Asgorath vs Arceus

[ThatDarnFish]

Magic God Dragon vs Space God Llama
Speed =
Takes place on MARS
Both 2-A versions
1-A Far Spells are restricted for Asgorath

Asgorath :

Fence Llama:

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Asgorath stomps

Resists everything Palkia could use by multiple layers. This will also happen with every single member of the creation trio.

 

[ThatDarnFish]

Asgorath stomps

Resists everything Palkia could use by multiple layers. This will also happen with every single member of the creation trio.

Even the Llama?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Even the Llama?

Yes. He can bypass Arceus' Low 1-C immortality through Far Realm spells (1-A).

 

[Vietthai96]

DnD have smurf hax

 

[ThatDarnFish]

Yes. He can bypass Arceus' Low 1-C immortality through Far Realm spells (1-A).

Well that would just mean we restrict Far Realm spells. Besides, it would be a 2-A Arceus Avatar

 

[Vietthai96]

Well that would just mean we restrict Far Realm spells. Besides, it would be a 2-A Arceus Avatar

well you can restrict ability, but it will not get added to the profile regardless of the result. but anyway DnD characters have smurf hax so........................

 

[Dragonstitch]

yeah even restricting the 1-A stuff this is still a stomp. no mater what member of the trio is used. Asgroth resists every ability they have. as well do to the fact that D&D is one of the few verses that treat destroying multiple 2-A s as greater then 1 they can't even hurt Asgroth

 

[ThatDarnFish]

well you can restrict ability, but it will not get added to the profile regardless of the result. but anyway DnD characters have smurf hax so........................

Restricting a 1-A ability from a 2-A match up doesn't invalidate it. There's been any number of battles where a move or ability that's higher than the tier if the combatants has been restricted.

yeah even restricting the 1-A stuff this is still a stomp. no mater what member of the trio is used. Asgroth resists every ability they have. as well do to the fact that D&D is one of the few verses that treat destroying multiple 2-A s as greater then 1 they can't even hurt Asgroth

Gonna swap to Llama and leave it at that for a while. If more people chime in and say it's a stomp for Asgorath, then RIP thread

 

[ThatDarnFish]

B U M P

 

[Sniper670]

This is clearly a stomp in favor of the smurf.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

This is clearly a stomp in favor of the smurf.

Another reason why Arceus shouldn’t be used in battles either he stalemates, stomps, or gets stomped.

 

[ThatDarnFish]

Another reason why Arceus shouldn’t be used in battles either he stalemates, stomps, or gets stomped.

M a n. What's the point of having a VS profile if you can't even be used for a good VS battle?

So even restricting the tier breaking stuff (which I don't see on Asgorath's profile, but I'll assume it's just out of date) Leaving them both to their 2-A abilities it's a stomp for someone?

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

M a n. What's the point of having a VS profile if you can't even be used for a good VS battle?

So even restricting the tier breaking stuff (which I don't see on Asgorath's profile, but I'll assume it's just out of date) Leaving them both to their 2-A abilities it's a stomp for someone?

should we ban Arceus from being used in matches if he’s so unmatchable


I wonder if this site has something like that.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

M a n. What's the point of having a VS profile if you can't even be used for a good VS battle?

So even restricting the tier breaking stuff (which I don't see on Asgorath's profile, but I'll assume it's just out of date) Leaving them both to their 2-A abilities it's a stomp for someone?

Asgorath bypasses layered resistances to his powers. Even ignoring far realm stuff, he would still stomp.

Edit: And that's ignoring stuff like his passive precognition that essentially gives him prep time, which does include himself as a dragon (and potentially plainly includes Arceus as per having the dragon type). And also the greater god's op probability manipulation of "I will always go first".

 

[ThatDarnFish]

Asgorath bypasses layered resistances to his powers. Even ignoring far realm stuff, he would still stomp.

Edit: And that's ignoring stuff like his passive precognition that essentially gives him prep time, which does include himself as a dragon (and potentially plainly includes Arceus as per having the dragon type). And also the greater god's op probability manipulation of "I will always go first".

Aah. Oh well. Chalk this one up as another flooop.

 

[Sniper670]

Asgorath bypasses layered resistances to his powers. Even ignoring far realm stuff, he would still stomp.

Edit: And that's ignoring stuff like his passive precognition that essentially gives him prep time, which does include himself as a dragon (and potentially plainly includes Arceus as per having the dragon type). And also the greater god's op probability manipulation of "I will always go first".

Arceus scales above every species of the entire franchise.

