Friday the 13th Revisions: Restoring Jason to his former glory

[Raincutter]

9-A


This is based primarily on this recently accepted calc from FvJ

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Shattas/Freddy_And_Jason_Survive_The_Propane_Tank_Explosion

Though there is also other evidence.

Necronomicon Freddy, while not trying, has this accepted 9-A calc

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Raincutter103118/Freddy_Krueger%27s_casual_attacks

While it's not shown, Ash's girlfriend is in the last shack Freddy blows up and she tanks the attack. Jason would definitely upscale her. He also tanked Freddy's attempt to crush his head in the previous issue


Necro Freddy himself has his durability in the real world accepted at 9-A and Jason damages him several times effortlessly.

Finally, Tina is accepted at 9-A.

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Tina_Shepard

While it's been assumed that Tina got stronger and Jason therefore wouldn't scale to her, it's stated that no one alone could stop either Freddy or Jason, with Tina not disagreeing. This is shown later on when Tina chooses to flee from Jason instead of just oneshotting him. Jason himself actually gets a tank thrown at him (the tank throw used to calc her to 9-A) and comes out unharmed.


Why "At least"? Because both Jason and Freddy tanked this 9-A explosion while massively weakened and fatigued, coming out largely in one piece, with Jason possibly further weakened by drugs per this writer. Jason himself heavily physically upscales Freddy, ripping his arm off during the fight and FvJvA Jason overwhelming several clones of Freddy, i.e. Jason is much stronger than a 9-A character.

The Case for 8-C

This is based on this 8-C calc

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Shattas/Jason_Voorhees_Survives_The_Heat_Of_The_Earth%27s_Core

Freddy also has a similar feat in the real world


In another novel, he may've survived being at the center of a mansion explosion, though this has no calc it should be comparable.

We can also use his performance against Ash Williams, oneshotting him in two out of their three fights.
This version of Ash easily scales to Building level

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Ash_Williams_(Dynamite_Entertainment)

Lastly, a time displaced base Jason does briefly manage to fight Uber Jason, even briefly overpowering him, though he does get put down quickly, which makes sense considering UJ's 8-C+ scaling

While it might be iffy to use a crossover to scale off Ash, it should be fine in light of Freddy and Jason's own feats and the latter's respective scaling against Freddy and Ash

There is also only a 6.38x gap between Jason's 9-A feat and baseline 8-C. Given Jason heavily upscaling Freddy and him getting stronger with every death, it'd be reasonable to just round him up just off the 9-A stuff. There's also the fact that Deadite Jason canonically receives one last power up from Freddy in Nightmare Warriors to lead his army.

-----------------

So if this is accepted, Jason should have a key that goes "At least 8-C" or at worst "At least 9-A, likely at least 8-C," and this key should be for FvJ up to Jason X as Jason grew younger and stronger when he resurrected himself in FvJ


And one final note, if Ash scaling is accepted, Jason should be upgraded to "At least Class K" for Ash upscaling deadite spine rips.

Tommy Jarvis
In Nightmare Warriors, Tommy is stated to be a Chosen One like Ash, fated to defeat evil. He should therefore have the same Chosen One powers as Ash.

These include: Fate Manip, Mid-Low Regen and Resistance to Fate Manip, Biological Manipulation, Spatial Manipulation, Soul Manipulation, Possession, and Corruption.

As for how he'd scale to Jason, Tommy beats the shit out of amped Jason at the end of the run (albeit after getting a cheap shot in), so he should have a Nightmare Warriors key.

Misc
Jason should have spatial manip/black hole resistance for fighting Uber Jason next to a black hole (same scan).
The script for P9 states Jason was bathed in holy light. Notably, it takes several demon hands to overpower him while he's bathed in the holy light (while impaled with the Kandarian Dagger ) So he should have resistance to holy manip

Speaking of the Kandarian Dagger, since it has durability negation, he should have resistance to dura negation for tanking it. Resistance to dura negation is implied by a novel statement that Freddy had no way of killing Jason even in the Dream World, and he could only hax Jason AFTER Jason felt a bit of fear from water.

 

[Raincutter]

bump

 

[Hellbeast]

9-A seems pretty good

 

[Raincutter]

9-A seems pretty good

Just curious, what's your contention with the 8-C arg?

