The moment he didn't use DSS against very much weakened Mundus, Dante couldn't even scratch him. Mundus even says that his power are to weak to do that, so yeah at that time DSS is only thing that can harm Mundus.
Not really. As we see during their final confrontation, a weakened almost dead Mundus was more than enough to match Dante's power in the human world which is consistent with him in the statue form almost killing Dante quite easily. If this was akin to Goku SSJ1 against Frieza then Dante would have used the same power he employed and fought Mundus off or even killed him at that point, similar to what Goku did to Frieza, instead he is weaker and barely able to fight Mundus off.
He mentions 3 titles of which they clearly belong to Demon Kings/Gods. Abigail had none of that and it's power was only stated to once rival a demon king or something along those lines.
In the scan Dante literally says that Sparda's victory over Mundus was because his "caring for others explodes and turns into anger", that this is what made him more powerful than Mundus. What Dante describes here is also exactly what happened to him when he saw Trish being killed by Mundus and what happened to Nero when he saw his uncle and father were going to kill each other.
In the cutscene Mundus just says that Dante is weaker because he is in the Human World compared to the first boss fight...
Abigail was a Demon King in all but name and Sid would state that was the case so he is also included in Dante statement
Apart from Gilver, Vergil, Abigail and Chen I don't really see when this happened to him, and it's always contradictory to say that an opponent has disappointing power when that same opponent has crucified you.
Nero explicitly has more potential than Dante and Vergil and received the most powerful power-up in the verse, so yeah I take that as enough proof that Nero has currently surpassed them and if he hasn't it's bullshit writing/lore-wise.
I know that, but it still doesn't make sense to me because I think Dante had already logically surpassed Sparda when he saw Mundus kill Trish.
It's not the biggest anything. He had an emotional outburst. He didn't awaken to justice since he already did that way back in DMC4.
What's explicitly shown and stated in the game >>>>>>> "I think it logically should happen differently".
Also about that, "Dante ́s awakening" refers to Dante fully accepting and unlocking his demonic and human heritage (at the beginning of DMC3 he only accepted his human side) and what allowed him to defeat Vergil at the end because the latter only accepted his demonic heritage. It's like Nero in DMC4 who only thought he was human at the beginning and didn't accept his demonic side, which changed when he got Yamato.
The power up he had in DMC4 is the same one Dante had in DMC3, which is not at all the same one Sparda had 2000 years ago against Mundus, that's what Nero had in DMC5. So yes, it's the most powerful power up because it literally represents the core theme of the verse.
It was only shown via a single in-game animation, not stated, but yeah I know my headcanon doesn't matter, but it's still bullshit
Additionally, both left bruises, and Dante’s was considerably bigger (which makes sense when you realize Dante spent all of Nero V Vergil regaining stamina and thus could muster more force against Nero than Verhil could. Plus, a little paypack).
Tbf Nero drew blood from the ***** slap given
Hence, my point. He really did rearranged his jaws if you actually pause there at the right time.
Against a heavily exhausted Dante though. We literally see him struggling to walk properly right before Nero hits him.
"When the emotion of caring for others explodes and turns into anger, the human spirit can display remarkable strength.
Which has been retconed to hell and back, but let's ignore that and say it still holds weight in todays world, Dante being weaker shouldn't matter because Mundus is ******* dying and weakened to the highest degree. If he had achieved Sparda levels of power he would have easily defeated a WEAKENED AND DYING Mundus quite easily.
Nope, Abigail was just a strong demon that didn't even register in Dante's knowledge until Sid told him about it. Abigail never was a contender for the throne, is never regarded in the same level as Argosax or Mundus and it has no feats beyonda vague "power to rival a demon king" statement. Taken at face value it ranges anywhere from Pluto (the weakest of them all) to sealed Mundus or Argosax the Chaos to full power Mundus and The Despair Embodied.
You literally pointed 4 examples of such thing, there is also Beowulf, Urizen who he fought for over 24 hours while said demon was constantly getting pumped full of demonic steroids and the dozens of black knights that came after Gilver.
