Naruto Uzumaki vs Son Goku Part 2 [13-2-0]

[Saqphire]

Furry blond guy FRA

 

[GodlyCharmander]

I dunno if Goku would really try to vaporize Naruto with a Kamehameha either

That depends, the SBA states that Goku knows this is a death match, no?

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Oh yeah btw, no one argued about the specifics of the fight yet, how it would go down. They just cited a winning condition that Naruto would never use in-character.

Literally none of these votes count yet lmao. There is literally no "reasons above" to vote for.

 

[MannyQ361]

Guess if Goku feels his lifespan being drained, he could try fighting at a range or using evasive maneuvers to outlast Baryon Mode.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Previous means the key immediately before.

That's the problem, it doesn't say "previous key". It says "all previous abilities".

It's literally not established neither in lore, nor in the profiles.

Claiming neither the profile nor the lore establish 6P sage mode has the abilities of standard sage mode is honestly a new low.

Should we even allow votes for invalid reasons? Because you never argued about the fight.

Which is why, if you read what you're replying ot instead of cutting out portions of it, you'd see I say "like others have mentioned", clearly referencing the 5 other people who have made those arguments.

Unbelievable.

For real man, that's what I've been saying too

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Guess if Goku feels his lifespan being drained, he could try fighting at a range or using evasive maneuvers to outlast Baryon Mode.

These people can only win if they assume Goku is the dumbest mf on Earth to continually take punches.

If Naruto grabs him once, he will just punch Goku away, and Goku will learn immediately that he has to keep his distance.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Weren't hashi and madara both overwelmingly stronger than everyone else in their era

I mean, that doesn't necessarily correlate. They're stronger than everyone else with skill that surpasses everyone else, that is self evident. A Kage of today or even throughout any generation does not in their whole life scratch the combat experience and skill of those two. They simply showcase their difference in skill with these fights.

Since this is about depleting life span, rather than an overall energy depletion, I don't see the Kaioken x10 lasting less than Baryon. This even incorrectly assumes Naruto will be landing many hits in this fight despite Goku having the skill advantage in martial arts.

I mean, honestly. If Goku can outlast BM despite life drain aswell as ki usage. Naruto is pretty much done. He'll revert back to base with no energy remaining and his major forms like KCM S06P Mode gone.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

That's the problem, it doesn't say "previous key". It says "all previous abilities".

Claiming neither the profile nor the lore establish 6P sage mode has the abilities of standard sage mode is honestly a new low.

Oops. Okay, I concede, I didn't realize it was 6P Sage Mode.

Which is why, if you read what you're replying ot instead of cutting out portions of it, you'd see I say "like others have mentioned", clearly referencing the 5 other people who have made those arguments.

For real man, that's what I've been saying too

That's the point, no one argued on how Naruto would achieve these winning conditions, he doesn't rip people apart, he grabs them and punches. That would immediately give Goku the knowledge that he can't be grabbed again.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

I mean, that doesn't necessarily correlate. They're stronger than everyone else with skill that surpasses everyone else, that is self evident. A Kage of today or even throughout any generation does not in their whole life scratch the combat experience and skill of those two. They simply showcase their difference in skill with these fights.


I mean, honestly. If Goku can outlast BM despite life drain aswell as ki usage. Naruto is pretty much done. He'll revert back to base with no energy remaining and his major forms like KCM S06P Mode gone.

I believe that's what's going to happen.


Because, think about it, Naruto starts with hand to hand, that's his tactic. If Goku feels his life force draining, that already would put his strategy on range, he would retreat, or at least use Kaioken x20 to outspeed Naruto, and overpower him. If Naruto grabs Goku, he will use it to land one more punch, that will also give Goku precious information that he has to keep his distance.

Goku has far more ranged techniques to deal with Naruto at this point, regular Ki blasts that scale relative to hid AP, waves, teleportation, solar flare. All of this would give him an out here.

 

[Delusionaltx2]

I mean, that doesn't necessarily correlate.

it does tho

if their stat stomping everyone then there's no reason to assume skill

They're stronger than everyone else with skill that surpasses everyone else, that is self evident.

I'm not denying that hashi and madara are more skilled than a normal shinobi but how would you get skill from them soloing armies of shinobi at once when they're so much stronger than them?

A Kage of today or even throughout any generation does not in their whole life scratch the combat experience and skill of those two. They simply showcase their difference in skill with these fights.

Again...how?