 

[Qawsedf234]

The issue I'm seeing with 9-A and 8-C, and the reason why Jason was downgraded, is that all those feats are explosion-based and Jason just does not do well in any other area

• He's regularly shown to be staggered by bullets and his durability can be overwhelmed after a while with even basic weapons
• Damage in the Tier 9-C to 9-B range regularly harm him him: Spikes, shards of metal, his own machete, a boat propeller, flags, spikes moved purely through gravity, power saws
• Direct explosives like grenades or mortars are shown to cause massive damage, with EU material reinforcing this point. The future grenade launcher also obliterates him, but that was previously discarded as being possible future tech rather than a durability anti-feat.

For the feat itself:

While it's not shown, Ash's girlfriend is in the last shack Freddy blows up and she tanks the attack. Jason would definitely upscale her. He also tanked Freddy's attempt to crush his head in the previous issue

Scaling Freddy's explosion to a crush requires UES, which is not proven here. He also does not blow up her shack. The full page shows hers was not touched, and he tears the roof off of it. She tanked nothing.

Additionally, Freddy explicitly noted he was holding back the entire time later on in the fight. He was just enjoying the thrill of messing with them and as soon as he got board he easily overpowered/suspended both Ash and Jason.

While it's been assumed that Tina got stronger and Jason therefore wouldn't scale to her, it's stated that no one alone could stop either Freddy or Jason, with Tina not disagreeing. This is shown later on when Tina chooses to flee from Jason instead of just oneshotting him. Jason himself actually gets a tank thrown at him (the tank throw used to calc her to 9-A) and comes out unharmed.

Jason being hit by the tank doesn't mean he scales to the full value, though I can see where this is coming from. Though afaik this statement comes before the Tank lift, something Tina didn't know if she was capable and beyond what she's done before. So you can't backscale her feat to that statement.

This is based on this 8-C calc

This is a heat durability feat, which we don't transfer to general durability without a UES-type durability system.

This version of Ash easily scales to Building level

The version of Ash that Jason is accepting as scaling to is not Dynamite Ash, but Ash from his first three movies. To the best of my knowledge, FvJvA and FvJvA:NW does not reference anything other than the three Evil Dead movies.

Lastly, a time displaced base Jason does briefly manage to fight Uber Jason, even briefly overpowering him, though he does get put down quickly, which makes sense considering UJ's 8-C+ scaling

I don't see where you're seeing Zombie Jason overpower Uber-Jason. He gets killed in like two hits and Uber-Jason comes out completely unharmed.

And one final note, if Ash scaling is accepted, Jason should be upgraded to "At least Class K" for Ash upscaling deadite spine rips.

If the spine rips happens in the Evil Dead movies, I can sorta get behind it. I don't think Jason ever fails to lift something I guess.

Jason should have spatial manip/black hole resistance for fighting Uber Jason next to a black hole (same scan).

They were not in a Black Hole, even if the book sometimes calls them that. They're in a Wormhole which exists outside the boundaries of time; which is why Jason can fight a previous version of Jason. After this Jason is sent outside of time where he rams into the ship with the woman carrying his child and it launched back into the timestream where he lands on the moon and a big robot kills him after like two weeks of fighting.

I can vaguely get behind a "Potentially higher" key, at least for durability, but a straight upgrade (especially an 8-C one) I do not buy in the slightest.

 

[Raincutter]

The issue I'm seeing with 9-A and 8-C, and the reason why Jason was downgraded, is that all those feats are explosion-based and Jason just does not do well in any other area

• He's regularly shown to be staggered by bullets and his durability can be overwhelmed after a while with even basic weapons
• Damage in the Tier 9-C to 9-B range regularly harm him him: Spikes, shards of metal, his own machete, a boat propeller, flags, spikes moved purely through gravity, power saws
• Direct explosives like grenades or mortars are shown to cause massive damage, with EU material reinforcing this point. The future grenade launcher also obliterates him, but At worst, it could just be acknowledged as a weakness.

At worst, I think piercing weapons could just be acknowledged as a weakness. As for the other stuff, I just don't they're all that relevant as they're either against a weaker Jason or are canceled out by instances of him tanking 9-B attacks such as the various instances of him smashing through doors or other explosions.

Also, why are we bringing up Black Flame stuff if we're not granting him his abilities shown there?

For the feat itself:

Scaling Freddy's explosion to a crush requires UES, which is not proven here. He also does not blow up her shack. The full page shows hers was not touched, and he tears the roof off of it. She tanked nothing.

