t. Ichibe’s ink was blotting out Yhwach’s name, not Zangetsu’s.
And Kenny resists via raw reiatsu.
So you concede then? Good to know you are incapable of defending your stance and refuse to debate relevant points.
Seriously …… have you actually been reading what I have typed and posted? Because it’s plain as day what my argument is.
Me neither yet everyone I respond with actual scaling and arguments, you just gove the equivalent of “no”
You just keep capping. RG had info on Yhwach from 1000 years ago and the recent invasion and had no clue about the Almighty. Hell, Yama himself believed that Royd was Yhwach despite the enormous disparity between current base Yhwach and Royd.
Right ……. you understand you just conceded the whole thing right? If Hikone is SK level, he is on the same level as Butterfly Aizen who, and get this, transcends all Hollow and Shinigami. You yourself have stated that this Kenny scales above people that transcend Yama.
You realise that Yhwach is talking to Mimihagi when he says he is far superior and not the husk. This also backed up by Yhwach consuming the husk, overflowing with excess reiatsu and states that absorbing the husk has given him overwhelming power.
You are consistently and constantly wrong at every turn in this thread yet you are telling me to get my facts straight? Gtfoh and read the series my guy because you very clearly don’t know what you are talking about and are basically tossing out half baked arguments you heard somewhere without actually understanding them.
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You obviously sound very very much butt hurt from my earlier comment ,get a grip ... You don't even know me but you're forcefully trying to prove to me that you know all ...
More debunk incoming ...
Also don't cry about me not responding to ichibe vs zaraki , I don't do roundabout debate ,it's uncivilized and never ends ...
- so you said
"No. Ikomikidomoe considered Novel Grimmjow to be weaker than the VL Barragan Iko knew despite Grimmjow having surpassed Espada Barragan by a huge margin. This combined with Yoruichi having gotten hilariously weaker after a century of doing **** all and Barragan being lazy as hell once he became God King ages ago, it’s blatantly obvious he got weaker."
Lmfao ,what is this ???You're trying to hid your headcanon with a it's obvious he got weaker lmfao , yuroichi got weaker ,sooooo ?
We're talking about barragan here , when was it stated he got weaker by literally anybody ???
Not to mention it only took yoruichi one arc to get stronger than b4...
Barragan literally had the hogyoku buff his abilities , to be far superior than before , Aizen said something along the lines of , " I'll give you power " and barragan even till death never once claimed if I was as strong as before I would have done whatever...
-also grimmjow = nnoitra , so it's obvious he's nowhere near barragan...
So you can keep your headcanon theory of regressed powers , nobody cares ...
- You also said " Yes. He literally stole the man’s Bankai, cut him in half and proceeded to obliterate both halves. How do you think he didn’t treat Yama like trash? "
Yiiisssh , ignore my explanation of how bankai is full power and base and shikai are less power ...
If you choose to remain ignorant it's yo choice ...
Plus YAMAMOTO now has one arm , as quoted by Aizen when urahara blocks his reiatsu vents , shinigami wrist is a major source of power and zaraki using kendo to increase this powers , yea no kidding even yhwach says YAMAMOTO was nowhere near his prime ...
- you again said " So a bunch of headcanon and a waste of time to read. Go get scans to prove that RJ doubles base Yama and this site doesn’t accept x10 Bankai multipliers without a statement for that specific Bankai.
RG = Gotei. Considering that plenty of captains outperformed members of the RG sans Ichibe, Ichibe > Yama as he has to make up the disappointing gap between Captains and the other RG. Then there is him also being called the pinnacle of Shinigami or some shit by Yhwach and Yhwach actually trying against Ichibe even though he embarrassed Yama. "
- This right here ^^^ shows ur bias towards zaraki and lack of judgement in this debate
...- 1. The only good thing you said here is , prove rujin jaka doubles power in shikai , yes there's no prove for that , but the only purpose of me saying that is to give an example for the difference between base and bankai ...
-2. This site doesn't accept × 10 increase ? Lol lol lol lmao , sooooo ? I'm only here to debate yama vs zaraki , this site is no different from fb or discord where I normally debate , non of them are the authors of bleach or have any right to put thier own limit on characters and expect me to bend to thier opinions and disregard scans and context , so I do not care if you don't accept a 10 × increase...
-3. So yhwach called ichibe the pinicle of all shinigami ,yes this happens after yama died ...
Yama slapped yhwcah , yhwach had to make a 1000 years plan to steal that bankai and beat yama ,then yhwach slapped ichibe on thier very first fight ...
It speaks for itself ...
