Wave Existence Correction

[Magicomethkuon]

Here I was taking care of the house working on Xenosaga versewide blogs and........Is that the Wave existence from Gears being wrongly scaled to the Imaginary Number Domain from Saga? Is that the Wave existence also being scaled to U-DO fused Albedo....What?

These two franchises are not a shared continuity. There's a number of similar concepts, names, they are written by the same person but there's no confirmation that they are the very same universe. This doesn't work for legal, continuity and cosmology reasons.

This won't downgrade the Wave Existence because its other feats in Gears are probably enough to stay in its tier on their own. But all information that scales it to Xenosaga content is a big misconception that must be removed.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Actually, Abel's Appearance kind of speaks otherwise about Xenogears and saga being different continuities. They're different universes but the same multiverse. Not that I know fully how to explain details, but I have spoke with a lot of people more familiar of the topic that have said otherwise. But I can ask for more details.

 

[Magicomethkuon]

Actually, Abel's Appearance kind of speaks otherwise about Xenogears and saga being different continuities. They're different universes but the same multiverse. Not that I know fully how to explain details, but I have spoke with a lot of people more familiar of the topic that have said otherwise. But I can ask for more details.

No, there is no confirmation of the two being the same. Nor of a shared continuity. It's speculation born from misunderstanding or misconceptions of similarly named concepts across two different continuities. That, and the author paying homage to a series that he can't do anything more with as Square holds the rights.

Xenosaga Abel is a completely distinct entity from Xenogears Abel.

Saga Abel does not even truly exist in the Real Number Domain, it is merely the actualized Real Number Domain form of U-DO's observations of the lower domain being perceived and thus gaining a RND emulation of a form, a Terminal point that RND existences (ergo, human beings) can perceive. This is done so that U-DO can better observe entities (namely, Nephilim) that it is mostly interested in from both sides. With the Abel's Ark Terminal in the IND and Abel Terminal in the RND.

Meanwhile the Abel in Gears was a completely normal boy who had the luck, or misfortune, to be nearby and make contact with the Wave Existence and thus became, the contact. They are similar in appearance and the name is most likely a homage or nod, much like Nephilim has no connection to Ellehayym Van Houten but shares the exact same appearance as a child. But these are not the same entity at all.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

My friend shared more details with me.

Alrighty, so back to this.

For starters, let's just address the elephant in the room. The fact that Xenogears has differences to Xenosaga to begin with is not out of any actual desire on Takahashi's part to make them distinct as opposed to legal reasons, with Xenogears being owned by Square and Xenosaga being owned by Namco (and later Monolith).

Various interviews clarify on this much and basically implicate that had not for the legal situation that the Xeno series is in, Monolith would have basically made Xenosaga as essentially a follow-up to Xenogears

Xenosaga Interview

We talk with the director of Xenosaga, Tetsuya Takahashi.

www.gamespot.com

GS: Is Xenosaga a direct sequel or prequel to Square's Xenogears?

YM: Though the development team is the same, they were previously working under Square for Xenogears, and now they have shifted to Monolith Software for Xenosaga. But with our relation between Square, I think it is difficult for us to say it is a direct sequel or prequel. It's probably more suitable to say that it follows the direction and style of Xenogears.

GS: Watching the trailer, we can't help notice that there are some familiar faces from Xenogears. Are these characters somehow related in Xenosaga?

TT: Now that we are under a different company, we figured we should start everything from scratch all over again. Though there are familiar faces that serve as important characters in Xenosaga, others are more like self-parodies, so we don't really want Xenogears fans to overreact. Like movies, sometimes you have the director of the movie or friend of the leading actor appearing as cameos, so it's similar to that.

