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Some Potential addition or Expansion for the Tiering System. Your thoughts?

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Proposed Tiers Beyond 0
  • Tier Alpha (α): Meta-Boundless. This tier is for beings that transcend the very concept of "Boundlessness" itself. While a Tier 0 character is absolute within a specific logical framework, an Alpha character treats that entire framework as a limited subset of a larger, even more absolute reality.
  • Tier Beta (β): Trans-Omnipotent. This tier designates characters who operate beyond the paradoxes of omnipotence. While VS Battles Wiki typically views Omnipotence as unprovable or tied to Tier 0, Beta represents beings whose "power" is not an attribute they possess, but the fundamental reason why logic exists in the first place.
  • Tier Gamma (γ): Ineffable / Non-Dual. Specifically for characters who transcend all distinctions, including the distinction between "being" and "non-being," or "power" and "powerlessness". This tier is reserved for those who cannot be defined by any quality, even the quality of being "Boundless".
  • Tier Omega (Ω): The Absolute Singularity. The final conceptual stop. This represents a state where even the concept of "tiers" or "scaling" is an infinitesimal fraction of the entity's nature. It is the source from which all other tiers, including "Boundlessness," are derived as mere shadows.

  • Tier Sigma (Σ): The Meta-Narrative Author
    This tier represents beings that treat Narrative Boundaries as if they were physical walls. While a lower-tier character might have Fourth Wall Awareness, a Tier Sigma entity possesses Narrative Manipulation that scales across different franchises and published works.
    • Conceptual Transcendence: They are Trans-Conceptual, meaning they exist before and after the concepts of "beginning," "end," "plot," or "logic" were even conceived by a creator.
    • Cross-Media Autonomy: They are not bound to their native series. Their influence or "presence" is felt across separate intellectual properties, effectively treating the entire real-world landscape of fiction (e.g. realm of fiction; trans-fiction and meta-fiction included) as a single, unified ground.
    • The Pataphysical Jump: They operate on the level of Pataphysics—the science of imaginary solutions. They transcend the "author-character" dynamic entirely, existing in a space where the distinction between the real writer and the fictional subject is blurred or reversed (e.i. Like an actor or actress portraying a character in a published work, or one of those those films or series where animated character 'interacts' with real-world actors; 2D animation with live-action videography).

    • It bridges the gap between "text" and "reality" by treating fiction as a tangible, unified layer of existence.

      Using previous examples, we can categorize this into two distinct "Trans-Narrative" behaviors:
      • The Actor/Avatar Model: Just as a real-world actor exists independently of the role they play, a Tier Sigma being is the "true self" behind a character. If the story ends or the book is burned, the "Actor" (the entity) remains untouched. They are merely "wearing" the story.
      • The Live-Action/Animation Hybrid: Like the logic in Who Framed Roger Rabbit or Space Jam, these beings treat the Real World as just another "room" they can walk into. They aren't just "aware" of us; they possess Meta-Narrative Manipulation, allowing them to interact with the "film grain" or the "author's pen" as if it were a physical object.



        Tier Delta (Δ): The Observational Anchor
        Characters in this tier don't just know about the audience; they are physically and metaphysically sustained by them. Their Attack Potency and Durability are tied to how many "Real World" observers are currently focusing on, believing in, or even just acknowledging their existence.--where a character’s power is directly proportional to their status in the "Real World" as perceived by the audience. This tier is essentially the "Reader-Embodiment" or "Audience-Driven" level.

        • Audience Empowerment: The character gains Reactive Evolution or power boosts based on their popularity, notoriety, or the intensity of the "cheers" from the real-world audience.
          • Example: Kamen Rider Oma Zi-O (not saying to change the character's tier, btw) has been depicted as returning from erasure via the cheers of the real-world audience.​
        • Narrative Anchor: As long as one person in the real world remembers the character, they cannot be truly erased. They possess a form of Abstract Existence where their "soul" is actually a collection of neurons in human brains. A memory, essential.​
        • Viewpoint Authority: They can manipulate the "camera" or the "perspective" of the story. If the reader looks away, the character can change the scene or reset the timeline because they exist in the "blind spot" of the narrative.