 

[Mommyleona]

Looks like Naruto FRA

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

That depends, the SBA states that Goku knows this is a death match, no?

Knocking out is also valid under SBA. SBA also just has Goku think that Naruto attacked him out of his own volition, but I doubt that's enough for Goku to go for the kill, it's not like Naruto will be threatening the Earth here.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Looks like Naruto FRA

?????

What "reasons above" are you talking about, no one has argued on how Naruto wins, they just cited a winning condition.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Knocking out is also valid under SBA. SBA also just has Goku think that Naruto attacked him out of his own volition, but I doubt that's enough for Goku to go for the kill, it's not like Naruto will be threatening the Earth here.

Goku could adjust his Kamehameha to just cripple Naruto, that wouldn't change the fact he could win with a single Kamehameha wave.

 

[Gamin_Yoon23]

Damnnn, ladies and gentlemen. Calm down, Attain Nirvana


Punching, kicking, CQC, Countering blows. Get as much hits in as possible. The Life drain of BM does its work automatically.

AFAIK the life drain is contact based right? Also what’s defined as successful contact in BM terms? I’d rather we not skip to conclusions and have the default being something like parrying for instance on Naruto’s end, somehow life drains Goku or anything of that fashion. If there’s instances provin

I dunno if Goku would really try to vaporize Naruto with a Kamehameha either

Is it not more in character for Goku to use the Kamehameha than Naruto leading with strangling or some form of grappling? Goku’s signature attack is the Kamehameha which he can use in distinct ways. I’m pretty sure in almost every significant battle Goku has been involved in he has. The likelihood of Goku using Kamehameha is higher than LS diff IMO.

Yes literally. That's the essence of BM. Each hit takes life span, Kaioken uses life force. It's Gojover.

Could Goku not theoretically use Kaioken in short bursts whenever deemed convenient? I’m certain he’ll know something strange is going on and notice he’s getting unreasonably more strain than usual. I don’t think that’ll go unnoticed. He could adjust accordingly.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Here's my scenario where Goku could win, and I'll grant, Naruto and Goku being close in skill with hand to hand advantage to Goku, and Naruto has danger sense.

• They go at each other. Both favor hand to hand combat.
• Goku has an advantage but Naruto is landing hits.
• Goku immediately feels like his life force is being drained with each hit and backs away, be it via a kiai attack or teleportation.
• If Naruto tries to rush him, Goku will keep his distance and use Ki Blasts.
• Goku either uses the Kaioken x20 to rush Naruto and not let him land any more hits, as he would have studied Naruto's style from that brief exchange, using both the speed advantage and the analysis to beat Naruto down.
• If Kaioken x20 is activated, and Goku has keen sense, the tails wouldn't be able to grab him (slow, massive, changes the air).
• Naruto is either outlasted out of BM, or Goku can land a charged ki attack which would one shot Naruto.
• Baryon Mode also gets progressively weaker as time goes on, so the gap in speed would only widen.

I think Goku wins most of the time if they're both In Character. I genuinely vote Goku for those reasons.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Oops. Okay, I concede, I didn't realize it was 6P Sage Mode.

Nice ig

That's the point, no one argued on how Naruto would achieve these winning conditions, he doesn't rip people apart, he grabs them and punches. That would immediately give Goku the knowledge that he can't be grabbed again.

This argument doesn't really work. It relies on the idea that Naruto COULD rip people apart but there has never been a case where he'd have such a massive LS advantage in-universe. But he DOES have it now.

Similarly Sasuke basically never crushed people with LS either. BUT when he fought Danzo where the LS gap between his susanoo and his opponent was uniquely that large, he did actually just crush his body. Same thing with Shin.

Fact of the matter is, Naruto uses his LS to squeeze people, be it through chakra arms or chakra tentacles. Whether or not that crushes the opponent is not a matter of Naruto wanting to do so but Naruto having the power to do so.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

I believe that's what's going to happen.


Because, think about it, Naruto starts with hand to hand, that's his tactic. If Goku feels his life force draining, that already would put his strategy on range, he would retreat, or at least use Kaioken x20 to outspeed Naruto, and overpower him. If Naruto grabs Goku, he will use it to land one more punch, that will also give Goku precious information that he has to keep his distance.