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/xenosaga-interview/1100-2823598/

It's also worth mentioning that Soraya Saga (who worked on both Xenogears and Xenosaga) clarifies that they are of the same fictional universe but aren't linear in terms of being sequel or prequel to one another https://www.siliconera.com/soraya-saga-on-xenogears-and-xenosaga/#6ORZdW55TH3Y6CYx.9

Personally speaking, what do you consider is the connection between Xenogears and Xenosaga?I think all Xeno works are, so to speak, like rivers and lakes that once sprung from our mind, eventually became independent. They sure are kin, but not lineal.
The bottom line is that Xenosaga is not a seperate cosmology or universe from Xenogears. They are very much related to one another and are set in the same cosmology. Hell, the events of The Perfect Works basically


Keep in mind, Xenosaga being a "sequel" to Xenogears isn't necessarily contradicted by anything and it's basically supported by both WoG and many other details such as how The Perfect Works essentially connects to Xenosaga or the countless comparisons between them that were intentionally there to convey how Xenosaga is set in the same "universe" as Xenogears


I can go on and on but the bottom line is that saying that Xenogears is fundamentally a different cosmology from Xenosaga is just wrong and also a wild claim considering WoG

But to add more things, Square Enix, Namco, and Nintendo aren't actually words of God regarding any of the Xeno games; those titles belong to Tetsuya Takahashi and Monolith Soft. And while that company has shifted ownership back and forth, they are consistently behind the story and gameplay of every Xeno related game. Also various concepts such as Ether are by lore and definition the exact same thing across all three verses. And the Zohar from Xenogears is like 1 to 1 the same one in Xenosaga; between having the exact same backstory, the exact same purposes, the numerous powers and abilities it shares, and was the lore devise that "Destroyed the entire universe and recreated and/or birth not just the new universe but supposedly an entire multiverse". And in Xenoblade, the Gate/Conduit is the exact same thing in every way only we actually see the very specific cutscene in XB2.

You can argue that Tetsuya is a very repetitive author who happens to know how to rewrite the entire "Birth of the Universe story using the exact same identically named plot devises of the exact same natures and origin stories" where he sometimes hints it didn't just recreate the universe the individual games set in, but an entire infinite multiverse that is often hinted throughout the series'. But it sounds far too alleges too pass this all as mere coincidence. Sure the parent companies own rights to the respective titles, but it's not like they control what Takahashi's intentions are or what's actually intended to be the canon story.

 

[Magicomethkuon]

My friend shared more details with me.



But to add more things, Square Enix, Namco, and Nintendo aren't actually words of God regarding any of the Xeno games; those titles belong to Tetsuya Takahashi and Monolith Soft. And while that company has shifted ownership back and forth, they are consistently behind the story and gameplay of every Xeno related game. Also various concepts such as Ether are by lore and definition the exact same thing across all three verses. And the Zohar from Xenogears is like 1 to 1 the same one in Xenosaga; between having the exact same backstory, the exact same purposes, the numerous powers and abilities it shares, and was the lore devise that "Destroyed the entire universe and recreated and/or birth not just the new universe but supposedly an entire multiverse". And in Xenoblade, the Gate/Conduit is the exact same thing in every way only we actually see the very specific cutscene in XB2.

You can argue that Tetsuya is a very repetitive author who happens to know how to rewrite the entire "Birth of the Universe story using the exact same identically named plot devises of the exact same natures and origin stories" where he sometimes hints it didn't just recreate the universe the individual games set in, but an entire infinite multiverse that is often hinted throughout the series'. But it sounds far too alleges too pass this all as mere coincidence. Sure the parent companies own rights to the respective titles, but it's not like they control what Takahashi's intentions are or what's actually intended to be the canon story.

The entire interview that your acquaintance shared does the opposite of what they are trying to imply, repeatedly proving that they are not set in a similar continuity and there is no official connection. This is like a series being a spiritual successor to another. From the very first question you can see the creator state that it can't be said that it's a direct sequel or prequel.

Now that we are under a different company, we figured we should start everything from scratch all over again. Though there are familiar faces that serve as important characters in Xenosaga, others are more like self-parodies, so we don't really want Xenogears fans to overreact

Same for this question. At a glance we see that they are speaking of no direct connection, a new start altogether and that fans shouldn't overreact about this being a sequel because any familiar faces are at most self-parodies and not a real sequel. This explains things such as Abel existing in Saga and having a child Fei's/Gears Abel appearance but otherwise no connection or similarity in nature of his being.

