Tasha vs Kaneki

[Arkenis]

Kaneki vs Tasha

Tokyo Ghoul Kaneki (Capped at 7-C)
Other Magic Marksman Arc
Song of Moirai is restricted
100 Meters
Equal Speed

Tasha:
Kaneki: Mikazzzuchi

 

[NikHelton]

I'm a bit confused about Tasha's profile. How does Kaneki respond to memory manipulation? What will prevent Tasha from using 7-A attacks right from the start? As far as I understand, Tasha's durability is 7-A. How will Kaneki break through it before RE?

Is the fight predicated on Kaneki surviving the attack and becoming 7-A?

 

[Arkenis]

I'm a bit confused about Tasha's profile. How does Kaneki respond to memory manipulation? What will prevent Tasha from using 7-A attacks right from the start? As far as I understand, Tasha's durability is 7-A. How will Kaneki break through it before RE?

Is the fight predicated on Kaneki surviving the attack and becoming 7-A?

The memory stuff doesn't matter much once Tasha attacks, he'll appear as a normal person but still attacking him. Best is he'll be caught off guard from appearance. The Desert Eagle is damaging to Tasha and can only be fired 3 times. Reread the page.

 

[NikHelton]

The memory stuff doesn't matter much once Tasha attacks, he'll appear as a normal person but still attacking him. Best is he'll be caught off guard from appearance. The Desert Eagle is damaging to Tasha and can only be fired 3 times. Reread the page.

I'm not familiar with the series, so I can't jump to conclusions so quickly. Could Deagle be his opening move?

What damage does it inflict? Is it a regular hole, or does it shred characters of similar durability?

What damage does the other weapons inflict? Can he win before Kaneki's RE kicks in?

And finally, what's his durability this round?

 

[Arkenis]

I'm not familiar with the series, so I can't jump to conclusions so quickly. Could Deagle be his opening move?

No. It is used when needed because it uses up so much mana and because it harms him.

What damage does it inflict? Is it a regular hole, or does it shred characters of similar durability?

Nah people of similar durability are usually fine.

What damage does the other weapons inflict? Can he win before Kaneki's RE kicks in?

He's just got pistols in this key, they use mana bullets so he'll be bombarded by that but also the constant pain and poison from their damage will effect him. There's also regen negation. You can read here about mana. Also he has access to Halloween making this a 2v1 if he wants.

And finally, what's his durability this round?

It's on page in the first key section.

 

[NikHelton]

No. It is used when needed because it uses up so much mana and because it harms him.


Nah people of similar durability are usually fine.

It doesn't look like it will be too dangerous for Kaneki

He's just got pistols in this key, they use mana bullets so he'll be bombarded by that but also the constant pain and poison from their damage will effect him. There's also regen negation. You can read here about mana. Also he has access to Halloween making this a 2v1 if he wants.

Kaneki resists this by having multiple layers. Scolopendra regenerates wounds from Shinohara's Bikaku Quinque, which is particularly toxic to Rinkaku compared to other kagune, which slow regeneration.

It's on page in the first key section.

But it's "At least Town level+, At most Mountain level+". What does it mean?

 

[Arkenis]

It doesn't look like it will be too dangerous for Kaneki

It'll one shot him.

Kaneki resists this by having multiple layers. Scolopendra regenerates wounds from Shinohara's Bikaku Quinque, which is particularly toxic to Rinkaku compared to other kagune, which slow regeneration.

That isn't mana based regeneration negation.

But it's "At least Town level+, At most Mountain level+". What does it mean?

At least​

Should be used to denote the lower cap of a character, if the exact value is indeterminate.

At most​

Should be used to denote the higher cap of a character, if the exact value is indeterminate.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Wait so Kaneki varies through the tiers depending on how much force he puts into his attacks?

 

[NikHelton]

It'll one shot him.

Wait, which Kaneki key are you using? Part 1? Post-Dragon?

That isn't mana based regeneration negation.

Energy alignment

At least
Should be used to denote the lower cap of a character, if the exact value is indeterminate.

At most
Should be used to denote the higher cap of a character, if the exact value is indeterminate.

I don't understand you. Just tell me if it's Dura 7-C or 7-A?

 

[NikHelton]

Wait so Kaneki varies through the tiers depending on how much force he puts into his attacks?

No, he just has different keys

 

[Arkenis]

Wait so Kaneki varies through the tiers depending on how much force he puts into his attacks?