Idk mane. This is a pretty great point, however, As seen within the fight BM was featured. "If Goku feels his life draining", the power seems to work in silent. As in, the blows slowly deal damaging blows to "life force" without the foe knowing, because Isshiki did not realize his life force was being tampered with and drained by Naruto until he started bleeding out of nowhere. I don't think it's meant for the enemy to know they're being depleted of life force even.

Goku has far more ranged techniques to deal with Naruto at this point, regular Ki blasts that scale relative to hid AP, waves, teleportation, solar flare. All of this would give him an out here.

These abilities and range are valid tho.

it does tho

if their stat stomping everyone then there's no reason to assume skill

I'm not denying that hashi and madara are more skilled than a normal shinobi but how would you get skill from them soloing armies of shinobi at once when they're so much stronger than them?

Again...how?

Narrative. Madara and Hashirama did not become strong out of nowhere. Sure they're incarnations and GAINED BS powers, but their lives were built on constant wars among clans and training aswell. This and their innate combat talents made them gain experience and skill. Just as Charmander said, Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence. They're praised for attaining power and skill which is what made them God's of Shinobi. It isn't built on just power because they weren't always strong.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

But he DOES have it now.

That's still not evidence that he would do that in character. He doesn't KNOW he has that kind of advantage, and he doesn't canonically test it.

Fact of the matter is, Naruto uses his LS to squeeze people, be it through chakra arms or chakra tentacles. Whether or not that crushes the opponent is not a matter of Naruto wanting to do so but Naruto having the power to do so.

I've never seen him doing such a thing. This also assumes Naruto will be able to grapple, which is also not something he does until later in the fight, which Goku will be weary about because of the life drain.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

the power seems to work in silent.

Goku has extremely extraordinary perception about ki, which is life energy. He would feel it.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

AFAIK the life drain is contact based right? Also what’s defined as successful contact in BM terms?

Physical blows; Any Physical contact possible. As long as his abilities, hands, even Chakra arms touch or hold you. Life force goes poof. It's also noted that Naruto indeed holds down his opponent in this form to deal everlasting blows. LS gap exists here too

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Goku has extremely extraordinary perception about ki, which is life energy. He would feel it.

Otsuktsuki are inherently the key knowledge to Life Energy (Chakra), even more than Naruto's and probably even Hagoromo's understanding. Yet Isshiki, The most prominent Otsuktsuki who physically roamed as of rn, didn't feel it until it was too late.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Otsuktsuki are inherently the key knowledge to Life Energy (Chakra), even more than Naruto's and probably even Hagoromo's understanding. Yet Isshiki, The most prominent Otsuktsuki who physically roamed as of rn, didn't feel it until it was too late.

Having knowledge and feeling exact power levels are not the same thing. Goku knows when he's having his life energy drained, he has fought people who do that before too.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Having knowledge and feeling exact power levels are not the same thing. Goku knows when he's having his life energy drained, he has fought people who do that before too.

The God Tree, Momoshiki literally takes half of Naruto's life energy from him, Multiple recordings of Jinchuruki Chakra being drained from them exists within Naruto aswell. Every shinobi can inherently feel their energy being drained, which slowly kills them overtime, not only weakens their strength. Your claim was Goku has extraordinary perception on ki, which is life energy, which when compared with Naruto exists aswell. The Otsuktsuki are the peak of Chakra understanding and even the most non notable shinobi have knowledge and are educated on Chakra levels, Chakra points, and is most certainly able to feel their energy leaving their bodies. Yet Isshiki didn't. There's no claim you can make to debunk that because thats quite literally what happened after 5 minutes of BM ass whopping to Isshiki.

 

[Delusionaltx2]

Narrative. Madara and Hashirama did not become strong out of nowhere. Sure they're incarnations and GAINED BS powers, but their lives were built on constant wars among clans and training aswell.

which just upscales them by an unquantifiable amount, it dosen't mean they would be able to handle them with just h2h skill if those shinobi were all equal in stats

This and their innate combat talents made them gain experience and skill. Just as Charmander said, Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence. They're praised for attaining power and skill which is what made them God's or Shinobi. It isn't built on just power because they weren't always strong.

Yeah, their title would requre some level of skill but the question here isn't if they have skill at all or not the question here is how would hashirama or madara soloing a bunch of random shinobi at once be a skill feat if they are overwhelmingly superior to them in stats.

To really explain this point, this would be like saying a single black belt can fight 1 million brown belts because a black belt is more skilled than they are individually

Technically being a black belt would make them more skilled than a brown belt but how does this upscale them in skill to the point where they would be able to fight a 1 million other brown belts with comparable stats?