Personally speaking, what do you consider is the connection between Xenogears and Xenosaga?I think all Xeno works are, so to speak, like rivers and lakes that once sprung from our mind, eventually became independent. They sure are kin, but not lineal.
The bottom line is that Xenosaga is not a seperate cosmology or universe from Xenogears. They are very much related to one another and are set in the same cosmology. Hell, the events of The Perfect Works basically

This never says that they are the same continuity either. Just that they are all works that came from their mind. Same quote, she states that they all became independent. Being kin because they are all works born from the same mind. A single author can have similarities between works but there is no confirmation. Homages, nods yes. But no shared continuity. Xenosaga has its own concepts and its own takes on things. It has parallels and concepts used in their own way.

And while Soraya's name is still relevant, in the same interview she answers that she missed Xenogears but that Saga was a fresh start full of hope.

The bottom line is that Xenosaga is not a seperate cosmology or universe from Xenogears. They are very much related to one another and are set in the same cosmology. Hell, the events of The Perfect Works basically

They aren't. The WoG provided brings all the more stability to my claim. I read, Perfect Works and then Perfect Guide from Saga. There is nothing in Perfect Guide, in the whole database of Saga I and III, nothing in the source material of games to support this conclusion. I'd love if there were. That would add even more complexity to each, but I have no intention to act like it's there when it's not.

Keep in mind, Xenosaga being a "sequel" to Xenogears isn't necessarily contradicted by anything and it's basically supported by both WoG and many other details such as how The Perfect Works essentially connects to Xenosaga or the countless comparisons between them that were intentionally there to convey how Xenosaga is set in the same "universe" as Xenogears

No, there is no WoG connecting the two. The above interview points us in the opposite direction. That said, I'd like to know which part of Perfect Works from Gears connects to Xenosaga in any conclusive manner. If I read it and missed that somehow, I'd welcome being proven wrong with open arms for I am arguing for a fact that I hate. Notwithstanding my circumstances, I don't remember anything connecting Xenosaga to gears or Gears to Saga in the perfect works. This still sounds like misconceptions and conclusions drawn from logical leaping.

I can go on and on but the bottom line is that saying that Xenogears is fundamentally a different cosmology from Xenosaga is just wrong and also a wild claim considering WoG

Once more. Nothing in Gears or Saga draws solid connection. The WoG never connected them and the interview is being interpreted in a way that says they are confirming the two are connected when it is in fact the very opposite.

But to add more things, Square Enix, Namco, and Nintendo aren't actually words of God regarding any of the Xeno games; those titles belong to Tetsuya Takahashi and Monolith Soft. And while that company has shifted ownership back and forth, they are consistently behind the story and gameplay of every Xeno related game.

Square (unfortunately) very much still owns the rights to the continuity of Gears. They can even make a remake of Xenogears any day they want and Tetsuya can not say a word about it. Topic was in a recent Square interview and they were secretive about it. Without a care they added Xenogears in World of Final Fantasy as a boss and a summon, complete with a fully animated revamped KISHIN because they felt like it. So yes, Square Enix IS WoG for Xenogears now, as much as I hate to admit that fact. And Xenogears does not belong to Tetsuya Takahashi anymore. Nor Monolith Soft.

They had WoG for the original work and that's about it. They no longer can touch Xenogears or its continuity no matter how much they may want to do more works or other material with it. Xenosaga and everything from there is a new beginning. Refer to the exact same interview that was linked.

Also various concepts such as Ether are by lore and definition the exact same thing across all three verses.

Actually, they aren't either. Ether in Gears has the Zohar as source of all and though my memory is faint for this last part, it disappears to almost everyone when DEUS is defeated (exception = Fei because Contact). Ether in Saga meanwhile has no connection at all to the Zohar and is a general catch-all terminology for every other thing achieved through supernatural means, scratch that, not even just magic or Gears. Nanomachine treatment that has nothing to do with the Zohar for example is also Ether. Spatial transfer is also called ether. So no. Even if they were and functioned exactly the same, which they are not, an author is entitled to use a similar source of energy across different continuities without that being grounds to say they are the same.

