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Currently, the VSBW has accepted the Boost multiplier for High School DxD; however, while reading the blog post where this was accepted, I found some inconsistencies and contradictions regarding the multiplier, and I would like to address them in this thread.
Our standards for multipliers
According to our standards, for multipliers that are x100 or higher, we must consider the following:
However, a good statement alone is not enough to get a high multiplier accepted. The amount of extra evidence one has to provide to get larger multipliers accepted is proportional to the size of the multiplier. For lower multipliers, like things much less than times 100, evidence can take the form of a clear increase in combat strength against priorly equal or superior opponents. For higher multipliers, like times 100 and above, the importance of stronger evidence, such as feats displaying power of a similar magnitude as the value the multiplier points to or the multipliers importance to the plot of the story, and a higher amount of evidence becomes increasingly necessary.
Since Boost currently has a multiplier defined as 2^14 (x16384), we need to find consistency in its feats as well as its implementation within the game. To begin, I want to talk about inconsistencies such as the multiplier.
Note: Upon reviewing the novel, it is never stated or implied that the base Issei of volume 16 is as strong as the base Issei of the first volume of Shin HSDXD. Therefore, we will assume that his base strength is the same up until the start of Shin HSDXD.
Inconsistency 1:
During Volumes 6 and 9, we have some interesting information that can be summarized as follows:
Diodora is a high-class demon, weaker than Rias. Considering this, Issei in BxB already surpassed Diodora when he used Ophis's snake, and with 14 Boost, he surpassed him considerably. However, it's inconsistent that with such a massive buff, Diodora managed to make Issei bleed and then didn't die when Issei used 28 Boosts. (While it can be argued that Issei didn't want to kill him out of consideration for Rias, this reasoning occurs after he had already launched the attack.)
Later, when Issei fights Sairaorg, he demonstrates that Sairaorg is stronger than Diodora and ten times stronger than Rias. Given that Issei in BxB is already ten times stronger than Base Diodora, this creates an inconsistency when he uses 14 Boost to try to match Sairaorg's power, as the difference wouldn't be that significant.
Taking into account that the 14 boosts + WDR is less than x100 (See inconsistency 4)
And as we see in the following scale:
Base Sairaorg > Issei + 14 Boosts ≥ x10 Rias > Issei BxB > x10 Diodora > Rias > Diodora ~ High Class Devil
14 boost appears to have a 10x increase at best
Inconsistency 2:
There will be an escalation chain here to clarify
Issei transferred approximately 19 boosts to Rias, giving her power as an ultimate-class devil and possibly a Maou class with 3 boosts, and subsequently, Rias was able to damage Kokabiel, a fallen angel cadre. Taking that into account, the minimum power of a Cadre would be 2^19 times that of a high-class demon.
Now, we know that Issei with his incomplete BxB is comparable to, and perhaps even superior to Rias (Raiser was frightened by his power). With his complete BxB, he should surpass that level.
The CxC is superior to Issei's BxB with Welsh Dragonic Rook and a 14 boost. Later, he can use the Welsh Dragonic Rook and a 14 boost in CxC (approximately a 24 boost + x12). He should already surpass Kokabiel by a difference of 384 times.
But later, Issei is able to fight Grendel, Rosweisse is capable of causing slight damage, and then Mirana surpasses Rosweisse, who is inferior to a Cadre-class fallen angel...
This is a clear inconsistency regarding the Boost and further evidence that the author doesn't know how to use his multiplier correctly.
Inconsistency 3:
I realized something... in volume 9, Issei uses 14 Boost against Cao Cao, who managed to cut an energy attack in half with his spear without any problems. He also took an attack from Ascalon and only cut off his arm, without a care in the world. (In fact, if we take it linearly, this would be a total of 42 Boost to cut off his arm.)
But when he obtains the Welsh Dragon Bishop, he only needs 28 Boost to be considered completely dangerous. Later, when he uses the Welsh Dragon Rook, which is a 6x boost, he manages to block a thrust from Cao Cao. This implies that Issei, with a 6x boost and a 28x boost, is ~ Cao Cao. But then, does a 28x Boost do similar damage as a 42x Boost?
