Is the Princess of Hell BRIGHT enough save her people (Charlie Morningstar vs The Vees) (0-0-0)

[Anonymous_Learner]

In "recent" times, I've repeatedly slander Charlie in the Hazbin Hotel Discussion thread despite Charlie being an interesting character to me that i'm invested in, her being the reason I got into power scaling on this site in the first place, and she was in the first thread VSBW Versus matchup where I put a giant text wall to defend my side of the debate and really the first one I ever really part took in. So, to counteract my slander and to commemorate this connection I have to her character, i'm making this matchup to hopefully give her something that technically could've happened
(Also, last match i wanna make before i post the Hellaverse Mega CRT)

Charlie Morningstar (Transformed+Rage Amped) vs. The Vees (with Might of Lilith)

Fight takes place in the Hellaverse Hell's Pride Ring, near V Tower
Distance: 75 Meters (may change on arguments but likely not)
Vox has access to his 100% state
The Vees get Shok.Wav, Angel Dust, and Alastor (Who'll just watch)
Charlie's ability to get razzle and dazzle is restricted since they're optional equipment
Charlie's Wall level scaling granted
Charlie has her shield and her trident
Charlie's Possibly Planet level scaling granted
While Charlie is incredibly enraged, she'll remain in character
Vox is bloodlusted
Charlie's Likely Class G LS is DENIED

Charlie Morningstar will start transformed and be enraged
Attack Potency: Upscales 188.61 Kilojoules in Base, Higher in transformation, Heavily Downscales 1.7 Yottatons with Rage Power while transformed
Speed: >Mach 0.57, Higher in Transformation, Heavily Downscales Mach 1.64 with Rage Power while transformed
Durability: Upscales 188.61 Kilojoules, Higher in transformation, Heavily Downscales 1.7 Yottatons with Rage Power while transformed
Lifting Strength: Upscales 504.86 Metric Tons, higher with transformation, Superior to 74,397.378 Metric Tons with Rage Power while transformed

The Vees
Attack Potency: 0.25 Tons of TNT for Angel Dust, >0.25 Tons of TNT for Velvette and Valentino, 73.68 Tons of TNT for 100% Vox and Shok.Wav, 1.7 Yottatons with Might of Lilith
Speed: >Mach 0.57 for Angel Dust, Velvette, and Valentino with Supersonic+ Combat, reactions, and travel speed for 100% Vox, and Shok.wav, Mach 1,282 Attack speed, Travel speed, and Attack speed via Pseudo-Teleportation and lightning for Vox, 1.7c Attack speed with Might of Lilith
Durability: 0.25 Tons of TNT for Angel Dust, >0.25 Tons of TNT Velvette and Valentino, 73.68 Tons of TNT for 100% Vox and Shok.Wav, Downscales 1.7 Yottatons for Might of Lilith
Lifting Strength: Upscales for 504.86 Metric Tons for everyone on the team, 74,397.378 Metric Tons for Shok.wav

Princess of Hell:
Supposed King of Hell with his lackeys and prisoners:
Adam Solos both groups (Incon):

 

[ShionAH]

She literally can’t lose, its a stomp

Edit: I didn’t see Might of Lilith but I think she still got this ngl. Tier difference is too much

 

[Alexander]

Charlie has caught someone faster and stronger than her at least twice, these guys are not getting out of here alive

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

She literally can’t lose, its a stomp

Bluntly Incorrect. The Vees have The Might of lilith which fires a beam stronger than her (Heavily downscaling vs the actual value...as a constant beam), heat value higher than her resistence (3,500°C vs roguhly 1,100°C), and can literal turn off her demon form, reducing her to unknown fodder base, a bunch of sinner civillians under Vox's controlling including one of her friends that she 100% won't be willing to slice and dice, and a shark with, in the profile's current state, faster travel speed and LS than her. Shok.Wav will be able to get to her before she ever reaches V Tower and, if it gets a hold of her like it did with Alastor, she won't be able to escape it's grasp and give Vox a free shot. Also, the vee aren't stupid. they watched adam vs the hotel staff, they know how strong she is, they're not rushing over there to get her and will just range snipe.
Of course, with Charlie being faster than the vees, it'll be hard to hit her, even with the range gap and insanely slower travel speed so she's not hopless

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Charlie has caught someone faster and stronger than her at least twice, these guys are not getting out of here alive

She stopped Lu from killing Adam, really doubt she'd be trying to kill the Vees here.

