Metroid Prime 2: Light of Aether downgrade

[Chariot190]

The reason that Samus upgrades to the Light Suit is to handle the power of the Light of Aether to begin with. This final suit is both an upgrade on all the prior suits, and required to handle such a power source.

And? In context, all it does, is protect from the elements. Not only that, she explicitly doesn't have it all. An unknown, arbitrary fraction was used to help make it.

As an energy source meant to be an alternative to a sun, the energy is constantly regenerating, and obviously comparable to one in energy at minimum (lore implies it being more impressive than merely a sun however; again as others before have mentioned already).

This, is flatout wrong? The planet lacks the benefits of a sun, because it doesn't have one. You know the energy a planet reaps from its sun is only tier 6 yes? And yes, LoA is stated to contain solar energy, geothermal energy, and other shit, it's just a mixmash of energy to help solve an energy crisis.

Also, a sun doesn't regenerate its energy, it gives off petatons of energy a second and eventually burns out.

Furthermore, the society of the planet had long used and harnessed it's renewable energy with Energy ontrollers.

Except when it isn't? If it's actively used, it's gone. They even used it in a giant **** off beam weapon, and the whole planet was weakened because they used a chunk of it up.

Samus absorbs small amounts of it throughout the game and doesn't get much of a buff,

No, she doesn't, she absorbs it, to give back to them? That's the whole plot, she isn't using it to amp. She's just shoving it in a battery.

but Emperor Ing absorbs half, and as a result acquires an empowering effect.

No, he doesn't, he drains bits of it, but never any meaningful amount. Secondly, his mutation is due to phazon, not the LoA.

The implication being you need a sizable amount for it to be meaningful, which Samus does eventually get once she gets the Light Suit.

No she doesn't, we know she doesn't, the very light she allegedly contains, is sitting in the energy module still, like man it's right there, ya can see it and scan it even

User votes don't matter, but disagree. Was cool to learn about Metroid

You very evidently have played the game.

She resists Phazon hax but Phazon is still a strong soul-destroying beam. You can’t “resist” stronger opponents beating you up.

And it didn't happen, we know what happened.

Yes, Dark Samus after being pumped full of essence disrupting Phazon and in her weakest form, tanked the collapse of an entire dimension, seems like sound logic.

You realize her tanking it wouldn't even be like 8-C right?

Never said they were the same, but the fact that both Dark Aether and the Darkburst dimension are both referred to as dark worlds, the only ones in the series introduced in the same game, hints at a correlation.

Youre arguing the same. They aren't, we know they aren't because it can be used in DA.

The OP and you discussed both the possibility of escaping DA by flying upward and tanking DA’s collapse earlier.

No? Read what's actually stated dog. Case and point, the shit you quoted, isn't us saying that.

The planet would have had a chance of surviving if he used a significant portion of the energy and defeated Samus, if would have zero chance if he didn’t boost himself with significant energy to defeat Samus.

Stop making stuff up, once more and this is staff only.
We know he didn't use it all, end of.

And you even agreed it can regenerate, albeit slowly.

50 years, by recollecting that. Is NOT 0.1 seconds like it'd need to be for them to scale. We know he didn't use it all because it's still full IMMEDIATELY after he dies.

Yes, and by endgame Samus does get half, halves are not always equal, if you split a grapefruit in two but have a big and small portion, those are still two halves of a whole.

I ask you to no longer comment.

You’ve been going on saying that Samus needed to restore “all” the energy to fully save Aether, now you’re saying it’s okay if the emperor uses some, pick a side.

Dude, I'm saying the amount he used was so negligible it literally did not matter. Damn he used 0.0000000001%, how will they ever recover?
You're arguing he used a meaningful amount in order to scale, yet we know any meaningful amount is actively bad and nobody there wants that and we know he didn't because it's still there to give to U-Mos in its effective entirety.
There's no debate to be had here.

We never get an indicator of how long the regeneration process takes, so saying it’s 50 years is disingenuous. And people don’t have to use all the energy every second to scale,

No they literally must, the AP value is for the total energy not some miniscule infinitesimal unknown fraction.

This is like arguing someone scales to a nuclear reactor's full energy output, by using like, 0.1% of it each attack.

And no, we know, for a fact, it lasted a long ass time, Luminoth died due to it.

the Luminoth could utilize the Light for multiple blasts without draining the entirety.

Yeah, and those blasts, don't scale to the entirety, they scale to the amount they used.

Yes, when it’s 100% gone, not at 80% or 90% gone, this doesn’t deconfirm the Emperor using a significant non-total amount of the light.

80% and 90% is cataclysmic and would result in the end of the world, albeit not instantly but they'd be doomed for the most part, we know this because that's LITERALLY what's happening over on Light Aether.

If the suit contained no amount of the light of Aether then why is U-Mos straight saying the light “energizes” the suit,

Hmm? Nobody said no LoA was involved, it's just, ya know, actually prove it it's applying to AP and stats? You can't, they don't state that.
In context, it protects from ailments, like a walking light.
We know she isn't using it to amp, because it'd be expended very quickly too, so even if she was, she isn't using any meaningful amount each attack.

to energize means to power up or boost

No, it doesn't?

, so the light is going into the suit.

We know, for a FACT it isn't all of it dude.

