Bleach Light Speed Revision:

JohnCenaNation · Jan 7, 2020

JohnCenaNation · Jan 7, 2020

Bump.

00potato · Jan 7, 2020

This is a lot, the question is which one do we use.

JohnCenaNation · Jan 8, 2020

Bump.

AstralKing7 · Jan 8, 2020

Here we go again. I got popcorn this time

Purgy · Jan 8, 2020

Quite a few feats, too many to be considered outliers, and there are more that weren't included here.

W0NDER3X · Jan 8, 2020

There's also Renji's feat of blocking Star Flash (i believe was the name).

Damage3245 · Jan 8, 2020

A lot of these have been rejected in the past so you're going to have to do more to argue for them than just listing them.

AstralKing7 · Jan 8, 2020

^this

Ricsi-viragosi · Jan 8, 2020

Each at a time

Soul Society Arc:

Negacion light has a version that bends into a cube, does it not?

Gran Rey Cero
I don't see how Gran Rey Cero scan proves lightspeed.

That gif on the second link for Cero for certain isn't even close to light. "Spiritual Light" isn't that good of a reason for it.

Aushwalw
Now, I'm ignorant about Bleach, but isn't Auswählen the thing shown rising as a stream of something from Mister Mustache's hand? Something light doesn't do?

Lille
I have no problems with Lille's blight at a glance, though it doesn't exactly show many light like standards besides being called it.

Mimihagi
The calc seems farfetched to me, especially with the multiplier, but I'll let experts of the verse decide that.

Gantebainne
Gantenbainne's statement isn't worth much on it's own.

Databook
I don't know Japanese for that scan.

Sunlight dodging
The dodging the sunlight seems fine, but I doubt it would give good results with such a distance and such a small distance.

Mask
Mask's attack seemed to cause a small explosion when blocked, but could be just the heat burning... something.

Gaki Rekko
Gaki Rekkō bends.

Tl;Dr most seem iffy. The calc is something experts for the verse can verify (though the whole crossing distances we can only guess the width of with time they took to cross does make it very doubtful to me. Less the logic behind the calc and more the author's lack of tought for it, but that is just me). There are a few that don't contradict it, but the only one that actually seems to fit the criteria is the sunlight feat, which doesn't seem that promising.

Ricsi-viragosi · Jan 8, 2020

Also I haven't participated in Bleach threads so some stuff that seems fine to me might have been rejected and/or debunked before.

Purgy · Jan 8, 2020

Negacio

The way you use "bend" implies it changes shape after being created, iirc it's created as a square and just extends downwards.

Gran Rey Cero

I don't see a gif in the original post but as far as I'm aware, the only justification for Gran Rey Cero being Relativistic is due to it bending space, but I'm not entirely sure on that.

Auswähle

Auswählen did break off into multiple segments and then bended into beams that reached down to the Seiretei from the Soul Palace yes, and while I admit the way it moved initially isn't how Light would normally behave, it's kinda irrelevant. Even if you disregard it as Light (Even though there are both statements saying it's Pure Energy and Light), it still travelled a tremendous distance very quickly which when calced still gives you near LS if not higher anyway.

Lille

Lille's Light moved in a straight line, was reflected and eliminated shadows... I'm not sure how much more you need for it to be classed as Light.

Mimihagi

I also have my doubts about the Mimihagi calc and personally only put his feat somewhere in Relativistic.

Gantebainne

I agree that the Databook panel alone wouldn't justify it being LS but it's contributing evidence for the entire thread imo.

Japanese Sca

I can't read Japanese either so let's just ignore that one

Sunlight Dodging

I'm not sure what you mean, he isn't that far away from the broken wall when he evades the Light.

Mask

Why does it causing an explosion mean it can't be Light? There are accepted Light feats that have caused explosions, like Kizaru from One Piece.

Gaki Rekko

Yes it does and while I'd normally say just because it doesn't behave like Light entirely isn't reason enough to disregard it, since Gaki Rekko is used very few times and from Filler of all places, I can't really make a counter argument so you're correct.

Damage3245 · Jan 8, 2020

> Why does it causing an explosion mean it can't be Light? There are accepted Light feats that have caused explosions, like Kizaru from One Piece.

Different situation. Kizaru's attacks are explicitely referred to as lightspeed multiple times. So there is more going for his feats than there are for these feats.

Purgy · Jan 8, 2020

I'm aware they're different situations, it wasn't a direct comparison, moreso was wondering why something would just get completely disregarded as Light because it caused an explosion.

Damage3245 · Jan 8, 2020

Well, it wouldn't get it completely disgarded but I believe it would count as a mark against it and it would have to be weighed up against the other evidence in favor for it.

Purgy · Jan 8, 2020

Fair enough. Honestly, I don't even agree with Mask's attack being Light anyway.

Ricsi-viragosi · Jan 8, 2020

@Purgy

No, the gif on the linked wiki for negacion (I don't know if the anime can be used but it still shows it as that) shows the light forming the square by bending.

Bending space isn't attributable to speed alone (especially for supposed light).

If the distance it crossed reached SoL speeds in an obvious manner I have the feeling there wouldn't be so much debate about FTL Bleach.

I'm fine with Lille's then, if there are no other problems with it.

I don't think spiritual light is going to contribute much, but that's me.

He is, at a glance, at about five meters away and his initial movement is bending his torso.

