• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

chisato aint 9a

Status
Not open for further replies.
LostLightt

LostLightt

Messages
345
Reaction score
11

ts calc dont even make sense. U used the second part and not the explosion part which I don't know why.

First of all the initial calc is wrong cause you pixel scaled to the debris

U also kinda missed the psi cause like, it's tilted yeah but the bottom is totes fine. This is a 3 psi explosion cause the steel is distorted, and thats about it

I don't even get the concrete part I'd have to ask someone better than me at calcs but I can't do that cause it's not allowed as a proxy so I'm finna leave that part

U calced the volume of the concrete got the frag values of it then you divided that by the area of it and then u did some weird thing that I had to ask someone about (this dont count as a proxy cause they just told me what it means). You divided the intensity of the explosion by surface area of a sphere to get per m2 then said that the concrete reduced the energy by that amount.

If I'm right on that then its wrong cause the entire tower floor and the surroundings reduces the strength, not just a specific part of concrete. U also have to do inverse square law as an extra i think cause it came like 10 meters from behind her so yeah.

Also I don't get it, why would you assume that concrete frag values decrease explosion values linearly. Thats just weird you're mixing different physics models so thats a big debunk

Das prolly it from my end I might be wrong on some things expect on the last point, I'm defo right on that cause they wouldn't decrease linearly and the 3 psi thing. But I reckon the other points okay and makes sense cause I can explain it better

tags: lycoris recoil and chisato nishikigi
 
Ok I read through the calc again. I’ll give some two cents before I focus on observing the thread cause who knows how long it’ll take till calc mods pull up with how long these threads can take (even for popular verses)
The PSI part, the source linked explains that 6 PSI is the minimal pressure required to damage reinforced concrete and we see in the scene concrete being shattered. So I don’t think the Steel only being bent and not annihilated should be a disqualifier.
So I don’t see why it should be taken down to 3 actually as that building would be composed of reinforced concrete and steel due to complying with Japanese safety standards on Earthquake resistances. So damaging the building but not knocking it down sounds like what 6 psi is.

On the concrete frag part. This is a more personal take but it’s a fine approximation even if it’s not fully accurate (as outside vacuums energy can be wasted and lost in a lot of ways for even other calcs) since while energy lost the end result is effectively just Delta between initial energy and concrete durability. The explosion lost that much energy in the process of breaking through to hit Chisato. And isn’t the calc focused on that portion of the explosion and not the whole thing? This is the first time I’ve seen someone mention that the general surroundings should nerf an ISL calc. I can understand saying the whole floor should be used, but Chisato isn’t the size of the whole floor and thus isn’t using debris to calc a portion more logical? “How much energy the explosion at that specific point needs to break through.”

Although in the event these metrics for the concrete are a deal breaker for the calculation. Do you have another proposed method for the calculation or are you just gonna nuke them back to 9-B?
 
Last edited:
LostLightt said:
ts calc dont even make sense. U used the second part and not the explosion part which I don't know why.
Click to expand...
The Alternate Solution was based on a Calc Group Member's concern which satisfied their criticisms, (The reason why a CGM accepted the calc in the first place)

LostLightt said:
First of all the initial calc is wrong cause you pixel scaled to the debris
Click to expand...
We only pixel-scaled the RC floor slab below Majima and Chisato, not the debris.

LostLightt said:
U also kinda missed the psi cause like, it's tilted yeah but the bottom is totes fine. This is a 3 psi explosion cause the steel is distorted, and thats about it
Click to expand...
The calculation massively underestimates the damage caused by the explosion by using only 6 psi, since the concrete inside the tower was destroyed by the explosion and most of the Skytree is made from Reinforced Concrete and Steel, the minimum psi required to affect reinforced concrete is 6 psi and if we say it's just an 3 psi explosion the Tower would never tilted, even if it was minimum reinforced concrete should still be affected for this.

LostLightt said:
U calced the volume of the concrete got the frag values of it then you divided that by the area of it and then u did some weird thing that I had to ask someone about (this dont count as a proxy cause they just told me what it means). You divided the intensity of the explosion by surface area of a sphere to get per m2 then said that the concrete reduced the energy by that amount.
Click to expand...
Okay, point by point.
  1. The intensity of the concrete means how much energy is required to fragment the slab volume in front of the target. When I divide this with surface area I’m applying a basic energy balance on the same blast wave as it passes through a layer. It's the same as what the explosion formula does; what really matters is the intensity of the concrete, since this is insignificant to the actual value of the explosion, because as you can see, the explosion passes through all the concrete in the scene.
  2. The concrete fragmentation is just the 0.03153% of the actual yield of the explosion. It doesn't matter how much concrete was, what actually matters is how much thick the concrete slab was and it was only 1.9 meter thick which doesn't stop the explosion yield. In this case the intensity required to destroy each square meter of concrete was insignificant compared to the transmitted intensity from the explosion. Basically, the energy flux of the explosion is partially absorbed by concrete layer and the rest is transmitted onward by conservation of energy.

