Death (No, I'm Not a Human) profile restoration (TRASHED)

[Hawktaro]

Update: The Saṃsāra theory is discarded, ignore it

So, Death's profile was deleted as it lacked a CRT post, so here i am.

First, to get things clear: Death is actually real as a being and not a "hallucination," as fans theorize. Shes directly mentioned in the entire game, especially by the Prophet and the Cultists.

• As stated by her, Death is the creator of time and likely the creator of her realm, which appears to be a dimension or universe of infinite size, also meant to be a higher plane of existence. Theres also the afterlife.
• In Ending 9, the Miner finds a "hole" created by Death. According to him, the flow of time feels weird and compasses also goes crazy.​
• The Immortal Man's talks about the cycle of rebirth (Im sure its inspired by the Saṃsāra cycle) suggesting the universe has infinite realities and possibilities. Knowing the game's nature and philosophy (as well as the fact that Death is a real being), the Immortal Man's dialogues are very possibly true.​

This gives a Low 1-C tier, as Death is directly responsible for this circle. It is very likely that she is also the God of the verse, since she is worshipped as a supreme entity and considered "Salvation" for all.

Death is Omnipresent, not only because she embodies the concept itself but also due to her importance within the overall reality of the game.

• Abstract Existence (Type 1) = Whole embodiment of Death.
• Acausality (Types 1 & 4) = Creates and predates time, lives in a cosmic realm separate from the human side.
• Nonexistent Physiology (Nature Types 1 &; 3, All Aspects) = Death is nothing but also eternal, embodying a empty void.
• Conceptual Manipulation = Creation of time, cycle of rebirth and the afterlife.
• Immortality (Types 1 and 5)= Predation of time, embodiment of nothingness and eternity.
• Large Size (Type 10) = Comes from the cosmic realm and her impact on all of the game verse, ranging from the human side, to the alternate realities and the afterlife.

 

[Hawktaro]

@Antvasima @TWILIGHT-OP

 

[Re5yh]

@Antvasima @TWILIGHT-OP

Normal users can't ping staff. Also, I think I agree on the Tier

 

[Hawktaro]

Normal users can't ping staff. Also, I think I agree on the Tier

Oh i call them instead

 

[TWILIGHT-OP]

@Antvasima @TWILIGHT-OP

I do not have evaluation rights, my apologies.
Ask Thread mods on their msg wall to evaluate your crt.

 

[Antvasima]

@Gyozu @Greatsage13th

What do you think about this?

 

[Antvasima]

@LandonTheGuy

Maybe you can help as well?

 

[Greatsage13th]

So, Death's profile was deleted as it lacked a CRT post, so here i am.

First, to get things clear: Death is actually real as a being and not a "hallucination," as fans theorize. Shes directly mentioned in the entire game, especially by the Prophet and the Cultists.

• As stated by her, Death is the creator of time and likely the creator of her realm, which appears to be a dimension or universe of infinite size, also meant to be a higher plane of existence. Theres also the afterlife.
• In Ending 9, the Miner finds a "hole" created by Death. According to him, the flow of time feels weird and compasses also goes crazy.​
• The Immortal Man's talks about the cycle of rebirth (Im sure its inspired by the Saṃsāra cycle) suggesting the universe has infinite realities and possibilities. Knowing the game's nature and philosophy (as well as the fact that Death is a real being), the Immortal Man's dialogues are very possibly true.​

This gives a Low 1-C tier, as Death is directly responsible for this circle. It is very likely that she is also the God of the verse, since she is worshipped as a supreme entity and considered "Salvation" for all.

I can see Low 2-C and likely 2-A but not Low 1-C. She's not a dimension higher than everything else.

Death is Omnipresent, not only because she embodies the concept itself but also due to her importance within the overall reality of the game.

Not quite sure.

• Abstract Existence (Type 1) = Whole embodiment of Death.

We don't know if she is the embodiment of death or not. This requires her to flat out state she is.

• Acausality (Types 1 & 4) = Creates and predates time, lives in a cosmic realm separate from the human side.

Sure.

• Nonexistent Physiology (Nature Types 1 &; 3, All Aspects) = Death is nothing but also eternal, embodying a empty void.

Possibly. she also qualifies for existence erasure and void manipulation.

• Conceptual Manipulation = Creation of time, cycle of rebirth and the afterlife.

This needs mods to check out.

• Immortality (Types 1 and 5)= Predation of time, embodiment of nothingness and eternity.