And the Zohar from Xenogears is like 1 to 1 the same one in Xenosaga; between having the exact same backstory, the exact same purposes, the numerous powers and abilities it shares, and was the lore devise that "Destroyed the entire universe and recreated and/or birth not just the new universe but supposedly an entire multiverse". And in Xenoblade, the Gate/Conduit is the exact same thing in every way only we actually see the very specific cutscene in XB2.

The Zohar Modifier (this is important) from Xenogears and the Zohar from Xenosaga, as well as the Twelve Zohar Emulators and the thirteenth replica made by Sellers to act as auxiliary for Omega Res Novae if I recall correctly.....are not the same thing either. Surely the Zohar has taken inspiration from the Zohar Modifier from Gears.

The Zohar Modifier of Gears had the Wave Existence imprisoned within it. Well, not really imprisoned as there is very fair reason to believe that it could have released itself from it, even if that does make an odd point that it was more than alright with obliterating the entire planet with everyone in it, in the aftermath of leaving upon DEUS's defeat. Regardless it powered the Ether of all things. It passively does this all the time.

Meanwhile in Saga the Zohar still has infinite energy but because it acts as Window between domains and the influx of energy upon Activation is immense. This is also a key difference. Passively, the Zohar from Saga does not do anything. It doesn't power abilities except in some cases for God Tiers that use it as a power source (in this sense they can be called a spiritual nod to how DEUS used it in Gears, but entirely disconnected characters use it. At absolute most. Omega Metempsychosis does a nod to it by having some scenery reminiscent of Gears, and potentially Welltal and Vierge looking A. M. W. S. in its hands but these are at most aesthetical).

The Zohar in saga also spends majority of the narrative distinctly outside of reach of space and time, sealed in Old Miltia or dormant. And then we have emulators that also serve entirely different functions such as ignition key to activate the original at their core. So no, they have similarities but are fundamentally different. And once more, even if they were the exact same. Nothing stops an author from salvaging a concept or another across their different works.

This does not mean same continuity on its own. And do not share the exact same history or powers or mechanics of their powers either. On Xenoblade alone I can not provide you with anything since that is the one series still in my waiting list.

You can argue that Tetsuya is a very repetitive author who happens to know how to rewrite the entire "Birth of the Universe story using the exact same identically named plot devises of the exact same natures and origin stories" where he sometimes hints it didn't just recreate the universe the individual games set in, but an entire infinite multiverse that is often hinted throughout the series'. But it sounds far too alleges too pass this all as mere coincidence. Sure the parent companies own rights to the respective titles, but it's not like they control what Takahashi's intentions are or what's actually intended to be the canon story.

Once more, there's no confirmation, proof, or certainty of this. Xenosaga does nothing whatsoever to connect to Xenogears, it does not mention any concept from gears in the way it was in Gears, it revamps things in its own ways and even the occasional visual nod to Xenogears is its own thing that works by its own original Xenosaga rules.

It's not too far to declare that this is not the same continuity. It's the reasonable conclusion, only one that does not rely on speculation and drawing conclusions without confirmation from source material. Finally, even without its name being brought, there are no grounds to the claim. But Square does control the canon of Gears now. None of us wanted that but alas they do.

 

[Bobsican]

I know this may be a hot take, but in the best case scenario of Xenoblade using characters from Xenogears and Xenosaga in a notable way is accepted, then Xenoblade should be deleted from the site as then it'd clearly be using the characters in a manner beyond what Fair Use allows, as much Blue and White got deleted out of similar stuff on that regard, even if never legally taken down.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

My friend said he was going to make more arguments on Discord, however.

I know this may be a hot take, but in the best case scenario of Xenoblade using characters from Xenogears and Xenosaga in a notable way is accepted, then Xenoblade should be deleted from the site as then it'd clearly be using the characters in a manner beyond what Fair Use allows, as much Blue and White got deleted out of similar stuff on that regard, even if never legally taken down.