I do feel like the intention of making them light speed was there from the author, so those feats can be calced and applied accordingly if no-one brings counter arguments as far as 8'm concerned.

Sekkonds. · Jan 8, 2020

i collected all of bleach beams with arguments in favor and aganist in one blog,but i don't think any of them apply as real light

Damage3245 · Jan 8, 2020

Moving in a straight line is not proof of lightspeed according to the criteria on the Laser / Light Beam Dodging page.

Purgy · Jan 8, 2020

After reading Sekkonds thread, I'm confused on why at least some of them haven't been accepted, I mean they fit 3 of the criteria required to be classified as Light and it says it only requires a "few" of them to be met.

Also, I had no idea Star Flash was stated as Light hence why I said I didn't think it was Light earlier, but the fact that it both travels straight and reflects aswell kinda makes it undeniable for me.

Lastly, the page says that just because it travels in straight line doesn't make it by default real Light, it should still be contributing evidence to say it is alongside everything else, and that's kinda the impression I got from reading the Laser/Light Beam thread.

Damage3245 · Jan 8, 2020

If travelling in a straight line isn't proof of lightspeed like the page says, it feels misleading to include that as a criteria that they have passed.

Purgy · Jan 8, 2020

From how I read it, it seemed like if it didn't fall under the second segment of criteria then it was at least evidence for it being Light even though not as much evidence as if it had been a criteria from the first segment.

But I see what you mean and I guess classing it as one of them by saying it fits "3" of the criteria was wrong.

USklaverei · Jan 9, 2020

I literally made a post about Negació where I showed:

Declared light

He moved straight

It was not made of Reishi (spiritual matter), the only thing not made of Reishi was Auswahlen, who did not interact with Seki-Seki, which was purely radiation, the photons do not interact with each other.

Cannot be physically interacted

Also, he had no Anti-Talent, but the wire was simply thrown into limbo.

Mask's Star Flash, I found it a bit iffy, but it's a few things:

Declared light

Travels straight

Reflects on a reflective surface

Does not explode, simply burns (light produces heat)

Auswahle is simply not accepted to double at times, but meets some criteria, such as:

It's made of photons

Cannot be physically interacted

Crossed a great distance in seconds

Lille from what I understand, he has two different lights, one he simply emanates and one he uses to attack. Where the same:

Declared light

Moves straight

Reflects on a reflective surface (although it was reflected by a sword that reflected power, it was being reflected as real light, a diffused reflection)

Used to erase shadows (although not a criterion, but good to cite)

USklaverei · Jan 9, 2020

This is not considered light here is even slutty.

AstralKing7 · Jan 9, 2020

Why are the same debunked arguments being used again tho? A staff member should take a look at this who participated in the last threads and blogs

USklaverei · Jan 9, 2020

Broken arguments? Literally no one argued against Lille's light, against Negacion they simply stopped responding and Auswalhen was denied, but with things now less judicious than him being accepted, this can be accepted.

The Mask beam was not even evaluated.

The_Prince_of_Counters · Jan 9, 2020

Yhwach's light should be considered real, the only thing going against it is that it bends ( barely.) In certain places but that can be dismissed as Artistic Liberty .

ZephyrosOmega · Jan 9, 2020

https://v1.mangabeast01.com/manga/Bleach/0651-004.png

I'm no bleach expert but this seems pretty solid light tbh

Damage3245 · Jan 9, 2020

@ZephyrosOmega; in that instance it looks like he creates a ball of energy that emits light.

USklaverei · Jan 9, 2020

This light looks a lot like the one it uses for attacks and the one it emanates.

JohnCenaNation · Jan 9, 2020

Bump.

Tyri456 · Jan 10, 2020

Damage3245 said:
A lot of these have been rejected in the past so you're going to have to do more to argue for them than just listing them.

that isn't true, no one argued the barro one for example.

Damage3245 · Jan 10, 2020

@Tyri456; a lot of these have been discussed and rejected in the past, so unfortunately it is true. I'm not a liar.

Tyri456 · Jan 10, 2020

not saying that, but I think a thread is needed for the barro one, I never saw arguments against barro tho, and also 1 or 2 of them have just been left unanswered, like the auswahlen one. The staff member said that the barro one is fine to him so there is a margin of debate at least, and regarding auswhalen does not always come from yhwach hands.

Ricsi-viragosi · Jan 10, 2020

Damage said a lot, not all.

And regardless, you definitly need a bit more than scans to have it accepted. But the ones that are being agreed on being fine should be, well, fine.

W0NDER3X · Jan 10, 2020

Wanna hear something funny? Aushwahlen has a FTL calc. If it gets accepted as light, that'd be an actual downgrade, no?

Purgy · Jan 10, 2020

There was a thread where Lille's Light was "countered" but it was all based on a couple panels where the Light appears to slightly curve. Personally I think it's ridiculous to disregard all the other evidence due to that but w.e

Tyri456 · Jan 10, 2020

Ricsi-viragosi said:
Damage said a lot, not all.

yeah, you are right, my bad then.

USklaverei · Jan 11, 2020

Ricsi-viragosi said:
Damage said a lot, not all.
And regardless, you definitly need a bit more than scans to have it accepted. But the ones that are being agreed on being fine should be, well, fine.

I can make a topic bringing all the talents and anti-talents that these "lights" have, I think it would make things a lot easier.

AstralKing7 · Jan 11, 2020

Wasn't there literally a blog made ablut that a year ago^

Bleach Light Speed Revision:

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