A Shrine Maiden tries to seal away a Chaotic Triangle(Kirin{Azure Striker Gunvolt} vs Bill Cypher)

[MysticBrawler]

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/623999505779654656/1174507833174265936/ezgif.com-video-to-gif_1.gif?ex=6567d8a8&is=655563a8&hm=f56087360ed3df4d8deedc2ffdff458fd48a121573011d01361a958d4fc4fb70&
Bill Cipher(Physical Form)

Kirin(Azure Striker Gunvolt)

Distance: 30 meters
Speed equalized
Kirin is not paired with Gunvolt
Kirin's Prevasion is restricted((In Kirin's profile it was noted that Prevasion can be restricted in matches since it can disabled in-verse)
Djinn's Wish and Golden Trillion is allowed
SBA for the rest

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[Smashtwig]

No

 

[MysticBrawler]

No

It's okay if you want to pass on this one. I can handle the arguments for Kirin's side.

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[Unkn0wnAether]

Dear god.

Following, might try to argue for Bill despite not watching GF in a while (never even watched weirdmageddon)

 

[MysticBrawler]

Dear god.

Following, might try to argue for Bill despite not watching GF in a while (never even watched weirdmageddon)

For Kirin her wincon here would be her Layered 4D Sealing/Absorption/Power Nullification(this is from her Radiant Fetters ability), as for Bill I'm not exactly sure what his wincon would be cause while he have a lot of haxes that he could use the only ones that I remember him using in a fight are his Energy Manipulation/Projection/Durability Negation(when he blasted Time Baby) and his Size Manipulation and Additional Limbs(When he fought the Shacktron).

 

[Accelerated_Evolution]

Can she handle Transmutation?

 

[MysticBrawler]

Can she handle Transmutation?

Nope, so I guess that can be his wincon. With that said, Kirin does have resistance to Petrification which seems to be one of the applications of Bill's Transmutation.

 

[Smashtwig]

Can she handle Transmutation?

Depends on what kind, she technically has done so when GV transmuted her into electricity and reformed her, with the same technique as Arc Chain which she does on her own. But that’s really sketchy . She more than likely cant handle trans,utation though

also her sealing is definitely her first move, she pretty much spams the crap out of it until she lands one.


but the thing is is that I’m pretty sure Bill has more resistances than his profile gives him… what happened? Also Precog from Bill, I heard it wasn’t passive from somewhere but if he Precogs he’ll just blast her with all of his hax once he gets that Kirin has a wincon in the first place



based on how things are of how they instant win at any time on round start I guess I can go Incon…? But of course I won’t be surprised if Bill just stomps here either

 

[Unkn0wnAether]

Depends on what kind, she technically has done so when GV transmuted her into electricity and reformed her, with the same technique as Arc Chain which she does on her own. But that’s really sketchy . She more than likely can handle trans,utation

Bill just kinda turns stuff into other stuff, like turning someone into furniture n whatnot

 

[Unkn0wnAether]

regardless bill has a bunch of other stuff to go over so I'll wait for more people to bring them up. dont feel like going incon tho

 

[Smashtwig]

I would agree that Bill would have a million more wincons and I basically have to gaslight myself into giving Kirin a chance, which I’m doing right now, theoretically it doesn’t matter what hax they throw out but who does it first am I wrong- since neither resists? From my POV it seems like they would do it at the same time? Therefore incon

but also a greater pool of powers may result in the increase of the chance of choosing the wrong one that Kirin may or may not (likely not tho) will resist, but Kirin pretty much always goes with her sealing first. Which is pretty much why I'm going incon

 

[Smashtwig]

Wait hol up

Prevasion and Anthem are restricted

Yeah Bill obliterates with AP



But assuming it isn't my crux of my incon argument is mostly what I just said. But along with that, Kirins starting move is sealing, but it looks weak- she throws PAPER at him. Considering Bill's personality I can definitely see him effin around and just let himself get sealed a multitude times if this fight was run like a hundred times in an emulator, and the other would be Bill hopefully pressing the right win button on frame one. His character is chaotic enough where I can't really tell what he really would do in character

 

[MysticBrawler]

Depends on what kind, she technically has done so when GV transmuted her into electricity and reformed her, with the same technique as Arc Chain which she does on her own. But that’s really sketchy . She more than likely cant handle trans,utation though

also her sealing is definitely her first move, she pretty much spams the crap out of it until she lands one.


