A Song of Ice and Fire: AP Upgrade (STAFF NEEDED PLEASE)

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

Looks good, looks relatively minor as well

Do you agree or disagree with Random Helper's argument/opinion, by the way?

 

[Random-Helper323]

I have a few concerns. I'm a little more cautious about giving 11 ton lifting strength and Wall Level AP to a character that's meant to be a human with no powers, based on a vague off-screen feat where all we know is she made a boulder come down off a cliff. For a point of reference, that lifting strength is enough to bench press four large SUVs, and casually carry ten horses around. I'm not saying fiction doesn't go there, because it does, but I'd rather weigh up matters, especially for a feat we don't see or get much information about.

A minor nitpick is that the calculation uses the entire length of the cow's body as the diameter for a sphere, resulting in a boulder that's actually larger than a cow. I'm okay with not worrying about that though.

The main issue is that we just don't know what position the boulder was in when she moved it. Was it on a slope aiming downwards already, for example? More likely than not given its location. This one's the issue for me. If the feat was shown or described and we knew she pushed it on more or less flat dirt, I'd be voting in favour of it.

I'm not vehemently opposed to this, and I'm not voting against it, I'm just concerned.

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

I have a few concerns. Firstly I'd be a little more cautious about giving 11 ton lifting strength and Wall Level AP to a character that's meant to be a human with no powers, based on a vague off-screen feat where all we know is she made a boulder come down off a cliff. For a point of reference, that lifting strength is enough to bench press four large SUVs, and casually carry ten horses around. I'm not saying fiction doesn't go there, because it does, but I'd rather weigh up matters, especially for a feat we don't see or get much information about.

A minor nitpick is that the calculation uses the entire length of the cow's body as the diameter for a sphere, resulting in a boulder that's actually larger than a cow. I'm okay with not worrying about that though.

The main issue is that we just don't know what position the boulder was in when she moved it. Was it on a slope aiming downwards already, for example? More likely than not given its location.

I'm not vehemently opposed to this, and I'm not voting against it, I'm just concerned.

I think you should tag staff members, or at least calc members, so we get more opinions.

 

[Random-Helper323]

I think you should tag staff members, or at least calc members, so we get more opinions.

Maybe. Any staff in particular you're thinking of?

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

Maybe. Any staff in particular you're thinking of?

Not really, none of them are ASOIAF supporters, so tag whoever you want. Maybe we should ask Armorchompy again since he already commented (but he didn't say anything about the calculation).

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

I have a few concerns. I'm a little more cautious about giving 11 ton lifting strength and Wall Level AP to a character that's meant to be a human with no powers, based on a vague off-screen feat where all we know is she made a boulder come down off a cliff. For a point of reference, that lifting strength is enough to bench press four large SUVs, and casually carry ten horses around. I'm not saying fiction doesn't go there, because it does, but I'd rather weigh up matters, especially for a feat we don't see or get much information about.

A minor nitpick is that the calculation uses the entire length of the cow's body as the diameter for a sphere, resulting in a boulder that's actually larger than a cow. I'm okay with not worrying about that though.

The main issue is that we just don't know what position the boulder was in when she moved it. Was it on a slope aiming downwards already, for example? More likely than not given its location. This one's the issue for me. If the feat was shown or described and we knew she pushed it on more or less flat dirt, I'd be voting in favour of it.

I'm not vehemently opposed to this, and I'm not voting against it, I'm just concerned.

This feat isn’t super reliable, that’s true, because we never actually see how she did it. Before the boulder fell, there were already multiple stones falling from above, which is pretty common in fiction when someone is moving something large, so I think it’s safe to assume she just pushed it. Jaime later thanked her for throwing the stones at the men, but I can’t really imagine her literally throwing a cow sized boulder.

Brienne also isn’t the only one with Class 25 lifting strength (11.19 tons) in this verse. Hugh Hammer has Class 25 as well (15.28 tons) from another calculation I made that got accepted. These only apply to exceptionally strong warriors in the verse, not average humans.

 

[Random-Helper323]

This feat isn’t super reliable, that’s true, because we never actually see how she did it. Before the boulder fell, there were already multiple stones falling from above, which is pretty common in fiction when someone is moving something large, so I think it’s safe to assume she just pushed it. Jaime later thanked her for throwing the stones at the men, but I can’t really imagine her literally throwing a cow sized boulder.

It's also common if someone's climbing up or something's rolling down, so I don't know.

Brienne also isn’t the only one with Class 25 lifting strength (11.19 tons) in this verse. Hugh Hammer has Class 25 as well (15.28 tons) from another calculation I made that got accepted. These only apply to exceptionally strong warriors in the verse, not average humans.

That does help a great deal, actually. It's a lot easier to believe this when a feat of similar magnitude already exists.

 

[Random-Helper323]

@Reiner04 @DarkDragonMedeus what do you think here?

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I suppose this looks alright.

 

[TheSwordOfTheEvening]

That does help a great deal, actually. It's a lot easier to believe this when a feat of similar magnitude already exists.

I have a question related to these upgrades. What would Gregor’s profile look like? We know that Brienne is physically stronger than a weakened Jaime, and he himself admitted it. He also mentioned seven other people who are physically stronger than himself, but Gregor’s strength among all of them was explicitly said to be inhuman, meaning significantly stronger than everyone else. Would it be valid to say: “At least Class 25, at most far higher”? The same would apply to his AP.

I’m not sure if I would need to make a separate CRT for this, but it’s related to the same upgrades. Greatjon Umber was one of the seven names Jaime mentioned, and he was physically overpowered by Robb’s direwolf and had his fingers ripped off. Direwolves currently also have Class 25 lifting strength (20.45 tons), and Wights are stronger than direwolves, since one of them overpowered Ghost in wrestling, nearly strangling him to death, and Ghost couldn’t break free until Jon intervened. Would Wights also be “At least Class 25, at most far higher”? Would it also be valid to upgrade the Wights to 9-B via this scaling chain?

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

Would it be valid to say: “At least Class 25, at most far higher”? The same would apply to his AP.

Would Wights also be “At least Class 25, at most far higher”?

"At least Class 25, likely far higher" yes

 

[Random-Helper323]

The stat is close to baseline Class 25, so I don't know about the Likely Far Higher part. We'd usually stick to a regular upscale.

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

Bump

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

Bump

 

[Random-Helper323]

I say the feat is likely okay, in light of the other similar feat. I disagree about anyone being Likely Far Higher though, as the feat is close to baseline.

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

I say the feat is likely okay, in light of the other similar feat. I disagree about anyone being Likely Far Higher though, as the feat is close to baseline.

So I'm counting your vote as "Agree"?

 

[Random-Helper323]

So I'm counting your vote as "Agree"?

Yeah, I guess it's okay now, due to an existing similar feat.

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

Three mods and an Admin, this can definitely be applied now

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

I disagree about anyone being Likely Far Higher though, as the feat is close to baseline.

In general, when we say "higher/far higher" it does not mean that a character is above Wall level, but above the given value (so in this case, 95 Kilojoules).

 

[Random-Helper323]

In general, when we say "higher/far higher" it does not mean that a character is above Wall level, but above the given value (so in this case, 95 Kilojoules).

I know. I'm saying higher is fine, far higher seems to go too far, to me.

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

Brienne also isn’t the only one with Class 25 lifting strength (11.19 tons) in this verse. Hugh Hammer has Class 25 as well (15.28 tons) from another calculation I made that got accepted. These only apply to exceptionally strong warriors in the verse, not average humans.

Robert who can casually fight with his warhammer might also be worth calculating.