General DC Comics Discussion Thread

[AyOgUyS]

Based on how the DC works, any being can actually “become” tier 0 as a process of returning to God.

What?

 

[Antvasima]

As far as I have understood, complete ego-dissolution leads to Enlightenment, as our highest selves are all aspects of God on a nondual level.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Tier 0 Darkseid someday

Let me feed you this
From your challenger for biggest darkseid glazer trophy. Its has some merit if you know nothing about dc and how inconsistent DC can be. Also bro call eclipso= great darkness.

 

[GeneralSol16]

Has someone planned doing a Linda Danvers profile? You know, the Supergirl from 2000s

 

[Antvasima]

I think that she first appeared as Matrix in the late 1980s.

 

[GeneralSol16]

I think that she first appeared as Matrix in the late 1980s.

They're technically not the same, especially since Linda still existed as SG after defusing

 

[Antvasima]

Did they defuse at some point? I did not know that. What happened to Matrix afterwards?

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Ok what is "cosmological" dimensions do you all think Wally was progressing through here?
The new power they are referring his him moving out of story lol. The detail he figure out was that he can move in and out as he please.

Tbf I don't think anyone can content with Wally if he is serious(writer dont forget about this power) and want to end them now nothing stopping him resetting them and the creation and only similar level threat who opperate outside narrative posses a challenge and threat.

 

[PromptedElephant641]

That’s just the SpectraVerse, special higher levels of the universe accessibly by the Flash(es). They are still part of material reality.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

That’s just the SpectraVerse, special higher levels of the universe accessibly by the Flash(es). They are still part of material reality.

He just come up with the name out of his own understanding. Material reality but cosmological dimensions doesnt sit right. Speed force is outside all material stuff.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

That’s just the SpectraVerse, special higher levels of the universe accessibly by the Flash(es). They are still part of material reality.

That is progressing through those dimensions after he agained his ability to move outside the thread of the stories, physics, vibration, time and etc.. It cant be material stuff.

 

[PromptedElephant641]

No. It is literally called the SpectraVerse. It consists of higher frequencies of Earth-Prime. This is all explained in The Flash Vol6. Because they are just higher frequencies of Earth-Prime, they are still just a part of material reality. The Speed Force is the barrier that separates the physical from the metaphysical as such the “frequencies” of the SpectraVerse are part of material reality below the Speed Force Wall.

 

[KirbyFan03]

No. It is literally called the SpectraVerse. It consists of higher frequencies of Earth-Prime. This is all explained in The Flash Vol6. Because they are just higher frequencies of Earth-Prime, they are still just a part of material reality. The Speed Force is the barrier that separates the physical from the metaphysical as such the “frequencies” of the SpectraVerse are part of material reality below the Speed Force Wall.

So you're saying DC Gods resist plot manip?

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

So you're saying DC Gods resist plot manip?

not possible for the most gods in sphere of gods. Maybe minus tier 0 darksied

 

[PromptedElephant641]

So you're saying DC Gods resist plot manip?

since the Sphere of The Gods transcends the Speed Force which in turn transcends the SpectraVerse than sure. I am not sure if it is a combat applicable plot manipulation resistance though.

 

[KirbyFan03]

since the Sphere of The Gods transcends the Speed Force which in turn transcends the SpectraVerse than sure. I am not sure if it is a combat applicable plot manipulation resistance though.

As long as they have resistance to plot manip that's fine by me combat applicable or no

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

since the Sphere of The Gods transcends the Speed Force which in turn transcends the SpectraVerse than sure. I am not sure if it is a combat applicable plot manipulation resistance though.

Wally can reach to the crack in source wall with speedforce so it cant be just below sphere of gods. And he has reset the creation with plot manipulation so its combat applicable for him.

 

[PromptedElephant641]

It literally is below the Sphere of The Gods. This is universally agreed upon by everyone that knows anything about DC Cosmology. It is on Grant Morrison’s map of the multiverse, it is very clear where it is supposed to be. It is evident that you do not understand The Flash Vol6 and are confusing the brief connection that Wally has with the Deep Change in the first 13 or so issues with the normal Speed Force. They are completely separate things. The Speed Force is a mere Emenation of The Deep Change.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Wally can reach to the crack in source wall with speedforce so it cant be just below sphere of gods. And he has reset the creation with plot manipulation so its combat applicable for him.

The Source Wall has emanations

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

It literally is below the Sphere of The Gods. This is universally agreed upon by everyone that knows anything about DC Cosmology. It is on Grant Morrison’s map of the multiverse, it is very clear where it is supposed to be. It is evident that you do not understand The Flash Vol6 and are confusing the brief connection that Wally has with the Deep Change in the first 13 or so issues with the normal Speed Force. They are completely separate things. The Speed Force is a mere Emenation of The Deep Change.