That's a huge mistake. Even if we assume that Issei only needs a 14 Boost to make Cao Cao bleed, it's still inconsistent that Issei with 28 Boost + WDR does less damage than his previous form. It just shows that the author doesn't know how his multiplier works.
Inconsistency 4:
It is said that the king piece can increase power by 10 to 100 times, implying that a high-class demon can reach ultimate class and possibly even the level of a Maou.
If we assume that Issei BxB V16 is stronger than high-class, he needed the CxC to face Diehauser, who has the level of a Maou without the king piece.
This implies that to reach the level of a Maou, he needs 14 Boosts + WDR because CxC already surpasses that.
I'd also like to point out that DxD has inconsistencies regarding power scaling, mainly because Issei in CxC is comparable to Saji BxB, who was defeated by Bedeze with the King Piece using his 1%, but then it's stated that he only obtains the power of a Maou by using the King Piece. Sairaorg BxB is weaker than him and at this point should have the power of Issei CxC + 14 Boosts + WDR, but he was still weaker until he used a new power that only Issei could face with the PDxD.
With this, I mean that even with the inconsistency of Issei CxC's Maou level, there's consistency in both that a 100x increase is superior to 14 Boosts + WDR
Furthermore, if you recall what I said regarding inconsistency 2, Rias would need 22 Boosts to obtain the power of a Maou. If she is at the level of a high-class Maou, the difference would be almost x4194304, which is exaggerated compared to what Ishibumi proposed.
Inconsistency 5:
As we know, Issei with 12 Boosts destroyed a mountain and was categorized as having the power of a high-class devil. However, as seen in his profile, Issei can only use Boost 18 at most:
Issei BxB > Incomplete Issei BxB > Issei 18 Boost
This gives us the idea that Issei's power in BxB is at least 64 times that of a high-class devil, right? However, this is incorrect. Because, as we saw in inconsistency 1, Issei in BxB is 10 times stronger than Diodora, a fairly weak high-class devil, so we could use that as the base high-class power.
Inconsistency 6:
This inconsistency is already well-known. Issei, with 12 Boosts and SIB, was comparable to Barakiel, but later needed 45 Boosts and even more to defeat him. However, Barakiel was ultimately defeated without being pulverized.
Is this perhaps because he held back? Possibly, but it's still a significant power jump considering our current data.
Feats
As you may know, there must also be justification using the feats shown. Previously, Sairaorg's mention of splitting the Earth was used to justify the jump, as seen here. However, I myself discredited it in the past, so its application wouldn't matter.
But we could still use the Boost without this, right?
Well, no, because doing an inverse with the current calculations would give us that the power of the Heavenly Dragons be planetary
Issei BxB → 2.70315 Teratons
Issei CxC > Issei BxB 14 Boost + WDR → 265.73093 Petatons
Issei PDxD > Issei CxC 14 Boost + WDR → 26.122413 Zettatons
(Using PDxD, Issei damaged Apophis, who reached the level of a Heavenly Dragon)
And for Issei and Vali's scales in the Diabolos Dragon, we have Level 6 feats to them, so the exponential increase of the Boost has no justification within the power scale of the work.
Another feat used to support the power of the universe was Crom Cruac shaking the three Heavens, which at the time were of universal size, affecting characters like Ddraig and Albion. But this has now been discredited in this thread, so the Heaven is only a 5-B level, so the feat wouldn't have such power. In fact, according to common feats, it would only be a 6-B level, which again makes sense considering the power of the Heavenly Dragons shown previously.
Conclusion
With all this analyzed, it was demonstrated that the literal increase of the Boost does not coincide with the scales shown by the author, and is also narratively contradictory due to its use.
Based on this, I propose two options:
Option 1: 14 Boosts have a x10 increase, while the WDR or SIB have a x6 increase, using it to scale other characters through feats.
Option 2: Not rely on the Boost as an increase due to certain irregularities, maintaining the AP increase of the WDR and SIB at x6, but relying primarily on the feats shown for scaling.