Not force, more just the state he's in. Regularly he's MCB but against Arima, his Kakuja grew more. His ap section sucks rn the more I look at it, he didn't even break IXA, just cracked it slightly, so I'm confused on why he's 7-C for it.

 

[NikHelton]

Not force, more just the state he's in. Regularly he's MCB but against Arima, his Kakuja grew more. His ap section sucks rn the more I look at it, he didn't even break IXA, just cracked it slightly, so I'm confused on why he's 7-C for it.

Kaneki cracked IXA's protective form, which scales to AP. According to Arima, it wasn't just a minor crack, as he now needs a new Quinque

 

[Arkenis]

Wait, which Kaneki key are you using? Part 1? Post-Dragon?

First key like I put in the original post.

Energy alignment

Tokyo Ghoul has no energy to equalize to Mana.

I don't understand you. Just tell me if it's Dura 7-C or 7-A?

Страница говорит тебе, что в лучшем случае он уровня «Гора+». Его плащ — это то, что сдерживает силу «Desert Eagle», и он носит этот плащ всё время.

 

[NikHelton]

First key like I put in the original post.

Ok

Tokyo Ghoul has no energy to equalize to Mana.

RC-cells
Otherwise, mana regen neg does not work because Kaneki does not have it and his powers are based on something else

Страница говорит тебе, что в лучшем случае он уровня «Гора+». Его плащ — это то, что сдерживает силу «Desert Eagle», и

In that case it should be "At least Town level+, Mountain level+ with Cloak"

 

[Arkenis]

Kaneki cracked IXA's protective form, which scales to AP. According to Arima, it wasn't just a minor crack, as he now needs a new Quinque

The crack is small, there's no arguing against this fact but Arima isn't saying he needs a new Quinque because Kaneki destroyed IXA, he's saying that because he's used IXA for a long time and now Kaneki can be used to make a new quinque. Also we just see IXA destroy Kaneki. Either way, Kaneki's ap and dura section are wonky and need better clarity.

RC-cells
Otherwise, mana regen neg does not work because Kaneki does not have it and his powers are based on something else

RC-cells aren't similar to Mana so no they can't be equalized.

In that case it should be "At least Town level+, Mountain level+ with Cloak"

Yeah that works but the cloaks standard equipment and it can't handle mountain level+ attacks constantly, that's its higher cap, not it's standard tier.

 

[NikHelton]

The crack is small, there's no arguing against this fact

IXA's durability in shield mode should be greater than that of its base form. IXA's base form was able to withstand direct attacks from Kaneki's kagune.

However, its shield mode couldn't withstand the onslaught of Part 1 Kaneki and cracked.

But Arima isn't saying he needs a new Quinque because Kaneki destroyed IXA, he's saying that because he's used IXA for a long time and now Kaneki can be used to make a new quinque. Also we just see IXA destroy Kaneki. Either way, Kaneki's ap and dura section are wonky and need better clarity.

This doesn't make sense. Arima had already chosen Kaneki for his plan and had no intention of making him a quinque. He says, "I need him," which indicates a breakdown. They actually made him a new IXA, just like Suzuya made a new Jason.
By the way, if Arima had wanted Kaneki as a quinque, he could have gotten him without killing him and then used it

RC-cells aren't similar to Mana so no they can't be equalized

In that case, mana manipulation simply won't work on Kaneki

Yeah that works but the cloaks standard equipment and it can't handle mountain level+ attacks constantly, that's its higher cap, not it's standard tier

Ok, thank you

 

[Arkenis]

In that case, mana manipulation simply won't work on Kaneki

Why not?

 

[NikHelton]

Why not?

Because Tasha and Kaneki have different energy sources. Tasha has mana, which is present in every living being but can only be manipulated by women. Kaneki has RC cells, which are present in every living being but can only be manipulated by ghouls. This already sounds like they're similar.
They have different energy sources, and their regeneration and strength depend on these sources. Therefore, Kaneki can't copy Tasha's abilities, and Tasha can't use a kagune.
By the way, Dura neg is limited to low-mid regen, while Kaneki scales to Kanae and Amon and has mid-range regen.

 

[Arkenis]

Because Tasha and Kaneki have different energy sources. Tasha has mana, which is present in every living being but can only be manipulated by women. Kaneki has RC cells, which are present in every living being but can only be manipulated by ghouls. This already sounds like they're similar.
They have different energy sources, and their regeneration and strength depend on these sources. Therefore, Kaneki can't copy Tasha's abilities, and Tasha can't use a kagune.
By the way, Dura neg is limited to low-mid regen, while Kaneki scales to Kanae and Amon and has mid-range regen.