Doesn't Freddy state that he is limited only by his imagination? That seems to imply UES as it's not like he's limited to the category of imagination he channels his will towards, i.e. He's not magically 4000x weaker just because he decided to go all out with a TK attack instead of an explosive one. The only restriction would be how feared he is and his own will.

Additionally, Freddy explicitly noted he was holding back the entire time later on in the fight. He was just enjoying the thrill of messing with them and as soon as he got board he easily overpowered/suspended both Ash and Jason.

Even so, I don't see why he'd hold back his durability. Jason performs similarly against Freddy in their first fight, where the latter grows gradually more pissed until he's using his full power, and Jason still endures his attacks and harms him.

Jason being hit by the tank doesn't mean he scales to the full value, though I can see where this is coming from. Though afaik this statement comes before the Tank lift, something Tina didn't know if she was capable and beyond what she's done before. So you can't backscale her feat to that statement.

She just says that it was bigger than anything she'd previously moved. The feat itself was fairly casual given that she didn't just "move" but rather hurled it across the sky. Even afterwards, Tommy states that only he can put Jason down. Pretty clear narrative implication that Tina < Jason

This is a heat durability feat, which we don't transfer to general durability without a UES-type durability system.

References for Common Feats

Throughout fiction and real life, there have been numerous feats demonstrating a certain character's or object's destructive power. This page's purpose is to consolidate calculations for those feats for better convenience in determining an object's or character's Attack Potency or Durability...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Seems to be accepted as a common feat

The version of Ash that Jason is accepting as scaling to is not Dynamite Ash, but Ash from his first three movies. To the best of my knowledge, FvJvA and FvJvA:NW does not reference anything other than the three Evil Dead movies.

It is Dynamite Ash. I made the profile. In the Hack/Slash crossover, Ash references the girlfriend Jason killed, shows the damage Jason did to his car, and also acknowledges the Marvel Zombies crossover. IIRC Jason is also shown in a flashback in a copyright friendly way.

I don't see where you're seeing Zombie Jason overpower Uber-Jason. He gets killed in like two hits and Uber-Jason comes out completely unharmed.

It's stated he pushed him back with a charge.

If the spine rips happens in the Evil Dead movies, I can sorta get behind it. I don't think Jason ever fails to lift something I guess.

It's from the Dynamite comics. The actual LS of the Evil Dead cast I unfortunately underestimated, Ash should scale to Kandar tearing apart a steel bridge, with just one beam requiring Class M strength to tear apart https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Viott/Igor_is_breaking_the_beam. This should be usable for all Ashes that consider the films canon

I also noticed that a random deadite in Nightmare Warriors was able to oneshot an apache helicopter, which would scale fodder deadites to 9-B+ https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/AH-64_Apache

They were not in a Black Hole, even if the book sometimes calls them that. They're in a Wormhole which exists outside the boundaries of time; which is why Jason can fight a previous version of Jason. After this Jason is sent outside of time where he rams into the ship with the woman carrying his child and it launched back into the timestream where he lands on the moon and a big robot kills him after like two weeks of fighting.

Fair enough, but it's still stated to be near an event horizon, which by definition has an immense pull of gravity and are found alongside black holes. Even if it's just a wormhole with one, I think the spatial manip resistance is fair.

I can vaguely get behind a "Potentially higher" key, at least for durability, but a straight upgrade (especially an 8-C one) I do not buy in the slightest.

Any upgrade to his durability would naturally carry over to his AP due to Tommy Jarvis. I think upscaling the 9-B+ deadites and Freddy's 9-A dura into a key somewhere into 9-A or something of the sort would be reasonable.
Besides that, do you think the Tommy Jarvis stuff is okay?

 

[Qawsedf234]

At worst, I think piercing weapons could just be acknowledged as a weakness. As for the other stuff, I just don't they're all that relevant as they're either against a weaker Jason or are canceled out by instances of him tanking 9-B attacks such as the various instances of him smashing through doors or other explosions.

Smashing through doors is under a megajoule in most of Jason's cases, and the explosions that he withstands are either off-screen or he's far away from. Anytime one makes close or direct contact, his body is gibbed. It's not even a consistent feature for him to take damage of this level.

Doesn't Freddy state that he is limited only by his imagination?

Freddy is canonically a jobber and will prolong things for his enjoyment. Freddy blowing things up does not translate to his durability in all cases because of that. Like I said, in the fight itself he tell Ash directly that he's going to stop messing around and instantly wins.

