[Witch Must Die Edition] - Yu vs Mikey REMATCH

[Shmooply]

Based off this disaster of a thread. I don't care if the verse might be deleted in the future because I'm an evil and wicked being.

Yu -

Manjiro Sano -

Kiryu tiger drops both (Incon) -

DA RULEZ:
- Roid beast/Yu's third key is being used, Kanto Manji Gang Mi-key is being used
- Speed equalized

 

[Shmooply]

bump

 

[Shmooply]

bump

 

[Viott]

Is this Dark Impulse Mikey?

 

[Dinozxd]

as far as i can understand from the profile, Yu has a 9-A attack. I'd say that pretty much makes his a stomp no?

 

[First_Witch]

>"Witch's days are numbered"

>"Its a Yu matchup and that is not my mental illness"

 

[Viott]

Can Mikey overcome Yu’s ANPR?
If he can’t, Yu will finish him with a single punch.

 

[Dinozxd]

Can Mikey overcome Yu’s ANPR?
If he can’t, Yu will finish him with a single punch.

Dark Impulse Mikey has Accelerated Development which would boost Mikey's speed as the fight goes on. He would eventually blitz him.

I just wanna learn about Yu's "Monster Stance" more as that seems to be the only way Yu can beat Mikey.

 

[Viott]

Dark Impulse Mikey has Accelerated Development which would boost Mikey's speed as the fight goes on. He would eventually blitz him.

I just wanna learn about Yu's "Monster Stance" more as that seems to be the only way Yu can beat Mikey.

There is a huge AP difference. He could finish it with a single punch.

 

[Viott]

Dark Impulse Mikey has Accelerated Development which would boost Mikey's speed as the fight goes on. He would eventually blitz him.

I guess this isn't Dark Impulse

 

[Dinozxd]

There is a huge AP difference. He could finish it with a single punch.

Mikey has the AP advantage vs Yu's base AP. Also Monster Stance only boosts his AP and not dura. Mikey one shots him as well.

I just wanna know the situation when Yu uses monster stance. Like when he gets angry, tired, etc.

I guess this isn't Dark Impulse

Dark Impulse isn't a key. Mikey has access to it in his every key. Kanto Manji Mikey is the most consistent Dark Impulse user too as he always goes into it in every fight.

 

[Viott]

Mikey has the AP advantage vs Yu's base AP. Also Monster Stance only boosts his AP and not dura. Mikey one shots him as well.

He can't get past Yu's ANPR, and Yu can hit Mikey's pressure points.

I just wanna know the situation when Yu uses monster stance. Like when he gets angry, tired, etc.

If I'm not mistaken, when he gets angry and Mikey approaches, he will kill Mikey.

If Mikey attacks when Yu does the monster stance, Yu will win.

Dark Impulse isn't a key. Mikey has access to it in his every key. Kanto Manji Mikey is the most consistent Dark Impulse user too as he always goes into it in every fight.

Ok

 

[Dinozxd]

He can't get past Yu's ANPR, and Yu can hit Mikey's pressure points.

Yu's Pressure Point hits without the monster stance thing ain't doin anything to Mikey tho there's like 300x AP difference between them.

Also another thing to note is Dark Impulse itself is already a blitz worth amp. This is speed equalized so both characters would start at the same speed, then when Mikey taps into Dark Impulse (which he consistently does at the start of his fights), he's gonna have a huge advantage in speed. He can just speedblitz and one shot Yu. If a blitz worth amp is still somehow not enough for him to outspeed Yu's reactions, Mikey's accelerated development would just make his next kick much faster.

If I'm not mistaken, when he gets angry and Mikey approaches, he will kill Mikey.

So it's kinda like a berserk state?

 

[azontr]

This match doesn't work because Mikey is at least 9x stronger than Yu and Yu in this key has no dura neg. Bro was so desperate to start smth he didn't even take a nanosecond to look at the AP before making a match.

At the same time, however, much like the previous match, Yu is still massively better in basically every other category, so Mikey likely isn't hitting him either. So uh, incon, I guess?

 

[Viott]

It would be better if the 4th key is used.

 

[AnonymousStandUser]

Yu’s 3rd key is just Yu from the Santorino fight no ?

 

[Viott]

Yu’s 3rd key is just Yu from the Santorino fight no ?

Yeah.

