Gojo powering a nation Re-Do

[Rodriiogo]

Didn’t auntie vote no?

I think no(?) Last answer was here

 

[Rodriiogo]

Bump

 

[Duedate8898]

Apologies, I do vote no for this

 

[PapiSavitar5025]

Apologies, I do vote no for this

Why?
This is just a recalc for an already accepted feat.

 

[Mythic381]

This is just a recalc for an already accepted feat.

That doesn't mean they agree for the reasons used to recalculate it.

 

[PapiSavitar5025]

That doesn't mean they agree for the reasons used to recalculate it.

hence why im asking "why"

 

[Arkenis]

hence why im asking "why"

Duedate answered in page 2.

 

[Sammy818]

Let’s wrap this up gang I lowkey don’t think the argument was necessarily bad, but this at best should be used as a supporting argument rather than a feat that upscales alone

 

[Sammy818]

Let’s wrap this up gang I lowkey don’t think the argument was necessarily bad, but this at best should be used as a supporting argument rather than a feat that upscales alone

If this was a mountain thread upgrade with like, one feat and two supporting ones(this being one of them) you might have made the jumper

 

[Rodriiogo]

Let’s wrap this up gang I lowkey don’t think the argument was necessarily bad, but this at best should be used as a supporting argument rather than a feat that upscales alone

I still think using that as a singular defeat to the entire argumentation is kinda eh, since the whole point is that the calculation is wrong in-context,
But if the mods wanna go that way and not change the timeframe for a better one the feat would be better wiped out until we have the supporting stuff then. Its not like Gojo needs that supporting small town calc for his current tier and the calc itself just doesnt work.

 

[Sammy818]

I still think using that as a singular defeat to the entire argumentation is kinda eh, since the whole point is that the calculation is wrong in-context,
But if the mods wanna go that way and not change the timeframe for a better one the feat would be better wiped out until we have the supporting stuff then. Its not like Gojo needs that supporting small town calc for his current tier and the calc itself just doesnt work.

I’m just saying I think if you put together a multi calc mountain thread and you put these args in it as a supporting argument rather than a sole upgrade calc, you probably could get this accepted, also as the comment on the calc said, include a 24 hour end

 

[Arkenis]

This has nothing to do with it only being one calc or the tier, it's the way he calced it. You can add four other mountain calcs and this one would still be rejected.

OP your best course of action is to participate in the general thread to see how scaling and calcs are handled for JJK to see what can be accepted and what can't.

 

[Rodriiogo]

I’m just saying I think if you put together a multi calc mountain thread and you put these args in it as a supporting argument rather than a sole upgrade calc, you probably could get this accepted, also as the comment on the calc said, include a 24 hour end

I know Im just saying I find it eh how that was used as a defeating point. Will add the 24 end later

 

[Rodriiogo]

This has nothing to do with it only being one calc or the tier, it's the way he calced it. You can add four other mountain calcs and this one would still be rejected.

How come? If its because "the standard is using 1 second" im pretty sure I already made it clear that I agree, it is. But thats when said person or thing is powering said thing continuously for that time. Which isnt the case for this feat with Gojo. Standards are meant to be used as, well, standards. Not things that define every calc of that type. The standard doesn't work at all here in the context here and is physically impossible to be the case so using it is just kinda ridiculous.

OP your best course of action is to participate in the general thread to see how scaling and calcs are handled for JJK to see what can be accepted and what can't.

I will try to do that yes. I've already been thinking of more stuff

 

[Arkenis]

How come? If its because "the standard is using 1 second" im pretty sure I already made it clear that I agree, it is. But thats when said person or thing is powering said thing continuously for that time. Which isnt the case for this feat with Gojo. Standards are meant to be used as, well, standards. Not things that define every calc of that type. The standard doesn't work at all here in the context here and is physically impossible to be the case so using it is just kinda ridiculous.

It's not about if its physically possible, this was already addressed. The one second for 24hrs is to show us how much he'd have to output hypothetically.

 

[Rodriiogo]

It's not about if its physically possible, this was already addressed. The one second for 24hrs is to show us how much he'd have to output hypothetically.