 

[Alexander]

She stopped Lu from killing Adam, really doubt she'd be trying to kill the Vees here.

If you consider Adam worse than them (and probably the worst character in the verse morality wise) then sure

 

[DarkLock92]

and can literal turn off her demon form, reducing her to unknown fodder base,

AWs only have power null when binding their target

Limited Power Nullification and Non-Physical Interaction (Angelic weapons can nullify demon's powers when bound by it. Striker nullified and disabled Stolas's powers. Grabbed onto Stolas while he was a shadow)

I doubt they can force her inside considering it already has Lucifer

 

[ShionAH]

The Vees have The Might of lilith which fires a beam stronger than her (Heavily downscaling vs the actual value...as a constant beam), heat value higher than her resistence (3,500°C vs roguhly 1,100°C)

She is not getting hit dawg when she can easily jump Vox and one shot him off of it But yeah valid wincon

and can literal turn off her demon form, reducing her to unknown fodder base

Nope, only works when they bind her. These guys arent Adam lol

She won't be able to escape it's grasp and give Vox a free shot.

Charlie genuinely MAULS that shark, like rips it into two easily. LS doesn’t mean shit if your AP is several tiers below

 

[DarkLock92]

Charlie genuinely MAULS that shark, like rips it into two easily. LS doesn’t mean shit if your AP is several tiers below

More accurately she punches his head off, tearing something apart is LS

 

[Mythic381]

The Vees have The Might of lilith which fires a beam stronger than her (Heavily downscaling vs the actual value...as a constant beam), heat value higher than her resistence (3,500°C vs roguhly 1,100°C)

She has enough reactions to dodge it, especially with her flying shield.

and can literal turn off her demon form, reducing her to unknown fodder base,

She only turned off her demon form when Adam was choking her, that's not going to happen here, unless M.O.L hits her, which again, she can dodge.

a bunch of sinner civillians under Vox's controlling including one of her friends that she 100% won't be willing to slice and dice,

She'd fly away.

and a shark with, in the profile's current state, faster travel speed and LS than her. Shok.Wav will be able to get to her before she ever reaches V Tower and, if it gets a hold of her like it did with Alastor, she won't be able to escape it's grasp and give Vox a free shot.

Why doesn't Charlie have Class G LS? Her profiles even mentions her grabbing and pulling Adam. Anyways, flying and reactions.

Also, the vee aren't stupid. they watched adam vs the hotel staff, they know how strong she is, they're not rushing over there to get her and will just range snipe.
Of course, with Charlie being faster than the vees, it'll be hard to hit her, even with the range gap and insanely slower travel speed so she's not hopless

**** the shield at this point according to you. Anyways, she can still fly over and drop on them to beat them.

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

She is not getting hit dawg when she can easily jump Vox and one shot him off of it But yeah valid wincon

She's jumping 75 meters with the baseline of human travel speed (5 m/s [Immensly superior FTL combat speed, NOT, travel speed])

Nope, only works when they bind her. These guys arent Adam lol

I meeeeeeeeeeeeeeean, it comes from Lucifer and Lucifer>Adam.
But sure, i guess

Charlie genuinely MAULS that shark, like rips it into two easily. LS doesn’t mean shit if your AP is several tiers below

LS lets shok.wav grip her and she can't escape it. She can't rip it half with her arm because that requires LS. Sure, she can stab or punch it's head off but it's gotten one or god forbid both her arms for even a split second, Vox'll get a free shot to genuiely obliterate her.