 

[AnonymousStandUser]

Ok so like…

Mikey is stronger, like way stronger (At least that’s what I find, Yu is seemingly in the 100-200 kilojoule range whereas Mikey is comfortably above 1 megajoule).

Although speed is equalised Yu has the advantage because of his Perception Manipulation but then again Mikey can get faster because of DI amping his speed, likely to a point that Yu’s perception would just be rendered mute.

Things like stamina/ endurance, that goes to Mikey, Yu is basically a glass cannon (that’s been said in the story iirc) whereas Mikey can tank multiple life altering injuries and be fine (kinda)

Combat should go to Yu, his boxing is far more intricate than even Mikey’s karate and kicks.

Overall… I guess Mikey wins ? Unless I’m missing something on Yu’s third key, he’s kinda cooked which is very weird to say.

 

[Dinozxd]

At the same time, however, much like the previous match, Yu is still massively better in basically every other category, so Mikey likely isn't hitting him either. So uh, incon, I guess?

Mikey's massively better stamina, lifting strength and hax wise. Yu outskills him pretty hard but Mikey can get around the speed difference with his stat amp and AD.

It would be better if the 4th key is used.

That would just make the match an AP stomp in Yu's favor tho.

 

[ElajRuengies]

Needs more SANGRIA.

 

[azontr]

Mikey's massively better stamina, lifting strength and hax wise. Yu outskills him pretty hard but Mikey can get around the speed difference with his stat amp and AD.

Again, much like in the previous match, Yu will not be expending much effort to dodge attacks he can basically read like an open book with his superior reactions, AD of his own, and insanely good analytical prediction beyond anything Mikey has to offer. It'd be like dodging punches from an infant for him.

 

[Viott]

When Yu enters his monster stance, if Mikey doesn't dodge Yu's punch, then Yu will be the winner.


Also, Yu can strike Mikey's weakest spot.

 

[azontr]

Monster Stance doesn't increase his AP that much. It's not going to take Mikey out.

Once he realizes doing straight damage isn't going to work, he's just going to keep dodging, which he can very easily do, until Mikey simply tires.

 

[Viott]

Monster Stance doesn't increase his AP that much. It's not going to take Mikey out.

Once he realizes doing straight damage isn't going to work, he's just going to keep dodging, which he can very easily do, until Mikey simply tires.

He damaged J with his monster stance, which is why he's 9-A, and it's already stated in his profile.


The reason J is 9-A is because he can block Yu's monster stance.

 

[Viott]

He can also win by hitting Mikey in the balls.

 

[azontr]

He damaged J with his monster stance, which is why he's 9-A, and it's already stated in his profile.

Whoever edited the profile did it poorly, since it's not actually reflected in the tiering section, which is where most people are going to look at first when opening a profile.

In this case, yeah, Yu stomps. Mikey gets hit once and just dies from an FTE attack from an unpredictable opponent that only gets faster and faster as time goes on.

 

[Viott]

When Yu enters his monster stance, if Mikey doesn't dodge Yu's punch, then Yu will be the winner.

I'm voting for Yu.

 

[AnonymousStandUser]

AD of his own

It's a "possibly" and tbh I do not agree with it, from what I remember Coach K taught Yu how to fight like Yuto's fighting style and from there Yu improved the style so at best it's a very limited form of Accelerated Development.

Mikey gets hit once and just dies from an FTE attack from an unpredictable opponent

1. The AP gap wouldn't allow that
2. "Monster Stance" although FTE fast is also predictable and vulnerable, Mikey should be capable of at least reading the attack

He can also win by hitting Mikey in the balls.

Mikey is shorter so Yu isn't gonna reach all the way down there and , plus he hasn't done anything to Yu personally to warrant such punishment.

 

[Dinozxd]

Again, much like in the previous match, Yu will not be expending much effort to dodge attacks he can basically read like an open book with his superior reactions, AD of his own, and insanely good analytical prediction beyond anything Mikey has to offer. It'd be like dodging punches from an infant for him.

He isn't dodging punches from an infant who can blitz him lol. No matter how good his anpr is, speed blitzing always counters that. Yu's AD seems to be based on skill rather than stats, which wouldn't really do anything as he already outskills Mikey.

Once he realizes doing straight damage isn't going to work, he's just going to keep dodging, which he can very easily do, until Mikey simply tires.

Moving over the fact that this scenario assumes an Athletic stamina guy outlasting a Superhuman stamina guy, making this fight longer would just be in Mikey's favor. His AD would boost his speed even more.