So let me lowball and give it intervals of 10, we have 10 layers for each species

Simple fact is, Level 20 Alakazam pretty much hax stomps a level 10. And so on. And that will proceed to get stomped by Mewtwo, and so on

Passive precognition? Lol please.

Alakazam can take one good look at you, and map your entire history from child birth till your death

Not to mention, sufficiently strong Characters can straight up nullify precognition with their presence

Overall, I agree Asgaroth stomps due to whatever infinitely above baseline Ap he has. But not for the reasons you listed. Those are chicken change to Arceus

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Arceus scales above every species of the entire franchise.

So let me lowball and give it intervals of 10, we have 10 layers for each species

Simple fact is, Level 20 Alakazam pretty much hax stomps a level 10. And so on. And that will proceed to get stomped by Mewtwo, and so on

Passive precognition? Lol please.

Alakazam can take one good look at you, and map your entire history from child birth till your death

Not to mention, sufficiently strong Characters can straight up nullify precognition with their presence

Overall, I agree Asgaroth stomps due to whatever infinitely above baseline Ap he has. But not for the reasons you listed. Those are chicken change to Arceus

Take Alakazam's precog, now apply it to every dragon in the infinite*infinite*infinite multiverse of D&D with 16 weeks in advance. That's Agorath's.

Also, that ain't how layers work, and Alakazam is only 3-D. Arceus 4-D layer hax barely is above 1 or 2 layers for the Creation and Lake Trio. Asgorath is a Greater God with, at the absolute least, 16 Divine Ranks. Every rank above the last straight up can bypass the resistance of the last. Arceus is absolute fodder between even the weakest of the gods in d&d and would be stomped.

Edit: By the way, if we went with how you scale layers, using levels to see who can stomp who, then Asgorath is straight up infinity layers above infinity. Even compared to other dragon deities that sre below him who would upscale to the infinity of dragons which, btw, do get actual 4-D hax eventually, something Pkmn lacks. Asgorath stomps to such a degree, Arceus literally can't do anything even taking into consideration his Low 1-C immortality, as Asgorath passively puts him down and uses his myriad of spells.

 

[Sniper670]

Take Alakazam's precog, now apply it to every dragon in the infinite*infinite*infinite multiverse of D&D with 16 weeks in advance. That's Agorath's.

Iirc infinite * Infinite * Infinite is still infinite

I don't see how that proves its higher than Arceus.

Especially when every copy of the game is its own cosmology so millions of infinite sized multiverses

Also, that ain't how layers work, and Alakazam is only 3-D. Arceus 4-D layer hax barely is above 1 or 2 layers for the Creation and Lake Trio.

Pokémon hax have been working on 4D level since the ages.

Asgorath is a Greater God with, at the absolute least, 16 Divine Ranks. Every rank above the last straight up can bypass the resistance of the last. Arceus is absolute fodder between even the weakest of the gods in d&d and would be stomped.

You can't bypass resistances your verse hasn't shown to have.
Does he have feats of seeing the future of beings who's future can't be seen??

If no then no amount of resistance layers bypassing will help you here.

I see none on his profile. Arceus cockblocks Every power, ability or move on the series.

What stops Arceus from bfring into his mind. Recreating him with his exact same powers, sleep haxing him into a dream world that grants him Invulnerability and ignores all defenses of the dreamer. Force him to dance(Broadway Force), absorbing his powers and making a plate out of it, rendering him immune to anything Agorath can do. And a whole lot

Nothing. Theres nothing on his profile that is impressive.

Arceus can simply be increasing all his stats while chilling inside Asgatoths mind. Thanks to Marshadow, he can just remain a shadow whole inside Agorath's shadow and copying his powers, stats and anything on between. Power absorption to Agorath doesn't even have resistances to. Straight up Shrink Agorath if he wanted to or even seal his powers

 

[Sniper670]

Note: I've heard about DnD notoriety, I'm only here to see how far Arceus can go and how realistically he can win this

I also forgot immortality Type 9 means His True Form can keep making more and more Avatars.

Plus, Draconic powers gets lol noped by Fairy Typing.

Psychic Powers gets lol noped by Dark Typing

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Iirc infinite * Infinite * Infinite is still infinite

I don't see how that proves its higher than Arceus.

Especially when every copy of the game is its own cosmology so millions of infinite sized multiverses

Pokémon hax have been working on 4D level since the ages.

You can't bypass resistances your verse hasn't shown to have.
Does he have feats of seeing the future of beings who's future can't be seen??