Moreover, if the transfer module Samus has can hold a significant chunk of the light of Aether within itself without overloading, then a suit energized by the light of Aether itself should be capable of carrying a comparable amount of light, since we know light energy did go into the suit.

We know it didn't, it's LITERALLY still in U-Mos energy module, at the temple, that if ya scan, says "hey it's like almost full lmao". Ie, Samus suit, quite literally, doesn't have a meaningful amount, the game even confirms it.

The transfer module even goes into and fuses with Samus, so we know that her suit is the element holding the energy within..

So? To scale she needs to use it every attack, she doesn't, we know she doesn't. We know she doesn't have the majority, we know she isn't using it, we know she returns it all, we know if used it's just gone for good and needs to be replenished, etc. Every actual confirmed fact, contradicts your claims.

 

[Chariot190]

Yeah, if the suit really did only contain a tiny fraction of the LoA, why did U-Mos wait until after all of the regional controllers were restored before handing it over? Why not just give it to Samus immediately, or after the first controller was restored, unless the suit required the potency of all 3 regional controller light sources+the main temple one to be created.

Maybe because she needed it to go collect temple keys and go places were she couldn't to get the last bit?

Dude, we know, for a fact, she doesn't have it all, or even close, because the game tells us she doesn't, he does.

 

[JJSliderman]

Maybe because she needed it to go collect temple keys and go places were she couldn't to get the last bit?

Dude, we know, for a fact, she doesn't have it all, or even close, because the game tells us she doesn't, he does.

Literally could have been done at any time after Torvus Bog by your logic, she had all the tools she needed at that point “besides” the light suit.

 

[Chariot190]

Literally could have been done at any time after Torvus Bog by your logic, she had all the tools she needed at that point “besides” the light suit.

And? It didn't, this does not mean you get to make stuff up that is objectively false. The LoA is quite literally in the temple still, and at nigh capacity given scans.

She doesn't have it all, or even the majority, this is simply how it is. Why didn't U-Mos do it before? **** idk, maybe he didn't wanna play his cards all at once to some literal who? What if she dies and even that little bit gets taken? Maybe he wanted the planet stable first? What if anything?

Who knows, we don't, so let's stop making up headcanon. End of the day, she simply doesn't because the game says and shows she doesn't, that's all that matters, your conjecture won't change the fact that is the case.

 

[Deagonx]

As an energy source meant to be an alternative to a sun, the energy is constantly regenerating

This is a complete non sequitur. Not only is linking to a wiki entry not a valid way to present this information, but (a) Suns do not regenerate energy and (b) this does not fix the reasons why the energy literally cannot be regenerating at a rapid pace due to how that breaks the plot of the game in multiple ways.

 

[JJSliderman]

And it didn't happen, we know what happened.

We know her particles floated to space and that’s it, nothing about the journey or path they took.

You realize her tanking it wouldn't even be like 8-C right?

Well okay, fair enough.

No? Read what's actually stated dog. Case and point, the shit you quoted, isn't us saying that.

What’s this then;

1. “It's straight-up stated that Dark Samus survived the destruction of Dark Aether because her particles floated into space, and she regenerated from that (Source).”

I ask you to no longer comment.

Well, I don’t have to listen to you in this regard, I’m sorry.

Dude, I'm saying the amount he used was so negligible it literally did not matter. Damn he used 0.0000000001%, how will they ever recover?
You're arguing he used a meaningful amount in order to scale, yet we know any meaningful amount is actively bad and nobody there wants that and we know he didn't because it's still there to give to U-Mos in its effective entirety.
There's no debate to be had here.

Literally all we have is the orb at the end of the fight, we don’t know how much he used or if the size of the orb makes a difference to how much was used.

No they literally must, the AP value is for the total energy not some miniscule infinitesimal unknown fraction.

This is like arguing someone scales to a nuclear reactor's full energy output, by using like, 0.1% of it each attack.

Which points to the fact that the Light Suit needs to be energized by 3 energy controllers and the main controller to function, aka about half the energy, before it even works, and doesn’t work before then. If it was an infinitesimal fraction, then it could have been done as soon as Samus arrived in the temple.

And no, we know, for a fact, it lasted a long ass time, Luminoth died due to it.

Luminoth died primarily from the battle with the Ing, not because of diminished resources from the Leviathan attack.

80% and 90% is cataclysmic and would result in the end of the world, albeit not instantly but they'd be doomed for the most part, we know this because that's LITERALLY what's happening over on Light Aether.

Yes, maybe eventually it would end the world via natural disasters as a “prolonged process”, which the Ing could stop by just stealing the light back after killing Samus.

Hmm? Nobody said no LoA was involved, it's just, ya know, actually prove it it's applying to AP and stats? You can't, they don't state that.
In context, it protects from ailments, like a walking light.
We know she isn't using it to amp, because it'd be expended very quickly too, so even if she was, she isn't using any meaningful amount each attack.

The fact that the suit only becomes active when all 3 regional controllers+the main controller are active on LA when Samus had everything she needed after Torvus Bog says to me that a significant amount of light energy was needed for the suit, otherwise why wait that long when giving it to Samus earlier would speed up the process. You say that U-Mos didn’t wanna give the suit to a “who”, even though by this point Samus had demonstrated she could take out two temple guardians and hordes of Ing on her own, and by your logic the amount of light in the suit was minuscule and didn’t matter.

