All-Fiction's Concept Manip: Anime Is Not Canon

[Agnaa]

Medaka Kurokami and Misogi Kumagawa have Conceptual Manipulation through All Fiction erasing colours in the last episode of the Medaka Box anime. But the rest of their profiles, and Medaka having the skill All Fiction at all, are based off of the manga.

As the Japanese wikipedia page for Medaka Box shows, the creators of the manga, Akatsuki Akira and Nisio Isin had no involvement in the creation of the anime besides providing the original source material.

Because of this, the Concept Manip has no place on their pages until they get an anime key, and even if they do, Medaka shouldn't get it, due to never obtaining All Fiction in the anime.

Suggestion: Remove Conceptual Manipulation from Medaka's profile (She never gets All Fiction in the anime, and All Fiction never erases concepts in the manga), and either remove Kumagawa's Conceptual Manipulation, or move it to a separate "Anime only" key based on anime feats where he doesn't have Bookmaker, April Fiction, or Non Fiction.

For some earlier discussion about this, see here and here, I'll address some important questions below.

Wasn't Good Loser Kumagawa done with some involvement by Nisio Isin?

Close, "Good Loser Kumagawa Gaiden" is the overall name for some arcs about Kumagawa in the past. While some of these were done by Nisio, such as the two manga arcs, and two books, none of these involve a similar storyline to the anime episode. So it's still an anime-only creation.

Can't All Fiction still erase concepts, such as sight, aura, and time?

Since All Fiction only erases these things for one person (Zenkichi's eyesight, Kumagawa's own aura and time), it doesn't affect the universal concept of those things, so it's not concept manipulation.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

 

[Lancer45Man]

I agree with this.

 

[Elizhaa]

Look's legit, I agree

 

[PrettyFearMachine]

Looks good, I agree with this.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I agree with this.

 

[DMB_1]

I agree.

Besides, even if you don't count the anime, giving All Fiction Concept Manipulation just for erasing colors is like giving any Darkness Manipulation user Void/Concept Manipulation because darkness itself is technically just the absence of light.

It's just not right

 

[Agnaa]

Also, if you think about it it's pretty ******* weird that Kumagawa could erase all colours and be unable to bring it back (since he can't undo things erased with All Fiction at this point), yet they're still around when the main series comes around.

Even if you take this as them just not wanting to ruin the visuals, Kumagawa says that people can't bleed out any more because the colour red doesn't exist, which seems like a super weird thing to never be commented on again if it were true and red was still erased.

 

[Antvasima]

I am fine with removing the power for both of them.

 

[Lilixa]

I remember in some match where she can erase someone from existence via all fiction. Can someone explain that abilitiy actually is ?

 

[Archaron]

I agree, finally remove this.

 

[Edwellken]

Seems fine.

 

[QuasiYuri]

The last Good Looser is like, directly link to the anime. The episode is the fourth part of the Good Looser series and totally is in the storyline. Also even the manga said to refer to the anime, like in volume 22.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

Actually the color one specifically was based on one of the Japanese only novels iirc. The anime is basically a stand in for the canon novels that have no hope of being translated. Essentially, the pages will be incomplete regardless, but this is as close as we can get. Also, the manga does reference the anime

 

[Mr._Common_Sense]

Ok, I read the Conceptual Manipulation page twice. So, the statement is regard to because of Kumagawa not erasing a concept across the entire universe the key would be removed?

However, isn't there a secondary choice on a lower level for conceptual manipulation do to the fact that color was erased on a globe scale?

 

[Wokistan]

Color can be erased without erasing the concept, since its a wavelength of light and there was still greyscale stuff remaining. Neutral rn.

 

[Creaturemaster971]

I don't know enough to be useful, but I wanna know how this turns out.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

Color can be erased without erasing the concept, since its a wavelength of light and there was still greyscale stuff remaining. Neutral rn.

Usually, yes. But the guy who he was fighting manipulates and weaponises color. If he merely erased the wavelengths of light, then either black or white would still exist, which he would attack with. Color as a whole would have to no longer exist

 

[Mr._Common_Sense]

@Wokista

Yea, I know the greyscale effect was still in play after Kumagawa erased all colors that just becaue its final input for the brain to recongize it surrondings without the visuals becoming blind.

I'm saying the range of the erasure. In the conceptual manipulation page it states the concept has to be erased on a universal scale to be considered it, but what about the cases where the range is a global/planterary scale.

 

[Agnaa]

The last Good Looser is like, directly link to the anime. The episode is the fourth part of the Good Looser series and totally is in the storyline. Also even the manga said to refer to the anime, like in volume 22.

I don't believe the Good Loser series was planned out with the anime being the fourth part in advance. I think the parts were just made and that ended up chronologically being the fourth part so that's where it was placed.

Also, I don't think it really matters that Nisio referenced the anime. If you've read more of his writing, he makes a ton of meta jokes and references to other mediums, so I don't believe that him mentioning it should make it canon. He joked in his novels about how they'd never be animated, then after they were joked about his reliance on those jokes.

@Mr. Common Sense In those cases the Concept Manip is said to have a limited range, such as with SCP-3160

 

[Mr._Common_Sense]

They may have to be an update to the Concept Manip page for a limit range spot because we do see all the colors were erased from the entire planet.

 

[Agnaa]

Maybe, but that belongs in another CRT. This one isn't about All Fiction being planetary or universal, it's about the anime not being canon to the manga, so please don't derail.

 

[Elizhaa]

Overall, we have an agreement for the changes so the changes can be added.

 

[Antvasima]

@Nedge

Yes they can. If somebody is willing to handle it, I can unlock the profiles in question.

@Agnaa

Do you or somebody else here know if anything useful happened or was explained in the Medaka Box and Kumagawa novels?

 

[Agnaa]

I'm not sure, and I don't believe they're translated. I could try to look into it more but most discussion about Medaka Box seems pretty dead outside of here.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Thank you for the help.

Should I unlock the two pages for you?

 

[Agnaa]

I'm on my phone, I won't be able to make the changes for another three hours or so. If no-one else has done the changes, I'll ask you to unlock then.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[Agnaa]

I'm ready to edit the pages now.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. I will unlock them. Tell me here when you are done.

 

[Agnaa]

I've removed concept manip from both.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Should we close this then?

 

[Agnaa]

Sure, why not.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.