DBZ Kai Upgrade (3-B/3-A Cell)

[StarShooter80]

I don't agree with the "over time" method. There is no suggestion that Cell plans to fire off Multi-Galaxy level attacks every second of his life, for the rest of his life, once he is through destroying the Earth. If Android 16 had said that was exactly Cell's plan, then it'd be a fair way of calculating it, but right now it is too speculative.

So you prefer the 3-A rating instead?

 

[Damage3245]

So you prefer the 3-A rating instead?

No. The character's statements don't suggest it is a directly imminent thing. For all we know Cell, with nobody to stop him, would simply continue getting stronger indefinitely through training or other means and he'd destroy everything in his path.

I don't think there's a direct rating that we can get from this.

 

[StarShooter80]

16's statement is directly in reference to his power once he gains his perfect form, and for the Namekians it was just the power they sensed alone without even knowing who Cell was. There's no implication Cell would also start training himself overtime, or try to gain any further amp to accomplish destroying the universe.

 

[Damage3245]

16's statement is directly in reference to his power once he gains his perfect form, and for the Namekians it was just the power they sensed alone without even knowing who Cell was. There's no implication Cell would also start training himself overtime, or try to gain any further amp to accomplish destroying the universe.

There's no implication that he would instantly bust the Universe either. As I said, I don't think we can get a solid rating from this so that's my stance currently.

 

[StarShooter80]

I'll count your vote, but still I don't see the logic in discounting it being either an overtime or instant feat just because it's not implied to be either strictly, especially for a character with only 4-A and hypersonic+ travel speed stats currently

 

[DivineAura44]

There's no implication that he would instantly bust the Universe either.

Thats why the overtime rating exists? We don't know if he's gonna destroy the universe instantly or overtime but we know he possessed the capability. Therefore we take the lowest end by using his lifespan.

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Obviously disagree. No, I haven't read the arguments. I just want Cell to be permanently Solar System Level.

lol

 

[Plants_vs_zombies_fan101]

bump

 

[Plants_vs_zombies_fan101]

Bump

 

[Greatsage13th]

I agree

 

[Cropfist]

I disagree

 

[StarShooter80]

Both counted

 

[Overvoid69]

I don't agree with the "over time" method. There is no suggestion that Cell plans to fire off Multi-Galaxy level attacks every second of his life, for the rest of his life, once he is through destroying the Earth. If Android 16 had said that was exactly Cell's plan, then it'd be a fair way of calculating it, but right now it is too speculative.

The calc is the absolute minimum. Because it assumes he's firing off attacks his whole lifespan, but if he were to be taking breaks that would reduce the time he's spending on destroying the universe and give him a higher attack potency rating

I agree with the overtime method

 

[SwordLegendz01]

Agree with overtime

 

[AwkguyDB]

I agree with this blog

 

[Hiryu-Z]

I agree

 

[Hiryu-Z]

Bump

 

[Rex_Eckles]

Is it possible it's just referring to Cell destroying every planet in the universe overtime? I know there's one statement for the "collapse of the universe", but I'm just curious.

 

[Overvoid69]

bump

 

[AyOgUyS]

Couldn't the universe destruction statement just as likely refer to Cell flying around, nuking planet after planet, until eventually he wipes out most of the universe?

 

[Hiryu-Z]

Bump

 

[Just_Butchering]

The overtime end is honestly unnecessary. Is a pretty direct statement of his capability.
Also if funny how this derailed into the life span of Cell and the androids lmao.
Anyways, I agree with the Universe level upgrade.

 

[Gp972]

Fun fact: the first mention is also in the manga

 

[AyOgUyS]

Is it possible it's just referring to Cell destroying every planet in the universe overtime? I know there's one statement for the "collapse of the universe", but I'm just curious.

Couldn't the universe destruction statement just as likely refer to Cell flying around, nuking planet after planet, until eventually he wipes out most of the universe?

^

 

[AguilaR202]

Either way his base stats don’t scale to it unless he has proof of it being a casual non charged attack.

 

[Overvoid69]

^

Maybe if it said "all life in the universe", but all of them straight up say the "entire universe"

 

[AerrowStorm1]

I...literally showed they are, for one.

For two, Kai LITERALLY has "destroy the universe" statements for Freeza and we treated it as him being a rampager.

And yes, if you say "I'm going to kill that guy" and your explict strongest attack can only kill a few cells at a time, then I'm going to assume that's what you meant. Prior status and context can change a statement, my friend.

Again, pointing this out.