LostLightt said:
If I'm right on that then its wrong cause the entire tower floor and the surroundings reduces the strength, not just a specific part of concrete.
Click to expand...
Nope, the explosion is not reduced equally by the entire floor and the surroundings, because the energy that reaches a point is determined by the propagation path of the shockwave. In this case is just the thickness which is already taken into account by the intensity.

LostLightt said:
U also have to do inverse square law as an extra i think cause it came like 10 meters from behind her so yeah.
Click to expand...
No the explosion came from 11 meters below the ground

LostLightt said:
Also I don't get it, why would you assume that concrete frag values decrease explosion values linearly. Thats just weird you're mixing different physics models so thats a big debunk
Click to expand...
Blast pressure depends on the rate of energy transfer from the explosive to the transmitting medium, which I solved with an simply approximation of the energy-balance between the two intensities. The rest of the slabs doesn't matter since the thickness is what absorbs the energy flux of the explosion, not the surroundings slabs and this doesn't even matter since the shockwave managed to pass through all the slabs and created the massive explosion that you see in the screen, which just confirms that the absorbed flux was insignificant to the explosion intensity.
 
Last edited:
6 PSI is actual a lowball because it's the bare minimum requirement for this feat. The entire tower is made out of reinforced concrete, and the tower starts tilting after the explosion meaning the structural support is damaged alongside the support beams and core walls being damaged beyond their load bearing capacity. This is way more than enough to justify a 6 PSI and can realistically go higher because for the tower to even begin tilting, one side is needed to structurally fail since concrete can't bend and deform plastically in the way steel can.

The actual correct PSI for this feat is 9 lol
 
Last edited:
CastoriceTheFifth said:
6 PSI is actual a lowball because it's the bare minimum requirement for this feat. The entire tower is made out of reinforced concrete, and the tower starts tilting after the explosion meaning the structural support is damaged alongside the support beams and core walls being damaged beyond their load bearing capacity. This is way more than enough to justify a 6 PSI and can realistically go higher because for the tower to even begin tilting, one side is needed to structurally fail since concrete can't bend and deform plastically in the way steel can.

The actual correct PSI for this feat is 9 lol
Click to expand...
pasting the comment i started writing hours ago is tuff ❤️‍🩹
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Honestly this could probably be solved without CGms since the OP’s thread is more so confusions with the calc rather than actual problems with the calc.
Click to expand...
nah jit my debunks aint confusions anymore, I was only confused about a few things but I got it now. I reckon a calc member should come re verify it
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
6 PSI is actual a lowball because it's the bare minimum requirement for this feat. The entire tower is made out of reinforced concrete, and the tower starts tilting after the explosion meaning the structural support is damaged alongside the support beams and core walls being damaged beyond their load bearing capacity. This is way more than enough to justify a 6 PSI and can realistically go higher because for the tower to even begin tilting, one side is needed to structurally fail since concrete can't bend and deform plastically in the way steel can.

The actual correct PSI for this feat is 9 lol
Click to expand...
I agree with this, idk if I remember 6 PSI being a lowball on Discord but it definitely is yeah
 
Is this just a disagreement over PSI ends? Seems fine to me if it explicitly breaks concrete though
 
Naito-desu said:
Is this just a disagreement over PSI ends? Seems fine to me if it explicitly breaks concrete though
Click to expand...
Basically contentions against the 6 PSI usage and something about explosion shouldnt be decreasing linearly

@Dark-Carioca a couple hours ago read through the OP and went to the calc comments to say theres nothing wrong with it, basically disagreeing with the thread. Do you also disagree with the thread?
 
Naito-desu said:
I don't see much need for this, so yeah, you can count me I guess.
Click to expand...
Can u prove an explosion decreases linearly as it busts through concrete when they're two different physics models.

Can u also prove that the inverse square law is accurate when the explosion comes from behind her and not above her.

Can u also prove that the concrete also got busted by 2 meters and not the whole thing being busted.
 
@LostLightt, do you want to continue this thread in hope to get more votes which would likely be hard atp or want to close it?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

CastoriceTheFifth
Chisato Nishikigi Vs Taiyo Yozakura (Lycoris Recoil Vs Mission: Yozakura Family)
Replies
7
Views
776
Kisaragi_Megumi
Kisaragi_Megumi
CastoriceTheFifth
David Martinez Vs Chisato Nishikigi (Cyberpunk: Edgerunners Vs Lycoris Recoil)
2 3
Replies
90
Views
4K
Apex_Predator_GX
Apex_Predator_GX
Padaruyos
Stats vs. Versatility (Part 1): Chisato Nishikigi vs Titanfall Pilot
Replies
1
Views
316
Padaruyos
Padaruyos
CastoriceTheFifth
  • Locked
Lycoris Recoil CRT but this verse is stronger than it looks?!?!
Replies
20
Views
1K
CastoriceTheFifth
CastoriceTheFifth
LostLightt
  • Locked
Lookism gets calc mogged
Replies
24
Views
2K
Powerscalingcat
Powerscalingcat
Back
Top