He damaged J with his monster stance, which is why he's 9-A, and it's already stated in his profile.


The reason J is 9-A is because he can block Yu's monster stance.

Wait. So Yu's Monster stance scales to 9-A because he damaged J and J scales to 9-A because he blocked Yu's monster stance?

Am i missing something here? Isn't this circular scaling?

 

[azontr]

It's a "possibly" and tbh I do not agree with it, from what I remember Coach K taught Yu how to fight like Yuto's fighting style and from there Yu improved the style so at best it's a very limited form of Accelerated Development.

It shouldn't be possibly, and K didn't teach Yu anything. That goes against his entire training style, which is to let Yu decide how he moves and fights on his own to bring out the extent of his talent. And even if we consider that Yu learned his fighting style just from video footage, that's even more impressive than doing it with a clear visual of Yuto in reality rather than on tapes.

1. The AP gap wouldn't allow that

Yu is 9-A with Monster Stance, which is over 50x stronger than Mikey's dura. One hit, and Mikey's dead.

2. "Monster Stance" although FTE fast is also predictable and vulnerable, Mikey should be capable of at least reading the attack

It's not predictable or vulnerable. To be a genius in The Boxer, being unpredictable is inherent, and the Monster Stance is the fullest expression of Yu's genius which stands above other geniuses, who are already unpredictable. And not only is it FTE, it constantly goes beyond that speed the more Yu moves and attacks while using it.

He isn't dodging punches from an infant who can blitz him lol. No matter how good his anpr is, speed blitzing always counters that. Yu's AD seems to be based on skill rather than stats, which wouldn't really do anything as he already outskills Mikey.

No, it doesn't. Analytical prediction can explicitly counter speed-blitzes in many cases, especially since Yu has higher perception and reactions than Mikey. Not to mention it's not just skill, Yu also straight up gets faster the more he fights.

Moving over the fact that this scenario assumes an Athletic stamina guy outlasting a Superhuman stamina guy, making this fight longer would just be in Mikey's favor. His AD would boost his speed even more.

As would Yu's own AD. Mikey's expending far more energy to even try and graze Yu while all Yu has to do is just tilt himself in any one direction to easily evade. Mikey's AD doesn't even mention that it allows him to blitz people, he only has that with Dark Impulse, which is an ability, so I don't even understand where you're getting this from.

 

[AnonymousStandUser]

I think the best way to settle this is to compare fights since both characters have fought opponents that have similar abilities and hax.

To start off with Mikey;
Mikey has fought Shuji Hanma, someone who has great kinetic vision which is somewhat comparable to Yu's Perception Manipulation, and blitzed and oneshot him via DI. Mikey has also fought Takemichi who had future sight, which also should be comparable to Yu's Perception Manipulation, and progressively got amped to a point where that ability was rendered mute. The difference is that Mikey hasn't fought anyone that is skilled and/ or layered in abilities like Yu

For Yu;
Yu has fought Jean Pierre and Aaron Tide, both characters with FTE attacks which is something Mikey has. In Jean's fight, Yu made use of his "monster stance" to blitz but even then Jean was still able to survive thanks to his skill and mad willpower. In Aaron's fight, the shear weight and power of his punches was enough to make Yu's arm bleed and be disabled despite Yu's attack redirection. The difference here is that Mikey is not a boxer and that he has a far higher LS than Aaron, as funny as that is, and higher stamina and endurance like.

The way I'm imagining this is basically Yu vs Aaron but Aaron is a kickboxer and he's short and also really insane like Jean.

 

[Viott]

1. The AP gap wouldn't allow that
2. "Monster Stance" although FTE fast is also predictable and vulnerable, Mikey should be capable of at least reading the attack

If the distance is close, it is difficult to escape.

Mikey is shorter so Yu isn't gonna reach all the way down there and , plus he hasn't done anything to Yu personally to warrant such punishment.

If he zips towards Yu, it won't be that hard to do.
No, Yu's third key is that he's in a state of rage. That's why he can do this.

He isn't dodging punches from an infant who can blitz him lol. No matter how good his anpr is, speed blitzing always counters that. Yu's AD seems to be based on skill rather than stats, which wouldn't really do anything as he already outskills Mikey.

Moving over the fact that this scenario assumes an Athletic stamina guy outlasting a Superhuman stamina guy, making this fight longer would just be in Mikey's favor. His AD would boost his speed even more.