Also, why are we bringing up Black Flame stuff if we're not granting him his abilities shown there?

Because BlackFlame is another example of Jason not showing consistency in his stats at the level you're suggesting. I just added it for flavor, so you're free to ignore it.

Even so, I don't see why he'd hold back his durability

Because he's just dumb. Most of his loses comes from underestimating his opponents and intentionally stalling out the conflict.

Jason performs similarly against Freddy in their first fight, where the latter grows gradually more pissed until he's using his full power, and Jason still endures his attacks and harms him.

That's an indication of what I mean. Freddy got much stronger and still let himself fight Jason. In both comics Freddy could've killed the main cast if he wasn't a psychopath and liked messing with them. Once he got tired of Jason and Ash he beat them in like five panels.

She just says that it was bigger than anything she'd previously moved.

She says she's not even sure if she can move it. The feat is something beyond anything she's tried before, so attempting to backscale this to the previous statement doesn't work. She was unaware of her strength at that moment.

The feat itself was fairly casual given that she didn't just "move" but rather hurled it across the sky. Even afterwards, Tommy states that only he can put Jason down. Pretty clear narrative implication that Tina < Jasonhttps://imgur.com/a/tina-shepard-throws-tank-ba9bz

Tommy lost to Jason and only won because of Stephanie stabbing him in the back. Tommy would think he would be the only one to put Jason down because he's obsessed with him. He's also wrong, because Jason revives from this because his niece wasn't the one who delt the final blow.

Now the narrative of Tina < Jason I can vaguely get, since he would presumably just outlast in an endurance contest like he did in Part VIII.

Seems to be accepted as a common feat

Heat is a separate thing from general durability

It is Dynamite Ash. I made the profile.

I'm not debating that it is Dynamite Ash, I'm saying Jason as he is now is only being scaled to Ash from the Evil Dead movies.

It's stated he pushed him back with a charge.

I see the muck statement now. Moving Uber-Jason does not mean Zombie Jason scales to his AP for the same reason Spider-Man staggering Thanos isn't a feat for Spider-Man. UJ was undamaged and then killed his older version with no issues.

It's from the Dynamite comics. The actual LS of the Evil Dead cast I unfortunately underestimated, Ash should scale to Kandar tearing apart a steel bridge, with just one beam requiring Class M strength to tear apart https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Viott/Igor_is_breaking_the_beam. This should be usable for all Ashes that consider the films canon

The link is dead.

As for the scaling, like I said, currently it's just Ash from the movies. The proposal here would be saying that Jason would scale to the entirety of Dynamite Ash, which will lead into rather massive canon issues we're going that route.

Fair enough, but it's still stated to be near an event horizon, which by definition has an immense pull of gravity and are found alongside black holes. Even if it's just a wormhole with one, I think the spatial manip resistance is fair.

I can vaguely see Jason X getting spatial resistance. His quantum duplicate wouldn't since it's just an alteration of Uber-Jason based on quantum probability going by the text.

Besides that, do you think the Tommy Jarvis stuff is okay?

The powers I'm okay with, the AP is inconsistent, but he'd downscale no matter what in some level. But I don't think Jason is consistent enough to warrant anything past 9-B in this incarnation.

 

[Hellbeast]

Just curious, what's your contention with the 8-C arg?

Eh nothing much, I just prefer 9-A but 8-C seems fairly solid

Perhaps a 9-A, likely 8-C? I’m not too fussed. I do agree piercing would better explain how Jason can be harmed by weapons seemingly below this brute force.

 

[Raincutter]

Smashing through doors is under a megajoule in most of Jason's cases, and the explosions that he withstands are either off-screen or he's far away from. Anytime one makes close or direct contact, his body is gibbed. It's not even a consistent feature for him to take damage of this level.

Door busting is 500 kj, something human jason can do. Grenades are just over 1 mj. Even if it was human Jason getting blown to pieces and even if we say Jason was taking the full yield of the grenade, it would be contradictory. People don't lose limbs from taking attacks twice as strong as what they can casually do. That's ignoring that Jason got stronger and the grenade's energy was dispersed.

Freddy is canonically a jobber and will prolong things for his enjoyment. Freddy blowing things up does not translate to his durability in all cases because of that. Like I said, in the fight itself he tell Ash directly that he's going to stop messing around and instantly wins.

