Undertale and Deltarune are getting a buff

[Delusionaltx2]

and you just now gave yourself an answer in the genocide Flowey mentioned that Asgore would show us souls and he really showed Flowey in the neutral ending he used this chance

I don't get it

My translator doesn't translate perfectly, so I'm unlikely to understand some words.

Understandable ig

You wrote something that wasn't clear to you. For example, Snowdin isn't in Undertale. However, I wrote it down so you'd understand.

But snowdin is in undertale

I don't understand what you're trying to say at this point. Maybe you're talking about Flowey surrendering, yes, he surrendered and ran away from the battle with Sans. That's Sans showing the cruelty that kill-or-be-killed shows.

you asked "Will this change his kill-or-be-killed goal?" although maybe because of the language barrier its prob "Would this change his kill-or-be-killed goal?"

I asked how sans changing floweys philosophy has any relevance to UT being 5D

It's nice writting but this is suppose to be a discussion about actual buffs not writting

Does anyone suffer from a reset? Frisk just resets Sans, and he doesn't remember anything; he's just standing there on the battlefield.

they end up back to where they were previously in a completely different timeline so yeah there are effects present

Did that have anything to do with it? It's a common question whether Chara controls Frisk's body, although it doesn't matter since Chara mentioned that her power was always ours, so whether Chara or Frisk controls it, their powers will be the same.

How does this answer its relevance to the CRT through?

However, how you came to this is simply a misunderstanding, because if it were, I would have mentioned it in the context of evidence, but there is none, so Sans was always vulnerable to reset. He may have amazing control of space, but he's vulnerable to resets, and can simply fight until the enemy completely breaks mentally.

Ok so because of the language barrier I'll just assume it probably was just a misunderstanding

Can you get to the main portion on how sans or whatever character is being used makes UT 5D?

 

[Oikarian]

I don't get it

You asked Flowey's goal, didn't you read the genocide route? Flowey's goal was 6 souls, which he forced the king to show, but he didn't show them. However, Flowey was sure that Asgore would show the souls for Chara, and indeed, at the end of the neutral route, he shows them.

Understandable ig

But snowdin is in undertale

Yes, I know she was always there.

you asked "Will this change his kill-or-be-killed goal?" although maybe because of the language barrier its prob "Would this change his kill-or-be-killed goal?"

I asked how sans changing floweys philosophy has any relevance to UT being 5D

It's nice writting but this is suppose to be a discussion about actual buffs not writting

So that's what you're really talking about. The Flowey timeline dialogue is about moving to another existing timeline. We all know the universe is 4D and no one will argue with that. Even Sans said it in Einstein's language. However, for Frisk to be able to move along the timeline, the timeline must exist initially, that is, it must be infinite. This is one of the author's unusual ideas to give through Frisk's ability as proof of the MWI theory. That is, everyone takes into account the fun of Frisk creating a new universe through a reset, but there is no such explanation in the dialogue about the creation, because it is explained that she moves through an existing similar timeline. I also think that Undertale is a multiverse because the world is separated from the timeline and it is logical that it is trying to contain the timelines.

they end up back to where they were previously in a completely different timeline so yeah there are effects present

How does this answer its relevance to the CRT through?

It's more of a misunderstanding. You seemed to be asking about the 4D timeline and how Frisk's ability works, but our conversations didn't go down the wrong path.

Ok so because of the language barrier I'll just assume it probably was just a misunderstanding

Can you get to the main portion on how sans or whatever character is being used makes UT 5D?

Yeah, I think I get it now.
You need to understand the essence of souls, let's try discussing it on Discord because I need scans.

 

[Delusionaltx2]

You asked Flowey's goal, didn't you read the genocide route? Flowey's goal was 6 souls, which he forced the king to show, but he didn't show them. However, Flowey was sure that Asgore would show the souls for Chara, and indeed, at the end of the neutral route, he shows them.

I said flowey would never have been able to get pass asgore on his own in response to the idea of flowey apperently being comparable to 40,000 monsters and you saying "well he killed asgore!" as the reason to why you think he would be able to do that

Yes, I know she was always there.

1. Snowdin is a place

2. If it was always there then wouldn't that contradict sans and papyrus supposedly not being in undertale?

Also, before the Genocide game, Sans and Papyrus weren't in Undertale. We were told directly that they had recently appeared in Snowdin. We remember Flowey's words when Sans appeared, he caused a lot of problems and stopped playing the Genocide games.

