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Shibai Otsutsuki Universal+ Removel

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ProfessorKukui4Life said:
Just to add a bit more to this, doesnt Ombipotence blantantly work on a cross dimensional scale? Even when Eida used it, it seemed to have reached/affected other dimensions, like Code having been affected.

If a Temu version of omnipotence can do that, then wouldn’t it stand to reason that the real thing is most definitely far beyond the scope of a planet?

EDIT: NVM. Didn’t notice the 7 new pages that popped up for this.
Click to expand...
Manipulating memories is far from creating a universe
 
Nierre said:
For what it's worth, I disagree with the OP FRA.

If anybody wants to link posts that debunk the rating better than the OP has so I can properly read it all, then do so. Ill try to check it out if I'm free
Click to expand...
Okay why do you disagree?
 
Saqphire said:
Disagree with OP, agree with nuking his profile until he actually becomes a real character
Click to expand...
I mean He’s real (The one piece!!) just as real as anyone else in the series and directly tied to the core plot. The entire Omnipotence arc, where people’s memories were rewritten, is explicitly linked to an ability a cyborg received through Shibai Ōtsutsuki’s DNA. The prescience ability currently driving the plot of Boruto: Two Blue Vortex also originates from Shibai’s DNA, heck even Codes claw mark with the claw grimes that plays a role in directing creating the current threats ( Shinju) comes from shibai. On top of that, Shibai’s physical body is stated to be in the possession of Amado, which directly confirms that he physically existed before discarding his body. So lore wise every matchess well.
 
Samlex1234 said:
I mean He’s real (The one piece!!) just as real as anyone else in the series and directly tied to the core plot. The entire Omnipotence arc, where people’s memories were rewritten, is explicitly linked to an ability a cyborg received through Shibai Ōtsutsuki’s DNA. The prescience ability currently driving the plot of Boruto: Two Blue Vortex also originates from Shibai’s DNA, heck even Codes claw mark with the claw grimes that plays a role in directing creating the current threats ( Shinju) comes from shibai. On top of that, Shibai’s physical body is stated to be in the possession of Amado, which directly confirms that he physically existed before discarding his body. So lore wise every matchess well.
Click to expand...
I'm aware of his lore, but all that mf is is a plot device told by some people, there's not even an actual personality here.

Imu is more of a real character than Shibai cuz she has a presence and dialogue yet that mf aint got a profile on here cuz there are no actual feats, just lore/narrative and a weapon feat that scales to no one. Rocks was actually in the same place as Shibai until they finally revealed him in a flashback yet there was no profile for him either
 
Saqphire said:
Imu is more of a real character than Shibai cuz she has a presence and dialogue yet that mf aint got a profile on here cuz there are no actual feats, just lore/narrative and a weapon feat that scales to no one.
Click to expand...
Imu actually got a feat pretty much immediately after popping up, but it was just Sabo scaling. Imu got more feats now tho.
 
AlternativePrinciple said:
First thing is first, provide a scan for that.

Secondly it says to all things not the universe itself. That’s a very big jump in logic to assume it’s gonna create the universe when it’s never stated or insisted on. Omnipotence directly claims to have created the universe while CoAT is for “all things” which is not the universe.
Click to expand...
Here are the scans. All things/everything typical refers to the universe. Matter is part of the universe. So if you say omnipotence made the universe you would be also talking about the matter aswell.
AlternativePrinciple said:
Your quick to assume that things like CoAT and hags world creation statement means universe when there is no narrative implication while also denying Omnipotence universe creation when it has narrative implications.
Click to expand...
The use terms like "all things "and "all of creation " which are other ways of saying universe. It's verbatim stated tso uses the power of creation. How does omnipotence have narrative universal implications? I'm not saying it can't be universal im saying their isn't enough evidence to come that conclusion.
AlternativePrinciple said:
This is just being dishonest and hypocritical

Once again do you have any proof that hags didn’t create ninjutsu? Perhaps a scan? Or any narrative evidence that contradict it? You having nothing of the sorts and just claim things while not backing them up with evidence.
Click to expand...
I posted it hagromo verbatim says he didn't create ninjustu only ninshu
AlternativePrinciple said:
We have explicit statements of hags being the one responsible for ninjutsu in the modern world while you have no evidence denying that claim.
Click to expand...
Well he said wasn't so much for that
AlternativePrinciple said:
Your very CRT was created this way, bunch of claims with no proof to back them up and nothing new to counter L2C omnipotence that hasn’t been addressed in previous thread. Plus there is proof of you having created this thread out of spite which makes sense given its quality and misinformation your replaying with
Click to expand...
No I didn't create it out of spite theirs 0 evidence for that I simply said certain verses face more scrutiny then others.
AlternativePrinciple said:
making it seem that you never actually read the series in the first place or the thread that got it accepted
Click to expand...
I read it in full
 
Someone close this.
It’s clear enough that “deleting shibai’s profile” has nothing to do with the OP, and can be treated in another thread for all i care. You don’t randomly sprout a thing like that in the 11th page of a CRT.