This is going too far and not at all even remotely comparable. While there have not been many Xenogears terms, Xenosaga is something Namco simply owns the title for; Monolith Soft still officially owns the characters and what not. KOS-MOS, and T-elos appearing in Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is not at all a violation of fair use and it would be hypocritical to jeopardize that while not doing the same thing to basically every Adult Swim cartoon ever made. The official artbook still considers KOS-MOS a creation of Vector Industries and mentions Shion and Allen as characters who worked on her. There's also some Xenosaga trilogy related plots that are implied to be canon to KOS-MOS and T-elos' backstories. Including the quote, "Merge with me!" Followed by "Request Declined". T-elos' personal side quest also mentions they used to be bitter enemies. Also, like KOS-MOS, T-elos is stated to be an artificial blade that was among the only few blades not created by the Architect, but drifted to Alrest from another world. Which follows the ending of Xenosaga Episode III where we see KOS-MOS drifting through space after she floated through some interdimensional portal. Likewise, there is a blue light in the end of Future Redeemed that is implied to be a reference to KOS-MOS.

That, and also we cannot ignore all these facts that make Conduit/Gate 1 to 1 in addition to it originally being named Zohar in the original datafiles.

• They are both Magnetic Abnormal Matter and Perpetual Motion Machines
• They were both found in a lake on Africa (Kenya to be specific)
• They are both described as "Gifts from a Divine Entity"
• They are both considered Ultimate Power sources containing Infinite amounts of "Upper Dimensional Energy"
• They were both used to empower mechs even at great distances
• They were both activated by a brilliant scientist with the intention to "Give Birth to a Universe"
• They both "Destroyed and recreated the universe" but also have details that it clearly effected/birthed more than one universe
  • With even more statements strongly implying the entire multiverse was effected
• They also both originally came from some "Upper Dimensional Plane above the Universe and traditional time and space" the Upper Domain and the "Far Flung Dimension" respectively.

I'll let Neo handle the Xenogears related stuff, but the connections from Xenosaga to Xenoblade are quite blatant, it does not violate anything as Namco literally gave Nintendo the full nod, and/or Monolith Soft is what's more important when discussing the plot/lore. And attempting to delete a "Big verse" just because it shifted parent companies despite having the exact same developers and production team that intends these things is going to far.

 

[Bobsican]

Uh... sources to the claims of Namco "only" owning the title name, with Monolith Soft retaining everything else that'd be relevant here?

AS cartoons generally don't go into that much use of what'd be works legally unrelated into their narrative (feel free to bring examples otherwise), as that'd fall within fair use, what you just described quite leans on the other Xeno games as being intended to have considerable implications to Xenoblade, which'd go beyond fair use IMO.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Pretty sure someone else already explained that on Discord, so I'd ask them.

Though, it is worth mentioning that Nintendo and Namco have a good relationship given the success of Smash Bros.

 

[Bobsican]

If you mean the talk I had with Neo on that, well, he never provided a source on that and instead mainly relied on all the Xeno games having the same author and the intent connecting them, the question would still be on if that'd be valid here given the circumstances of multiple IPs spread across different companies from the start, plus there'd still be the concern of breaking copyright for our purposes, independently of if actual legal action was taken as said before with Blue and White.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Another thing, while I do not know about XB2, but Namco Bandai was credited in the Future Redeemed credits for the Vector Industries logo and the blue light that appeared in the ending. So worst case scenario (In Nintendo/Monolith's side) is that Namco did give Nintendo permission to use it.

There is also this.

 

[Magicomethkuon]

For honesty's sake, Xenoblade I must not comment blindly. First I'd like to expand my knowledge of that branch of Takahashi's works. I'll underline a few things about the license of Xenosaga.

BAMCO loves using the Xenosaga license for a number of things. KOS-MOS's cameos are everywhere, including their favored Tales of..., Project X-Zone or NAMCO x CAPCOM, Soul Calibur and even SUPER ROBOT TAISEN WARS OG SAGA ENDLESS FRONTIER (yes, also developed by Monolith Soft).