I'm not saying blowing things up translates to 9-A Freddy. His profile has him at 9-A for taking a tank shell, the same Freddy who gets his arm broken by Ash afterwards. So even messing around, Freddy sets his durability that high, which matches his nerfed FvJ real world self enduring the 9-A explosion

Because BlackFlame is another example of Jason not showing consistency in his stats at the level you're suggesting. I just added it for flavor, so you're free to ignore it.

If we're free to use material not accepted as canon, then I could just as well bring up other versions of Jason https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Jason_Voorhees_(Jason_vs_Leatherface)

Because he's just dumb. Most of his loses comes from underestimating his opponents and intentionally stalling out the conflict.

That's an indication of what I mean. Freddy got much stronger and still let himself fight Jason. In both comics Freddy could've killed the main cast if he wasn't a psychopath and liked messing with them. Once he got tired of Jason and Ash he beat them in like five panels.

What are you talking about here? FvJ Freddy explicitly wasn't holding back by the end of their fight.

She says she's not even sure if she can move it. The feat is something beyond anything she's tried before, so attempting to backscale this to the previous statement doesn't work. She was unaware of her strength at that moment.

And then she more than moved it is my point. She was intimidated by the size, but the actual effort involved proved relatively trivial. Compare that to when she actually struggled in VII where she passed out after resurrecting her father. I'd compare it to a naturally strong person stepping into the gym to bench 135 and doing so easily. Just because they might be scared by the weights doesn't mean they never exerted that force in their life before or never could or that their intuitive judgments about their own power relative to others beforehand would be invalidated.

I'm not debating that it is Dynamite Ash, I'm saying Jason as he is now is only being scaled to Ash from the Evil Dead movies.

I see. This should still warrant Class K based off a deadite reducing a human to blood in AoD and ED2, which should be superior to crushing a human body

I see the muck statement now. Moving Uber-Jason does not mean Zombie Jason scales to his AP for the same reason Spider-Man staggering Thanos isn't a feat for Spider-Man. UJ was undamaged and then killed his older version with no issues.

The text states they both charged at one another. Zombie Jason got the upper hand, meaning he both survived Uber Jason's charge and was strong enough to counter it. It's different than Spider-Man just moving Thanos's weight.

The link is dead.

That's strange

Igor is breaking the beam.

vsbattles.fandom.com

If that doesn't work, you can search for it in google and it's the first thing that shows up if you type "vsbattles" "igor" "Steel" "calc"

As for the scaling, like I said, currently it's just Ash from the movies. The proposal here would be saying that Jason would scale to the entirety of Dynamite Ash, which will lead into rather massive canon issues we're going that route.

Like?

I can vaguely see Jason X getting spatial resistance. His quantum duplicate wouldn't since it's just an alteration of Uber-Jason based on quantum probability going by the text.

The text uses flowery language. They're obviously not visually identical, they're not materially identical (Zombie Jason doesn't have nanites), so I assume they were only "identical" in the sense that they were both truly Jason in some sense, and neither could exist with the other simultaneously (hence the electron analogy). The other was not some clone. And this is supported by the text clarifying that the other Jason was the one who put on the mask and became iconic.

The powers I'm okay with, the AP is inconsistent, but he'd downscale no matter what in some level. But I don't think Jason is consistent enough to warrant anything past 9-B in this incarnation.

You think even the 9-B+ upscale off a random Deadite would be too much?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Door busting is 500 kj, something human jason can do. Grenades are just over 1 mj. Even if it was human Jason getting blown to pieces and even if we say Jason was taking the full yield of the grenade, it would be contradictory. People don't lose limbs from taking attacks twice as strong as what they can casually do. That's ignoring that Jason got stronger and the grenade's energy was dispersed.

Human Jason performed his feat by using his left leg and both hands, so it's not 500 KJ in a punch, but over those three body parts. a 1 Megajoule explosion, if close enough, could cause that damage due to the surface area being smaller than Jason's original feat. For example a .45 ACP round has a surface area of 1.032256 cm^2 and has roughly 500 Joules of kinetic force, while a fist has a surface are of 430 square cm^2. You'd need 208 Kilojoules punch to replicate the pressure of a relatively low velocity and wide bullet. Close-range explosions and rifle rounds would be able to harm a 9-B character, but would bounce off an 8-C character for these reasons.