          Note: Integration with Existing Systems
          Under this proposal, Tier 0 could remain a "catch-all" for characters reaching the standard definition of the Absolute, while these Greek designations would provide a way to differentiate between "baseline" Boundless characters and those who exist in a state of higher-order transcendence.​
 
Proposed Tiers Beyond 0
  • Tier Alpha (α): Meta-Boundless. This tier is for beings that transcend the very concept of "Boundlessness" itself. While a Tier 0 character is absolute within a specific logical framework, an Alpha character treats that entire framework as a limited subset of a larger, even more absolute reality.
  • Tier Beta (β): Trans-Omnipotent. This tier designates characters who operate beyond the paradoxes of omnipotence. While VS Battles Wiki typically views Omnipotence as unprovable or tied to Tier 0, Beta represents beings whose "power" is not an attribute they possess, but the fundamental reason why logic exists in the first place.
  • Tier Gamma (γ): Ineffable / Non-Dual. Specifically for characters who transcend all distinctions, including the distinction between "being" and "non-being," or "power" and "powerlessness". This tier is reserved for those who cannot be defined by any quality, even the quality of being "Boundless".
  • Tier Omega (Ω): The Absolute Singularity. The final conceptual stop. This represents a state where even the concept of "tiers" or "scaling" is an infinitesimal fraction of the entity's nature. It is the source from which all other tiers, including "Boundlessness," are derived as mere shadows.

  • Tier Sigma (Σ): The Meta-Narrative Author
    This tier represents beings that treat Narrative Boundaries as if they were physical walls. While a lower-tier character might have Fourth Wall Awareness, a Tier Sigma entity possesses Narrative Manipulation that scales across different franchises and published works.
    • Conceptual Transcendence: They are Trans-Conceptual, meaning they exist before and after the concepts of "beginning," "end," "plot," or "logic" were even conceived by a creator.
    • Cross-Media Autonomy: They are not bound to their native series. Their influence or "presence" is felt across separate intellectual properties, effectively treating the entire real-world landscape of fiction (e.g. realm of fiction; trans-fiction and meta-fiction included) as a single, unified ground.
    • The Pataphysical Jump: They operate on the level of Pataphysics—the science of imaginary solutions. They transcend the "author-character" dynamic entirely, existing in a space where the distinction between the real writer and the fictional subject is blurred or reversed (e.i. Like an actor or actress portraying a character in a published work, or one of those those films or series where animated character 'interacts' with real-world actors; 2D animation with live-action videography).

    • It bridges the gap between "text" and "reality" by treating fiction as a tangible, unified layer of existence.

      Using previous examples, we can categorize this into two distinct "Trans-Narrative" behaviors:
      • The Actor/Avatar Model: Just as a real-world actor exists independently of the role they play, a Tier Sigma being is the "true self" behind a character. If the story ends or the book is burned, the "Actor" (the entity) remains untouched. They are merely "wearing" the story.
      • The Live-Action/Animation Hybrid: Like the logic in Who Framed Roger Rabbit or Space Jam, these beings treat the Real World as just another "room" they can walk into. They aren't just "aware" of us; they possess Meta-Narrative Manipulation, allowing them to interact with the "film grain" or the "author's pen" as if it were a physical object.



        Tier Delta (Δ): The Observational Anchor
        Characters in this tier don't just know about the audience; they are physically and metaphysically sustained by them. Their Attack Potency and Durability are tied to how many "Real World" observers are currently focusing on, believing in, or even just acknowledging their existence.--where a character’s power is directly proportional to their status in the "Real World" as perceived by the audience. This tier is essentially the "Reader-Embodiment" or "Audience-Driven" level.
        • Audience Empowerment:The character gains Reactive Evolution or power boosts based on their popularity, notoriety, or the intensity of the "cheers" from the real-world audience.
          • Example: Kamen Rider Oma Zi-O (not saying to change the character's tier, btw) has been depicted as returning from erasure via the cheers of the real-world audience.​
        • Narrative Anchor: As long as one person in the real world remembers the character, they cannot be truly erased. They possess a form of Abstract Existence where their "soul" is actually a collection of neurons in human brains. A memory, essential.​
        • Viewpoint Authority: They can manipulate the "camera" or the "perspective" of the story. If the reader looks away, the character can change the scene or reset the timeline because they exist in the "blind spot" of the narrative.