In the same vein, how would we quantify the ranking to a point where we can say "oh yeah they can solo an army of comparable opponents with just skill"?

 

[Mommyleona]

?????

What "reasons above" are you talking about, no one has argued on how Naruto wins, they just cited a winning condition.

saying a wincon and believing that it's reasonable is enough to vote imo, you dont have to describe all the possible scenarios of how one can win
LS meta is strong

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

The God Tree, Momoshiki literally half of Naruto's life energy from him, Multiple recordings of Jinchuruki Chakra being drained from them exists within Naruto aswell. Every shinobi can inherently feel their energy being drained, which slowly kills them overtime, not only weakens their strength. Your claim was Goku has extraordinary perception on ki, which is life energy, which when compared with Naruto exists aswell. The Otsuktsuki are the peak of Chakra understanding and even the most non notable shinobi have knowledge and are educated on Chakra levels, Chakra points, and is most certainly able to feel their energy leaving their bodies. Yet Isshiki didn't. There's no claim you can make to debunk that because thats quite literally what happened after 5 minutes of BM ass whopping to Isshiki.

Naruto, after gaining Six Paths Sage Mode, is granted unrivaled knowledge of all life in this world and the energies that power them.<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-74"><span>[</span>39<span>]</span></a> By using this knowledge, and his mastery over Yin-Yang Style, the foundational abilities for all Jutsu in the world.<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-75"><span>[</span>40<span>]</span></a> Naruto can perform truly miraculous feats of intelligence and manipulation. He stopped the fading life of Might Guy after he utilized the 8th Gate,<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-Naruto673-76"><span>[</span>41<span>]</span></a> which slowly heats the body until it incinerates into ash, by restoring his chakra nodes before they were destroyed.<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-Naruto673-76"><span>[</span>41<span>]</span></a> He also re-created the eye of Kakashi Hatake after it was ripped out by Madara Uchiha by utilizing cells from Kakashi's body and reconstructing them into an entirely separate biological function.<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-77"><span>[</span>42<span>]</span></a> Compounding onto this, Naruto is equipped with the ability to create Truth Seeking Orbs, structures which are noted to grant users truth in all things<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-78"><span>[</span>43<span>]</span></a> and utilize all five nature transformations, alongside Yin-Yang Style.<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-79"><span>[</span>44<span>]</span></a> A feat that hasn't been achieved since the days of Hagoromo Ōtsutsuki and Hamura Ōtsutsuki, with even consummate geniuses like Minato Namikaze and Itachi Uchiha being incapable of mastering all seven transformations.<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-80"><span>[</span>45<span>]</span></a><a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-81"><span>[</span>46<span>]</span></a><a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-82"><span>[</span>47<span>]</span></a><a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Naruto_Uzumaki_(New_Era)#cite_note-Naruto673-76"><span>[</span>41<span>]</span></a>

And btw. Naruto can be compared in understanding of life energy to Goku. Otsuktsuki are no different and I would even say they're far superior being basically God's within the verse.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

saying a wincon and believing that it's reasonable is enough to vote imo, you dont have to describe all the possible scenarios of how one can win
LS meta is strong

Goku one shots with Kaioken x20 Kamehameha. There, a much more likely winning condition


But he wouldn't start with that, he wouldn't do that, and the opportunities for him to land that attack are low without proper planning. Yet, I could technically vote Goku for it without any elaboration. I don't think it's a fair system.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

The God Tree, Momoshiki literally half of Naruto's life energy from him, Multiple recordings of Jinchuruki Chakra being drained from them exists within Naruto aswell. Every shinobi can inherently feel their energy being drained, which slowly kills them overtime, not only weakens their strength. Your claim was Goku has extraordinary perception on ki, which is life energy, which when compared with Naruto exists aswell. The Otsuktsuki are the peak of Chakra understanding and even the most non notable shinobi have knowledge and are educated on Chakra levels, Chakra points, and is most certainly able to feel their energy leaving their bodies. Yet Isshiki didn't. There's no claim you can make to debunk that because thats quite literally what happened after 5 minutes of BM ass whopping to Isshiki.

You're assuming they can sense exact power levels and power rankings, and know when they're getting less powerful. That is simply not the case.

Goku HAS faced people who drained life force, and he KNOWS his exact level of energy at all times. No amount of claims will debunk that.