The thread hasn’t be wholesomely rejected, yes, but then again, it’s clear to everyone that the current arguments agreed upon by the opposition are not really in tally with Ichimojii’s post, and would need a less hectic properly made thread to further an organic discussion.
 
Kaydee1648 said:
Someone close this.
It’s clear enough that “deleting shibai’s profile” has nothing to do with the OP, and can be treated in another thread for all i care. You don’t randomly sprout a thing like that in the 11th page of a CRT.

The thread hasn’t be wholesomely rejected, yes, but then again, it’s clear to everyone that the current arguments agreed upon by the opposition are not really in tally with Ichimojii’s post, and would need a less hectic properly made thread to further an organic discussion.
Click to expand...
I mean the crt is already 11 pages long. And it’s still only about Low 2-C Shibai mainly.

And it’s in grace right now. So unless you can convince all the other evaluating staff that agreed with the removal I don’t think you can just say close it and let’s start over.
 
ichimojii said:
Manipulating memories is far from creating a universe
Click to expand...
This served as additional evidence( though I don’t think that is even needed), introduced to demonstrate the proven scope and scale of the ability. Omnipotence is not mere memory manipulation in the sense of genjutsu or standard mind control. It rewrites memory through reality warping, altering information at the fundamental level rather than inducing perception-based effects.
The ability is explicitly described as a “programming language that materializes will.” This is why no one in the verse outside the Ōtsutsuki can resist it even though we have people vast in mind manipulation resistance. Among the Ōtsutsuki, resistance is genetic, not skill-based. They are the clan of gods, and all known information about godhood in the series traces directly back to the Ōtsutsuki.

Like even based on the established lore, godhood cannot be attained without first becoming an Ōtsutsuki, and becoming an Ōtsutsuki requires the sacrificial process involving the Ten-Tails and an Otsutsuki. Every aspect of divinity in the narrative, its origin, mechanism, and authority, is inseparable from the Ōtsutsuki lineage.

Even fragments of Shibai Ōtsutsuki’s abilities already grant access to near-omniscience, which aligns with the traditional attributes of godhood. gods are repeatedly described as omniscient and omnipotent, and notably, the supreme ability itself is literally named Omnipotence.

Furthermore, wielding Omnipotence is implied to require omnipotence and omnipresence by nature, not merely by application. The power is presented as the absolute pinnacle of the verse, surpassing all known abilities to the extent that gods can even use it to author entirely new powers. So no it’s not just a technique that manipulates memories.


ichimojii said:
Here are the scans. All things/everything typical refers to the universe. Matter is part of the universe. So if you say omnipotence made the universe you would be also talking about the matter aswell.

The use terms like "all things "and "all of creation " which are other ways of saying universe. It's verbatim stated tso uses the power of creation. How does omnipotence have narrative universal implications? I'm not saying it can't be universal im saying their isn't enough evidence to come that conclusion.

I posted it hagromo verbatim says he didn't create ninjustu only ninshu

Well he said wasn't so much for that

No I didn't create it out of spite theirs 0 evidence for that I simply said certain verses face more scrutiny then others.

I read it in full
Click to expand...
Omnipotence > Yin–Yang / COAT

Omnipotence operates on a higher tier than Yin–Yang Release. It possesses Information Manipulation (Type 2) alongside reality warping meaning it does not merely construct worlds, but defines and programs reality itself, including its rules, structures, and necessary constituents.

COAT (Yin–Yang Release) is also a form of reality warping, as it derives from the dual principles of Yin (form/concept) and Yang (actuality/life). Yin–Yang can indeed give rise to all things within existence, but it is never stated to create existence itself or define its governing framework.

This distinction is demonstrated throughout the series. Lower-ranking Ōtsutsuki are already capable of using Yin–Yang to create matter, space, and even dimensions. For example, Kaguya Ōtsutsuki employed Yin–Yang through ETSO to destroy and recreate her dimensions that contained space, matter and energy. However, the scale of Yin-yang creation also varies not all TSO are equal Yin–Yang application is dependent on the user’s authority and output.

The same principle applies to Toneri Ōtsutsuki, who also utilized Yin–Yang via Truth-Seeking Orbs but on a lower scale and we don’t scale him to Kaguya’s ETSO.. Why because Yin-yang being capable of creating a universe, solar system, planet or anything matter what so ever is dependent of the energy the user possesses.

Omnipotence is responsible for the framework that includes Yin and Yang themselves.
 
Last edited:
ichimojii said:
Manipulating memories is far from creating a universe
Click to expand...