          Note: Integration with Existing Systems
          Under this proposal, Tier 0 could remain a "catch-all" for characters reaching the standard definition of the Absolute, while these Greek designations would provide a way to differentiate between "baseline" Boundless characters and those who exist in a state of higher-order transcendence.​
no
 
Proposed Tiers Beyond 0
  • Tier Alpha (α): Meta-Boundless. This tier is for beings that transcend the very concept of "Boundlessness" itself. While a Tier 0 character is absolute within a specific logical framework, an Alpha character treats that entire framework as a limited subset of a larger, even more absolute reality.
  • Tier Beta (β): Trans-Omnipotent. This tier designates characters who operate beyond the paradoxes of omnipotence. While VS Battles Wiki typically views Omnipotence as unprovable or tied to Tier 0, Beta represents beings whose "power" is not an attribute they possess, but the fundamental reason why logic exists in the first place.
  • Tier Gamma (γ): Ineffable / Non-Dual. Specifically for characters who transcend all distinctions, including the distinction between "being" and "non-being," or "power" and "powerlessness". This tier is reserved for those who cannot be defined by any quality, even the quality of being "Boundless".
  • Tier Omega (Ω): The Absolute Singularity. The final conceptual stop. This represents a state where even the concept of "tiers" or "scaling" is an infinitesimal fraction of the entity's nature. It is the source from which all other tiers, including "Boundlessness," are derived as mere shadows.

  • Tier Sigma (Σ): The Meta-Narrative Author
    This tier represents beings that treat Narrative Boundaries as if they were physical walls. While a lower-tier character might have Fourth Wall Awareness, a Tier Sigma entity possesses Narrative Manipulation that scales across different franchises and published works.
    • Conceptual Transcendence: They are Trans-Conceptual, meaning they exist before and after the concepts of "beginning," "end," "plot," or "logic" were even conceived by a creator.
    • Cross-Media Autonomy: They are not bound to their native series. Their influence or "presence" is felt across separate intellectual properties, effectively treating the entire real-world landscape of fiction (e.g. realm of fiction; trans-fiction and meta-fiction included) as a single, unified ground.
    • The Pataphysical Jump: They operate on the level of Pataphysics—the science of imaginary solutions. They transcend the "author-character" dynamic entirely, existing in a space where the distinction between the real writer and the fictional subject is blurred or reversed (e.i. Like an actor or actress portraying a character in a published work, or one of those those films or series where animated character 'interacts' with real-world actors; 2D animation with live-action videography).

    • It bridges the gap between "text" and "reality" by treating fiction as a tangible, unified layer of existence.

      Using previous examples, we can categorize this into two distinct "Trans-Narrative" behaviors:
      • The Actor/Avatar Model: Just as a real-world actor exists independently of the role they play, a Tier Sigma being is the "true self" behind a character. If the story ends or the book is burned, the "Actor" (the entity) remains untouched. They are merely "wearing" the story.
      • The Live-Action/Animation Hybrid: Like the logic in Who Framed Roger Rabbit or Space Jam, these beings treat the Real World as just another "room" they can walk into. They aren't just "aware" of us; they possess Meta-Narrative Manipulation, allowing them to interact with the "film grain" or the "author's pen" as if it were a physical object.



        Tier Delta (Δ): The Observational Anchor
        Characters in this tier don't just know about the audience; they are physically and metaphysically sustained by them. Their Attack Potency and Durability are tied to how many "Real World" observers are currently focusing on, believing in, or even just acknowledging their existence.--where a character’s power is directly proportional to their status in the "Real World" as perceived by the audience. This tier is essentially the "Reader-Embodiment" or "Audience-Driven" level.
        • Audience Empowerment:The character gains Reactive Evolution or power boosts based on their popularity, notoriety, or the intensity of the "cheers" from the real-world audience.
          • Example: Kamen Rider Oma Zi-O (not saying to change the character's tier, btw) has been depicted as returning from erasure via the cheers of the real-world audience.​
        • Narrative Anchor: As long as one person in the real world remembers the character, they cannot be truly erased. They possess a form of Abstract Existence where their "soul" is actually a collection of neurons in human brains. A memory, essential.​
        • Viewpoint Authority: They can manipulate the "camera" or the "perspective" of the story. If the reader looks away, the character can change the scene or reset the timeline because they exist in the "blind spot" of the narrative.