No, it doesn't?

We know, for a FACT it isn't all of it dude.

We know it didn't, it's LITERALLY still in U-Mos energy module, at the temple, that if ya scan, says "hey it's like almost full lmao". Ie, Samus suit, quite literally, doesn't have a meaningful amount, the game even confirms it.

Except, no, the energy controller was not at full power in the sense of having the totality of all planetary energy on Aether, because it didn’t. A large chunk was still in the dark world. So, “full power” has to be referring to something else.

So? To scale she needs to use it every attack, she doesn't, we know she doesn't. We know she doesn't have the majority, we know she isn't using it, we know she returns it all, we know if used it's just gone for good and needs to be replenished, etc. Every actual confirmed fact, contradicts your claims.

You’re contradicting yourself, you say that Samus didn’t have a significant portion because she couldn’t have in order to have enough energy to save Aether, then also turn around and say the energy can be replenished, which would allow Samus to use up some of the energy and still save the planet in the long run.

 

[Chariot190]

We know her particles floated to space and that’s it, nothing about the journey or path they took.

Prime 3 exists

Well okay, fair enough.

“It's straight-up stated that Dark Samus survived the destruction of Dark Aether because her particles floated into space, and she regenerated from that (Source).”

A statement saying her tanking it doesn't mean shit, there's more dude. I think it should be evident there's gonna be some sort of DS regen downgrade.

Well, I don’t have to listen to you in this regard, I’m sorry.

You probably should unless you want to ruin this for everyone. Your constant conjecture and half baked nonexistent replies aren't sufficient, if you continue to do so, this thread will need to be restricted, and nobody wants that.

Literally all we have is the orb at the end of the fight, we don’t know how much he used or if the size of the orb makes a difference to how much was used.

Yeah, except, it's energy? Energy not even contained in stuff? of course it'd be bigger if there's more of it, it doesn't have an excuse like being in a module. It isn't even abstract energy.
Also, "we don't know how much he used", you know this means we can't scale it to him right? A requirement is to know he had it all.

Which points to the fact that the Light Suit needs to be energized by 3 energy controllers and the main controller to function, aka about half the energy, before it even works, and doesn’t work before then. If it was an infinitesimal fraction, then it could have been done as soon as Samus arrived in the temple.

Conjecture, again, for the umpteenth time.

It isn't, if it WAS, then said places would be ******. And would begin decaying, like they were, when they didn't have sufficient energy routed to them. This is not te case, the game even says this is not the case.

There's nothing to argue here, the game tells you he has most of it still, that the required amount is being routed between places (which he can't do if he GAVE that shit to her), and we SEE that he still has it. You're wrong, stop arguing it.

Luminoth died primarily from the battle with the Ing, not because of diminished resources from the Leviathan attack.

Keyword, primarily, the fact any Luminoth died off due to cataclysms, and diminished resources means that shit did not regen in like 0.1 seconds.

es, maybe eventually it would end the world via natural disasters as a “prolonged process”, which the Ing could stop by just stealing the light back after killing Samus.

No it'd be exceptionally quick because we're told it'd be quick, U-Mos was straight ****** when Samus showed up, the planet had little time left even with the energy he had, which was above your aforementioned 10%.

The fact that the suit only becomes active when all 3 regional controllers+the main controller are active on LA when Samus had everything she needed after Torvus Bog says to me that a significant amount of light energy was needed for the suit,

And it doesn't for me, because they don't actually say that and in fact state the opposite, your assumption is demonstrably false.

otherwise why wait that long when giving it to Samus earlier would speed up the process.

Don't know and don't care, point is it doesn't matter, because we know it isn't true.

You say that U-Mos didn’t wanna give the suit to a “who”, even though by this point Samus had demonstrated she could take out two temple guardians and hordes of Ing on her own, and by your logic the amount of light in the suit was minuscule and didn’t matter.

And? Maybe you don't quite understand. We know she wasn't given a meaningful amount, because we're told he has it, we see that he has it, we know he has the majority because it's being routed to the places he couldn't before because he didn't have enough, the scan visor says he as like all of it, and so on. There's noting to say, your assumption, is false, because the game says the opposite, end of.

Not only that, she'd still be expending it every attack, so whatever small amount she had, she obviously isn't using all at once.
And this is under the assumption she even CAN use it like, and not like what the game actually tells us she can do with it.

Like damn, best case scenario here is Samus has a negligible fraction of a 5-B energy source that she uses a negligible fraction of each attack.
Like what are we looking at here? 7-C? 6-C? Completely unknown and negligible, giving you the benefit of the doubt.

Yes, maybe eventually it would end the world via natural disasters as a “prolonged process”, which the Ing could stop by just stealing the light back after killing Samus.

Not if she's using it like he is dog.
Your arguments don't even coincide with each other.

Except, no, the energy controller was not at full power in the sense of having the totality of all planetary energy on Aether, because it didn’t. A large chunk was still in the dark world. So, “full power” has to be referring to something else.

Keyword, almost, near, etc. It isn't at its peak, but it's getting there.
When Samus gets that last bit, it's now peak.

You’re contradicting yourself, you say that Samus didn’t have a significant portion because she couldn’t have in order to have enough energy to save Aether, then also turn around and say the energy can be replenished, which would allow Samus to use up some of the energy and still save the planet in the long run.