If no then no amount of resistance layers bypassing will help you here.

I see none on his profile. Arceus cockblocks Every power, ability or move on the series.

What stops Arceus from bfring into his mind. Recreating him with his exact same powers, sleep haxing him into a dream world that grants him Invulnerability and ignores all defenses of the dreamer. Force him to dance(Broadway Force), absorbing his powers and making a plate out of it, rendering him immune to anything Agorath can do. And a whole lot

Nothing. Theres nothing on his profile that is impressive.

Arceus can simply be increasing all his stats while chilling inside Asgatoths mind. Thanks to Marshadow, he can just remain a shadow whole inside Agorath's shadow and copying his powers, stats and anything on between. Power absorption to Agorath doesn't even have resistances to. Straight up Shrink Agorath if he wanted to or even seal his powers

D&D is treated as having the biggest 4-D multiverse in the wiki because of it's layered nature.

D&D has all of that at infinity.

Not accepted.

Yes, every god has that and each can bypass each other.

Asgorath resists all of Arceus' powers layered. See here.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Note: I've heard about DnD notoriety, I'm only here to see how far Arceus can go and how realistically he can win this

I also forgot immortality Type 9 means His True Form can keep making more and more Avatars.

Plus, Draconic powers gets lol noped by Fairy Typing.

Psychic Powers gets lol noped by Dark Typing

Asgorath bypasses fairy resistance.

Asgorath bypasses dark type resistance.

The avatar will keep being passive'd. Asgorath stomps.

 

[Sniper670]

Asgorath bypasses fairy resistance.

Why. It's not resistance, it's immunity

Asgorath bypasses dark type resistance.

Why. It's not resistance, it's immunity

The avatar will keep being passive'd. Asgorath stomps.

Same as Arceus, and his true form is even harder to reach

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Why. It's not resistance, it's immunity

Why. It's not resistance, it's immunity

Same as Arceus, and his true form is even harder to reach

Immunity is NLF. They would work, at best, at 4-D. Asgorath bypasses by sheer layers.

Arceus doesn't have remotely any hax or layer to do anything even to lesser gods. His avatar gets stomped. If we count his true form as getting involved in this match, then obviously Asgorath is stomped without his far realm spells.

 

[Sniper670]

D&D is treated as having the biggest 4-D multiverse in the wiki because of it's layered nature.

D&D has all of that at infinity.

Not accepted.

Yes, every god has that and each can bypass each other.

Asgorath resists all of Arceus' powers layered. See here.

No resistance to power absorption, nor power mimicry, nor Broadway force, what sealing does it have? Arceus with little power he gave to humans allowed them to seal most of hoopa's powers.

No resistance to dream hax

 

[Sniper670]

Immunity is NLF. They would work, at best, at 4-D. Asgorath bypasses by sheer layers.

Alright. It's immunity on account of how it works in the verse so we go with that.

Plus his Plates bypasses all that

Arceus doesn't have remotely any hax or layer to do anything even to lesser gods. His avatar gets stomped. If we count his true form as getting involved in this match, then obviously Asgorath is stomped without his far realm spells.

Maybe. But there are things Asgorath has not shown to be resistant to, which I mentioned in my previous post

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Alright. It's immunity on account of how it works in the verse so we go with that.

Plus his Plates bypasses all that

Maybe. But there are things Asgorath has not shown to be resistant to, which I mentioned in my previous post

Broadway Force is resisted, look again.

Power Absorption and Mimicry is useless, he gets passive'd before Arceus uses them.

Plate scaling is simply 1 layer. Asgorath still stomps.

 

[Sniper670]

Broadway Force is resisted, look again.

I see that

Power Absorption and Mimicry is useless, he gets passive'd before Arceus uses them.

Passive'd by what exactly ?

Plus, Arceus has already seen the history of the guy via psychometry. His True Form can simply try again

Plate scaling is simply 1 layer. Asgorath still stomps.

Scales above all Pokémon across the infinite multiverse

It's not just one layer. He's literally immune to any hax that can be used against him

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Keep in mind. Asgorath knows everything Arceus will do against him with 16 weeks in advance. He can straight up prepare against absolutely everything Arceus can conjure up with access to basically every single spell that exists in D&D.

And btw, while dream stuff isn't mentioned on that blog, it is a power that exists in-verse and I can get the scans real quick.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I see that

Passive'd by what exactly ?

Plus, Arceus has already seen the history of the guy via psychometry. His True Form can simply try again

Scales above all Pokémon across the infinite multiverse

It's not just one layer. He's literally immune to any hax that can be used against him

Pokemon are 3-D. Plus Asgorath has that but for 4-D.