Mikey's speed can't increase forever, there is a limit, prove that he increased his speed enough to overcome Yu's ANPR.

He dodges Mikey's attacks and then finishes the job by hitting Mikey's balls

 

[Viott]

Thanks to his ANPR, Yu can dodge attacks from characters who are faster than him. Mikey's speed cannot increase forever; at a certain point, it will stop increasing, and it must be proven that he can get fast enough to surpass Yu's ANPR.

 

[azontr]

You don't have to multi-post. You can make your arguments in a single post, or edit them into your previous post.

 

[Viott]

Why wasn't my vote counted?

 

[Dinozxd]

Spoiler: Replies

No, it doesn't. Analytical prediction can explicitly counter speed-blitzes in many cases, especially since Yu has higher perception and reactions than Mikey. Not to mention it's not just skill, Yu also straight up gets faster the more he fights.

How high does Yu's reactions scale from his combat? If it's not like a blitz higher, then Mikey's stat amp would still outspeed that.

Also Yu's AD speed boosting wise is pretty weak compared to Mikey.

As would Yu's own AD. Mikey's expending far more energy to even try and graze Yu while all Yu has to do is just tilt himself in any one direction to easily evade. Mikey's AD doesn't even mention that it allows him to blitz people, he only has that with Dark Impulse, which is an ability, so I don't even understand where you're getting this from.

The damage of Mikey grazing Yu would be equal to Yu landing like 20 perfect punches in his base form lol.

Mikey canonically has access to Dark Impulse in every key. Kanto Manji Mikey Key is used here, which is the key that Mikey uses DI the most. He mostly activates it at the start of his fights and it stays activated throughout the fight. He even has the ability to use the ability unsuppressed, which just boosts his AP and speed, but it isn't really in character for him to do that unless he's losing.

If he zips towards Yu, it won't be that hard to do.
No, Yu's third key is that he's in a state of rage. That's why he can do this.

Is it like... in character for him to do that? Idk Yu very much but I know that he's a boxer (big shocker) and low blows aren't allowed in boxing yk.

Mikey's speed can't increase forever, there is a limit, prove that he increased his speed enough to overcome Yu's ANPR.

He overcame Takemichi's precog with it. Unless Yu's anpr is somehow better than literally looking into the future, he isn't dodging that.

I'd also like to add that AD isn't Mikey's only ability. He also has fear hax, which he can use to stun people. He also has paralysis inducement and dura neg. With his much superior LS, he can just dislocate his limbs and render him unable to move once he grabs him. He also has the superior acrobatics which would help him close and open the distance between him and Yu when needed. He also has supernatural willpower on top of his already better endurance and stamina. Yu literally has no wincons other than his anpr and monster stance, which i don't really believe is 9-A anymore since my question about it's scaling still hasn't been answered. I already explained how his anpr gets countered by Mikey's AD too.

 

[Viott]

Wait. So Yu's Monster stance scales to 9-A because he damaged J and J scales to 9-A because he blocked Yu's monster stance?

Am i missing something here? Isn't this circular scaling?

He beat many middleweight boxers in a single round. (J)

The person who demonstrated the 9-A feat is the former World Lightweight Boxing Champion.

He overcame Takemichi's precog with it. Unless Yu's anpr is somehow better than literally looking into the future, he isn't dodging that.

Only Takemichi was not too fast to react, and that has nothing to do with ANPR.

 

[azontr]

All of that and it still does not prove that Mikey's AD allows him to blitz. Nothing on the profile implies it's even near the level you're pushing it as. It just allows him to become more skilled faster than anyone else, which is literally baby level to Yu, who became the greatest Boxer of all time with the greatest technique in history just from witnessing a single one-two combo from Coach K. Just because he spams Dark Impulse doesn't make this apply to his AD whatsoever.

Yu's reactions let him dodge punches that would literally be impossible for him to dodge otherwise, and his AD allows him to outspeed attacks that completely surpass his reactions and only allow him to barely deflect attacks, let alone dodge them. He adapts to this kind of stuff in seconds, meanwhile all Mikey does is just get more skilled over time, which Yu not only also does but he does it on an unfathomably higher scale.

The AP gap between them is only 9.2x, enough for a one shot with a direct hit, but a single graze isn't going to actually hurt Yu, our standards on this changed a very long time ago, you wouldn't get pasted just by getting grazed by Mike Tyson even though he's much stronger than you. So even if Mikey somehow gets close enough to maybe fizzle Yu's hair, it's not actually going to do damage.