We literally already had this argument dude. Pay attention.
Samus can't replenish that shit, at all, not only can she not gather the right type of energy, and the energy she does gather we know gets used for like, ammo and shit, which she uses up and has a hard cap on and works on a completely unrelated scale to a hypothetical LoA bullshit given it works the exact same as in Dark Sit and Varia, but you expect her to replenish it so it's back to full, within the literal seconds between attacks or tanking damage, where she does absolutely nothing to get it back, or the at max minutes between Ing and DS and then handing it over where it's full? And it being replenished, taking at least long enough for Luminot to die as a byproduct of it having been used, means it ain't quick, and thus, doesn't apply or can be used as a counterpoint.
Same with Ing, his ass was not replenishing it, yet it's back to normal to where when Samus hands it over it's the expected amount?

This isn't just headcanon, it's blatantly ignoring the source.

 

[JJSliderman]

Prime 3 exists

Having mid godly regen doesn’t change the plot of prime 3 at all.

So even when I agree with you it’s still a problem somehow, okay.

A statement saying her tanking it doesn't mean shit, there's more dude. I think it should be evident there's gonna be some sort of DS regen downgrade.

She could have tanked it, but the fact she was stuck in that dimension while it was erased alongside the Ing (who did completely get annihilated), along with Dark Samus’ regen profession from Prime 1 to 2, showcases low-godly can also work, given she regenerated after being inside an erased dimension.

You probably should unless you want to ruin this for everyone. Your constant conjecture and half baked nonexistent replies aren't sufficient, if you continue to do so, this thread will need to be restricted, and nobody wants that.

How is it all my fault if you don’t really source anything either.

Yeah, except, it's energy? Energy not even contained in stuff? of course it'd be bigger if there's more of it, it doesn't have an excuse like being in a module. It isn't even abstract energy.
Also, "we don't know how much he used", you know this means we can't scale it to him right? A requirement is to know he had it all.

It was inside a module though, the entire thing was an energy controller the emperor wrapped his mouth around, that’s what the log entry says.

Conjecture, again, for the umpteenth time.

It isn't, if it WAS, then said places would be ******. And would begin decaying, like they were, when they didn't have sufficient energy routed to them. This is not te case, the game even says this is not the case.

There's nothing to argue here, the game tells you he has most of it still, that the required amount is being routed between places (which he can't do if he GAVE that shit to her), and we SEE that he still has it. You're wrong, stop arguing it.

Literally how would the places begin decaying if the light was no longer under the control of the dark world. Now that it’s in the controllers, the energy is regulated and everything can be distributed properly. They don’t even have the full amount of light energy, and yet it still calls the receptacles at “full power”, that alone showcases that ifs not about the amount of light of Aether.

Keyword, primarily, the fact any Luminoth died off due to cataclysms, and diminished resources means that shit did not regen in like 0.1 seconds.

Since when do they say it was due to diminished resources? Almost all of the Luminoth deaths are attributed to Ing attacks.

No it'd be exceptionally quick because we're told it'd be quick, U-Mos was straight ****** when Samus showed up, the planet had little time left even with the energy he had, which was above your aforementioned 10%.

They were still in a survivable state though, the planet wasn’t going to disappear into oblivion in 5 minutes, they had the necessary planetary energy to continue existence.

And it doesn't for me, because they don't actually say that and in fact state the opposite, your assumption is demonstrably false.

The Light Suit objectively cannot be obtained canonically without first restoring the planetary energy of Aether to at least half. Not a portion of half, not “beginning of game” levels of energy, but specifically in the endgame. The way the light suit cutscene is framed is that the suit is unable to be collected without first acquiring enough planetary energy to energize it.

Don't know and don't care, point is it doesn't matter, because we know it isn't true.

You keep saying that even though the energy in the controllers can regenerate energy to a degree and we know that “full power” doesn’t refer to amount of light energy.

And? Maybe you don't quite understand. We know she wasn't given a meaningful amount, because we're told he has it, we see that he has it, we know he has the majority because it's being routed to the places he couldn't before because he didn't have enough, the scan visor says he as like all of it, and so on. There's noting to say, your assumption, is false, because the game says the opposite, end of.

Not only that, she'd still be expending it every attack, so whatever small amount she had, she obviously isn't using all at once.
And this is under the assumption she even CAN use it like, and not like what the game actually tells us she can do with it.

Like damn, best case scenario here is Samus has a negligible fraction of a 5-B energy source that she uses a negligible fraction of each attack.
Like what are we looking at here? 7-C? 6-C? Completely unknown and negligible, giving you the benefit of the doubt.

No, because if Samus was only getting a tiny boost from the light of Aether, again, there is literally zero reason U-Mos couldn’t just give Samus the suit at the start. The suit was inside the main energy controller all along, and it would literally only be a benefit to do so. U-Mos recognizes Samus as a capable warrior and she has the energy transfer module that is the ONE thing that can save the planet, and he knows that he can’t use the module due to not having the capacity to reclaim the energy, so Samus is the only chance. Not giving the LS to her at the earliest opportunity is stupid on his part.

Not if she's using it like he is dog.
Your arguments don't even coincide with each other.