but the thing is is that I’m pretty sure Bill has more resistances than his profile gives him… what happened? Also Precog from Bill, I heard it wasn’t passive from somewhere but if he Precogs he’ll just blast her with all of his hax once he gets that Kirin has a wincon in the first place



based on how things are of how they instant win at any time on round start I guess I can go Incon…? But of course I won’t be surprised if Bill just stomps here either

That's from her Resistance to Matter Manipulation(Macro-Quantum) right? The description for Atomic Manipulation did say that the users could transmute one thing to another so if KIrin resists the second highest level then she could be resistant to transmutation outright.

This was written in Bill's Weakness: "His precognition needs to be activated and he often neglects to use said power in combative scenarios, presumably due to hubris. " With that said, I think it's safe to assume that it's in-character for him to not use Precognition in a fight.

 

[MysticBrawler]

Wait hol up

Prevasion and Anthem are restricted

Yeah Bill obliterates with AP



But assuming it isn't my crux of my incon argument is mostly what I just said. But along with that, Kirins starting move is sealing, but it looks weak- she throws PAPER at him. Considering Bill's personality I can definitely see him effin around and just let himself get sealed a multitude times if this fight was run like a hundred times in an emulator, and the other would be Bill hopefully pressing the right win button on frame one. His character is chaotic enough where I can't really tell what he really would do in character

I think you're forgetting the fact that Kirin not only has the Elise Image Pulse to give her Mid-Godly Ressurection but alsol the Djinn which would not only give her the benefits of Anthem(i.e. Mid-Godly Regeneration) but also 4D Invulnerability via her Image Pulse.

 

[Accelerated_Evolution]

That's from her Resistance to Matter Manipulation(Macro-Quantum) right? The description for Atomic Manipulation did say that the users could transmute one thing to another so if KIrin resists the second highest level then she could be resistant to transmutation outright.

Does she ever resisted being directly transmuted?

 

[MysticBrawler]

Does she ever resisted being directly transmuted?

She did resist Petrification and she can transmute herself into electricity and reform, but I'm not sure if that would be enough evidence to show that she resists Transmutation. With that said, I think it's safe to assume that Transmutation would work on her if Bill decides to use it.

 

[Smashtwig]

I also agree that if Bill doesn't screw around he'd probably win with whatever hax he has on him, if he presses the right hax win button that is

However, Kirin has, at the very least, survived being turned into electronic data from Gunvolt, though he would also be the guy turning her back- I guess the Elise Image Pulse could do something about that- and technically if you really wanna stretch things, she does actually have Gunvolt Image Pulses that could do it for her, and an Azure Spirit of his that more than likely lets her use the Arc Chain that does the whole self-transmutation thing and back. I should note that Gunvolt can theoretically make just about anything with his Azure Striker (the same thing used to turn Kirin to electricity and back) including all types of matter, energy, and even powers

She also has Below Absolute Zero resist which is also a form of molecular matter manip, Tenjian has used it to turn an apple into ice, so maybe you can do something with that

Also no Kirin doesn't just have the Djinn on hand.

Is Kirin alive when she's transmutated? If not, she can probably revive, if so, she can likely still make her Septima work in... some way- Septimas are thought based so there doesn't need to be any biological process to make things happen most of the time

 

[MysticBrawler]

Also no Kirin doesn't just have the Djinn on hand.

She doesn't? But doesn't she have both Djinn's wish and Golden Trillion in her profile?

 

[Smashtwig]

She doesn't? But doesn't she have both Djinn's wish and Golden Trillion in her profile?

Same reason why she has GV on her file. Is temporary. Ideally you wanna treat Djinn like GV when it comes to Kirin fights, specificying if she has or doesn't have it. Another reason why Djinn is there is because Anthem Kirin is straight up a notable "character" when it comes to GV Powerscaling being the only character able to beat MGV. In a powerscaling debate people would ask the question "What if Kirin went Djinns Wish?" So even if it's not on her on demand it had to be mentioned somewhere

 

[Unkn0wnAether]

Is Kirin alive when she's transmutated?