The following is personal conjecture based on what I think can happen, so take this as individual take, but I wouldn't be surprised if they managed to connect Xenoblade and Xenosaga in the future in a solid manner. BAMCO is much more willing to be on good terms with Monolith about the occasional cameo and talks. But they do have the license, just more willing than Square ever has been about the potential future of collaborative works coming in the horizon. And yes, they must be credited when a cameo happens.

Unfortunately BAMCO also thinks that Xenosaga as a series wouldn't be profittable so a remake or continuation is unlikely. But they could end up accepting more and deeper connections in the future with Xenoblade. That wouldn't surprise me if it ever happens, or if I find that it already happened once I play the Xenoblade Trilogy as well.

I do have reservations about cross verse scaling if the cameo is all that exists in the end because otherwise we may as well end up scaling KOS-MOS also to the other cameo series. Hello, KOS-MOS that obtains scaling from Super Robot Wars. Nice to meet you!

Gears is a can of worms however that I don't think is ever having the same opportunity.

 

[Magicomethkuon]

My friend said he was going to make more arguments on Discord, however.

This is going too far and not at all even remotely comparable. While there have not been many Xenogears terms, Xenosaga is something Namco simply owns the title for; Monolith Soft still officially owns the characters and what not. KOS-MOS, and T-elos appearing in Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is not at all a violation of fair use and it would be hypocritical to jeopardize that while not doing the same thing to basically every Adult Swim cartoon ever made. The official artbook still considers KOS-MOS a creation of Vector Industries and mentions Shion and Allen as characters who worked on her. There's also some Xenosaga trilogy related plots that are implied to be canon to KOS-MOS and T-elos' backstories. Including the quote, "Merge with me!" Followed by "Request Declined". T-elos' personal side quest also mentions they used to be bitter enemies. Also, like KOS-MOS, T-elos is stated to be an artificial blade that was among the only few blades not created by the Architect, but drifted to Alrest from another world. Which follows the ending of Xenosaga Episode III where we see KOS-MOS drifting through space after she floated through some interdimensional portal. Likewise, there is a blue light in the end of Future Redeemed that is implied to be a reference to KOS-MOS.

That, and also we cannot ignore all these facts that make Conduit/Gate 1 to 1 in addition to it originally being named Zohar in the original datafiles.

• They are both Magnetic Abnormal Matter and Perpetual Motion Machines
• They were both found in a lake on Africa (Kenya to be specific)
• They are both described as "Gifts from a Divine Entity"
• They are both considered Ultimate Power sources containing Infinite amounts of "Upper Dimensional Energy"
• They were both used to empower mechs even at great distances
• They were both activated by a brilliant scientist with the intention to "Give Birth to a Universe"
• They both "Destroyed and recreated the universe" but also have details that it clearly effected/birthed more than one universe
  • With even more statements strongly implying the entire multiverse was effected
• They also both originally came from some "Upper Dimensional Plane above the Universe and traditional time and space" the Upper Domain and the "Far Flung Dimension" respectively.

I'll let Neo handle the Xenogears related stuff, but the connections from Xenosaga to Xenoblade are quite blatant, it does not violate anything as Namco literally gave Nintendo the full nod, and/or Monolith Soft is what's more important when discussing the plot/lore. And attempting to delete a "Big verse" just because it shifted parent companies despite having the exact same developers and production team that intends these things is going to far.

Few corrections here about Saga Zohar.