          Note: Integration with Existing Systems
          Under this proposal, Tier 0 could remain a "catch-all" for characters reaching the standard definition of the Absolute, while these Greek designations would provide a way to differentiate between "baseline" Boundless characters and those who exist in a state of higher-order transcendence.​
No..
☠️
This doesn't even make sense ...
 
Proposed Tiers Beyond 0
  • Tier Alpha (α): Meta-Boundless. This tier is for beings that transcend the very concept of "Boundlessness" itself. While a Tier 0 character is absolute within a specific logical framework, an Alpha character treats that entire framework as a limited subset of a larger, even more absolute reality.
  • Tier Beta (β): Trans-Omnipotent. This tier designates characters who operate beyond the paradoxes of omnipotence. While VS Battles Wiki typically views Omnipotence as unprovable or tied to Tier 0, Beta represents beings whose "power" is not an attribute they possess, but the fundamental reason why logic exists in the first place.
  • Tier Gamma (γ): Ineffable / Non-Dual. Specifically for characters who transcend all distinctions, including the distinction between "being" and "non-being," or "power" and "powerlessness". This tier is reserved for those who cannot be defined by any quality, even the quality of being "Boundless".
  • Tier Omega (Ω): The Absolute Singularity. The final conceptual stop. This represents a state where even the concept of "tiers" or "scaling" is an infinitesimal fraction of the entity's nature. It is the source from which all other tiers, including "Boundlessness," are derived as mere shadows.

  • Tier Sigma (Σ): The Meta-Narrative Author
    This tier represents beings that treat Narrative Boundaries as if they were physical walls. While a lower-tier character might have Fourth Wall Awareness, a Tier Sigmaentity possesses Narrative Manipulation that scales across different franchises and published works.
    • Conceptual Transcendence: They are Trans-Conceptual, meaning they exist before and after the concepts of "beginning," "end," "plot," or "logic" were even conceived by a creator.
    • Cross-Media Autonomy: They are not bound to their native series. Their influence or "presence" is felt across separate intellectual properties, effectively treating the entire real-world landscape of fiction (e.g. realm of fiction; trans-fiction and meta-fiction included) as a single, unified ground.
    • The Pataphysical Jump: They operate on the level of Pataphysics—the science of imaginary solutions. They transcend the "author-character" dynamic entirely, existing in a space where the distinction between the real writer and the fictional subject is blurred or reversed (e.i. Like an actor or actress portraying a character in a published work, or one of those those films or series where animated character 'interacts' with real-world actors; 2D animation with live-action videography).

    • It bridges the gap between "text" and "reality" by treating fiction as a tangible, unified layer of existence.

      Using previous examples, we can categorize this into two distinct "Trans-Narrative" behaviors:
      • The Actor/Avatar Model: Just as a real-world actor exists independently of the role they play, a Tier Sigma being is the "true self" behind a character. If the story ends or the book is burned, the "Actor" (the entity) remains untouched. They are merely "wearing" the story.
      • The Live-Action/Animation Hybrid: Like the logic in Who Framed Roger Rabbit or Space Jam, these beings treat the Real World as just another "room" they can walk into. They aren't just "aware" of us; they possess Meta-Narrative Manipulation, allowing them to interact with the "film grain" or the "author's pen" as if it were a physical object.