So that's what you're really talking about. The Flowey timeline dialogue is about moving to another existing timeline. We all know the universe is 4D and no one will argue with that. Even Sans said it in Einstein's language. However, for Frisk to be able to move along the timeline, the timeline must exist initially, that is, it must be infinite.

Um no? For frisk to move accross time they would just need some form of time manipulation that allows them to time travel which they already have.
The timeline wouldn't need to be infinite

This is one of the author's unusual ideas to give through Frisk's ability as proof of the MWI theory. That is, everyone takes into account the fun of Frisk creating a new universe through a reset, but there is no such explanation in the dialogue about the creation, because it is explained that she moves through an existing similar timeline.

1. This only proves the cosmology is an ad Infinium, which is already accepted iirc

2. There are tons of different versions to MWI going for 2-C to like low 1-A, assuming we grant MWI saying "The verse has MWI!" dosen't really grant much tbh

I also think that Undertale is a multiverse because the world is separated from the timeline and it is logical that it is trying to contain the timelines.

We already accepted UT as a multiverse

Undertale: Cosmology Blog

vsbattles.fandom.com

It's more of a misunderstanding. You seemed to be asking about the 4D timeline and how Frisk's ability works, but our conversations didn't go down the wrong path.

I'm asking where 5D is comming from? Because the blog itself just says "well the verse might actually have MWI so 5D!1!"

Yeah, I think I get it now.
You need to understand the essence of souls, let's try discussing it on Discord because I need scans

I'm currently multi tasking so no

edit: also the point of a CRT is to explain and get this approved on site so moving this to cord is unnnessesary

 

[StrymULTRA]

Imma be fr I can barely understand a single thing of this, and most of the stuff you're trying to propose are already accepted here.

So, I've explained the obvious scale of cosmologies, now let's start with the reasons. The first thing people mention is that they want to prove the MWI theory, the very one that proves the interpretation of the world by this, our 5D multiverse, and 4D universes are interpreted within it, this is the MWI theory.

You did not explain how is this Low 1-C.

Also lol at giving everyone Immeasurable speed from the lost souls stuff, they were all obviously amped due to being parts of Asriel.

 

[Axorandom0]

Again, this is a problem. Most Sans characters are "glass." They are weak but strong. They don't need to have high AP, DC, or durability. It's enough for such a character to simply be inactive or at least have powers that are good in themselves. Glass characters like XGaster don't have universal durability, but their OverWrite abilities change the universe itself.

Sans isn’t a glass cannon since his attack and defense are equal. He’s a Hax merchant. Additionally, his Hax are firmly not stronger than him, with it mainly being his durability negation which allows him to punch above has weight class.

I also didn't take into account his game statistics. It's strange to compare his statistics when he wasn't serious. We don't know his serious side. So please don't take that side into account. His abilities aren't fully shown. He showed most of them before the battle.

He was serious though?????? My guy he was trying to kill you and stall you from continuing the genocides that he (doesn’t) remember. Like, why would he hold back in that fight? What purpose does that serve for him?

I didn't say he was know into the game codes, I just wrote "coincidences and sometimes it's worth noticing such small details." Where did you get the idea of knowing into the game codes? I also wrote that Sans is unpredictable for most of the dialogue, although the fact that Papyrus survived somehow simply explained that he is a Deltarune character and did not show his death.

“Sans lies about his brothers death because he’s unpredictable” is… definitely a “take”.

Also he did show his death we see him turn into DUST

I won't explain it in this context. It seems you didn't understand the meaning of soul powers. Yes, I expected that. Not everyone would understand how soul powers work on this scale. It turned out to be a complex context. Not everyone would understand.

My guy you need to make sure people understand what you’re talking about if you want it accepted, especially when it could mean placing everyone at Above Goku level.

I'm not sure you understood the full part of these contexts, most of the contexts contradict what I said in the source, either you didn't read carefully or the context was too complicated for you, but something must be the reason for this.

This is in response to me saying that your calculations aren’t accepted, and… what do you mean I didn’t understand them?? You can’t put unaccepted calculations into a content revision like this.

 

[Kellex]

I think I got some of it now, but some word of advice first:

Read the text on the Android version, as the PC version scatters the text.

Make it so it's also readable on PC then. Most VSbattle blogs already work well on PC and mobile devices by default, and I find it tedious having to look at the blogs on my phone + typing this at the same time. You're a new member tho so I'll let slide for now.