• They are both Magnetic Abnormal Matter and Perpetual Motion Machines - Actually the Zohar in Saga didn't have any energy or followed any phenomena that could be understood by Lower Domain Terminology. Something like Magnetic Abnormal Matter would be odd, considering this would at most be a phenomenon of the Imaginary Number Domain only if we could equate Magnetic Abnormal Matter to an Imaginary Counterpart of Magnetism and Matter affected by it in the Real Number Domain. Remember, all phenomena in space and physics is contained in the RND, and then any abnormal and freed counterparts or even conceptual can be found in the IND. The Zohar energy is thus even beyond that, a window to the Upper Domain.
• They were both found in a lake on Africa (Kenya to be specific) - Correct. Lake Turkana.
• They are both described as "Gifts from a Divine Entity" - This is a lie in Xenosaga. Wilhelm deliberately created the entire ruse of the Zohar being connected in any way to some sort of grand divine entity for the sake of more easily manipulating the Ormus organization and Margulis. Every time someone in Saga mentions it being from the divine, they have been blinded by Wilhelm's ploys. Any other mention of the power being that of God, as Perfect Guide explains in detail, has not really anything to do with divinity as opposed to simply being power transcendental to the Real Number of the Lower Domain and thus humans are inclined to call all these sources superior to them the power of God.
• They are both considered Ultimate Power sources containing Infinite amounts of "Upper Dimensional Energy" - Correct.
• They were both used to empower mechs even at great distances - Also correct. In Saga thanks to the Vessels of Anima that were made from chaos's body iirc. Does Blade use a similar artifact and reason?
• They were both activated by a brilliant scientist with the intention to "Give Birth to a Universe" - I'm not sure how this would be grounds to connect things but correct, Grimoire Verum did perform link experiments. I don't recall the express intention being the Birth of a New Universe instead of obtaining connection with the Upper Domain by activation for unstated purposes (other than the generic, energies of the above, never before seen! fascination and what they could do). Later on Grimoire changed objectives and was trying to get his daughter back. Or are you perhaps talking of Dmitri Yuriev's attempts to shift to a higher domain with Omega Metempsychosis that used the Original Zohar at its core?
• They both "Destroyed and recreated the universe" but also have details that it clearly effected/birthed more than one universe
  
  • With even more statements strongly implying the entire multiverse was effected.
  This is incorrect. The Zohar in Saga never destroyed the Universe. Its haywire activation might have reached the effect of shifting everything from the RND (destroying all material existence and Gnosifying all the Imaginary number domain of ONE Lower Domain). But even that was prevented by Wilhelm's power, who sealed the planet of LOST JERUSALEM before the phenomena went any further. The range was limited to a single planet. Considering that Wilhelm's entire plan revolves around never allowing the Universe to end and repeating it endlessly, it would be also very strange and a plot hole that makes the narrative implode from every direction if, at some point, he simply let it happen.
• They also both originally came from some "Upper Dimensional Plane above the Universe and traditional time and space" the Upper Domain and the "Far Flung Dimension" respectively. - Actually, the Zohar was there linking the two Domains from the Lower Domain since the dawn of time at the Big Bang. This is self-evident since it serves as window and bridge between domains, yet never seen in the Upper Domain. It was found in a Real Number Domain lake, likely at Wilhelm's instructions because Vector soon got their hands on it. Despite being a failsafe of the Lower Domain, Wilhelm was always aware of it. At one point U-DO, with its Imaginary Number Domain terminal rather than its true unbound Upper Domain form swallows it.

 

[CloverDragon03]

I know this may be a hot take, but in the best case scenario of Xenoblade using characters from Xenogears and Xenosaga in a notable way is accepted, then Xenoblade should be deleted from the site as then it'd clearly be using the characters in a manner beyond what Fair Use allows, as much Blue and White got deleted out of similar stuff on that regard, even if never legally taken down.

No

 

[BestMGQScalerEver]

I know this may be a hot take, but in the best case scenario of Xenoblade using characters from Xenogears and Xenosaga in a notable way is accepted, then Xenoblade should be deleted from the site as then it'd clearly be using the characters in a manner beyond what Fair Use allows, as much Blue and White got deleted out of similar stuff on that regard, even if never legally taken down.

Wtf is this take

 

[Magicomethkuon]

It's a hot take but won't matter at the end of the day, Monolith Soft has already shown with the cameos so far that they wouldn't be taking any content out of Xenosaga without proper negotiation with BAMCO. It's entirely possible that this connection happens but in a way that respects the rights of both companies.

They aren't crazy to try and play a game of copyright infringement against Square Enix for Gears though, of that I'm certain.