I agree. But what my point for this was, is that if it works across dimensions (a far weaker version of Omnipotence at that), then the scope of what the ability effects is on a cosmological scale rather than a planetary one. So the basis for limiting omnipotence to that of just planetary is pretty largely weak, if nothing.

And side note, but manipulating memories is just something as a result of its reality warping.
 
ichimojii said:
Here are the scans. All things/everything typical refers to the universe. Matter is part of the universe. So if you say omnipotence made the universe you would be also talking about the matter aswell.

The use terms like "all things "and "all of creation " which are other ways of saying universe. It's verbatim stated tso uses the power of creation. How does omnipotence have narrative universal implications? I'm not saying it can't be universal im saying their isn't enough evidence to come that conclusion.

I posted it hagromo verbatim says he didn't create ninjustu only ninshu

Well he said wasn't so much for that

No I didn't create it out of spite theirs 0 evidence for that I simply said certain verses face more scrutiny then others.

I read it in full
Click to expand...
With all due respect, my friend, after reading your quotes, I struggle to find a definitive point or a logical goal in your arguments. It seems there is a significant misunderstanding of the narrative context here (no offense intended).

Regarding your point about Hagoromo not creating Ninjutsu: How is this relevant to the core of our discussion? As we know, Hagoromo established Ninshu to allow people to connect and understand one another. Over time, this practice was weaponized and evolved into Ninjutsu. By simple derivation, Ninjutsu is a sub-product or a distorted version of Ninshu. Therefore, Hagoromo remains the 'Source' and 'Origin' of Ninjutsu, even if the final result contradicted his original peaceful intent. For the people of the Naruto world, he is functionally the progenitor of both. This is a basic historical fact within the series.

Now, regarding the 'Creation of All Things' (CoAT):
The Databook explicitly defines this as a technique. It is a methodology to manifest something out of nothing. Having access to a technique does not automatically scale a character to the level of Shibai or any higher Otsutsuki 'God.' To put it simply: it’s like a Rasengan. A Rasengan’s power depends on the user’s chakra and scale. If you have the chakra of a God, your Rasengan could potentially destroy a galaxy; if you are a Genin, it’s just a small sphere. Similarly, CoAT is a tool for creation, but it doesn't grant 'God-tier' status by itself. Your assumption that possessing this technique makes one equal to a higher Otsutsuki deity is a claim with no actual evidence or backing.

Finally, the last scan you provided actually reinforces my point rather than yours. Hagoromo himself, on the stone tablet, mentions that an 'Unknown God' used contradictory forces to create the entire universe and everything within it. We should actually thank Hagoromo for this, as he provides the narrative evidence that a higher Creator exists.

Most importantly, you cannot arbitrarily limit the meaning of the Kanji 'Shinra Bansho' (森羅万象) to just 'Earth' or 'Planetary' scale. In Japanese philosophy and literature, this term literally means 'All things in nature' or 'The whole of creation.' Attempting to downplay a term that encompasses the totality of existence is a linguistic error that ignores the author’s intent.
 
IMO I find this thread to be highly illogical as OP never provided proofs for removing Shibai Uni+ with Omnipotence and it had turned into a toxic thread from what I have read in the 11 pages.
My opinion on this thread is this:

The Naruto official website both in Japanese and English for the Boruto database on Shinjutsu Omnipotence clear this up: Omnipotence is what was used to create this current world. And Momoshiki knowledge on Shinjutsu declared that Omnipotence had created worlds. Not just one world.

Boruto Database: Omnipotence | NARUTO OFFICIAL SITE (NARUTO & BORUTO)

Omnipotence Classification: Shinjutsu Wielder(s): Currently only Eida
naruto-official.com naruto-official.com

『BORUTO』データベース！「全能」 | 【公式】NARUTO OFFICIAL SITE、NARUTO -ナルト-オフィシャルサイト、BORUTO -ボルト-

全能 分類:神術 術者:現在のところエイダのみ かつて「神」となった大筒木が、今ある世界を創る際に用いたとされる術。 あらゆ
naruto-official.com naruto-official.com



世界 is used to describe what Omnipotence had created, it will be highly illogical for a god to have just created earth or society. so the word world here means Universe.

We seen inferior Otsutsuki who are not Gods already create Space-Time dimensions that have stars and planets, e.g Kaguya with TSO.

By qualitative scaling from the lore of Boruto, we know that Omnipotence true might can only be used by an Almighty and All knowing being e.g Otsutsuki Gods. Shibai could or could have not created this world but a God with Omnipotence did. and since Shibai in lore is a perfect user of Omnipotence due to being an Otsutsuki and all powerful and all knowing god he is capable of it. Even if assume that Shiabi did not create this world, he can with Omnipotence create one.
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
I agree. But what my point for this was, is that if it works across dimensions (a far weaker version of Omnipotence at that), then the scope of what the ability effects is on a cosmological scale rather than a planetary one. So the basis for limiting omnipotence to that of just planetary is pretty largely weak, if nothing.