Only Type 1. It is not shown that she is deathless.

• Large Size (Type 10) = Comes from the cosmic realm and her impact on all of the game verse, ranging from the human side, to the alternate realities and the afterlife.

She does not exhibit any large size.

 

[Greatsage13th]

@Gyozu @Greatsage13th

What do you think about this?

I evaluated the above. Concept hax and her tiering would require the attention of moderators to evaluate since it is quite literally above what I can affirm for what can be on the profile.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out.

@Duedate8898 @Mr._Propeller_Hat @AbaddonTheDisappointment @ActuallySpaceMan42

Are any of you willing to help out here please?

 

[Comiphorous]

Okay the first issue i'm seeing with the profile in the first place is assuming that death is in fact real in those scenes. We clearly see that the entire bit of death is based on a poster in the guy's house and none of that actually happened and in fact the player was outside being toasted by the sun before dying. That entire scene was based off the fact the player is a shut in who doesn't like other people and wants to be isolated.

I disagree with restoring the profile. Death is likely not a real person and is just a hallucination of the player while they're dying.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Okay the first issue i'm seeing with the profile in the first place is assuming that death is in fact real in those scenes. We clearly see that the entire bit of death is based on a poster in the guy's house and none of that actually happened and in fact the player was outside being toasted by the sun before dying. That entire scene was based off the fact the player is a shut in who doesn't like other people and wants to be isolated.

I disagree with restoring the profile. Death is likely not a real person and is just a hallucination of the player while they're dying.

I can't really agree with this considering the fact that multiple factions or individuals acknowledges Death's existence. The prophet for one, the visitors for two, the death cultists for three and the mushroom guy for last (calls her mycelium).

 

[Comiphorous]

I can't really agree with this considering the fact that multiple factions or individuals acknowledges Death's existence. The prophet for one, the visitors for two, the death cultists for three and the mushroom guy for last (calls her mycelium).

1. Fair.
2. When do the visitors mention her? I don't recall that.
3. A cult worshipping a deity would say a deity is real, regardless if they're actually correct or not.
4. The mushroom guy asks you to join him at the "mushroom festival" in "mushroom land" how is that person at all credible?

 

[Greatsage13th]

2. When do the visitors mention her? I don't recall that.

The immortal man for one. Superfek for 2, he flat out states that he can sense if someone was deathless, and he hints of a 'cosmic calamity' and putting Death on the same level as it.

3. A cult worshipping a deity would say a deity is real, regardless if they're actually correct or not.

Unlike a typical cult, their leader can sense Death's connection which lead them to the main protagonists' house

4. The mushroom guy asks you to join him at the "mushroom festival" in "mushroom land" how is that person at all credible?

Because a giant mushroom did end up spawning in the city in his ending.

 

[Comiphorous]

The immortal man for one.

Doesn't talk about death as a cosmic entity, and just a concept on his beliefs about what happens after death being reincarnation.

Superfek for 2, he flat out states that he can sense if someone was deathless, and he hints of a 'cosmic calamity' and putting Death on the same level as it.

That first part is unrelated to death as an entity, but alright. "Cosmic Calamity" likely is referring to the sun considering he said that after asking about a FEMA agent.

Unlike a typical cult, their leader can sense Death's connection which lead them to the main protagonists' house

And the death cult leader immediately threatens to kill the player if you refuse to house his peons, so that connection must mean jack to them really if he's willing to just throw out said "connection" immediately without thought.

Because a giant mushroom did end up spawning in the city in his ending.

Yeah that appears after the player eats a giant mysterious mushroom which makes new objects appear in their house. I don't think anything is visually reliable after they eat that mushroom.


Death's profile relies heavily on taking everything at face value and ignoring any signs that it may not be real.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Doesn't talk about death as a cosmic entity, and just a concept on his beliefs about what happens after death being reincarnation.

That first part is unrelated to death as an entity, but alright. "Cosmic Calamity" likely is referring to the sun considering he said that after asking about a FEMA agent.

And the death cult leader immediately threatens to kill the player if you refuse to house his peons, so that connection must mean jack to them really if he's willing to just throw out said "connection" immediately without thought.

Yeah that appears after the player eats a giant mysterious mushroom which makes new objects appear in their house. I don't think anything is visually reliable after they eat that mushroom.


Death's profile relies heavily on taking everything at face value and ignoring any signs that it may not be real.

Even if we don't take the above into account. What about the tunnels that lead to Death's domain, and actually meeting Death face to face before being sent off to an isolated land?