Like my first post, this kinda sounds like you either forgot or didn't play the game.
It has nothing to do with durability. Whether you're exhausted or not, someone will make you bleed in one hit if they have the strength to do so.
Dante explicitly says that this power-up comes from the anger of seeing people you love in danger of dying or being killed:
And after that he got a power up and his arm grew back.
Dante and Nero have naturally had love/compassion/empathy and a sense of justice since they were born because they are part human. Sparda received this from the moment he wanted to save humans and not before because he is a pure demon.
This is absolutely not a reliable argument because it is based on a retconned scene.
It doesn't matter what Abigail's true level is because Dante explicitly says that all the "so-called" powerful demons and demon kings were disappointing to him. He explicitly makes it clear that to him they are all frauds, regardless of whether a statement that says X demons have the level of Y demon is true or not.
Gilver and Vergil are obviously not included in this statement by Dante, and neither is Chen because he is basically a mad scientist, not a powerful demon he was told to go kill. I didn't include Urizen because it was after this statement, and it's technically Vergil.
I think being beaten and literally crucified is ridiculously contradictory.
Dante was already hunting demons before the game started and went to open Devil May Cry, and he went to take care of the mess made by his brother from the beginning of the game so he clearly wanted to stop the demons. His discussion with Lady only means that he didn't care about family matters at first, because Dante and Lady have a discussion about family before that, not about justice and saving people. Dante already knows about humanity because he is human himself and he has already clearly shown love before DMC3. From his first interaction with Vergil in the game he denies having a father, it is only after this boss fight that he gradually accepts his father and therefore his demonic side.
This further explains why I disagree even more with Nero still being considered weaker than Dante and Vergil because it would mean that Nero still doesn't have enough strength to stop them and that he only had the chance to do it because they were tired. A super important scene in Nero's character development is thrown out the window and becomes meaningless just because of one in-game animation
Let's not ignore Jester is able stomp Dante in the face because he was wounded and weak, while the same demon admit he wouldn't be doing that to either of them in prime condition.
Fair point.
That goes for about any series, if you are exhausted from other battles beforehand, some characters may get a better chance on you
Not about durability. A Planet level character wouldn't be able to make a Multi Galaxy character bleed even if the latter was tired after a long fight.
Arkham could only damage Dante and Vergil because they were weakened, and he even knocked Vergil unconscious. Dante was similarly weakened when Nero punched him. Please stop trying to scrap the entire verse's canon and power system just to fit your headcanon.
About the durability yeah I was wrong, but that doesn't change the fact that it's the "Nero who is still inferior to Dante and Vergil" take that screws up the entire character development of Nero as explained above...
No, it doesn't. It just clashes with your headcanon. It fits nicely with what we actually see.
It's not headcanon, just basic storytelling comprehension.
Nero was trying to fight Dante and Vergil, not demon lords. According to what is currently accepted in scaling, if Nero had come much earlier he would have been beaten by the twins and thus the whole scene with the power up and the monologue would have been pointless and meaningless.
I don’t see how. It’s not uncommon for characters to get a big power up and still only win to circumstances because the foe was too great.
In Nero's case it was his main goal since DMC4 and it still makes more meaningless and pointless his monologue and power up scene which is supposed to be the climax of his character development.
His goal was to stop them killing each other, not surpass them. By this whole logic of "the power up is pointless unless they're stronger than everyone else", Gohan's power boost against Cell was meaningless because Cell was stronger and he needed help from Goku and Vegeta to win.
His goal was to stop them, yes, but for that you need to have enough strength. Since DMC4, Nero said that he wants to have enough strength to be able to save those he cares for. Being more powerful is part of his character development.
Comtext…which indicates Vergil was nerfed.
I don't really see your point here.
Dude you literally missed my point, Nero despite fighting exhausted Dante and Vergil, still managed to put up a fight to one of them, let alone injure, which would scale him above even a demon lord level character