 

[DarkLock92]

Gojo vs Disaster Curses aah matchup
If she can take out Shok.wav early, which she definitely can given the AP gap, than she should be fine, as he was a bigger issue for Al than the MoL. She's got the speed to dodge the beam and get to Vox quickly, given everything that Emily was able to do before the beam reached her, and with her stats I doubt anyone can slow her down especially with Razzle, which also means she doesn't need to fight Angel head-on.

Hell if we want to get dark, Razzle can act as a temporary meat shield against Shok.wav.

However, if she get hit once, it's game over due to the heat hax.

I'm currently leaning towards Charlie

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

She has enough reactions to dodge it, especially with her flying shield.

She only turned off her demon form when Adam was choking her, that's not going to happen here, unless M.O.L hits her, which again, she can dodge.

Yes, she can dodge, that's why this ain't just "Vox hollow purples her from 75 meters away and negs despite her being able to one shot him"

She'd fly away.

Fairs.

Why doesn't Charlie have Class G LS? Her profiles even mentions her grabbing and pulling Adam.

My thoughts exactly but i'm not at all willing to make a mini crt for it since it'd literally die and i'm making a Mega CRT anyways

Anyways, flying and reactions.

**** the shield at this point according to you. Anyways, she can still fly over and drop on them to beat them.

1st off, what shield? The you mean the one that's currently unknown?
2nd off, Razzle got caught by Lute, who's not at all as fast as adam, and Dazzle was later outspeed by adam, meaning Dazzle is slower than Charlie herself and has like zero flight comparisons to someone like emily so it's very well Dazzle could get hit by the Might of Lilith beam

 

[ShionAH]

She's jumping 75 meters with the baseline of human travel speed (5 m/s [Immensly superior FTL combat speed, NOT, travel speed])

Yeah why not, she goated bro trust. She could summon Razzle and Dazzle too to fly

LS lets shok.wav grip her and she can't escape it. She can't rip it half with her arm because that requires LS. Sure, she can stab or punch it's head off but it's gotten one or god forbid both her arms for even a split second, Vox'll get a free shot to genuiely obliterate her.

 

[ShionAH]

My thoughts exactly but i'm not at all willing to make a mini crt for it since it'd literally die and i'm making a Mega CRT anyways

We don’t need CRT for basic scaling chains. Someone should apply that to Charlie’s profile lol.

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

We don’t need CRT for basic scaling chains. Someone should apply that to Charlie’s profile lol.

No, we do, that's why we couldn't add striker having overlord level angelic weapons to his profile

 

[Mythic381]

My thoughts exactly but i'm not at all willing to make a mini crt for it since it'd literally die and i'm making a Mega CRT anyways

Why not add it to the Mega CRT?

1st off, what shield? The you mean the one that's currently unknown?

The one that broke an Angelic Weapon and that she used to fly away in the finale.

2nd off, Razzle got caught by Lute, who's not at all as fast as adam, meaning Dazzle is slower than Charlie herself and has like zero flight comparisons to someone like emily so it's very well Dazzle could get hit by the Might of Lilith beam

Razzle wasn't like trying to dodge, he was just flying directly. I'm talking about Charlie's shield (which seems to be forgotten here and in her profile.)

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

No, we do, that's why we couldn't add striker having overlord level angelic weapons to his profile

Crt right here before anyone says anything

Simple Hellaverse Upgrade for Strikers Angelic Weapons

Pretty simple, anyone with AW's gets the planetary calc ranges added to their profile, Strikers shouldn't be any different and, in fact, are also made by Carmine too. Strikers weapons need to be given the rating considering both of these verses are in the same cannon and operate on the same...

vsbattles.com

 

[DarkLock92]

How Charlie genuinely does my goat:

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

Why not add it to the Mega CRT?

LS stuff is being worked out in the crt, that's all i'll say

The one that broke an Angelic Weapon

Again...that's currently unknown

that she used to fly away in the finale.