Asgorath resists precog and psychometry, and even Arceus' true form ain't accepted with 5-D hax, so Asgorath resists.

I will get you the list of passives tho. Although many haxes on Asgorath profile (which Arceus doesn't resist almost any single one, much less layered).

 

[Chariot190]

What's the point of having a VS profile if you can't even be used for a good VS battle?

For people who just want to know how strong a dude is. Don't forget, we index first, matches just a """"fun"""" side thing.

 

[Sniper670]

Keep in mind. Asgorath knows everything Arceus will do against him with 16 weeks in advance. He can straight up prepare against absolutely everything Arceus can conjure up with access to basically every single spell that exists in D&D.

You're stretching it buddy

Can likely sense any event that effects Dragons at least 16 weeks in advance

And btw, while dream stuff isn't mentioned on that blog, it is a power that exists in-verse and I can get the scans real quick.

Do so. And its not just dreams, it's dream Manipulation and Subjective Reality as every dream in Pokémon is another Plane of reality. So good luck with that

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

You're stretching it buddy


Do so. And its not just dreams, it's dream Manipulation and Subjective Reality as every dream in Pokémon is another Plane of reality. So good luck with that

I am not. Literally how the power works. He knows everything that will affect a dragon (including himself) 16 weeks in advance. He has passive prep to the entire fight.

Subjective Reality is resisted. Literally how Divine Spells work. Asgorath resists other deities. So yeah, don't even have to search anything then.

 

[Sniper670]

Pokemon are 3-D. Plus Asgorath has that but for 4-D.

Pokémon hax work on 4D things just fine

Asgorath resists precog and psychometry, and even Arceus' true form ain't accepted with 5-D hax, so Asgorath resists.

Arceus True Form is just going to keep making more and more Avatars

Plus sufficiently strong characters can bypass precognition and act outside of what was seen. So good luck with that

I will get you the list of passives tho. Although many haxes on Asgorath profile (which Arceus doesn't resist almost any single one, much less layered).

Let me see it

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Pokémon hax work on 4D things just fine

Arceus True Form is just going to keep making more and more Avatars

Plus sufficiently strong characters can bypass precognition and act outside of what was seen. So good luck with that

Let me see it

Show me where was this accepted.

Asgorath bypasses 4-D resistances to it. Arceus doesn't even have resistance. Simple as that.

Will do so, sorry for the wait.

 

[Sniper670]

I am not. Literally how the power works. He knows everything that will affect a dragon (including himself) 16 weeks in advance. He has passive prep to the entire fight.

Cute?
Because Calyrex can do the same, Xatu can do the same, in fact Xatus can even bfr characters to relive their past while shrunken. Alakazam can do that as well. Easy peezy

Subjective Reality is resisted. Literally how Divine Spells work. Asgorath resists other deities. So yeah, don't even have to search anything then.

Sure.. What stops Arceus from sealing his powers, copying them, or straight up absorbing them

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Cute?
Because Calyrex can do the same, Xatu can do the same, in fact Xatus can even bfr characters to relive their past while shrunken. Alakazam can do that as well. Easy peezy

Show me when it's accepted as 4-D, then we talking. And even then, lol, still resisted by couple layers. Arceus can't precog Asgorath, simply put. Also, we already accepted Arceus doesn't have those powers anyway.

 

[Sniper670]

Show me where was this accepted.

That's what I've been told ever since I came to the wiki tho.

And it's been used in matches all the time no problem. I can't find where it has been accepted, but that's what it's been

Asgorath bypasses 4-D resistances to it. Arceus doesn't even have resistance. Simple as that.

His Plates nopes everything. Everything you see in the multiverse, his plates stops it. Literally under the plates page.

Will do so, sorry for the wait.

Sure

 

[Sniper670]

Show me when it's accepted as 4-D, then we talking. And even then, lol, still resisted by couple layers.

Power mimicry and power absorption he has no resistances to?

And once Arceus has taken his powers, and used them for a plate, it's over

Arceus can't precog Asgorath, simply put. Also, we already accepted Arceus doesn't have those powers anyway.

He can. And who says he doesn't have those powers?

That CRT was decided to remove non Pokémon stuff from his profiles. Everything stays the same

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

All deity powers here.

The most relevant here is the Aura passive. Just standing there, Asgorath makes it so the Arceus Avatar straight up flees from him (while also nerfing his abilities) or completely daze it into taking no action.