What are you suggesting, that the life force drain also makes an illusion that makes it so the user thinks he's at 100%? Absolutely not.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Yeah, their title would requre some level of skill but the question here isn't if they have skill at all or not the question here is how would hashirama or madara soloing a bunch of random shinobi at once be a skill feat if they are overwhelmingly superior to them in stats.

To really explain this point this would be like a single black belt being forced to fight 1 million brown belts because a black belt is more skilled than they are individually

Technically being a black belt would make them more skilled than a brown belt but how does this upscale them in skill to the point where they would be able to fight a 1 million other brown belts with comparable stats?

In the same vein, how would we quantify the ranking to a point where we can say "oh yeah they can solo an army of comparable opponents with just skill"?

Well the answer lies in this, what rank are the aforementioned in the shinobi world each? Given your point focuses on Belts within Martial arts. The ninja world also has ranks given to those who exceed a certain level. Traditionally, a Genin is more skilled than a Academy Student, A Chunin is more skilled than a Genin, a Jonin is more skilled than a Chunin and so forth. Hashirama is on a Kages level, and not just any Kage's level, the strongest, fastest, most skilled and talented to have ever immersed. Madara, being his rival is on that level and they have Battles leading up to this point that show for it. Like Shisui was the most skilled Uchiha for his time, but also the strongest. There is visual evidence that showcases his skill and strength, aswell as people glazing him, categorizing him and telling his story. So do the aforementioned Madara and Hashirama. They're outclassing every ninja to ever exist because the narrative tells us they're unmatched God Of Shinobis. Put them as the same strength as any regular shinobi and their skills are still unfathomed. They're the Himothy of their time. Absence of Evidence is Not Evidence Of Absence.

 

[DavidTPPM]

That's still not evidence that he would do that in character. He doesn't KNOW he has that kind of advantage, and he doesn't canonically test it.

He doesn't need to…?
Goku getting crushed is just a side effect of Naruto squeezing him with his class Z lifting strength.

It doesn't matter if Naruto intends to crush him or not, if he squeeze him with his level of LS Goku will get crushed.

The only way this would NOT happen is if Naruto purposely held back which there's no evidence for. Especially in Baryon Mode where Naruto is on a strict timer and can't afford to pull punches.

I've never seen him doing such a thing. This also assumes Naruto will be able to grapple, which is also not something he does until later in the fight, which Goku will be weary about because of the life drain.

Naruto grabbed Isshiki pretty much seconds into their fight, and then did it again extremely soon after activating Baryon Mode. He also tried to grab Delta early in their fight.

So I think it's more than in-character enough for him to grab the opponent early in the fight, and here he literally just has 9 tentacles on his back at all times which he used exactly for that so it should be extra in character for him to try using them.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

He doesn't need to…?
Goku getting crushed is just a side effect of Naruto squeezing him with his class Z lifting strength.

It doesn't matter if Naruto intends to crush him or not, if he squeeze him with his level of LS Goku will get crushed.

The only way this would NOT happen is if Naruto purposely held back which there's no evidence for. Especially in Baryon Mode where Naruto is on a strict timer and can't afford to pull punches.

Oh yeah, crushing is not happening here. DB character have "disadvantage" for pulling, crushing attacks are no different than a solar system level ki wave pushing them back and exploding on them, it's pressure applied on their bodies.

Naruto grabbed Isshiki pretty much seconds into their fight, and then did it again extremely soon after activating Baryon Mode.

With Baryon Mode, Naruto started with Hand to Hand, and then moved on to grappling. You're exaggerating "extremely soon", as the fight im BM was short in itself, he fought and kicked Isshiki around for at least a few combos before using the tails. He has other priorities when he isn't on a timer and trying to minimize his movements.

It's not ooc for him to grapple, it is ooc for him to start with a grapple in that form. If Goku is already weary of approaching Naruto after exchanging blows once, that will make grappling difficult.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

You're assuming they can sense exact power levels and power rankings, and know when they're getting less powerful. That is simply not the case.

Uhh, yeah. Shinobi's do that. They inherently have sensory abilities for Chakra. I'm pretty sure its on the pages of Shinobis aswell. Probably not for sensing other people's power levels tho, but definitely Chakra levels and Chakra around them.

Goku HAS faced people who drained life force, and he KNOWS his exact level of energy at all times. No amount of claims will debunk that.