With the instance I was thinking of, yes. But I couldn't find it on his profile so I guess I'll have to use this scan instead where they're presumably unconscious

 

[Unkn0wnAether]

okay for some reason the scan isn't working on the forums for me so it's just the scan where he turns the gang into banners

 

[Accelerated_Evolution]

okay for some reason the scan isn't working on the forums for me so it's just the scan where he turns the gang into banners

Switch the "static.wikia.nocookie" to "vignette.wikia.nocookie"

 

[Unkn0wnAether]

gotcha, its good now

 

[Smashtwig]

Hm... well making her unconscious is legitimately the best way to deal with this. However, this example in particular kinda seems to take a bit of time? The first snap makes them weirdly unconscious after a second or so, then he takes a whole nother snap to transmute them?

With all my points above you could construct an argument that goes "lmao it takes too long so it could be reversed in time or Kirin seals before that"

Alternatively, when GV goes Anthem he's really only stopped when Kirin wakes up shortly (minutes in gameplay) after she goes down from having no HP (Anthem happens when u die).

This is why I always go incon or Kirin gets stomped. Its a really weird interaction and if it doesnt work i dont see why Bill doesn't stomp, yeah he could eff around and Kirin can get the W by way of arrogance, but at the same time Bill effing around could be hin insta transmuting. Hes too chaotic that it's a 50 50 shot whether he let's himself accidentally get sealed or he just instant wins, but the fact remains that it's up to him whether or not he will instant win

So yeah, stomp in Bill's favor or if we heavily take character into account, incon because Bill effs around in different ways

 

[MysticBrawler]

Same reason why she has GV on her file. Is temporary. Ideally you wanna treat Djinn like GV when it comes to Kirin fights, specificying if she has or doesn't have it. Another reason why Djinn is there is because Anthem Kirin is straight up a notable "character" when it comes to GV Powerscaling being the only character able to beat MGV. In a powerscaling debate people would ask the question "What if Kirin went Djinns Wish?" So even if it's not on her on demand it had to be mentioned somewhere

Hmm, I see. I was under the assumption that she had it by default unless it was specifically stated to be restricted. All right then I'll add that in.

 

[MysticBrawler]

Hm... well making her unconscious is legitimately the best way to deal with this. However, this example in particular kinda seems to take a bit of time? The first snap makes them weirdly unconscious after a second or so, then he takes a whole nother snap to transmute them?

With all my points above you could construct an argument that goes "lmao it takes too long so it could be reversed in time or Kirin seals before that"

Alternatively, when GV goes Anthem he's really only stopped when Kirin wakes up shortly (minutes in gameplay) after she goes down from having no HP (Anthem happens when u die).

This is why I always go incon or Kirin gets stomped. Its a really weird interaction and if it doesnt work i dont see why Bill doesn't stomp, yeah he could eff around and Kirin can get the W by way of arrogance, but at the same time Bill effing around could be hin insta transmuting. Hes too chaotic that it's a 50 50 shot whether he let's himself accidentally get sealed or he just instant wins, but the fact remains that it's up to him whether or not he will instant win

So yeah, stomp in Bill's favor or if we heavily take character into account, incon because Bill effs around in different ways

You think so? Cause the way I see it it seems more likely for this match to be either be inconclusive or a stomp in Kirin's favor since speed is equalized, making them both FTL+ and Kirin's talisman throwing speed is apparently faster than her own speed, which would make her wincon more likely to occur compared to Bill's.

 

[Smashtwig]

You think so? Cause the way I see it it seems more likely for this match to be either be inconclusive or a stomp in Kirin's favor since speed is equalized, making them both FTL+ and Kirin's talisman throwing speed is apparently faster than her own speed, which would make her wincon more likely to occur compared to Bill's.

Either way, it's either Incon or it can't be added to profiles at all

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump

 

[MysticBrawler]

Bump. So is this a stomp or inconclusive?

 

[Smashtwig]

idk, i’d personally drop this one either way. Most of the time Incons aren’t addable either if neither can beat each other or if things aren’t well discussed

 

[MysticBrawler]

idk, i’d personally drop this one either way. Most of the time Incons aren’t addable either if neither can beat each other or if things aren’t well discussed

Well we know that they both have wincons so I'd prefer if the conclusion was that this is inconclusive even if this couldn't be added in. With that said, since it doesn't seem like anyone is interested in continuing this thread I guess it's fine if we just drop this one.