Razzle wasn't like trying to dodge, he was just flying directly. I'm talking about Charlie's shield (which seems to be forgotten here and in her profile.)

She summoned Razzle and Dazzle to fly, she never flown with her shield, what are you on?

 

[ShionAH]

No, we do, that's why we couldn't add striker having overlord level angelic weapons to his profile

No we do not. If a character got CRT that upgraded them to Tier 6 for example, you don’t need a separate CRT to scale someone to that level for overpowering that character.

So what, we were supposed to say “Uh anyone who scales to this scales to this” lmao?

 

[DarkLock92]

No we do not. If a character got CRT that upgraded them to Tier 6 for example, you don’t need a separate CRT to scale someone to that level for overpowering that character.

So what, we were supposed to say “Uh anyone who scales to this scales to this” lmao?

I think you do need a CRT if you want to add or change scaling chains between profiles

That's mostly besides the point though, because we're debating based on what's on the profiles, aren't we not?

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

Yeah why not, she goated bro trust. She could summon Razzle and Dazzle too to fly

She's not goated tho, twin.
Dazzle is dead and Both dragon demons are slower than herself (Caught by Lute, outspeed by Adam) and doesn't have FTL travel speed either

Hmm, fairs.

No we do not. If a character got CRT that upgraded them to Tier 6 for example, you don’t need a separate CRT to scale someone to that level for overpowering that character.

So what, we were supposed to say “Uh anyone who scales to this scales to this” lmao?

YOU didn't include charlie in your CRT so now another one has to made for her

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

I think you do need a CRT if you want to add or change scaling chains between profiles

That's mostly besides the point though, because we're debating based on what's on the profiles, aren't we not?

Exactly and she's class K but i'm trying to make sure folks don't go messing with the Profiles mid match...for a matchup when it coulda or shoulda been done before

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

She's jumping 75 meters with the baseline of human travel speed (5 m/s [Immensly superior FTL combat speed, NOT, travel speed])

The average human speed unless said otherwise wasn't accepted as far as I'm aware.
It do be pretty stupid to say people just randomly get gazillion of times faster cause they're fighting someone lol

 

[ShionAH]

I think you do need a CRT if you want to add or change scaling chains between profiles

We arent changing scaling, Charlie ALREADY scales to Adam. Any upgrade to him instantly passes to her as well.

YOU didn't include charlie in your CRT so now another one has to made for her

No. I can ask any staff, YOU DO NOT NEED A CRT TO FIX THE ALREADY SCALING CHARACTERS

DID YOU WANT ME TO WRITE “UHH GUYS IF THIS PASSES, ANYONE WHO SCALES TO THIS… SCALES TO THIS” ON MY CRT?? THATS JUST COMMON SENSE.

If I scaled Adam to 5-B but never mentioned Lucifer, would we need ANOTHER CRT for him?? **** NO. You just SCALE THE DAMN THING

woah!! What??? So like… characters above Adam… would also be above this new feat he did?? WOAH!!! WHAT?? Why would you NOT MENTION THAT SHION!!

Like holy shit, yall KNOW I am right. I’ll ask a staff if you really need that confirmation.

 

[DarkLock92]

We arent changing scaling, Charlie ALREADY scales to Adam. Any upgrade to him instantly passes to her as well.

Didn't you need a CRT to scale Lucifer and Adam to Alastor's LS, despite them already scaling above him?

No. I can ask any staff, YOU DO NOT NEED A CRT TO FIX THE ALREADY SCALING CHARACTERS

DID YOU WANT ME TO WRITE “UHH GUYS IF THIS PASSES, ANYONE WHO SCALES TO THIS… SCALES TO THIS”

woah!! What??? So like… characters above Adam… would also be above this new feat he did?? WOAH!!! WHAT??

Like holy shit, yall KNOW I am right.