Energy recharges over time by absorbing from the environment, this process has been going for 50 years and is why the planet is still livable despite starting from a position of low energy and having it continuously stolen, etc.

Keyword, almost, near, etc. It isn't at its peak, but it's getting there.
When Samus gets that last bit, it's now peak.

It does not say almost in the scan of the main controller post-Light suit, it says “running at full power”. Now you’re twisting the words.

We literally already had this argument dude. Pay attention.
Samus can't replenish that shit, at all, not only can she not gather the right type of energy, and the energy she does gather we know gets used for like, ammo and shit, which she uses up and has a hard cap on and works on a completely unrelated scale to a hypothetical LoA bullshit given it works the exact same as in Dark Sit and Varia, but you expect her to replenish it so it's back to full, within the literal seconds between attacks or tanking damage, where she does absolutely nothing to get it back, or the at max minutes between Ing and DS and then handing it over where it's full? And it being replenished, taking at least long enough for Luminot to die as a byproduct of it having been used, means it ain't quick, and thus, doesn't apply or can be used as a counterpoint.
Same with Ing, his ass was not replenishing it, yet it's back to normal to where when Samus hands it over it's the expected amount?

She can literally replenish it by putting it back in the energy controller, that’s the controller’s job. Same with Emperor Ing, he’s sitting on an energy controller.

 

[JJSliderman]

I’ll admit though, it does feel like scaling to the LoA is sort of pointless since it’s 5-B max anyway.

There might be another way to get star level but I’ll save that for another time.

 

[Chariot190]

Having mid godly regen doesn’t change the plot of prime 3 at all.

Im saying Prime 3 has a bunch of extra info?

So even when I agree with you it’s still a problem somehow, okay.

Dont waste time.

She could have tanked it

Could have is not did.

, but the fact she was stuck in that dimension while it was erased alongside the Ing (who did completely get annihilated),

Who said it was? It collapsed?

along with Dark Samus’ regen profession from Prime 1 to 2,

With statements and explanations given. You can't assume literal multiple infinite bounds past that just because. Hell she even has a anti-statement.

showcases low-godly can also work, given she regenerated after being inside an erased dimension.

Dude, the feat is like 8-C maybe due to ISL. We see that her particles still existed, we're told her particles reformed. You're adding in a whole extra bit of wank there. Due to a dimensional collapse, that is like 5-B at best, assuming she took it all (she didnt).

How is it all my fault if you don’t really source anything either.

Huh? Everything I've noted has been linked, at some point, in this thread?
Do I really need to link the final boss death every other sentence or something? No. I don't.

You on the other hand, are quite frankly just making stuff up, I've asked and given you a chance to post a statement a dozen times, that's on you.
The burden of proof here, is on you to prove all these claims man.

It was inside a module though, the entire thing was an energy controller the emperor wrapped his mouth around, that’s what the log entry says.

Yeah and then he died and Samus just kinda sucked it up.
Funny you mention that though, the scan literally also says him draining it is a continuous process, aka, he ain't using it all at once.

Stop making stuff up.

Literally how would the places begin decaying if the light was no longer under the control of the dark world.

Because according to you Samus has it? If they don't have it, they'd stay ****** up, it doesn't matter who has it.
And we know because we see as such.

Now that it’s in the controllers, the energy is regulated and everything can be distributed properly.

Exactly, meaning she doesn't have it.

They don’t even have the full amount of light energy, and yet it still calls the receptacles at “full power”,

It doesn't, it says near yes? If I'm misremembering, then goddamn, she might not even have a small amount. That's BAD for your argument.

that alone showcases that ifs not about the amount of light of Aether.

The literal plot of the game.

Since when do they say it was due to diminished resources? Almost all of the Luminoth deaths are attributed to Ing attacks.

Dog, cataclysms, at least one even starved.

And there, again, "almost all".

They were still in a survivable state though, the planet wasn’t going to disappear into oblivion in 5 minutes, they had the necessary planetary energy to continue existence.

They WEREN'T. Even the space pirates say the planet is gonna be gone soon. They were doomed. They LITERALLY didn't have enough to continue existence, the planet was failing.

The Light Suit objectively cannot be obtained canonically without first restoring the planetary energy of Aether to at least half. Not a portion of half, not “beginning of game” levels of energy, but specifically in the endgame. The way the light suit cutscene is framed is that the suit is unable to be collected without first acquiring enough planetary energy to energize it.

Dude, none of that matters. We know it didn't have it all, we know it isn't the majority. The game disagrees with you. You can make up whatever you want to go "see it makes sense!", it doesn't matter if we're flatout told the opposite. It isn't even the game being inconsistent, they just straight up don't do what you're saying they do.

You keep saying that even though the energy in the controllers can regenerate energy to a degree

They can't, you made this up, post a statement. It's made abundantly clear that shit can't, gathering more over time ISN'T regenerating.

and we know that “full power” doesn’t refer to amount of light energy.

It does when we know it has to be enough to sustain and route energy to all 3 regions, which it is quite literally doing, and as we know the amount he had prior, wasn't enough to do even 1 other region. Well, do I need to elaborate further?

No, because if Samus was only getting a tiny boost from the light of Aether, again, there is literally zero reason U-Mos couldn’t just give Samus the suit at the start.

I can think of several, like the fact why the hell would he want to give any at all?