I'm not saying blowing things up translates to 9-A Freddy. His profile has him at 9-A for taking a tank shell, the same Freddy who gets his arm broken by Ash afterwards. So even messing around, Freddy sets his durability that high, which matches his nerfed FvJ real world self enduring the 9-A explosion

Even in that last fight, Freddy is messing around. He's joking with Ash and after absorbing Jason was just going to kill them all again. I'm not disagreeing with you that Freddy can be 9-A, my point is that it's really hard to scale anyone to Freddy because his personality makes it hard to scale him in general.

If we're free to use material not accepted as canon, then I could just as well bring up other versions of Jason https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Jason_Voorhees_(Jason_vs_Leatherface)

I mean...

This is also him taking damage from someone the comic says outright he'd curbstomp if he truly felt like killing them. So again, he's harmed by things demonstrably under what you're suggesting.

What are you talking about here? FvJ Freddy explicitly wasn't holding back by the end of their fight.

FvJ Freddy was, but not FvJvA Freddy which is the subject of the conversation. He tells Ash outright that he's done dicking around and then casually overpowers both him and Jason. Meaning for the entirety of the fight beforehand, he was just dicking around with both Ash and Freddy because he's that type of person.

And then she more than moved it is my point. She was intimidated by the size, but the actual effort involved proved relatively trivial. Compare that to when she actually struggled in VII where she passed out after resurrecting her father. I'd compare it to a naturally strong person stepping into the gym to bench 135 and doing so easily. Just because they might be scared by the weights doesn't mean they never exerted that force in their life before or never could or that their intuitive judgments about their own power relative to others beforehand would be invalidated.

The issue is that Tina does not know her upper limits because she didn't explore them. Your example doesn't fit what happened, since it's more like a strong person questioning if they can lift 300 lbs, but then do it, when before they thought their upper limit was 150 and they were weaker than another lifter. If you want to scale Jason to this feat or calculate this feat I can get those, but the tank lift isn't something that statement can really be scaled to in my view. Also, when Tina revived her father, he just instantly overpowered and folded Jason. So that example seems weird, since it would imply that a maxed-out Tina can overwhelm Jason, at least through summoning.

I see. This should still warrant Class K based off a deadite reducing a human to blood in AoD and ED2, which should be superior to crushing a human body

If there's a calc for that, sure. But iirc the Class K spine rip is also scientifically impossible, since it requires destroying every muscle group at once, when realistically it happens segmented over time. But if pulping a human is Class K then Jason has ample reason to scale to it since he's superior to most Deadites (or at least most film Deadites).

The text states they both charged at one another. Zombie Jason got the upper hand, meaning he both survived Uber Jason's charge and was strong enough to counter it. It's different than Spider-Man just moving Thanos's weight.

The text goes as follows:

• Uberjason charges into the fog, then Zombie Jason follows
• The narration then describes how the scenes keep changing to something from Jason's past, with JJJ, Amanda, and the Android looking in horror at the scene
• Zombie Jason charges Uberjason to the murk surrounding the pier in FvJ, but there's no mention of Uberjason being knocked over
• Uberjason kills Zombie Jason easily afterwards and is never described as taking damage. In fact the narration describes Zombie Jason (and his machete) as being slammed around like a Virtual Hockey player

Unlike with the clone Jason, who actually damages Uber-Jason in their fight, the quantum duplicate just doesn't put up a show here.

That's strange

The URL for your previous one was just slightly off:

• Dead Link: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Viott/Igor_is_breaking_the_beam
• Current Link: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Viott/Igor_is_breaking_the_beam.

There was a period that was missing. But the feat itself is Ignor crushing an I-Beam, can you show the Kandarian Deadite doing that?

Like?

The eternity of the Jason X novel and comic series. Earth dies right after the intro of Jason X, they go to space, and there's a big environmental collapse. Additionally, while the F13 franchise steadily expanded in mystic threats, the Dynamite comics have superheroes and the like running about to my memory, which is just never suggested in the core F13 stuff.

The text uses flowery language. They're obviously not visually identical, they're not materially identical (Zombie Jason doesn't have nanites), so I assume they were only "identical" in the sense that they were both truly Jason in some sense, and neither could exist with the other simultaneously (hence the electron analogy). The other was not some clone. And this is supported by the text clarifying that the other Jason was the one who put on the mask and became iconic.