 

[Greatsage13th]

The house has the strong connection, it does not disprove anything even if the cult kills the protagonist.

Don't forget about the fact that the prophet was lead to the protagonist's house by Death herself.

 

[Comiphorous]

Even if we don't take the above into account. What about the tunnels that lead to Death's domain, and actually meeting Death face to face before being sent off to an isolated land?

Again, this is making the assumption everything is real. Right after being sent to "isolation land" the player wakes up being outside being cooked alive and dying by the sun. Both events cannot be real at the same time.

The house has the strong connection, it does not disprove anything even if the cult kills the protagonist.

If the house has the strong connection why would they threaten to burn the house down? Either they're lying or don't care, which wouldn't make sense for a cult.

Don't forget about the fact that the prophet was lead to the protagonist's house by Death herself.

The Prophet is like the one single piece of evidence i can say implies their existence being real, but most if not all of Death's statements and feats come from events that don't actually happen at all.

If you;
remove all the statements/feats from when the player talks to Death, since atp the player is outside dying and likely hallucinating.
remove the immortal man's statements, since he's talking about his belief in reincarnation.
and remove the pale man's statements, since he's talking about the sun and not death.

then I may hear you out on the profile. but a lot of the heavy lifting on that tiering comes from a really big assumption on the immortal man's statement and hallucination/fake scenario from the player.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Again, this is making the assumption everything is real. Right after being sent to "isolation land" the player wakes up being outside being cooked alive and dying by the sun. Both events cannot be real at the same time.

The ending where he's cooked to death happens when he kills too many people in a short period of time. The ending where he meets death required him not to do so. Hence, he was not burnt to death in the isolation ending.

If the house has the strong connection why would they threaten to burn the house down? Either they're lying or don't care, which wouldn't make sense for a cult.

They would refer to the area where the house stood rather than the house itself if that's the case.

The Prophet is like the one single piece of evidence i can say implies their existence being real, but most if not all of Death's statements and feats come from events that don't actually happen at all.

If you;
remove all the statements/feats from when the player talks to Death, since atp the player is outside dying and likely hallucinating.
remove the immortal man's statements, since he's talking about his belief in reincarnation.
and remove the pale man's statements, since he's talking about the sun and not death.

then I may hear you out on the profile.

Where did you find the player dying and hallucinating anyways? There's no ending where he dies under a hallucination.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Unless the game has a new update I haven't known about.

 

[Comiphorous]

The ending where he's cooked to death happens when he kills too many people in a short period of time. The ending where he meets death required him not to do so. Hence, he was not burnt to death in the isolation ending.

Considering they're depicted as outside in the sun, black as coal talking about feeling nothing I'd recon they're outside dying. Hell the very fact they're talking to death itself kind of implies they're dying in the first place.

They would refer to the area where the house stood rather than the house itself if that's the case.

But they didn't say that. They said the house itself, not the area.

Where did you find the player dying and hallucinating anyways? There's no ending where he dies under a hallucination.

Half the endings are some sort of hallucination or crazy person type shit. The main character isn't exactly mentally well by any stretch of the imagination. Seeing giant building sized mushrooms and angelic figures appearing out of nowhere definitely gives the vibes this guy sees wacky stuff.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Considering they're depicted as outside in the sun, black as coal talking about feeling nothing I'd recon they're outside dying. Hell the very fact they're talking to death itself kind of implies they're dying in the first place.

Show us the cutscene.

Half the endings are some sort of hallucination or crazy person type shit. The main character isn't exactly mentally well by any stretch of the imagination. Seeing giant building sized mushrooms and angelic figures appearing out of nowhere definitely gives the vibes this guy sees wacky stuff.

As fas as we can see, the only thing that remotely counts as a hallucination is the mushroom guy ending.

 

[Comiphorous]

Show us the cutscene.

You talk to death and go right into this cutscene starts by looking at a poster inside of the player's real house, talking about not feeling anything and being black as coal while laying in a field outside.

As fas as we can see, the only thing that remotely counts as a hallucination is the mushroom guy ending.

Because a woman resurrecting as an angel and crucifying the player isn't out of left field for a verse like this and is obviously real..?

I mean seriously the characters and the visitor origins are grounded characters (besides a single character, being the prophet). Having sht like that being real makes no sense when nothing else in the series is mystical in the slightest.

 

[Comiphorous]

Bottom line is, even if death was real (which I don’t think the entity is) the scaling just doesn’t sit right with me.