Speed force wall that act as boundary bettween material multiverse and sphere of gods. Ok just explain me this thing-
All seven fundamental cosmic forces —including the Speed Force, Strength Force, Still Force, and Sage Force—ultimately spring from the Source? Isn't this right? And doesnt that lighting that cross through each layer of existence from speed force wall to penetrate even source wall show their reach?

 

[GlitchedNess]

While I'm against batman being higher than anything but multi city block I don't see how the gloves make him a superman tier when it could just mean his enemies have crappy electricity manip resistance

This has consistently been the case

There are even direct statement that these gloves are designed to fight Superman

It's also supposedly a seismic glove, not just simple shock gloves.

So him hurting Lex here is definitely not an outlier.

 

[Antvasima]

The first scan above was from an artificial reality created by Mister Mxyzptlk and Bat-Mite, so we cannot scale from it.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

The Source Wall has emanations

No mentioned of Source Wall having emanations here
I mean if you read them its said he is inside the speedforce at the highest vibration and he take those arch angles there to cause a delay.

But yes deep change is something else and if from beyond even the source wall.

Maybe Wally plot manipulation and steping outside the story abilit also comes from it.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Shouldn't the Darksied get KO Darksied H1-A key since KO Superman has it.

 

[GlitchedNess]

The first scan above was from an artificial reality created by Mister Mxyzptlk and Bat-Mite, so we cannot scale from it.

Even then Deathstroke stated that the gauntlet he used was designed for "Superman and the likes".
It scales to Rebirth Lord Havoc and Dreamslayer

Who were villains that could fight against an entire JLA team consists of people like Wonder Woman and The Atom of the likes during Post-Crisis

I know this is about Rebirth but the fact that he has gauntlet designed for fighting "Superman and the likes", and him hurting characters who are supposedly portrayed as tiers above him, I don't think it's much of a stretch to say it hurting Lex is not an outlier.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Even then Deathstroke stated that the gauntlet he used was designed for "Superman and the likes".
It scales to Rebirth Lord Havoc and Dreamslayer

Who were villains that could fight against an entire JLA team consists of people like Wonder Woman and The Atom of the likes during Post-Crisis

I know this is about Rebirth but the fact that he has gauntlet designed for fighting "Superman and the likes", and him hurting characters who are supposedly portrayed as tiers above him, I don't think it's much of a stretch to say it hurting Lex is not an outlier.

Eh maybe for AP I can see it

Batman isn't FTL and he needed Jarro to blind lex

 

[KirbyFan03]

No mentioned of Source Wall having emanations here
I mean if you read them its said he is inside the speedforce at the highest vibration and he take those arch angles there to cause a delay.

But yes deep change is something else and if from beyond even the source wall.

Maybe Wally plot manipulation and steping outside the story abilit also comes from it.

The last image portrays the godrealms so I can't argue there

 

[Elizio33]

Ok what is "cosmological" dimensions do you all think Wally was progressing through here?
The new power they are referring his him moving out of story lol. The detail he figure out was that he can move in and out as he please.

Tbf I don't think anyone can content with Wally if he is serious(writer dont forget about this power) and want to end them now nothing stopping him resetting them and the creation and only similar level threat who opperate outside narrative posses a challenge and threat.

These "cosmological dimensions" are part of the SpectraVerse, which is described as a hidden vibrational architecture of Earth-0, composed of 10, 11, or 26 discrete frequencies representing different "angles" or "layers of existence" within the same universe. Mr. Terrific explains that Wally's movement through these cosmological dimensions can be tracked via interference patterns, and elsewhere his team states they are mapping N-dimensional structures while modeling the Multiverse. If these scenes refer to the same research, the SpectraVerse is at least presented as part of an N-dimensional cosmological model, though the comic never explicitly states that each individual frequency is itself a higher dimension.

 

[GeneralSol16]

Did they defuse at some point? I did not know that. What happened to Matrix afterwards?

Disappeared from existence just like Linda did lol

 

[PromptedElephant641]

These "cosmological dimensions" are part of the SpectraVerse, which is described as a hidden vibrational architecture of Earth-0, composed of 10, 11, or 26 discrete frequencies representing different "angles" or "layers of existence" within the same universe. Mr. Terrific explains that Wally's movement through these cosmological dimensions can be tracked via interference patterns, and elsewhere his team states they are mapping N-dimensional structures while modeling the Multiverse. If these scenes refer to the same research, the SpectraVerse is at least presented as part of an N-dimensional cosmological model, though the comic never explicitly states that each individual frequency is itself a higher dimension.

I agree that the “frequencies” / “angles” of the SpectraVerse are not geometric dimensions. They are abstractions of various degrees of complexity. The lower ones are kind of irrelevant for tiering purposes; however, higher ones such as the realm of pure mathematics would qualify for being low-1A for containing all mathematical concepts. The most fundamental layer, The Gallery of Moments, should qualify as 1A. Given that we are told that the realms visited correspond to the Earth-Prime universe, each universe is 1A in its entirety, kind of like Marvel, via having a SpectraVerse; however, this is only applicable to The Flashes as no other character has any evidence of interacting with these layers of reality. Since they only appear in The Flash Vol6, the only people that can possibly scale to the SpectraVerse are the Flashes and the massively enhanced Rogues he fights throughout the first 13 issues.