Agree: BlackeJan (With Option 2), 1smrizvi (General), Lupus1756 (With Option 2), Dark_Soul20189 (With Option 2), Vietthai96 (With Option 2), DarkDragonMedeus (With Option 2), Maniaunavailable (General), IvarUHQ (With Option 2), Digital_Franz (With Option 2), KingTempest (General)
Neutral:
Disagree:
Our standards for multipliers
According to our standards, for multipliers that are x100 or higher, we must consider the following:
However, a good statement alone is not enough to get a high multiplier accepted. The amount of extra evidence one has to provide to get larger multipliers accepted is proportional to the size of the multiplier. For lower multipliers, like things much less than times 100, evidence can take the form of a clear increase in combat strength against priorly equal or superior opponents. For higher multipliers, like times 100 and above, the importance of stronger evidence, such as feats displaying power of a similar magnitude as the value the multiplier points to or the multipliers importance to the plot of the story, and a higher amount of evidence becomes increasingly necessary.
Since Boost currently has a multiplier defined as 2^14 (x16384), we need to find consistency in its feats as well as its implementation within the game. To begin, I want to talk about inconsistencies such as the multiplier.
Note: Upon reviewing the novel, it is never stated or implied that the base Issei of volume 16 is as strong as the base Issei of the first volume of Shin HSDXD. Therefore, we will assume that his base strength is the same up until the start of Shin HSDXD.
Inconsistency 1:
During Volumes 6 and 9, we have some interesting information that can be summarized as follows:
Diodora is a high-class demon, weaker than Rias. Considering this, Issei in BxB already surpassed Diodora when he used Ophis's snake, and with 14 Boost, he surpassed him considerably. However, it's inconsistent that with such a massive buff, Diodora managed to make Issei bleed and then didn't die when Issei used 28 Boosts. (While it can be argued that Issei didn't want to kill him out of consideration for Rias, this reasoning occurs after he had already launched the attack.)
Later, when Issei fights Sairaorg, he demonstrates that Sairaorg is stronger than Diodora and ten times stronger than Rias. Given that Issei in BxB is already ten times stronger than Base Diodora, this creates an inconsistency when he uses 14 Boost to try to match Sairaorg's power, as the difference wouldn't be that significant.
Taking into account that the 14 boosts + WDR is less than x100 (See inconsistency 4)
And as we see in the following scale:
Base Sairaorg > Issei + 14 Boosts ≥ x10 Rias > Issei BxB > x10 Diodora > Rias > Diodora ~ High Class Devil
14 boost appears to have a 10x increase at best
Inconsistency 2:
There will be an escalation chain here to clarify
Issei transferred approximately 19 boosts to Rias, giving her power as an ultimate-class devil and possibly a Maou class with 3 boosts, and subsequently, Rias was able to damage Kokabiel, a fallen angel cadre. Taking that into account, the minimum power of a Cadre would be 2^19 times that of a high-class demon.
Now, we know that Issei with his incomplete BxB is comparable to, and perhaps even superior to Rias (Raiser was frightened by his power). With his complete BxB, he should surpass that level.
The CxC is superior to Issei's BxB with Welsh Dragonic Rook and a 14 boost. Later, he can use the Welsh Dragonic Rook and a 14 boost in CxC (approximately a 24 boost + x12). He should already surpass Kokabiel by a difference of 384 times.
But later, Issei is able to fight Grendel, Rosweisse is capable of causing slight damage, and then Mirana surpasses Rosweisse, who is inferior to a Cadre-class fallen angel...
This is a clear inconsistency regarding the Boost and further evidence that the author doesn't know how to use his multiplier correctly.
Inconsistency 3:
I realized something... in volume 9, Issei uses 14 Boost against Cao Cao, who managed to cut an energy attack in half with his spear without any problems. He also took an attack from Ascalon and only cut off his arm, without a care in the world. (In fact, if we take it linearly, this would be a total of 42 Boost to cut off his arm.)
But when he obtains the Welsh Dragon Bishop, he only needs 28 Boost to be considered completely dangerous. Later, when he uses the Welsh Dragon Rook, which is a 6x boost, he manages to block a thrust from Cao Cao. This implies that Issei, with a 6x boost and a 28x boost, is ~ Cao Cao. But then, does a 28x Boost do similar damage as a 42x Boost?
That's a huge mistake. Even if we assume that Issei only needs a 14 Boost to make Cao Cao bleed, it's still inconsistent that Issei with 28 Boost + WDR does less damage than his previous form. It just shows that the author doesn't know how his multiplier works.