There is confirmation in 13 blades that yama is the strongest shinigami , you can take it or leave it , it's a matter of opinions ...
- now you said " You just keep capping. RG had info on Yhwach from 1000 years ago and the recent invasion and had no clue about the Almighty. Hell, Yama himself believed that Royd was Yhwach despite the enormous disparity between current base Yhwach and Royd."
- you're talking out yo ass bruhhhhhhhh jesus
, imagine what you just said , you just indirectly said yhwach didn't have the almighty 1000 years ago , cause you're trying to apply another silly theory to support yo argument smh ...- remember what the thousand year blood war is ???? Yes , yhwach had manipulated the future since a thousand years ago , ichigo entire life , ichigo paving a way for yhwach to visit the royal palace , ichigo killing the Reio , all part of yhwach's 1000 years plan , which he did with the almighty...
Not to mention that when we saw the flash back of how yhwach recruited Haschwalth , we actually saw the almighty active didn't we ? And that was only 200 years after yhwach was born ...
So cap cap headcanon blah blah blah , crap , I don't know why bleach fans think too much , take things as they are and stop theorizing...
- yamamoto slapped yhwach with the almighty , that's the literal story , accept it or not facts be facts
..- I'll kill the case with this , there is absolutely zero statement from anywhere concerning if ichibe knew about the almighty or not , not to mention yhwach doesn't need to yell I am using the almighty before using it ...
Even yama hid his bankai ability 1k years ago so ...
" sayo "
- again you said "Right ……. you understand you just conceded the whole thing right? If Hikone is SK level, he is on the same level as Butterfly Aizen who, and get this, transcends all Hollow and Shinigami. You yourself have stated that this Kenny scales above people that transcend Yama."
Yes I did say hikone is sk level at first but I recently did a debate about hikone with a friend , so in conclusion I understood that hikone is not even as powerful as the dead Reio above ... Why ?
- that statement came from like page 140... Bruhhhhhhhh it's page 140 , there is so many narrative that hikone was nowhere near complete at all during that time , that's still very much behind in hikone's development , the context doesn't even say he became as strong as the Reio above , it only said it resembled his reiatsu , yes , that's not a word ment to equalise strength " resembled " , it also said it wasn't like Aizen's , (yea it didn't resemble Aizen's) , but those who sensed it knew he was suitable to be Reio... All it says is hikone's reiatsu has a similar chill to that of yhwach's that that of Aizens ...
That pretty much sums it , he had the potential to get that strong but he was nowhere near , during that time he was still struggling with the espadas so " FAT NO..."
Even at the end of cfyow , mayuri just says , hikone was not a perfected vessel and mayuri claimed he could have perfected hikone , so no ,he's not as strong as yhwach or Aizen or ichigo , this explains why he couldn't get past base zaraki ...
- so finally you said " You realise that Yhwach is talking to Mimihagi when he says he is far superior and not the husk. This also backed up by Yhwach consuming the husk, overflowing with excess reiatsu and states that absorbing the husk has given him overwhelming power. "
Jesus , I'll address this once and if you continue to argue this , I'll let scans do the talking...
Yhwach says iirc "you might have seen the future but you didn't forsee the difference in out strength, you're far inferior to what I am now. (Full stop)
Then he says , right arm ,am taking your strength "
Bruh ,since when did mimihagi start seeing the future with the almighty ???
No you need to answer that question , cause last time I checked mimihagi only governed stagnation , that's prolly why it wasn't present in the almightys vision of the future or the Reio is just acasual ...
Yhwach talks to his father , after letting him know he's above him , he tells mimihagi he is collecting it's power ...
Two different things ,I don't know how you misinerpreted that scene honestly.
Oh wait , did you also happen to forget the fact that yhwach just stabed the Reio like slicing butter ?
Then ichigo struggled to pull yhwach's sword from the Reio but when he got additional reiatsu from yhwach ,he again sliced the Reio in two like butter ...
Yea no kidding ,even without yhwach saying it , with feats he is far superior to the Reio for casually stabbing him and amping ichigo enough to split him in two...
If bankai yama beat him up 1k years ago when he was in his prime then with what feats can zaraki keep up with YAMAMOTO ???????
Battling hikone ???
There is confirmed in the novel that YAMAMOTO would have Swifty ended that war , a war containing zaraki ..
And the whole point of can't fear your own world is that nobody has surpassed YAMAMOTO yet ...
You're forcefully trying to maneuver the literal plot and ignore author statement to give zaraki a win cause you're a zaraki fan boy , I get it lol ...
- also yhwach resting after absorbing the husk is supposed to mean what exactly ?
Yea it doesn't help anything you said ...