Put this along with Yu's obscenely layered Analytical Prediction, and reading Mikey like an open book would be an understatement. So long as Yu has 9-A Monster Stance, Mikey simply has no chance of winning. He's just not on the same level.

 

[Dinozxd]

He beat many middleweight boxers in a single round. (J)

The person who demonstrated the 9-A feat is the former World Lightweight Boxing Champion.

This should be stated in the profiles.

Only Takemichi was not too fast to react, and that has nothing to do with ANPR.

Huh? He's literally looking into the future and still got blitzed. That would go the same way if an anpr user was predicting his movements.

All of that and it still does not prove that Mikey's AD allows him to blitz. Nothing on the profile implies it's even near the level you're pushing it as.

It's written on the profile that he blitzed a dude with precog, man.

meanwhile all Mikey does is just get more skilled over time, which Yu not only also does but he does it on an unfathomably higher scale.

This is again, false. Mikey's kid key has AD which makes him develop skill faster. The speed developing AD is in the Dark Impulse section of his ability section. From the profile it looks like Dark Impulse is another key but that's just a designing error by me. He has access to Dark Impulse (and those abilities) in every key.

The AP gap between them is only 9.2x, enough for a one shot with a direct hit, but a single graze isn't going to actually hurt Yu, our standards on this changed a very long time ago, you wouldn't get pasted just by getting grazed by Mike Tyson even though he's much stronger than you. So even if Mikey somehow gets close enough to maybe fizzle Yu's hair, it's not actually going to do damage.

Mikey's AP goes from massively upscaling 1.39 MJ to highly upscaling 4.6 MJ. Idk which ones used here but I assumed it'd at least be 4.6 MJ as his opponent literally has a 9-A move lmao. A dude who's 30x stronger you would 100 percent do big damage with a graze. The difference between Mike Tyson and an average man isn't 30x (it isn't even 5x, probably) so that's just a bad example.

Also I never said Mikey would be able to damage Yu by fizzling his hair cuz like, hair doesn't have nerves?

Yu's reactions let him dodge punches that would literally be impossible for him to dodge otherwise, and his AD allows him to outspeed attacks that completely surpass his reactions and only allow him to barely deflect attacks, let alone dodge ththem.

Also I don't see anything in the profile even implying this

[/SPOILER]

 

[azontr]

It's written on the profile that he blitzed a dude with precog, man.

Dude, if you're talking about Takemichi, then Takemichi isn't even close to being close to comparable to Mikey in stats in any way shape or form, so he wouldn't have been able to dodge anyways. Yu literally is as fast as Mikey and has higher reactions, so he's not going to be able to do that to somehow who can also grow faster.

This is again, false. Mikey's kid key has AD which makes him develop skill faster. The speed developing AD is in the Dark Impulse section of his ability section. From the profile it looks like Dark Impulse is another key but that's just a designing error by me. He has access to Dark Impulse (and those abilities) in every key.

I admittedly missed the Dark Impulse section, but either way, it's still not a good display of AD. Takemichi was slower than him to begin with. Getting fast enough that someone whose slower than him can't beat him with precog isn't impressive.

Mikey's AP goes from massively upscaling 1.39 MJ to highly upscaling 4.6 MJ. Idk which ones used here but I assumed it'd at least be 4.6 MJ as his opponent literally has a 9-A move lmao. A dude who's 30x stronger you would 100 percent do big damage with a graze. The difference between Mike Tyson and an average man isn't 30x (it isn't even 5x, probably) so that's just a bad example.

The 4.6 megajoules is only a possibly rating which isn't being used. This doesn't address the argument either way, getting grazed by someone 9x stronger than you isn't going to do any actual damage, you have to actually directly hit them or else it's just going to brush by, which isn't going to do anything but ruffle Yu's hair.

Also I don't see anything in the profile even implying this

The scan of him being able to dodge punches impossible to dodge normally is on there, but the rest are admittedly shittily applied from years ago, idk why they have not been fixed. But if you want to go see for yourself, the references are there. Yu is cleanly dodging Aaron's punches for an entire fight, but the moment Aaron uses technique, Yu can barely deflect the punches, let alone dodge despite his reactions and predictions, and then immediately afterwards he starts cleanly dodging Aaron's punches again.