 

[AyOgUyS]

Maybe if it said "all life in the universe", but all of them straight up say the "entire universe"

Well "universe" within fiction often does not refer to all of space and time but rather only all matter within it. And given the statements don't give any timeframe, thus there's no proof he could do it in a short time. Cell has not shown the capability to destroy areas bigger than a solar system at a time. It's far more likely the statement means he's just gonna fly around nuking solar system after solar system until the entire universe is destroyed. There is no evidence his attacks will engulf the whole universe or anywhere close. To me it's far more reasonable to say he's destroying chunks at a time.

 

[Overvoid69]

Well "universe" within fiction often does not refer to all of space and time but rather only all matter within it

That's fine the crt is arguing 3-A/B not Low 2-C

And given the statements don't give any timeframe, thus there's no proof he could do it in a short time

From the AP page: 2.825e+92 Joules for destroying a Universe and 8.593e+68 Joules to be Multi Galaxy Level
You would need the overtime feat to be more then 3.2875596e+23 Seconds or 10,417,647,729,865,389 Years for it to stop being Multi Galaxy Level and drop to Galaxy Level, so it does not need to be a "short time" for it to be Multi Galaxy Level.

Cell has not shown the capability to destroy areas bigger than a solar system at a time

Toei Cell already has a at least Galaxy Level rating, so idk where ur getting this from

It's far more likely the statement means he's just gonna fly around nuking solar system after solar system until the entire universe is destroyed

Good thing he isn't capped at Solar

There is no evidence his attacks will engulf the whole universe or anywhere close. To me it's far more reasonable to say he's destroying chunks at a time.

Which still gives us a 3-B rating

 

[AyOgUyS]

That's fine the crt is arguing 3-A/B not Low 2-C

From the AP page: 2.825e+92 Joules for destroying a Universe and 8.593e+68 Joules to be Multi Galaxy Level
You would need the overtime feat to be more then 3.2875596e+23 Seconds or 10,417,647,729,865,389 Years for it to stop being Multi Galaxy Level and drop to Galaxy Level, so it does not need to be a "short time" for it to be Multi Galaxy Level.

Toei Cell already has a at least Galaxy Level rating, so idk where ur getting this from

Good thing he isn't capped at Solar

Which still gives us a 3-B rating

Alright well what is the maximum amount of matter Cell can destroy within a single attack? Because if he can only destroy X amount of area in an attack, "destroying the universe" just means he is destroying X over and over. Oh and I don't think sharing DNA doesn't mean equal lifespans. After all humans and chimpanzees have 99% similar DNA or something yet we have different lifespans and Cell has so many conflicting DNA from many different species within him that choosing to limit him to Namekian lifespans feels completely arbitrary.

 

[Overvoid69]

Alright well what is the maximum amount of matter Cell can destroy within a single attack? Because if he can only destroy X amount of area in an attack, "destroying the universe" just means he is destroying X over and over.

Doesn't work unless u can properly Cap his AP/DC which we can't.

Alright well what is the maximum amount of matter Cell can destroy within a single attack? Because if he can only destroy X amount of area in an attack, "destroying the universe" just means he is destroying X over and over. Oh and I don't think sharing DNA doesn't mean equal lifespans. After all humans and chimpanzees have 99% similar DNA or something yet we have different lifespans and Cell has so many conflicting DNA from many different species within him that choosing to limit him to Namekian lifespans feels completely arbitrary.

He would need to spend more then 10,417,647,729,865,389 Years of destroying the universe for the feat to drop down to Galaxy from Multi Galaxy. There is 0 evidence he can live this long or that he'd actually spend this ridiculous amount of time on destroying the universe.

 

[Planck69]

So far, all of the counters I have seen have been vague allusions to true immortality for Cell with no direct evidence at all, while OP has been one of the only ones here to supply solid numbers and scans.

I do doubt he'd be firing off attacks for the entirety of his lifetime, but that just means he's a lot higher than the bare minimum presented here. I'm ambivalent to how consistent this rating would be, but I just found the counter arguments very poor in comparison.

All that aside, plain Universe level is a more sensible reading of all the statements than "he's actually gonna be firing a galaxy busting attack every microsecond for the rest of his centuries long life".

 

[AyOgUyS]

Doesn't work unless u can properly Cap his AP/DC which we can't.

He would need to spend more then 10,417,647,729,865,389 Years of destroying the universe for the feat to drop down to Galaxy from Multi Galaxy. There is 0 evidence he can live this long or that he'd actually spend this ridiculous amount of time on destroying the universe.

Alright then I’ll concede on those points