 

[Quickmia]

Ok what is "cosmological" dimensions do you all think Wally was progressing through here?
The new power they are referring his him moving out of story lol. The detail he figure out was that he can move in and out as he please.

Tbf I don't think anyone can content with Wally if he is serious(writer dont forget about this power) and want to end them now nothing stopping him resetting them and the creation and only similar level threat who opperate outside narrative posses a challenge and threat.

Isn't it explicitely stated by Wally himself that fighting Superman is equivalent to suicide? Prime also said he's faster than all the Flashes recently.

 

[Elizio33]

I agree that the “frequencies” / “angles” of the SpectraVerse are not geometric dimensions. They are abstractions of various degrees of complexity. The lower ones are kind of irrelevant for tiering purposes; however, higher ones such as the realm of pure mathematics would qualify for being low-1A for containing all mathematical concepts. The most fundamental layer, The Gallery of Moments, should qualify as 1A. Given that we are told that the realms visited correspond to the Earth-Prime universe, each universe is 1A in its entirety, kind of like Marvel, via having a SpectraVerse; however, this is only applicable to The Flashes as no other character has any evidence of interacting with these layers of reality. Since they only appear in The Flash Vol6, the only people that can possibly scale to the SpectraVerse are the Flashes and the massively enhanced Rogues he fights throughout the first 13 issues.

Oh, but the Gallery of Moments and the Realm of Pure Math are different cases, i was more talking about treating the 10 to 26 frequencies as higher spatial dimensions.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Isn't it explicitely stated by Wally himself that fighting Superman is equivalent to suicide? Prime also said he's faster than all the Flashes recently.

He said Barry is the only one fast enough to catch him

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Isn't it explicitely stated by Wally himself that fighting Superman is equivalent to suicide? Prime also said he's faster than all the Flashes recently.

In his latest Wally considered a threat that entire JL can't beat and even all of batman contengency plan failed. No one is faster than neither superman or Barry. Prime never fought or saw current Wally we cant say anything.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

He said Barry is the only one fast enough to catch him

Barry himself said Wally is beyond him.

 

[Quickmia]

In his latest Wally considered a threat that entire JL can't beat and even all of batman contengency plan failed. No one is faster than neither superman or Barry. Prime never fought or saw current Wally we cant say anything.

Im not saying Superman is FASTER but he's certainly not losing out to Wally.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Barry himself said Wally is beyond him.

Yeah

 

[PromptedElephant641]

Superboy Prime is faster than the Flashes, as Bart had to absorb the entire Speed Force to catch up to him. Modern Wally might have been faster during his brief period where he became “unmoored” in Flash Forward; however, he has since gone back to normal as just being the fastest of all speedsters. It is likely that Wally is comparable, and possibly superior, to Superboy Prime when the later is in his base state; however, when SBP is in his enraged state he is far faster.

As for regular Superman, any of the flashes can beat him in a race if the situation requires it. This should not be much of a debate when comparing a guy who has a 1A power source versus a guy who get his power from being an impossibly efficient solar panel.

 

[Quickmia]

Superboy Prime is faster than the Flashes, as Bart had to absorb the entire Speed Force to catch up to him. Modern Wally might have been faster during his brief period where he became “unmoored” in Flash Forward; however, he has since gone back to normal as just being the fastest of all speedsters. It is likely that Wally is comparable, and possibly superior, to Superboy Prime when the later is in his base state; however, when SBP is in his enraged state he is far faster.

As for regular Superman, any of the flashes can beat him in a race if the situation requires it. This should not be much of a debate when comparing a guy who has a 1A power source versus a guy who get his power from being an impossibly efficient solar panel.

Again, no one's saying that Superman is beating the Flashes in a race. But even Wally IN Flash Forward was thanking the fact he was fighting some fodder vampire Superman alternate instead of the actual Superman because that was the equivalent to killing yourself.

 

[Osemere]

I agree that the “frequencies” / “angles” of the SpectraVerse are not geometric dimensions. They are abstractions of various degrees of complexity. The lower ones are kind of irrelevant for tiering purposes; however, higher ones such as the realm of pure mathematics would qualify for being low-1A for containing all mathematical concepts. The most fundamental layer, The Gallery of Moments, should qualify as 1A. Given that we are told that the realms visited correspond to the Earth-Prime universe, each universe is 1A in its entirety, kind of like Marvel, via having a SpectraVerse; however, this is only applicable to The Flashes as no other character has any evidence of interacting with these layers of reality. Since they only appear in The Flash Vol6, the only people that can possibly scale to the SpectraVerse are the Flashes and the massively enhanced Rogues he fights throughout the first 13 issues.

Do you have the scan saying the SpectraVerse exists within Earth-Prime?