Yama still bodies
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Ok I think I saw you say something about butterfly Aizen being superior to bankai yamamoto ...
*Sigh , bleach fans
- so Aizen says I have transcended shinigamis and hollows ok ...
Now how credible is that statement ?
1. He has never seen ichibe or bankai YAMAMOTO in action not even once for him to quote he is stronger than them ...
2. He states he is above all shinigamis and hollows confidently placing the level of strength he has above everything he has seen but it gets instantly contradicted when ichigo who has powers that Aizen doesn't know about came in and slapped Aizen around like a child ...
- see where am going ???? Yes , Aizen claiming he transcends everything was taking ichigo into account and he also estimated how strong ichigo will get after training but he still placed himself on top , but it got contradicted...
His whole transcending all shinigami and hollow statement doesn't apply to anything he hasn't seen , ichigo proved that , bankai YAMAMOTO beat yhwach who sits comfortably above butterfly Aizen ...
Ichibe was slapping yhwach around altho yhwach wasn't at full power at that time but this poses as a fat contradiction to Aizen statement...
Like that last fight , Aizen was doing nothing but boasting and talking rubbish ...
- false statement when he said ichigo no longer has reiatsu
- false statement when he claimed he could atomiz ichigo with kido
Aizen capped a lot , so no , butterfly Aizen is nowhere near bankai YAMAMOTO ...
Cause meanwhile yama has a solid statement by not even forcefully releasing his bankai , he can destroy SS ...
His reiatsu is that powerful that just by existing SS was going off
Again butterfly Aizen is nowhere near
*Sigh , bleach fans
- so Aizen says I have transcended shinigamis and hollows ok ...
Now how credible is that statement ?
1. He has never seen ichibe or bankai YAMAMOTO in action not even once for him to quote he is stronger than them ...
2. He states he is above all shinigamis and hollows confidently placing the level of strength he has above everything he has seen but it gets instantly contradicted when ichigo who has powers that Aizen doesn't know about came in and slapped Aizen around like a child ...
- see where am going ???? Yes , Aizen claiming he transcends everything was taking ichigo into account and he also estimated how strong ichigo will get after training but he still placed himself on top , but it got contradicted...
His whole transcending all shinigami and hollow statement doesn't apply to anything he hasn't seen , ichigo proved that , bankai YAMAMOTO beat yhwach who sits comfortably above butterfly Aizen ...
Ichibe was slapping yhwach around altho yhwach wasn't at full power at that time but this poses as a fat contradiction to Aizen statement...
Like that last fight , Aizen was doing nothing but boasting and talking rubbish ...
- false statement when he said ichigo no longer has reiatsu
- false statement when he claimed he could atomiz ichigo with kido
- false statement when he claimed he was so powerful ,he would shatter ichigo's zanpakuto with one swing
- false statement when he said he destroyed a mountain
- false statement when he said he now transcends everybody in the verse and is now the strongest ...
Aizen capped a lot , so no , butterfly Aizen is nowhere near bankai YAMAMOTO ...
Cause meanwhile yama has a solid statement by not even forcefully releasing his bankai , he can destroy SS ...
His reiatsu is that powerful that just by existing SS was going off
Again butterfly Aizen is nowhere near
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Ong. Coulda sworn he said he wasn’t gonna respond.
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No you read wrong ...
I said I won't respond to zaraki vs ichibe cause that's not what's been discussed
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It looks so cause I basically copied pasted most of his earlier comment and compiled them with mine
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 15,245
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Can I get the scaling chain for this. How Base Yhwach is above Butterfly Aizen?
Excellence616
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Kenpachi oneshot with Shikai alone
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He wins in Base
. But the OP and Yama goons didn’t wanna listen just ignored and did what they wanted to do anyways 
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I don’t see how people get Yama to Hikone’s level.He wins in Base
You could even argue the TYBW top tier Captains that scale to the elites scale above Yama in terms of physical attributes (but not his Zanpakuto’s AP) considering physically he’s relative to Royd who’s at best the 8th strongest Quincy, as Gremmy, the 5 Elites and Jugram exist
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So do I can change your vote? :v
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bro these one piece goons...
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I get the feeling that you posted this on the wrong thread …
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Wtf
TheGreatJedi13
Username Only- 5,088
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nah his replies got bfr to this thread
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Bankai or not, Kenny scales to ~1000x Yama's value. Just the shockwave of Nozarashi negs.
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 15,245
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Zaraki , Ginjo and Hanatoro negs Yama.
People should stop making stomp matches
People should stop making stomp matches
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Character development. A beautiful thing to see
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