If it is physically possible or not is important in the context of the statement as thats the whole point of it. Going by low balled hypotheticals instead of what the story is telling you is....????

I'd be fine if the statement itself was a hypothetical but it is not, the japanese even makes it more obvious. When making calcs like this we need to see what the statement is saying from the pov of whos doing it, this is all things I already addressed. The current calculation is running on a impossible assumption instead of what the story tells and/or shows. The whole time there was about me "doing assumptions" but the current calc makes a impossible one instead of a logical more simpler one. They both use assumptions but the current calc uses a physically impossible and most complicated solution which wouldnt apply under occam's razor for example. Theres 0 way of defending the assumption the current calc does while there is ways of defending a different end like mine.

 

[Arkenis]

If it is physically possible or not is important in the context of the statement as thats the whole point of it. Going by low balled hypotheticals instead of what the story is telling you is....????

Is what? The wiki generally works on lowballs and the story doesn't tell us much, you've taken what it says and asserted more than is stated.

I'd be fine if the statement itself was a hypothetical but it is not, the japanese even makes it more obvious. When making calcs like this we need to see what the statement is saying from the pov of whos doing it, this is all things I already addressed. The current calculation is running on a impossible assumption instead of what the story tells and/or shows. The whole time there was about me "doing assumptions" but the current calc makes a impossible one instead of a logical more simpler one. They both use assumptions but the current calc uses a physically impossible and most complicated solution which wouldnt apply under occam's razor for example. Theres 0 way of defending the assumption the current calc does while there is ways of defending a different end like mine.

The statement is a hypothetical. The current calc is less complicated than yours. You're unable to get us a timeframe properly and you've based it entirely on Cyrus having some attack in mind which just isn't stated.

 

[Rodriiogo]

Is what? The wiki generally works on lowballs and the story doesn't tell us much, you've taken what it says and asserted more than is stated.

The wiki works on low balls when they are logical and not ridiculous. This one is straight up a impossible one for the sake of it with no basis.

The statement is a hypothetical. The current calc is less complicated than yours. You're unable to get us a timeframe properly and you've based it entirely on Cyrus having some attack in mind which just isn't stated.

It is litetally not a hypothetical, Cyrus notes in the japanese that Gojo can handle the power needs of an entire country. It can't be a hypothetical if its a certain that they were even planning to use which is the case here. And the calc being "more complicated" (which I dont see how it is) doesn't make the assumptions less logically correct and simple. Also we already accept that Cyrus got that conclusion via gojo's attacks, I was just bringing possibilities of what it could be, that was not a main point. Look at the difference between assumptions:

My calc:
Gojo handles the power needs of an entire country as he normally and physically possible can. Despite being a sorcerer, Cyrus has knowledge on sorcerers being tired and having to regain CE even after short fights. Gojo would output CE for time to time so he can rest and regain CE to continuously handle the needs in a physically possible way.

Current Calc:
Gojo has infinite stamina and no need to regain CE in Cyrus's eyes, he ignored every single showing of stamina in the recording and somehow assumed Gojo has infinite stamina and/or we assume that he got extra off-screen WRONG knowledge from Kenjaku (as saying gojo can do that is still wrong even with six-eyes). Gojo would continuously output his CE Output every single second even tho that is physically impossible and literally kills him. TLDR, Cyrus is an idiot in this assumption.


Tell me which one is more clear and less absurd. The reason the current one looks simpler is because the assumptions it does are hidden in just not saying it outloud. Think it outloud and you realise how ridiculous it is.

 

[AyOgUyS]

I Lowkey agree with OP

 

[Sammy818]

I think OP does have a point here, due to gojo needing significant rest, however the ration should probably be 1 minute: 72 hours

 

[AyOgUyS]

I think OP does have a point here, due to gojo needing significant rest, however the ration should probably be 1 minute: 72 hours

what would the result be, factoring in this timeframe?

 

[Sammy818]

what would the result be, factoring in this timeframe?

