Conceptual Magic Question

[Kavliaris]

Let's say magic originates from a transcendent, universal concept. That would classify it as a Type 1 concept.

1. Low-rank spells derive relevant attributes from the concept and use them as components.
2. Meanwhile, mid-rank spells actually embody the concept itself.
3. Higher-rank spells, on the other hand, infuse the concept directly into the spell.

So, from what I understand, low-rank spells don't necessarily have conceptual manipulation. Is that true?
What about mid and high-rank spells? Even though they use conceptual manipulation, does the concept get 'downgraded' and become a 'type 2'?
Lastly, is the distinction between mid-rank and high-rank actually a real difference, or is it just word salad?

 

[Vietthai96]

1. isn't even conceptual or anything

2. Is vague, embodies means a lot of thing, it could be that the magic is the concept itself, or just extension of concept

3. Yeah

 

[Kavliaris]

2. Is vague, embodies means a lot of thing, it could be that the magic is the concept itself, or just extension of concept

For point 2, the spell embodies by 'representing' the concept. Is that representation the same as being an extension of the concept, thus making it merely a derivative? Not CM?

3. Yeah

Uh, which one?

 

[Vietthai96]

For point 2, the spell embodies by 'representing' the concept. Is that representation the same as being an extension of the concept, thus making it merely a derivative? Not CM?

Not CM, because this mean the spell is just an "avatar" of the concept

Uh, which one?

I mean point 3 the magic will have CM due to incorporated the concept into it

 

[Kavliaris]

Not CM, because this mean the spell is just an "avatar" of the concept

Can you elaborate on why? Representing a concept is at least telling that it's an extension and embodies its attributes, while many profiles have CM with even vaguer description or derivative powers.

 

[Vietthai96]

Can you elaborate on why? Representing a concept is at least telling that it's an extension and embodies its attributes, while many profiles have CM with even vaguer description or derivative powers.

Represent the concept =/= being the concept itself, you need additional proof to prove that respresent the concept = the concept

Having attributes of the concept =/= having the concept itself, what is this suppose attributes?

You only get CM hax from
1. You are the concept itself
2. You are capable of directly manipulating the concept itself
3. You can "wield" and "use" the concept. For example, A's power is a conceptual power, B's magic is conceptual magic, C's weapon is a conceptual weapon

 

[Kavliaris]

Represent the concept =/= being the concept itself, you need additional proof to prove that respresent the concept = the concept

Having attributes of the concept =/= having the concept itself, what is this suppose attributes?

By 'attribute,' I mean one specific characteristic from a broader concept. For example, chameleon camouflage, but the magic only extract the 'camouflage' ability without physically changing user body.

You only get CM hax from
1. You are the concept itself
2. You are capable of directly manipulating the concept itself

Yes, from the CM feat I gather these two versions are the most obvious, easy to understand, and explicit, so I have no issue with it.

Spoiler: CM feat

[No Distance Strike]

He swung his sword so fast that he ignored the concept of distance, thus drastically increasing the speed of his strike. Unfortunately, it was useless. Wang Tian cut the "no distance" concept of his technique, thus returning distance. In other words, Ji Lanfang's attack could no longer ignore distance and had to travel from point A to point B where Wang Tian.

'He is directly striking the law of [Names] that exists in phenomena.'

The [Arms], [Legs], [Torso], [Meridians], [Immortal Body], [Inner World], and all other [Names] that make up ■■■ are struck, and the blows surpassing the physical force of reality break ■■■ apart.

Even as I try to think, the very concept of nouns is gone.

No, at this level, it feels as though even the concept of 'letters' themselves has been erased.

[Names] have been defining the contours of the world, and with their disappearance, all boundaries in this world have become meaningless.

That's right.

The boundary between the Inner Sea and Outer Sea of Mount Sumeru blurs, and Mount Sumeru begins to collapse.

'I must have it. I must have it. I must...!'

And so, I—

Reach out my hand,

Plunge it into my own body,

And begin,

To [extract it].

Buduk.

Bududududuk...!

Budududuk...!

: : KUAAAAAAA!!! : :

It is a [concept].

I am extracting an entire [concept] from within me.

That concept is like a [tongue] that can speak, like a precious [heart], or even like [testicles] that one cannot imagine being without.

Budududududuk...!

My scream echoes within the world of vapor, and my willpower pushes back against the vaporous world.

At the same time, I manage to partially escape the world of vapor and return to the True Immortal Realm above.

"If it's a 'transaction,' I will comply. What does the Supreme Deity desire?"

: : Offer something you consider precious. Then, I shall grant you a name. : :

"...Understood."

Without hesitation, I offer what I hold in my hand.

Something that resembles a tongue, a heart, or perhaps even testicles.

A writhing thing that's formed of candle flame or glass, flies towards the being of vapor.

It is the [desire for names] that I had just extracted.

3. You can "wield" and "use" the concept. For example, A's power is a conceptual power, B's magic is conceptual magic, C's weapon is a conceptual weapon

in my opinion, conceptual derived power shouldn't sit at the same place as the other two CM feats.
It's like OP's first point. It's derived from a concept, but not all magic necessarily involves 'pushing interpretation' or 'imposing ideas.' But it's still conceptual power as the narrative said.