And side note, but manipulating memories is just something as a result of its reality warping.
Click to expand...

It's not necessarily weaker just that eida can only use it subconsciously. Creating an entire planet to me is better then manipulating memories on a interdimension scale which is largely unquantifiable. She also has her charm power only affects those who look at her


It's low grade reality warping with high range from what has been shown. We didn't see casuality,Past, present or future being manipulated. Just memories that are connected to chakra. Just because someone is a reality warper doesn't mean their universal. Like luffy for example has RW yet he's not universal. Reality Warping powers general have a ceiling.
 
ichimojii said:
It's not necessarily weaker just that eida can only use it subconsciously. Creating an entire planet to me is better then manipulating memories on a interdimension scale which is largely unquantifiable. She also has her charm power only affects those who look at her


It's low grade reality warping with high range from what has been shown. We didn't see casuality,Past, present or future being manipulated. Just memories that are connected to chakra. Just because someone is a reality warper doesn't mean their universal. Like luffy for example has RW yet he's not universal. Reality Warping powers general have a ceiling.
Click to expand...

Im pretty sure it was stated, AFAIK, that non Otsutsuki can't use Shinjutsu to their fullest extent or capability. Hence why Eida has no control over it.

Anyway, im not saying reality warping don't generally have ceilings. But the reality warping here, from Omnipotence, should have a ceiling much higher than planetary.
 
Also.
DSVJrFB.png


We literally see this encompass only the planet.

Stop saying this had universal range.
 
HelloThere1089 said:
I think it's a bit dishonest to say it only encompasses the planet when the literal panel shows the wave travelling outside of the planet and the ability is shown to affect characters like Code who are outside of that dimension. But that's just me.
Click to expand...
Traveling where? To uninhabited planets where no one knows Boruto to alter no one’s memories?
 
Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye said:
Traveling where? To uninhabited planets where no one knows Boruto to alter no one’s memories?
Click to expand...
Idk, ask the author why he drew an omnidirectional ring travelling outwards. I can only assume it affects everything within it's range which seems to encompass the dimension code was in at the time along with the main one.
 
R81handman said:
IMO I find this thread to be highly illogical as OP never provided proofs for removing Shibai Uni+ with Omnipotence and it had turned into a toxic thread from what I have read in the 11 pages.
My opinion on this thread is this:

The Naruto official website both in Japanese and English for the Boruto database on Shinjutsu Omnipotence clear this up: Omnipotence is what was used to create this current world. And Momoshiki knowledge on Shinjutsu declared that Omnipotence had created worlds. Not just one world.

Boruto Database: Omnipotence | NARUTO OFFICIAL SITE (NARUTO & BORUTO)

Omnipotence Classification: Shinjutsu Wielder(s): Currently only Eida
naruto-official.com naruto-official.com

『BORUTO』データベース！「全能」 | 【公式】NARUTO OFFICIAL SITE、NARUTO -ナルト-オフィシャルサイト、BORUTO -ボルト-

全能 分類:神術 術者:現在のところエイダのみ かつて「神」となった大筒木が、今ある世界を創る際に用いたとされる術。 あらゆ
naruto-official.com naruto-official.com



世界 is used to describe what Omnipotence had created, it will be highly illogical for a god to have just created earth or society. so the word world here means Universe.

We seen inferior Otsutsuki who are not Gods already create Space-Time dimensions that have stars and planets, e.g Kaguya with TSO.

By qualitative scaling from the lore of Boruto, we know that Omnipotence true might can only be used by an Almighty and All knowing being e.g Otsutsuki Gods. Shibai could or could have not created this world but a God with Omnipotence did. and since Shibai in lore is a perfect user of Omnipotence due to being an Otsutsuki and all powerful and all knowing god he is capable of it. Even if assume that Shiabi did not create this world, he can with Omnipotence create one.
Click to expand...


You acting as if creating dimensions is a casual feat kaguya needs prep and time. Brouto hypes up Uzuhiko using planet level energy against code who scales above kaguya. If narratively Brouto high tiers are above solar system level attacks Uzuhiko which uses the planet's forces shouldn't be a threat at all. Amado hypes up shibai being able to create storms and the otsutsuki being able to manipulate life/death. When all these feats have done by characters in OG Naruto
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
Unless we're going to say the omnidirectional wave just vanished between dimensions after clearly going beyond the planet (and that takes much bigger assumptions to claim), since it's a wave thats actually traveling, it should be safe to say it would have to encompass the entirety of one dimension before going into another one (where Code is).
Click to expand...
Ain’t no way you think that wave travelled millions of light years and went outside the bounds of that universe and physically entered another one

Unless I’m not reading this right
 
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