That's not similar in their fundamentality. RC Cells = organic matter, Mana = nature energy. Never mentioned anything about copying abilities or Tasha using a kagune. It's said that damage done by mana can only be undone by mana and that even regular healing magic which can heal regular wounds can't heal magical wounds. Kaneki can't get past that. It's limited to low-mid but says likely higher. The character would have to remove the mana to regenerate as we saw.

 

[NikHelton]

That's not similar in their fundamentality. RC Cells = organic matter, Mana = nature energy. Never mentioned anything about copying abilities or Tasha using a kagune. It's said that damage done by mana can only be undone by mana and that even regular healing magic which can heal regular wounds can't heal magical wounds. Kaneki can't get past that. It's limited to low-mid but says likely higher. The character would have to remove the mana to regenerate as we saw.

This works on creatures with mana. Do you have an example of it working on something that doesn't?

 

[Arkenis]

This works on creatures with mana. Do you have an example of it working on something that doesn't?

No need, the manga makes it clear this is a general thing.

 

[NikHelton]

No need, the manga makes it clear this is a general thing.

Mana damages creatures with mana, but they can't heal because they don't manage their mana.
It's perfectly clear. If a creature doesn't have mana, this type of energy won't be harmful to it.

 

[Arkenis]

Mana damages creatures with mana, but they can't heal because they don't manage their mana.
It's perfectly clear. If a creature doesn't have mana, this type of energy won't be harmful to it.

It damages everyone. You can't read the scans so I guess it makes sense you're arguing this way, but anyone else can look at the scans and see mana is in general harmful regardless if you have mana or not. And no, they can't heal because their mana isn't powerful enough to remove the hostile mana.

 

[NikHelton]

It damages everyone. You can't read the scans so I guess it makes sense you're arguing this way, but anyone else can look at the scans and see mana is in general harmful regardless if you have mana or not. And no, they can't heal because their mana isn't powerful enough to remove the hostile mana.

Honestly, it feels like we're at a dead end. I understand your position. I suggest we call a moderator so they can advise us on how the crossover rules will work in this fight.

 

[NikHelton]

Why don't you use "Escape From Britain" and "Post-Dragon"?

 

[Arkenis]

Why don't you use "Escape From Britain" and "Post-Dragon"?

both first keys are more equal in skill. And Tasha's Britain arc doesn't really change much while Post-Dragon has better skills and more abilities making it more of a stomp.

 

[Mikazzzuchi]

Kaneki looks favorable.

 

[Arkenis]

Kaneki looks favorable.

How does he deal with regen negation or danmaku spam?

 

[NikHelton]

What are the wincons of both?

 

[Arkenis]

Tasha can one shot if he gets to that point, he can overwhelm through danmaku which deal magical damage and his Battle field basically makes him never miss. He's also got paralyzing darts to slow down Kaneki.

 

[NikHelton]

Tasha can one shot if he gets to that point, he can overwhelm through danmaku which deal magical damage and his Battle field basically makes him never miss. He's also got paralyzing darts to slow down Kaneki.

What about Kaneki's wincon?

 

[Mikazzzuchi]

How does he deal with regen negation or danmaku spam?

Kaneki has extensive experience battling ghouls that spam multiple attacks and has already successfully dodged Arima's attacks while on the brink of death. His instincts and heightened senses will allow him to evade attacks. His LS will also help him strip Tasha of his 7-A protective gear, after which the kakuja comes into play and Kaneki delivers a decisive blow. Regen negation probably doesn't work for the reasons Nick pointed out.
The fight is likely to be close, but Kaneki seems like the more advantageous option.

Count my vote.

 

[Arkenis]

What about Kaneki's wincon?

Just beat Tasha before the Desert Eagle comes out. He's got the LS advantage by 9x also.

Kaneki has extensive experience battling ghouls that spam multiple attacks and has already successfully dodged Arima's attacks while on the brink of death. His instincts and heightened senses will allow him to evade attacks. His LS will also help him strip Tasha of his 7-A protective gear, after which the kakuja comes into play and Kaneki delivers a decisive blow. Regen negation probably doesn't work for the reasons Nick pointed out.
The fight is likely to be close, but Kaneki seems like the more advantageous option.

