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Because, as said previously, it isn't even the 4th universe in Shuffle itself.
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Deactivating Anti-Space-Time attack mechanism limiter... | Sonic Cosmology Downgrade Part 2
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Well no, some minigames are referred to as “accident” games that are confined to specific boards, 4D space has one of those.
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That literally makes no sense because it's not even the forth world they go into in the game (I appreciate the Phineas and Ferb mention, peak show, but the game kinda showed its own context here)
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And that means it's within the 4D space because?
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If ot's confined to a board, than that has to take place in it.
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Because every other accident minigame is confined to its specific board? The riot train ones involve stopping the train, the emerald coast one involves surfing to escape a tidal wave, the nature zone one involves hoop jumping a ring of fire in the jungle, etc.
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Show me, nvm found it.
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ExcelsisBerny
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Just an idea, could we maybe condense the discussions into messages that aren’t just single lines of text? Otherwise, this thread’s gonna hit 16 pages too and become unreadable (and then the staff won’t be able to evaluate things properly).
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I disagree with the OP as well for the same reasons.
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3 staff disagreements now. Grace period reached?
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Here is the emerald coast one
Here is the fire bird one
Here is the nature zone one
Here is the riot train one
Here is the 4D space one
Every single one of these accident minigames features iconography exclusive to their respective board, with the 4-D space one being triggered getting next to the white vortex (which is the centerpiece of the minigame)
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48 hours iirc but its prob already over for bro
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ExcelsisBerny
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I'm leaning towards agreement ngl. The arguments are really weird.
But my vote doesn't count so welp.
But my vote doesn't count so welp.
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Yes because for some reason 4D space is quirky like that (even though it has a white vortex one to one with the version in 4-D space)
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Let's wait for a few more staff votes.
So far...
Agree: 0
Disagree: 3 - Dalesean, Qawsedf, Maverick
Neutral: 1 - DarkDragonMedeus
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Disagree FRA
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- #139
Alright fine, I concede that it's probably referring to 4+1D space after looking at the Japanese and thinking it over. The issue is that we have no proof that it has "non-insignificant" extent in the 5th dimension. It is no different from a multiverse of 4D timelines being ranked as 2-A instead of Low 1-C since there is no proof that the 5th dimensional axis has any "significant" extent.
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I mean the significant extent is that 4-D space is, in itself, a dream world, and also four dimensional space, and dream worlds are already accepted as universal or even infinite in scope, meaning 4-d space in Maginaryworld would be infinite 4-D space, and thus 5-D overall.
Same with Otherworld, its infinite super-dimensional space.
Same with cyberspace, its space directly stated to be beyond quantification while also being 4-D due to being more complex and advanced than Eggman’s Tesseract dimension.
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So the reason the 5D rating exists is because of that +1. The reason a multiverse is usually 2-A is that you have an infinite amount of 3D+1 spaces. If a space is 4D+1 then you have an uncountable infinite amount of 4D snapshots, which means you have a significant 5D axis.
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Says here in the Tiering System FAQ that "Multiversal structures past Low 2-C frequently have a distance of unknown length along a 5th dimensional axis separating them. That isn't automatically Low 1-C, as for Low 1-C the distance must be known to be of non-insignificant size." Despite being infinite and 4+1D, these multiverses are still tier 2 since the burden of proof is to prove that it has a "non-insignificant" 5th dimensional size.
The problem isn't about the time dimension (we assume it to be significant), but the extra spatial dimension.
The same should apply to 4th Dimension Space in Sonic, right?
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The comment you're quoting literally explains why it's a significant 5th dimensional axis...
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Plus the same statement directly says it is infinite... so like
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No it doesn't. The 5th dimensional axis that the FAQ talks about is an extra spatial dimension, which cannot be assumed to be significant. The 5th dimensional axis that Qawsedf talks about is a temporal dimension
That's a temporal dimension. Basically:
4th dimensional space dimensions:
-1st spatial dimension (obviously significant)
-2nd spatial dimension (obviously significant)
-3rd spatial dimension (obviously significant)
-4th spatial dimension (no proof of being non-insignificant)
-temporal dimension (assumed to be significant)
The 4th spatial dimension is the 5th axis that the Tiering System FAQ talks about (it can't be talking about the temporal dimension because that's assumed to be significant on this wiki, and it's clearly spatial since it separates timelines along a "distance of unknown length") and the dimension of Fourth Dimension Space which I am calling to attention. We have no proof that it has "non-insignificant size." So we are only left with 3+1 significant axes plus a hypertimeline for 5D AP
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- #146
That's irrelevant. The Tiering System FAQ talks of a multiverse that can be infinite in 3 of its dimensions plus its time dimension, but still has an insignificant 5th axis. That's how pretty much every 2-A structure is assumed to be on this site. Just because a 2-A structure is infinite doesn't mean every one of its axes is as well. Same goes with Fourth Dimension Space in Sonic.
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Yeah not really seeing the OP’s side to hold much ground compared to the supporters, disagree with the OP.
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4 disagreements 1 neutral
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I mean OK but we literally have zero evidence that the extra spatial dimension has any significant extent. Lots of structures including quite literally every single 2-A structure is "infinite" but that doesn't mean it also has significant extent on the 5th dimensional axis.
Just saying this in case of the tiny probability you bother responding (not saying you have to).
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4th disagreement, now.
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Dude just give up,
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I mean being fair they were brought into 4-D space by Lumina, half of Illumina, the creator of the space, so that might have contributed a bit.
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That's what I mean by my previous statement. Universes are 4D because they have an uncountable number of 3A snapshots, which results in a 4-Dimensional space of significant size.:
Multiverses are a collection of 3D+1 spaces, which can be separated with a non-significant 5th Dimensional axis, but that's because they're 3D+1. If they were 4D+1 then it would be a 5D space of significant size, as you have a Low 2-C space repeated an uncountable infinite number of times:
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If those spaces are separated by a non-significant 5th dimensional axis, that means that the multiverse as a whole is 4D+1. Saying "4D+1" doesn't automatically mean that each of the 4 spatial dimensions is significant. If it was a 4D+1 dimensional space where only 3 of those dimensions are significant, that would be an uncountably infinite collection of spaces where only three of those dimensions are significant. How is it any different from 4th Dimension Space in Sonic?
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I believe 4D space is accepted as there being infinite variations to it. Not super sure, so others can correct me if I'm wrong.
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That doesn't change how 4D beings perceive 3D beings, but I guess the thread is over, we can discuss it in private or somewhere else.
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nah, Cyber Space and the Eggfield do however
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Oh yeah, and those are 4D+1 spaces.
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That's the point of the blog since it's building that argument:
- The Tesseract shows that universes/dreams can contain a fourth axis
- Things containing dreams are stated as being infinite in size or endless
- If they can contain an entire 4th-dimensional object and are infinite, then they have a significant axis
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Second one is irrelevant since a 2-A structure is an infinite structure containing an infinite amount of infinitely large timelines but still has an insignificant 4th spatial dimension. Is the argument basically that since it has a tesseract, the fourth dimensional axis can't be tiny or whatever (since otherwise it wouldn't look like a tesseract)? Because that's the only way I can possibly see significant 4D from those premises.
But that basically just means that the significant extent of the 4th spatial dimension hinges entirely on whether the thingy we see is a tesseract or not. Do you actually think that it's a tesseract? Based solely on your own reasoning and our standards, do you think that it's actually proof of a tesseract?
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