The suit was inside the main energy controller all along, and it would literally only be a benefit to do so.

"We needed stronger weapons, better armor. We withdrew from Dark Aether while our greatest minds devised new engines of war."
" The Energy Transfer Module, a device designed to recover our lost planetary energy, was ready at last. A force of our greatest warriors was assembled, each equipped with the best armor and weaponry available. We sent this brave cadre of fighters to invade the Sky Temple and seize the missing energy lying within."
"That last hit breached my armor. The poison spreads. "
The Luminoth invented armor immune to Dark Aether's toxic effects, damn why didn't U-Mos give Samus this right away too? Even worse if this stuff is just Light Suit expies (only armor in game actually immune to DA). Were they all using LoA too?

Who knows, who gives a shit. Point is we know she didn't have it all, end of.

U-Mos recognizes Samus as a capable warrior and she has the energy transfer module that is the ONE thing that can save the planet, and he knows that he can’t use the module due to not having the capacity to reclaim the energy,

Damn sucks that Samus and Ing use it all even tho all he wants is it back.

so Samus is the only chance. Not giving the LS to her at the earliest opportunity is stupid on his part.

Why didn't he give her all the weapon upgrades, DA immune suits and more right away too?

You're trying to justify shit, we know simply isn't true. It doesn't matter what you think does, or doesn't make sense, it is how it is.

Energy recharges over time by absorbing from the environment,

Which she doesn't do, Ing doesn't do, and isn't an instant process (How the **** are they getting 5-B energy back every few seconds from draining like tier 6 and 7 stuff at best?)

this process has been going for 50 years and is why the planet is still livable despite starting from a position of low energy and having it continuously stolen, etc.

FIFTY YEARS. Is not a few seconds.

It does not say almost in the scan of the main controller post-Light suit, it says “running at full power”. Now you’re twisting the words.

Are we even talking about the same scan? But hey, that's even worse, you're flflat-outrong then. The Temple Module was peak condition. She has like none of it then.

She can literally replenish it by putting it back in the energy controller, that’s the controller’s job.

No, the controller's job is to regulate it, and give it to places where it needs to go.
"Our greatest minds devised a way to preserve and regulate the remaining planetary energy - the Energy Controllers."
"The main Energy Controller was built in the Great Temple: three sub-controllers were built in the temples of Torvus, Agon, and Sancuary. They collected the energy of Aether, then radiated it over the world to all who needed it. In time we came to call this precious energy the "Light of Aether." It brought an age of peace and prosperity to the Luminoth."
"Nothing worked. Our efforts placed a great strain on the Energy Controllers, and weakened Aether. "

Where does it say it's job is to do that?
Everything it says, the game shows us, like the radiated part, if ya scan it at the end game tells ya that, hell that's how ya can fast travel even. They don't state or show what you claim it can do. And the worst part is, you're only arguing this, to justify something else they never actually state or show. It's a chain of conjecture, some of which is provably wrong.

Same with Emperor Ing, he’s sitting on an energy controller.

Which it can't do. I told you to post a scan.

I’ll admit though, it does feel like scaling to the LoA is sort of pointless since it’s 5-B max anyway. There might be another way to get star level but I’ll save that for another time.

Do not reply, unless you can post an actual statement saying it's constantly regenerating, and does so in huge batches to where they can expend it without issue and it instantly comes back.