Count my vote.

He doesn't have extensive experience in part one of battling danmaku in the tens, unless you can show that. Again this is part one not re and Arima demonlished Kaneki. Show he's capable of evading dozens of invisible bullets with his instinctive action. Nik's reasons for the regen negation don't work, and idk how more clear my explanation can be for that.

 

[NikHelton]

Just beat Tasha before the Desert Eagle comes out. He's got the LS advantage by 9x also.

So, what's stopping him from doing this?

Kaneki doesn't need to dodge invisible bullets. He simply sees where the projectile is heading and dodges.
He blocks all enemy bullets with his kagune, and even if he actually has one, Regen Neg simply doesn't work when blocking bullets with his kagune.

Kaneki sees that the enemy is strong enough and uses a half-kakuja.

 

[Arkenis]

So, what's stopping him from doing this?

Kaneki doesn't need to dodge invisible bullets. He simply sees where the projectile is heading and dodges.
He blocks all enemy bullets with his kagune, and even if he actually has one, Regen Neg simply doesn't work when blocking bullets with his kagune.

Kaneki sees that the enemy is strong enough and uses a half-kakuja.

The projectile is invisible. How will he see magical bullets?

What do you mean "Regen Neg simply doesn't work when blocking bullets with his kagune."

You aren't making sense and you still don't understand how the regen negation works.

 

[NikHelton]

The projectile is invisible. How will he see magical bullets?

He doesn't have to dodge bullets. He looks where Tasha is aiming and dodges

What do you mean "Regen Neg simply doesn't work when blocking bullets with his kagune."

Kaneki simply blocks the 7-C blasts with his kagune rather than absorbing them with his body. This doesn't negatively affect him in any way.

You aren't making sense and you still don't understand how the regen negation works.

​

 

[Arkenis]

He doesn't have to dodge bullets. He looks where Tasha is aiming and dodges

Tasha isn't gonna be standing still, he will move around so it's gonna be a bit harder to dodge something you can't see while the shooter is moving.

Kaneki simply blocks the 7-C blasts with his kagune rather than absorbing them with his body. This doesn't negatively affect him in any way.

So his kagune gets regen negated and intense pain will constantly deter him. How does that not negatively affect him?
Also, let's be realistic, it's bullets, he's gotten hit by attacks before, he'll get hit by bullets here. Haven't seen you guys address the battle field, targets Kaneki within at least 27 yards and can be made bigger. Tasha can also just shoot from afar to avoid the ap diff altogether.

 

[NikHelton]

Tasha isn't gonna be standing still, he will move around so it's gonna be a bit harder to dodge something you can't see while the shooter is moving.

He'll simply continue to evade the shot's trajectory, gradually closing the distance. That doesn't sound like a big deal.

So his kagune gets regen negated and intense pain will constantly deter him. How does that not negatively affect him?

Okay, Kaneki's kaguna will be damaged, so a hole in it will prevent it from functioning. Besides, Kaneki can create a new one.

Also, let's be realistic, it's bullets, he's gotten hit by attacks before, he'll get hit by bullets here.

Kaneki always dodges bullets

Haven't seen you guys address the battle field, targets Kaneki within at least 27 yards and can be made bigger. Tasha can also just shoot from afar to avoid the ap diff altogether.

It's even easier to dodge from a distance.

 

[Arkenis]

He'll simply continue to evade the shot's trajectory, gradually closing the distance. That doesn't sound like a big deal.

In an open field where there are zero obstacles sure this is fine. But it's not gonna be an open field where Kaneki has clear fov, they're in Central Park.

Okay, Kaneki's kaguna will be damaged, so a hole in it will prevent it from functioning. Besides, Kaneki can create a new one.

And this? We see that mana begins breaking the body and making the eyes bleed with Sabrina. Magic also causes pain once in the body to the point of death

Kaneki always dodges bullets

Yeah I never said "he doesn't dodge bullets", I said he's been attacked before, he'll be hit here.

It's even easier to dodge from a distance.

No it isn't.
Forcefield Creation & Homing Attack (Able to create a battle field cutting off the outside with dimensional gallery pouch. Within the field his bullets track his enemies sound, temperature, magical powers and killing intent)

 

[NikHelton]

I don't quite understand. If, according to your arguments, Kaneki is unable to dodge attacks, unable to regenerate after them, and will be destroyed, then how will he even win? Judging by your position, this is a stomp.