Inconsistency 4:
It is said that the king piece can increase power by 10 to 100 times, implying that a high-class demon can reach ultimate class and possibly even the level of a Maou.
If we assume that Issei BxB V16 is stronger than high-class, he needed the CxC to face Diehauser, who has the level of a Maou without the king piece.
This implies that to reach the level of a Maou, he needs 14 Boosts + WDR because CxC already surpasses that.
I'd also like to point out that DxD has inconsistencies regarding power scaling, mainly because Issei in CxC is comparable to Saji BxB, who was defeated by Bedeze with the King Piece using his 1%, but then it's stated that he only obtains the power of a Maou by using the King Piece. Sairaorg BxB is weaker than him and at this point should have the power of Issei CxC + 14 Boosts + WDR, but he was still weaker until he used a new power that only Issei could face with the PDxD.
With this, I mean that even with the inconsistency of Issei CxC's Maou level, there's consistency in both that a 100x increase is superior to 14 Boosts + WDR
Furthermore, if you recall what I said regarding inconsistency 2, Rias would need 22 Boosts to obtain the power of a Maou. If she is at the level of a high-class Maou, the difference would be almost x4194304, which is exaggerated compared to what Ishibumi proposed.
Inconsistency 5:
As we know, Issei with 12 Boosts destroyed a mountain and was categorized as having the power of a high-class devil. However, as seen in his profile, Issei can only use Boost 18 at most:
Issei BxB > Incomplete Issei BxB > Issei 18 Boost
This gives us the idea that Issei's power in BxB is at least 64 times that of a high-class devil, right? However, this is incorrect. Because, as we saw in inconsistency 1, Issei in BxB is 10 times stronger than Diodora, a fairly weak high-class devil, so we could use that as the base high-class power.
Inconsistency 6:
This inconsistency is already well-known. Issei, with 12 Boosts and SIB, was comparable to Barakiel, but later needed 45 Boosts and even more to defeat him. However, Barakiel was ultimately defeated without being pulverized.
Is this perhaps because he held back? Possibly, but it's still a significant power jump considering our current data.
Feats
As you may know, there must also be justification using the feats shown. Previously, Sairaorg's mention of splitting the Earth was used to justify the jump, as seen here. However, I myself discredited it in the past, so its application wouldn't matter.
But we could still use the Boost without this, right?
Well, no, because doing an inverse with the current calculations would give us that the power of the Heavenly Dragons be planetary
Issei BxB → 2.70315 Teratons
Issei CxC > Issei BxB 14 Boost + WDR → 265.73093 Petatons
Issei PDxD > Issei CxC 14 Boost + WDR → 26.122413 Zettatons
(Using PDxD, Issei damaged Apophis, who reached the level of a Heavenly Dragon)
And for Issei and Vali's scales in the Diabolos Dragon, we have Level 6 feats to them, so the exponential increase of the Boost has no justification within the power scale of the work.
Another feat used to support the power of the universe was Crom Cruac shaking the three Heavens, which at the time were of universal size, affecting characters like Ddraig and Albion. But this has now been discredited in this thread, so the Heaven is only a 5-B level, so the feat wouldn't have such power. In fact, according to common feats, it would only be a 6-B level, which again makes sense considering the power of the Heavenly Dragons shown previously.
Conclusion
With all this analyzed, it was demonstrated that the literal increase of the Boost does not coincide with the scales shown by the author, and is also narratively contradictory due to its use.
Based on this, I propose two options:
Option 1: 14 Boosts have a x10 increase, while the WDR or SIB have a x6 increase, using it to scale other characters through feats.
Option 2: Not rely on the Boost as an increase due to certain irregularities, maintaining the AP increase of the WDR and SIB at x6, but relying primarily on the feats shown for scaling.
Agree: BlackeJan (With Option 2), 1smrizvi (General), Lupus1756 (With Option 2), Dark_Soul20189 (With Option 2), Vietthai96 (With Option 2), DarkDragonMedeus (With Option 2), Maniaunavailable (General), IvarUHQ (With Option 2), Digital_Franz (With Option 2), KingTempest (General)
Neutral:
Disagree:
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