I think you're misunderstanding my point. The scene is talking about what ifs and wave function collapse but in the hardest way possible to read (because the Death Moon author writes in a Kirkbridian fashion for 60% of the novel). I'm saying that Uber-Jason should get it, because it's Uber-Jason being subjected to that waveform collapse and fighting a Quantum duplication of himself from the past. They're both the true Jason, but at different points in space-time.

You think even the 9-B+ upscale off a random Deadite would be too much?

9-B+ for Zombie Jason I can get behind more, especially considering he's got like five death amps since that point. My thing is saying Jason is 9-A or 8-C is getting into non-sensical territory, where you're actively ignoring most of his showings because they contradict that rating.

 

[Dalesean027]

Qaw makes sense to me here, we do need to have some level of consistency to warrant this

 

[Raincutter]

Qaw makes sense to me here, we do need to have some level of consistency to warrant this

Just to keep track, Qaw is fine with:

Tommy power revisions
Adding some resistances (not the Uber) for Jason
Maybe a 9-B+ key/upscale

 

[Raincutter]

Human Jason performed his feat by using his left leg and both hands, so it's not 500 KJ in a punch, but over those three body parts. a 1 Megajoule explosion, if close enough, could cause that damage due to the surface area being smaller than Jason's original feat. For example a .45 ACP round has a surface area of 1.032256 cm^2 and has roughly 500 Joules of kinetic force, while a fist has a surface are of 430 square cm^2. You'd need 208 Kilojoules punch to replicate the pressure of a relatively low velocity and wide bullet. Close-range explosions and rifle rounds would be able to harm a 9-B character, but would bounce off an 8-C character for these reasons.

A grenade even right next to him would have its energy distributed across his body, an area greater than what's in him bashing through doors with his shoulder or an arm and a leg. In none of the actual instances of them harming him is that even the case. He's at best right next to it, receiving perhaps half the energy.

Even in that last fight, Freddy is messing around. He's joking with Ash and after absorbing Jason was just going to kill them all again. I'm not disagreeing with you that Freddy can be 9-A, my point is that it's really hard to scale anyone to Freddy because his personality makes it hard to scale him in general.

My point is that FvJvA showed that 9-A is casual for Freddy. FvJvA Freddy is also just Freddy using a Necro spell to have his dream powers in the real world, so casual Necro Freddy = casual Dream World Freddy. If that's true, then it follows that Jason tanking hits from an explicitly not-holding-back Dream World Freddy should at the very least scale him above casual Freddy's demonstrated AP.

I mean...

This is also him taking damage from someone the comic says outright he'd curbstomp if he truly felt like killing them. So again, he's harmed by things demonstrably under what you're suggesting.

This version of Jason is only 9-A off upscaling Leatherface pulverizing a steel door. I don't see one of Leatherface's cousins being able to down him with a cheapshot as contradictory.

FvJ Freddy was, but not FvJvA Freddy which is the subject of the conversation. He tells Ash outright that he's done dicking around and then casually overpowers both him and Jason. Meaning for the entirety of the fight beforehand, he was just dicking around with both Ash and Freddy because he's that type of person.

The issue is that Tina does not know her upper limits because she didn't explore them. Your example doesn't fit what happened, since it's more like a strong person questioning if they can lift 300 lbs, but then do it, when before they thought their upper limit was 150 and they were weaker than another lifter. If you want to scale Jason to this feat or calculate this feat I can get those, but the tank lift isn't something that statement can really be scaled to in my view. Also, when Tina revived her father, he just instantly overpowered and folded Jason. So that example seems weird, since it would imply that a maxed-out Tina can overwhelm Jason, at least through summoning.

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Raincutter103118/Jason_knocks_down_a_blast_door

I've actually been meaning to calc this for a while. Thanks for reminding me about it. I'm not sure if this counts as calc stacking. I guess the first set of values could be used if it does.

As for Tina, there is one final statement that could be used for an upscale. After Jason dies, Freddy says that every one of the survivor's soul had increased his power, but Jason's was like a "blast furnace."

If there's a calc for that, sure. But iirc the Class K spine rip is also scientifically impossible, since it requires destroying every muscle group at once, when realistically it happens segmented over time. But if pulping a human is Class K then Jason has ample reason to scale to it since he's superior to most Deadites (or at least most film Deadites).