I mean, so do the aforementioned Naruto. Probably not as much as Goku but still has regardless. He's been getting Kurama extracted from him (which is inherently half his lifeforce). Knowing his strong an enemy is will be irrelevant. My point was always; Naruto hits Goku, overtime Goku gets a realization HIS life force has drained significantly. All of this squabbling is kinda of a non defeater and doesn't validate a point or the point I BELIEVE you're trying to make.

What are you suggesting, that the life force drain also makes an illusion that makes it so the user thinks he's at 100%? Absolutely not.

No. But, the life force drain wouldn't be detected by the enemy until they start bleeding and realize their actually running out of life span. Isshiki who could determine his own life force before and after BM's assault, couldn't until he started inspecting the damage done, such as him randomly bleeding and stumbling to ground. Think of it like being hit with poison, the poison erodes you overtime, and after a while you realize you're starting to lose strength aswell as weaken drastically to near death. Isshiki again could not and did not detect this while inherently being able to sense his own Chakra levels and life span (Chakra = Life force) until after BM pummeled him for 5 minutes. In this fight mind you, Kaioken is like an Undertale effect actively helping this process take place faster.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Oh yeah, crushing is not happening here. DB character have "disadvantage" for pulling, crushing attacks are no different than a solar system level ki wave pushing them back and exploding on them, it's pressure applied on their bodies.

It is noteworthy that using gravity as a anti-feat doesn't work unless you're suggesting Goku's lifting strength is Class 25. The gravity feats are accepted as overall plot induced stupidity and a massive outlier even with the current acceptable parameters. It's irrelevant, and does not work again the several cases where pressure is applied from much stronger character. It's basically an outlier for all intents and purposes.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Oh yeah, crushing is not happening here. DB character have "disadvantage" for pulling, crushing attacks are no different than a solar system level ki wave pushing them back and exploding on them, it's pressure applied on their bodies.

I forgot DB characters can use Explosive Energy Waves.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Uhh, yeah. Shinobi's do that. They inherently have sensory abilities for Chakra

They can feel presences based on Chakra, knowing power levels and exactly how much energy they have is another ability entirely.

I mean, so do the aforementioned Naruto.

I'm not making a comparison to Naruto's skill list. I'm saying that if Goku has even a drop of his ki drained by an outside source, he has both the experience and hax to detect it, and react accordingly.

No. But, the life force drain wouldn't be detected by the enemy

What causes the lack of detection? The life force is removed, and that causes a change in energy levels that Goku can detect. If Isshiki couldn't, that's an anti-feat for him and nothing else.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

It is noteworthy that using gravity as a anti-feat doesn't work unless you're suggesting Goku's lifting strength is Class 25. The gravity feats are accepted as overall plot induced stupidity and a massive outlier even with the current acceptable parameters. It's irrelevant, and does not work again the several cases where pressure is applied from much stronger character. It's basically an outlier for all intents and purposes.

It would be pretty lit if someone could point out the anti feats and stuff. I myself find them strange, however it's not my place to speak nor do I care really. A thread would be pretty cool addressing the anti feats and stuff

 

[GodlyCharmander]

It would be pretty lit if someone could point out the anti feats and stuff. I myself find them strange, however it's not my place to speak nor do I care really. A thread would be pretty cool addressing the anti feats and stuff

Dismissing gravity anti-feats is how we got our current LS for DB anyway

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

They can feel presences based on Chakra, knowing power levels and exactly how much energy they have is another ability entirely.

Fair. I said this tho,

Probably not for sensing other people's power levels tho, but definitely Chakra levels and Chakra around them.

I'm not making a comparison to Naruto's skill list. I'm saying that if Goku has even a drop of his ki drained by an outside source, he has both the experience and hax to detect it, and react accordingly.

I see. However, what if its a case that even Isshiki himself couldn't. Wouldn't that raise a question. Because all Shinobi's can detect a drop in their Chakra levels, especially by an outsource by reading and detecting other chakra. The experience aswell as the hax. Otsukstuki However are a whole tier above the latter in terms of understanding Chakra and better manipulation of it. Detecting it would be no issue for them either, and yet Isshiki didn't.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

However, what if its a case that even Isshiki himself couldn't. Wouldn't that raise a question

We could raise a question, but ultimately, it'd be speculation, we could blame Isshiki's distraction and incompetence, or something else. Unless we have a mechanical reason why the life drain is undetectable, I don't see Goku just casually ignoring a sharp decline in his health from a few punches.