Even tho
"In time the roar of a wounded planet subsided. The air, though foul, was breathable. Light made its way through the dark veil over our world. Slowly, we ventured out from the shelters of our homes to see what remained of our paradise. What little comfort we gained by surviving was soon shattered, for when we looked outward, all we saw was devastation. Half of the planet's energy had vanished from the Energy Controllers. Aether became violently unstable as a result."
(Aka it literally can't regenerate it, even just half being gone caused the planet to become unstable, if the energy controllers, in your very argument, can instantly regenerate major fractions of energy instantly, why in the actual hell do they care? This is also a case of a huge length of time, we know on impact DA was made and the energy was shifted.
Yet in that whole time, where they were hiding and taking shelter, till when they emerged, the Energy Controller hadn't regenerated it?
"They discovered that this world held the missing half of our planet's energy. "
Sometime later, they still talk as if they're only at half capacity.
"We developed Crystals that brought the Light of Aether to the dark world. Using these Crystals allowed our warriors to explore the enemy lands, to bring war to the Ing. Sadly, the Crystals were not enough. We needed stronger weapons, better armor. We withdrew from Dark Aether while our greatest minds devised new engines of war."
This is damning. Those tiny wee lil crystals ya find throughout DA where ya heal, can be protected and aren't harmed by the environment?
Also contains LoA.
Do they all use the whole ass thing at once? For the like, idk, 200 crystals ya find throughout? **** no, they just use a tiny lil infinitesimal fraction of it, enough to protect from Dark Aether, rendering it safe.
Gee, that's almost exactly like what the Light Suit is stated to do, and is shown to do.
" We decided to build a device to recover our lost planetary energy from Dark Aether. Without this energy, the dark world would cease to be, and our world would be restored to stability."
Them saying the thing just like, moves stuff, not regens it.
"The Energy Transfer Module, a device designed to recover our lost planetary energy, was ready at last. "
Them stating again what it does, simply collect it and bring it back. Mind you, there's been a war, why hasn't it regenerated yet if it can quickly?
"Our studies of the Ing revealed their attacks as dark energy. We built weapons to use this energy, thinking it could overload enemy targets and eliminate them. We soon learned our error, as the Dark Beam was not of great effect on the Ing. We then began to develop a weapon that used light energy. This weapon would dispatch the Ing with terrible efficiency."
"None of the warriors sent to the Sky Temple returned. Our forces searched Dark Aether for them, in vain. Of the Energy Transfer Module, there was no sign. Though saddened, we set out to prepare another mission, to build another module, to try once more to save our dying world.
Why do they need it? Why is the world dying? Why isn't it regenerating? It's been ages since simply half was gone, why ain't it coming back quick enough to where the planet dying is a nonissue?
"Our blood chilled when we learned that the energy within that temple was drained. The Ing had found the Energy Transfer Module, and were using it as a weapon against us."
Why? It'd just regen? They don't need it? As long as they have a tiny bit it'll come back?
"The Ing turned their focus on the Torvus Bog next, sending a vast force to lay siege to the temple there. Thousands upon thousands of Ing were destroyed by our warriors, yet they kept coming until there was no Luminoth alive to offer resistance in Torvus. On that day, the energy of Torvus was taken to Dark Aether, and our hopes for survival grew dim."
They lost more and began to think they were doomed? Why? They still have the main hub and Sanctuary? That's over 25%?
"Our battered forces gathered in the Sanctuary Fortress to prepare for the inevitable siege there. They didn't wait long. Wave after wave of Ing assaulted the greatest of our fortresses, with one goal in mind: to seize the energy there. The Ing turned the machines of Sanctuary against our warriors, and soon all was lost. The energy of Sanctuary was taken by the Ing. Only one Energy Controller remained on Aether.
"What few remained gathered in the Great Temple. There, all but U-Mos, the last Sentinel of Aether, entered into life-preserving stasis. There they would remain, to be released once the Ing were destroyed... or to sleep forever. His people safe, U-Mos prepared for the last, terrible assault. In the silence of the Great Temple, he prayed for salvation, for deliverance from the terror of the Ing."
Literally praying to god.
You're telling me, the energy modules can regenerate huge swarms of energy in moments, yet everything tells us it can't do that.
We also know they use disgustingly small amounts for protection, whether it be light crystals or armor.
And yet you think Samus was empowered the whole of it, and was using it constantly and it just regenerated in mere seconds? Stuff never even stated? While also telling and showing us the Light she gathered was being used and routed across the planet with the main hub being at peak and very clearly still filled with energy she gathered, which we see, a fact we know isn't possible without having gathered each chunk of energy (Ie, a minority of the energy isn't sufficient to route to the other regions).

 

[JJSliderman]

It doesn't, it says near yes? If I'm misremembering, then goddamn, she might not even have a small amount. That's BAD for your argument.

No, it means that “full power” literally does not refer to the actual amount of light of Aether. Because at that point, the controllers DON’T have the full power of the light of Aether, they have a fraction. Ergo, your argument that the chamber having “full power” means that none of the light power was amping the suit is wrong.

The rest is kinda just repeating what was already said and is not getting anywhere clearly so, I’ll stop here cuz it’s pointless to argue, I agree that mass energy conversion doesn’t work so the scaling is irrelevant for a tier boost.

 

[Chariot190]

No, it means that “full power” literally does not refer to the actual amount of light of Aether. Because at that point, the controllers DON’T have the full power of the light of Aether, they have a fraction. Ergo, your argument that the chamber having “full power” means that none of the light power was amping the suit is wrong.

You know they have 4 controllers yeah? And that one already had some of its energy at the start?
You also ignored the fact the energy was being routed to te 3 regions, a fac we know it can't do if it doesn't have the energy needed, which, I didn't before said energy was given back, ie, Samus can't have that gathered energy, because it's LITERALLY being used.

The rest is kinda just repeating what was already said and is not getting anywhere clearly so, I’ll stop here cuz it’s pointless to argue, I agree that mass energy conversion doesn’t work so the scaling is irrelevant for a tier boost.

So? Who gives a damn if it's an upgrade or a downgrade, it should be accurate first and foremost.

 

[JJSliderman]

So? Who gives a damn if it's an upgrade or a downgrade, it should be accurate first and foremost.

Fine, fine. But if the goal is accuracy, then the LoA should probably be above baseline 5-B, since Aether has comparable gravity to Tallon IV which is a massive planet.

 

[Chariot190]

Fine, fine. But if the goal is accuracy, then the LoA should probably be above baseline 5-B, since Aether has comparable gravity to Tallon IV which is a massive planet.

No? Even if that was true, LoA has nothing to do with GBE? As said ages ago, atomizing the whole planet, is just a lil above baseline last I checked, and LoA isn't even that and it def ain't keeping the planet's GBE together.
Gravity doesn't affect anything at all here. Aether could have 0.1g gravity or 10000g gravity, it wouldn't affect the feat.

Besides, where are you getting it's comparable from? They're never even compared.

 

[JJSliderman]

No? Even if that was true, LoA has nothing to do with GBE? As said ages ago, atomizing the whole planet, is just a lil above baseline last I checked, and LoA isn't even that and it def ain't keeping the planet's GBE together.
Gravity doesn't affect anything at all here. Aether could have 0.1g gravity or 10000g gravity, it wouldn't affect the feat.