SANS:​

*

Sans is actually strong

vsbattles.fandom.com

1. The first thing I would like to say is to let Sans be a "strong monster in the dungeon" Sans has really terrible stats but his abilities and hax say otherwise he deserves to be strong among monsters.

Sans' stats are extremely low yes and his abilities/hax are good, but this doesn't make him "stronger" per se. You see, the stats in Undertale don't show the monster's current strength, but rather the peak they can dish out. Take for example: ASGORE and TORIEL are rated 80 ATK+DEF despite the fact that they were obviously holding back from Frisk (especially Toriel). Sans on the other hand only has 1 ATK+DEF and his hax hard carries by ignoring DEF.

3. Manipulation of space and time: He can expand and contract space as he did in his room and in battle, and he can also create portals since his room is unusual, stop time as he showed in Grillby, and have ready-made attacks in battle.

4. Manipulation gravity: He has telekinesis, but also changes the position of gravity, which he demonstrates well in battle.

5. Sans is also able to attack the game's inventory, i.e. the buttons, and can change any font. Moreover, he can see Frisk's statistics, so he can know how many lv we have.

These are already on profile like I said earlier.

6. Debunking: Many people think that the hacker's ending breaks the 4th wall, but they don't consider that Sans's words could have been spoken by Toby Fox. Yes, it was Sans who spoke, but Toby Fox delivers this dialogue. Also, for them, the evidence is dodging and attacks to button, but these are Sans' abilities, otherwise how can Asgore break the button but not break the 4th wall?

I don't see how this is relevant, but I'll answer anyway. Sans in the hacker ending breaks the fourth wall by asking us to tell the creator to fix it. He has no idea who Toby Fox is nor do we know if it's even spoken by Toby himself; how the heck would you know? Also abilities aren't restricted to one character ya know.

PAPYRUS:​

1. Papyrus should be the strongest monster in the dungeon simply because his strength is recognized by Undyne and even surprisingly Flowey, I think he deserves to be a strong monster in Undertale.

I disagree. Just because his strength is recognized by Flowey and Undyne doesn't make him stronger than them let alone Asgore.

2. Papyrus's intelligence should be equal to Sans's, he's quite smart in that regard, sometimes it's worth looking at his other side.

Your blog is stretching Papyrus' intelligence by quite a bit when this is how he is in the game and what Axorandom0 already said in the first reply.

3. Gravity manipulation: Gravity distortion, gravity manipulation, weight alteration that allows Frisk to become heavy or light, telekinesis, and levitation.

4. Magic healing: Papyrus healed Frisk after the battle, her health reserve is back to 20 without eating.

Already have that on his profile.

5. Magic pencil: The secret boss has a pencil and Papyrus is skilled in drawer.

He didn't draw; he painted. Also I don't see how it has anything to do with So Sorry.

6. Radar: Thanks to this, he knows where Toby Fox is and is able to sense his presence.

This radar doesn't have any relevancy nor does it have anything to do with Toby Fox. The "presence" you bring up when coming near the Mysterious Door area is just his phone signal getting weaker.

Not responding to the Low 1-C part for now cause I don't know how to respond to that part yet, but the one issue I've seen from all of your blogs is how much of it is being lead by speculation and guesses. Like why is there so much Gaster references lmao.

 

[AyOgUyS]

​

Not responding to the Low 1-C part for now cause I don't know how to respond to that part yet, but the one issue I've seen from all of your blogs is how much of it is being lead by speculation and guesses. Like why is there so much Gaster references lmao.

His 5D argument is just "MWI cuz multiple timelines"

 

[AyOgUyS]

Yeah, I think I get it now.
You need to understand the essence of souls, let's try discussing it on Discord because I need scans.

My discord is dinosaurscpfan if you want it but expect my reply speed to be inconsistent

 

[Axorandom0]

You see, the stats in Undertale don't show the monster's current strength, but rather the peak they can dish out.