The text goes as follows:

• Uberjason charges into the fog, then Zombie Jason follows
• The narration then describes how the scenes keep changing to something from Jason's past, with JJJ, Amanda, and the Android looking in horror at the scene
• Zombie Jason charges Uberjason to the murk surrounding the pier in FvJ, but there's no mention of Uberjason being knocked over
• Uberjason kills Zombie Jason easily afterwards and is never described as taking damage. In fact the narration describes Zombie Jason (and his machete) as being slammed around like a Virtual Hockey player

Unlike with the clone Jason, who actually damages Uber-Jason in their fight, the quantum duplicate just doesn't put up a show here.

Ok. The best I can make of it is that they're both in a stand off, UJ charges first (he doesn't charge randomly into the fog with Jason following him), Jason follows, but they get lost in the fog, hence "ballet of the blind." Zombie Jason may or may not have caught him offguard in the fog. This I concede.

The URL for your previous one was just slightly off:

• Dead Link: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Viott/Igor_is_breaking_the_beam
• Current Link: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Viott/Igor_is_breaking_the_beam.

There was a period that was missing. But the feat itself is Ignor crushing an I-Beam, can you show the Kandarian Deadite doing that?

The feat calcs the strength required to tear the beam apart given its cross section, hence tensile strength. (Or maybe I have the wrong feat? The link is dead lol)
His page gives some good pics of the bridge he destroyed https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Kandar
Other pics online also give an idea of what the bridge looked like afterwards

The eternity of the Jason X novel and comic series. Earth dies right after the intro of Jason X, they go to space, and there's a big environmental collapse. Additionally, while the F13 franchise steadily expanded in mystic threats, the Dynamite comics have superheroes and the like running about to my memory, which is just never suggested in the core F13 stuff.

To the best of my knowledge, there shouldn't be a problem then since Dynamite comics AFAIK either don't give definite dates for stories that take place in the future (Jason X starts off 4 centuries later) or they have Ash hopping across various dimensions and timelines.

I think you're misunderstanding my point. The scene is talking about what ifs and wave function collapse but in the hardest way possible to read (because the Death Moon author writes in a Kirkbridian fashion for 60% of the novel). I'm saying that Uber-Jason should get it, because it's Uber-Jason being subjected to that waveform collapse and fighting a Quantum duplication of himself from the past. They're both the true Jason, but at different points in space-time.

Yeah, so UJ at a different point in the timeline is just Zombie Jason and thus as powerful as Zombie Jason was at the time. I don't really understand what your point is here.

9-B+ for Zombie Jason I can get behind more, especially considering he's got like five death amps since that point. My thing is saying Jason is 9-A or 8-C is getting into non-sensical territory, where you're actively ignoring most of his showings because they contradict that rating.

Okay. I'm fine with that. Jason would probably have a "Deadite General" or "FvJvA" key. And he should have an "At least" rating for heavily upscaling the normal deadites.

 

[Dalesean027]

Just to keep track, Qaw is fine with:

Tommy power revisions
Adding some resistances (not the Uber) for Jason
Maybe a 9-B+ key/upscale

Yeah those were fine as well, apologies for not addressing those too

 

[Raincutter]

Yeah those were fine as well, apologies for not addressing those too

Ok. I'll see what he thinks about these last few arguments. Otherwise, we can add those.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Okay. I'm fine with that. Jason would probably have a "Deadite General" or "FvJvA" key. And he should have an "At least" rating for heavily upscaling the normal deadites.

Making it a new key would be better:

• Human (Part II) -> Human (Part IV) -> Possessed Bodies -> Undead -> Deadite / Body Restored -> Über-Jason -> Jason X^3

But we'd need to shuffle the Jason X novelization powers into the Deadite key afaik. Because a lot of those statements only exist for that iteration.

 

[Raincutter]

Making it a new key would be better:

• Human (Part II) -> Human (Part IV) -> Possessed Bodies -> Undead -> Deadite / Body Restored -> Über-Jason -> Jason X^3

But we'd need to shuffle the Jason X novelization powers into the Deadite key afaik. Because a lot of those statements only exist for that iteration.

Cool. I'll update the Tommy Jarvis page. Could you do Jason's or unlock it?

 

[Qawsedf234]

I've unlocked it but the 9-B+ calc still needs approvals doesn't it?

 

[Raincutter]

I've unlocked it but the 9-B+ calc still needs approvals doesn't it?

I was going off primarily from upscaling deadites that oneshot 9-B+ apache helis.

The calc would be a nice supporting feat

 

[Raincutter]

Added the revisions. This thread can be closed now.