Besides, where are you getting it's comparable from? They're never even compared.

Samus jumps the exact same height on both planets, isn't that a sign of similar gravity. And if they're similar gravity, they're of similar mass.

 

[Chariot190]

Samus jumps the exact same height on both planets, isn't that a sign of similar gravity. And if they're similar gravity, they're of similar mass.

Man she jumps the same height aboard gravity-regulated ships with normal humans walking around unaided, be real
Also wrong, size effects that just as much.

The planet's own energy supply, once torn in two by the impact, is now stable. The inhabitants of the world, the starborne Luminoth, have begun the long task of mending Aether.

Unrelated but Prime 3 scan stating even with all the energy is a long ass task.

 

[JJSliderman]

Man she jumps the same height aboard gravity-regulated ships with normal humans walking around unaided, be real
Also wrong, size effects that just as much.

I mean, by all accounts Aether appears and acts exactly the same in dimensions as a Tallon IV or a Zebes. But okay. I think most planets Samus goes to have comparable masses so it would be weird if Aether broke the mold.

 

[Chariot190]

I mean, by all accounts Aether appears and acts exactly the same in dimensions as a Tallon IV or a Zebes. But okay. I think most planets Samus goes to have comparable masses so it would be weird if Aether broke the mold.

ZDR, BSL station, Tourian in particular at least, multiple planets in Prime 3, like, every manga planet in S&J, etc.

 

[JJSliderman]

Well I'd say Aether is a little different, given Tallon Metroids are encountered on both it and Tallon IV and they have the same movement ability on both planets.

 

[Chariot190]

Geemers and Shreikbats.
Also Metroids found on like half those places yet don't visually act different, even though half have blatant normal human gravity, hell normal unaided humans like scientists been on a few.

 

[JJSliderman]

Those planets don't have the benefit of surviving a collision with a full grown leviathan like Tallon IV did.

 

[Armorchompy]

I don't think talking about the gravity/mass of Metroid planets is worthwhile RN.

 

[Chariot190]

Those planets don't have the benefit of surviving a collision with a full grown leviathan like Tallon IV did.

So?
Your argument is Aether has the same gravity because it just does and because they act the same and so does she and every planet Sams goes to has insane gravity.
Yet, that logic also applies to places we know have earth gravity, given she jumps the same on a 1g ship or 1g planet, as she does Zebes, and so do the lil fellas.
Secondly, over half the planets she's went to have normal gravity, the high G stuff is the exception, not the rule.

Finally, this actually doesn't matter, gravity doesn't effect LoA's yield, as it doesn't effect the GBE, this ain't at all relevant man.

 

[JJSliderman]

So?
Your argument is Aether has the same gravity because it just does and because they act the same and so does she and every planet Sams goes to has insane gravity.
Yet, that logic also applies to places we know have earth gravity, given she jumps the same on a 1g ship or 1g planet, as she does Zebes, and so do the lil fellas.
Secondly, over half the planets she's went to have normal gravity, the high G stuff is the exception, not the rule.

Finally, this actually doesn't matter, gravity doesn't effect LoA's yield, as it doesn't effect the GBE, this ain't at all relevant man.

It was less arguing about gravity and more just similar mass, since Aether appears the same size as Tallon and survived a full grown leviathan collision like Tallon (which seemingly requires a more massive planet than the Prime 3 ones) and has creatures from both worlds that act and move the same in terms of mobility, and appears made of the same materials as Tallon instead of being some kind of gaseous planet, so they should have similar mass.

 

[Chariot190]

It was less arguing about gravity and more just similar mass, since Aether appears the same size as Tallon and survived a full grown leviathan collision like Tallon (which seemingly requires a more massive planet than the Prime 3 ones) and has creatures from both worlds that act and move the same in terms of mobility,

This is all conjecture, and man, Aether like barely survived,
"The starborne terror burnt through the heavens and struck Aether with an untold might. We all expected the world to shatter... but Aether held. There was great devastation, however. The green plains of Agon were scorched forever, and the forest of Torvus was engulfed and wracked by the sea. The skies burned for days, casting darkness over the land."
They expected the planet to be destroyed, and like, it made Dark Aether. Tallon legit took far, far, better.

This also doesn't matter, I'm not saying that to be mean either, calc wise none of this actually changes the value, it could be true, or it could be even lower than default, it dont matter.

and appears made of the same materials as Tallon instead of being some kind of gaseous planet, so they should have similar mass.

the materials have stated density values and they all normal man

 

[Armorchompy]

Yall, stick to the relevant topic, Aether's GBE doesn't matter cuz nobody scales to it

 

[Armorchompy]

Anyhow, fellas, I think discussion around this has slowed down and there is a fairly clear consensus, so if by tonight (it's morning here) no massive changes happen it should be good to close and apply this.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Anyhow, fellas, I think discussion around this has slowed down and there is a fairly clear consensus, so if by tonight (it's morning here) no massive changes happen it should be good to close and apply this.

Yeah I wasn't really swayed from my original stance. I don't think the Low 4-C stuff is a valid path of AP scaling.

 

[Armorchompy]

'Tis night-time, I am locking and applying (maybe the latter tomorrow since it's later here).