About 6 megatons, nearly city level but with red and purple it is

 

[Sammy818]

I think OP does have a point here, due to gojo needing significant rest, however the ration should probably be 1 minute: 72 hours

Because this calc assumes gojo powers for 1 singular second and needs rest, however powering for a minute before going back down is more reasonable

 

[Mommyleona]

Lowkey lost the plot at like page 3

 

[Rodriiogo]

Because this calc assumes gojo powers for 1 singular second and needs rest, however powering for a minute before going back down is more reasonable

So basically Gojo powers the country 60 times to match the 72 hours?

Side note: added the 1 day end to the calc as asked

 

[Sammy818]

So basically Gojo powers the country 60 times to match the 72 hours?

Side note: added the 1 day end to the calc as asked

No, I’m saying they extract energy from gojo for a minute before his body is Incapable of outputting more energy before it turns fatal, ie that minute of energy is able to power the nation for 24-72 hours

 

[Sammy818]

So basically Gojo powers the country 60 times to match the 72 hours?

Side note: added the 1 day end to the calc as asked

Also, lowkirkenually add a wank end, essentially they run gojo until he dies(like 10-30 minutes) and the energy extracted lasts 80 years(a lifetime, also this end is not getting accepted and will only be for personal agendas)

 

[Rodriiogo]

No, I’m saying they extract energy from gojo for a minute before his body is Incapable of outputting more energy before it turns fatal, ie that minute of energy is able to power the nation for 24-72 hours

Fair, I can agree with this, 1 minute of constant energy output seems reasonable, if we go by that, applying that to every end of the calc would give:

1 day/Low-End: 7.872564e+15 Joules / ~1.88 Megatons of TNT (Small City level)

2 days/Mid-End: 1.5745128e+16 Joules / ~3.76 Megatons of TNT (Small City level+)

3 days/High-End: 2.3617692e+16 Joules / ~5.64 Megatons of TNT (Small City level+)

 

[Rodriiogo]

Also, lowkirkenually add a wank end, essentially they run gojo until he dies(like 10-30 minutes) and the energy extracted lasts 80 years(a lifetime, also this end is not getting accepted and will only be for personal agendas)

Using lifetime energy in 20 minutes would only makes it Large Mountain level we should use it (truth )

 

[Sammy818]

Using lifetime energy in 20 minutes would only makes it Large Mountain level we should use it (truth )

Isn’t it a trump presidency in jjk? Those mfs woudl run gojo till death so lowkey it makes more sense(cope)

 

[Rodriiogo]

Fair, I can agree with this, 1 minute of constant energy output seems reasonable, if we go by that, applying that to every end of the calc would give:

1 day/Low-End: 7.872564e+15 Joules / ~1.88 Megatons of TNT (Small City level)

2 days/Mid-End: 1.5745128e+16 Joules / ~3.76 Megatons of TNT (Small City level+)

3 days/High-End: 2.3617692e+16 Joules / ~5.64 Megatons of TNT (Small City level+)

Added this as an alternative end in the calc.

 

[AyOgUyS]

About 6 megatons, nearly city level but with red and purple it is

hm ok

 

[Legion350]

Here is where my problem lies right now. Even a Low 7-B end has too many assumptions to be useful. With his current tier he could already pull this off using the China end with a little bit of exertion per day. I'll use his most casual tier making feat to explain, and hypothetical assumptions of my own to explain this. If we consider his pumping out energy to be a very exhausting thing, we know Gojo has extremely casual feats that reach High 7-C [164.16 KT, which he did as a aura farm flex], which I will call 1 GU [Gojo Unit]

If he pumps out 1 GU per second for a for just half an hour, that generates in excess [1.236E18] of a day's worth of energy to the entirety of the country. Even if they think generating that much energy would be physically demanding like exercise for a normal person, the avg healthy person can do wayyy over 30 min of intense exercise per day if you spread it out. They can decide to space out the energy draining throughout the day if they're nice about it lol.

Even if they thought Gojo pumping out the energy to equivalent to a marathon of exertion [with the average marathon taking 4.5 hours to complete] could get over half a months worth of energy from one day [1.11266E19]. They could very well have been intending to break it into blocks where they take his energy, he is able to rest for a week, rinse and repeat, which still result in a net of energy independence for a lifetime.