        Tier Delta (Δ): The Observational Anchor
        Characters in this tier don't just know about the audience; they are physically and metaphysically sustained by them. Their Attack Potency and Durability are tied to how many "Real World" observers are currently focusing on, believing in, or even just acknowledging their existence.--where a character’s power is directly proportional to their status in the "Real World" as perceived by the audience. This tier is essentially the "Reader-Embodiment" or "Audience-Driven" level.​
        • Audience Empowerment:The character gains Reactive Evolution or power boosts based on their popularity, notoriety, or the intensity of the "cheers" from the real-world audience.
          • Example: Kamen Rider Oma Zi-O (not saying to change the character's tier, btw) has been depicted as returning from erasure via the cheers of the real-world audience.​
        • Narrative Anchor: As long as one person in the real world remembers the character, they cannot be truly erased. They possess a form of Abstract Existence where their "soul" is actually a collection of neurons in human brains. A memory, essential.​
        • Viewpoint Authority: They can manipulate the "camera" or the "perspective" of the story. If the reader looks away, the character can change the scene or reset the timeline because they exist in the "blind spot" of the narrative.

          Note: Integration with Existing Systems
          Under this proposal, Tier 0 could remain a "catch-all" for characters reaching the standard definition of the Absolute, while these Greek designations would provide a way to differentiate between "baseline" Boundless characters and those who exist in a state of higher-order transcendence.​
Agree.
Beyond all these would be the tier, Very Existent Misfit and only graham would scale to it. He would erase this entire system on His Very Existent Misfit nothingness
 
Why are y'all disagreeing with this guys 🗿
Seems pretty blatant to me, only goku scales to this cuz he solos fiction.
 
Incompatible with the current Tier 0 standards
"Beyond omnipotence" is a concept most philosophers would just facepalm upon hearing about
Most. But philosophical structuring, along with the body of knowledge, has broadened since the ancient of days. As well as our understanding of cosmology and logic and tautology. Then one take into consideration contexts.

And, yes, Jedi. I understand you take.
 
Yakub and his children are not reading AI slop.
Ah, yes. "AI slop" that is becoming one's go-to word when they run across something that they sense is remotely 'artificially' generated. sigh look, If you were in my shoes, you'd realize the effort that this would take to construct. With a bit of digging.

Plus you have some people that can conceptualize and abstract...think in higher levels of what is power and what constitute powers within human conceivability and those that tedder on the edge of what one could comprehend, even barely.

Not sure, if you can understand that. Again, my apologies for sound too deep and complex.
 
Please understand and read our current standards for tier 0

At a glance majority of your proposition goes against the very nature of how we define Tier 0
The idea of conceptualizing ideas or abstract concepts beyond boundless is already addressed on the page. And we are under the absolute assumption that absolutely nothing more exists beyond it, and it is the final grounding.
And to assume otherwise then that simply means it wasn't tier 0 from the beginning
 
IMG-7023.webp

True
 
Proposed Tiers Beyond 0
  • Tier Alpha (α): Meta-Boundless. This tier is for beings that transcend the very concept of "Boundlessness" itself. While a Tier 0 character is absolute within a specific logical framework, an Alpha character treats that entire framework as a limited subset of a larger, even more absolute reality.
  • Tier Beta (β): Trans-Omnipotent. This tier designates characters who operate beyond the paradoxes of omnipotence. While VS Battles Wiki typically views Omnipotence as unprovable or tied to Tier 0, Beta represents beings whose "power" is not an attribute they possess, but the fundamental reason why logic exists in the first place.
  • Tier Gamma (γ): Ineffable / Non-Dual. Specifically for characters who transcend all distinctions, including the distinction between "being" and "non-being," or "power" and "powerlessness". This tier is reserved for those who cannot be defined by any quality, even the quality of being "Boundless".
  • Tier Omega (Ω): The Absolute Singularity. The final conceptual stop. This represents a state where even the concept of "tiers" or "scaling" is an infinitesimal fraction of the entity's nature. It is the source from which all other tiers, including "Boundlessness," are derived as mere shadow.
dont we do something similar to this? that all tier 0s are without description and see all things in the world as the same (correct me if im wrong)?
 
dont we do something similar to this? that all tier 0s are without description and see all things in the world as the same (correct me if im wrong)?
Tier 0 could still encompass all these. You're right.
 
The idea that something transcends boundless is literally contradictory to the current standards. Unless you want to make a CRT to change the standards for tier 0, though I doubt anyone would actually take you seriously.
 
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