I'd like to note that, in genocide, Papyrus' stats are listed as 3/3 instead of 20/20, implying that there are certain cases where they will actually be lowered. However, considering how this isn't done with Asgore/Toriel, it may just be an inconsistency. Or perhaps an upscale for the Dreemurrs /j

 

[AyOgUyS]

I'd like to note that, in genocide, Papyrus' stats are listed as 3/3 instead of 20/20, implying that there are certain cases where they will actually be lowered. However, considering how this isn't done with Asgore/Toriel, it may just be an inconsistency. Or perhaps an upscale for the Dreemurrs /j

Undertale stats make no sense
snowdrake's mother somehow has negative stats

 

[Oikarian]

I said flowey would never have been able to get pass asgore on his own in response to the idea of flowey apperently being comparable to 40,000 monsters and you saying "well he killed asgore!" as the reason to why you think he would be able to do that

Among the murders, Flowey mentions Asgore, but Asgore don't let show souls; he didn't let him pass, although this sometimes confuses and makes Asgore stronger. However, Flowey isn't even afraid of him, and he calls the king names. He didn't particularly impress Flowey, although his dialogues mentioned souls. Moreover, Chara had to make several attacks to finally kill him, and the neutral Frisk didn’t even kill him, he just disappeared???

1. Snowdin is a place

2. If it was always there then wouldn't that contradict sans and papyrus supposedly not being in undertale?

I don't know how you interpreted it, but I used context as time, not place. If we need to prove that they are from another world, we need larger contexts.

Um no? For frisk to move accross time they would just need some form of time manipulation that allows them to time travel which they already have.
The timeline wouldn't need to be infinite

Flowey, who read all the books, didn't say that Frisk can reverse time. Flowey said that we move another timeline, but even so, Sans's theory somehow doesn't fit with the context. Are you saying that the timeline actually jumps??? Although this is Sans's theory, he blamed us for doing it.

1. This only proves the cosmology is an ad Infinium, which is already accepted iirc

2. There are tons of different versions to MWI going for 2-C to like low 1-A, assuming we grant MWI saying "The verse has MWI!" dosen't really grant much tbh

MWI theory does not exist 2-A, although if we prove that the multiverse does not exist, we will get an infinite 4D, but 1-A is possible, but we need context, for example, a 6D multiverse must contain 5D universes, this principle is also taken into account in MWI, if the universe is 4D but the multiverse is 6D, then this can be taken if it is mentioned in the context.

We already accepted UT as a multiverse

That's good, but I read the article a year ago, and i wrote it 3 years ago, but I didn't know that you accepted UT like a multiverse.

Undertale: Cosmology Blog

vsbattles.fandom.com

I'm asking where 5D is comming from? Because the blog itself just says "well the verse might actually have MWI so 5D!1!"

I'm currently multi tasking so no

Thanks to Frisk's movement, she is unlimited in this. If MWI does not exist, then what Flowey said is denied because there cannot be a universe that should exist. Similarly, without MWI theories, what Flowey and Sans said is refuted, even though they say they are moving to another timeline. one of the problems is that if ut is a multiverse it must have a +1 structure to contain an infinite number of its interpretations.

edit: also the point of a CRT is to explain and get this approved on site so moving this to cord is unnnessesary

I got, but I just suggested it to make it easier to communicate.

 

[Oikarian]

@Axorandom0 I'll answer later because I'm busy discussing with someone else.

 

[Oikarian]

My discord is dinosaurscpfan if you want it but expect my reply speed to be inconsistent

I added you as a friend, accept oikarian01, there you can ask a question you didn't understand.

 

[AyOgUyS]

I added you as a friend, accept oikarian01, there you can ask a question you didn't understand.

i'll reply on discord later

 

[AyOgUyS]

Thanks to Frisk's movement, she is unlimited in this. If MWI does not exist, then what Flowey said is denied because there cannot be a universe that should exist. Similarly, without MWI theories, what Flowey and Sans said is refuted, even though they say they are moving to another timeline. one of the problems is that if ut is a multiverse it must have a +1 structure to contain an infinite number of its interpretations.

First of all no a construct that contains infinite 4d constructs within itself wouldn't be 5d and also UT doesn't have infinite timelines

 

[Oikarian]

1) "Undertale Cosmology", "Papyrus in Actually Strong" and "Sans in Actually Strong" have received an update. You can also read the scale on the PC versions.
2)I'll be very busy because my medical education is getting in the way, and I'm also studying music and drawing. My goal is to create a game. I could complete the scale of Undertale scaling in a week, but I think due to the workload of training, I'll finish somewhere in July, so don't expect active responses from me in the comments.
3)I noticed they added Level 1-C and other new abilities and I only found out about it now, but I'm glad Undertale has reached this point, although the game still has potential for further development if more evidence is found.