Am I saying this what they were thinking, obviously not because we aren't given any significant information about how they would do this. But I am arguing that there are ways for them to do this that need less assumptions and don't change his tier. Hell, we don't even know how they planned to keep him captured.

 

[Arkenis]

Here is where my problem lies right now. Even a Low 7-B end has too many assumptions to be useful. With his current tier he could already pull this off using the China end with a little bit of exertion per day. I'll use his most casual tier making feat to explain, and hypothetical assumptions of my own to explain this. If we consider his pumping out energy to be a very exhausting thing, we know Gojo has extremely casual feats that reach High 7-C [164.16 KT, which he did as a aura farm flex], which I will call 1 GU [Gojo Unit]

Prove the earthquake was a casual feat for him.

 

[ElJoaki5]

Prove the earthquake was a casual feat for him.

Missing the point

 

[Arkenis]

Missing the point

Its the basis of the argument, it matters more than whatever reasoning he's tryna use

 

[Legion350]

Its the basis of the argument, it matters more than whatever reasoning he's tryna use

Fair enough, I don’t want to make this more confusing, so I’ll modify what I said slightly. Even with brain damage, unable to open his domain, and dropping energy he is he’s still superior to special grades like Yuta and Hakari who are Town level. and they scale above the energy per second value for either calc. In other words a near braindead Gojo could still generate more energy than the minimum of the original calculation's second only value. Not to mention even if the government already had him captured and restrained, it’s not like they lose their previous stores of energy, and to use Gojo as a sole power source they'd have to redo some infrastructure. So I see no reason why draining him in bursts doesn't work if they are able to store his energy effectively, while allowing him to have breaks for sleep.

The biggest takeaway is that if we can’t agree on the parameters of the calculation then it shouldn’t be usable for his tier. It's vague and we have no timeframe for any of this.

 

[Arkenis]

The biggest takeaway is that if we can’t agree on the parameters of the calculation then it shouldn’t be usable for his tier. It's vague and we have no timeframe for any of this.

Some do agree with the timeframe already chosen. True that it is vague but that we already don't use it because we have better feats, most don't scale, and now the issues brought up in this thread just further push how unusable it is.

 

[Legion350]

Some do agree with the timeframe already chosen. True that it is vague but that we already don't use it because we have better feats, most don't scale, and now the issues brought up in this thread just further push how unusable it is.

I mean it sounds like we are in agreement then tbh. I'm not saying hakai [ctrl+alt+del] the calc from the verse page. When I say shouldn't be usable for the tier, I mean it's not strong enough evidence to be anything beyond a supporting calc. It's not much of an issue atm bc nothing is relying on it.

 

[Sammy818]

Here is where my problem lies right now. Even a Low 7-B end has too many assumptions to be useful. With his current tier he could already pull this off using the China end with a little bit of exertion per day. I'll use his most casual tier making feat to explain, and hypothetical assumptions of my own to explain this. If we consider his pumping out energy to be a very exhausting thing, we know Gojo has extremely casual feats that reach High 7-C [164.16 KT, which he did as a aura farm flex], which I will call 1 GU [Gojo Unit]

If he pumps out 1 GU per second for a for just half an hour, that generates in excess [1.236E18] of a day's worth of energy to the entirety of the country. Even if they think generating that much energy would be physically demanding like exercise for a normal person, the avg healthy person can do wayyy over 30 min of intense exercise per day if you spread it out. They can decide to space out the energy draining throughout the day if they're nice about it lol.

Even if they thought Gojo pumping out the energy to equivalent to a marathon of exertion [with the average marathon taking 4.5 hours to complete] could get over half a months worth of energy from one day [1.11266E19]. They could very well have been intending to break it into blocks where they take his energy, he is able to rest for a week, rinse and repeat, which still result in a net of energy independence for a lifetime.

Am I saying this what they were thinking, obviously not because we aren't given any significant information about how they would do this. But I am arguing that there are ways for them to do this that need less assumptions and don't change his tier. Hell, we don't even know how they planned to keep him captured.

At that point the feat should just be tossed out