Ok chill dude

 

[ShionAH]

Didn't you need a CRT to scale Lucifer and Adam to Alastor's LS, despite them already scaling above him?

They didn’t scale to his tentacles.

For example when Striker was upgraded to Class K, everyone got that level without additional CRTs

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

No. I can ask any staff, YOU DO NOT NEED A CRT TO FIX THE ALREADY SCALING CHARACTERS

DID YOU WANT ME TO WRITE “UHH GUYS IF THIS PASSES, ANYONE WHO SCALES TO THIS… SCALES TO THIS”

Yes, twin. I do it all the time for every CRT i do, it's not that difficult

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

The average human speed unless said otherwise wasn't accepted as far as I'm aware.
It do be pretty stupid to say people just randomly get gazillion of times faster cause they're fighting someone lol

I guess but it doesn't really matter cuz she has no travel speed and should be assumped, at most, to be baseline superhuman.
She's not jumping or running 75 meters instantly

 

[DarkLock92]

Anyway, here's how I think this most likely plays out:
-Shok.wav rushes in via superior travel speed, most likely in Berserk mode. Unfortunately for my goat, he's not known to dodge hits and is only high animalistic in intelligence so he most likely gets one-shot.

-Then Charlie flies up on Razzle to avoid the crowd, and this is where it could go wrong, as he is slower than her which could lead to them being hit. But Charlie's reaction speed is immensely superior to the MoL's speed which could allow her to steer Razzle away before the beam could land.

-Assuming all goes right, she teaches the MoL and destroys it easily given her AP is overwhelmingly superior to its durability. Atp the Vees pretty much have no wincons left so that would give her the victory.

 

[ShionAH]

Voting the Princess of Goats

 

[DarkLock92]

Anyway, here's how I think this most likely plays out:
-Shok.wav rushes in via superior travel speed, most likely in Berserk mode. Unfortunately for my goat, he's not known to dodge hits and is only high animalistic in intelligence so he most likely gets one-shot.

-Then Charlie flies up on Razzle to avoid the crowd, and this is where it could go wrong, as he is slower than her which could lead to them being hit. But Charlie's reaction speed is immensely superior to the MoL's speed which could allow her to steer Razzle away before the beam could land.

-Assuming all goes right, she teaches the MoL and destroys it easily given her AP is overwhelmingly superior to its durability. Atp the Vees pretty much have no wincons left so that would give her the victory.

Forgot, to mention, if she get shot out of the sky, then she'll have to deal with the crowd, but most of them will probably get friendly fired by Vox and none of them have the stats to hold her back. She could get hit trying to save them, but given her speed advantage I don't think that's likely.

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

If you consider Adam worse than them (and probably the worst character in the verse morality wise) then sure

Who do you vote, gang

 

[DarkLock92]

Also what is Alastor doing here, bro is NOT helping

 

[Mythic381]

She summoned Razzle and Dazzle to fly, she never flown with her shield, what are you on?

Dude, what?

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

Also what is Alastor doing here, bro is NOT helping

He made it easier for Charlie to win, trust

 

[DarkLock92]

So yeah I'm voting Charlie

He made it easier for Charlie to win, trust

Lore accurate

 

[ShionAH]

wait if they have Al then Vox thinks he can't harm Charlie!! Which means Might of Lilith wincon is gone!!

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

I guess but it doesn't really matter cuz she has no travel speed and should be assumped, at most, to be baseline superhuman.
She's not jumping or running 75 meters instantly

Nah.

Combat requires one to move one's body, though, so being able to run or fly at a certain speed is an inevitable part of combat speed. A character that can't do that, couldn't really fight at that speed, as an opponent running at that speed could literally run circles around them without them being able to keep up. They would effectively be glued in place during the fighting, being unable to dodge attacks by moving to the side.

Slower travel speed than combat speed (And we're talking about billions upon billions of times) is a psyop I say
I swear if JJK had come out earlier, we'd actually have people arguing that Naoya's mach speed stuff was only for his travel speed lol