It uses statements from a character explaining their belief in reincarnation as proof of infinite timelines and makes the assumption that where they talk to death is infinite just based off vibes instead of any real feat.

 

[Greatsage13th]

You talk to death and go right into this cutscene starts by looking at a poster inside of the player's real house, talking about not feeling anything and being black as coal while laying in a field outside.

The same house which was in the isolated land? This does not prove that meeting Death was a hallucination. How does it prove that?

Because a woman resurrecting as an angel and crucifying the player isn't out of left field for a verse like this and is obviously real..?

That is not a hallucination. We don't even have proof of that it was. A baby can be born in less than 4 days mind you by the same woman that looked like the angel.

I mean seriously the characters and the visitor origins are grounded characters (besides a single character, being the prophet). Having sht like that being real makes no sense when nothing else in the series is mystical in the slightest.

You what? You thought this series was not supernatural?

 

[Greatsage13th]

Bottom line is, even if death was real (which I don’t think the entity is) the scaling just doesn’t sit right with me.

It uses statements from a character explaining their belief in reincarnation as proof of infinite timelines and makes the assumption that where they talk to death is infinite just based off vibes instead of any real feat.

True, but the lowball for Death would still be Low 2-C regardless due to being the sole reason that time exists in the 1st place.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Could you prove that the setting is actually grounded with no supernatural stuff?

 

[Hawktaro]

I can see Low 2-C and likely 2-A but not Low 1-C

The dialogue is based on the Samsara Cycle. It is the the continuous, beginningless cycle of birth, life, death, and rebirth. It is theoretical idea of parallel realities through the idea of multiple realms of existence. The Immortal Man suggest there are infinite circles, infinite realities, infinite universes. This is exactly the purpose of Low 1-C.

She's not a dimension higher than everything else.

Her realm is literally meant to be a higher plane.

Not quite sure.

Its Death itself, directly affecting the Samsara as a whole. Death is everywhere and claims everyone.

She does not exhibit any large size.

Large Size is not only by appearance. She directly impacts the cycle, manifesting everywhere in the Cosmos, plus the higher plane i mentioned before.

 

[Hawktaro]

Considering they're depicted as outside in the sun, black as coal talking about feeling nothing I'd recon they're outside dying. Hell the very fact they're talking to death itself kind of implies they're dying in the first place.

But they didn't say that. They said the house itself, not the area.

Half the endings are some sort of hallucination or crazy person type shit. The main character isn't exactly mentally well by any stretch of the imagination. Seeing giant building sized mushrooms and angelic figures appearing out of nowhere definitely gives the vibes this guy sees wacky stuff.

I'm pretty sure the mushroom is an allusion to a nuclear bomb.

 

[Hawktaro]

Could you prove that the setting is actually grounded with no supernatural stuff?

The series is meant to be weird, thats why everyone looks uncanny and off.

Bottom line is, even if death was real (which I don’t think the entity is)

The game likely wants you to think you're surrounded by lunatics (especially the cultists) until you see her in person during Ending 9. I really don't see the point in her being a hallucination if even the Pale Man and the Prophet (who's the most sane character in the game) acknowledge her existence. The reason why the cult leader was so interested in your house is because of Death; that's why he was able to sense her presence.

 

[LandonTheGuy]

I'm fine with this, but i don't understand the large size stat

 

[Comiphorous]

The game likely wants you to think you're surrounded by lunatics (especially the cultists) until you see her in person during Ending 9. I really don't see the point in her being a hallucination if even the Pale Man and the Prophet (who's the most sane character in the game) acknowledge her existence. The reason why the cult leader was so interested in your house is because of Death; that's why he was able to sense her presence.

pale man: doesn’t even talk about death as an entity. I already talked about this. Death as a concept fun fact, exists outside of a supposed entity.

Prophet: yeah he’s solid proof I suppose.

Cultists: and despite this interest he threatens to burn the house down and kill you. Clearly not that interested.

 

[Hawktaro]

pale man: doesn’t even talk about death as an entity. I already talked about this. Death as a concept fun fact, exists outside of a supposed entity.

Some of his dialogues indicates he is aware of her as a being. There's even a theory that Death is the one who sent the Visitors.

Cultists: and despite this interest he threatens to burn the house down and kill you. Clearly not that interested.

? That was just a threat, nothing more. His interest is on Death's presence, not on the building.

 

[Hawktaro]

I'm fine with this, but i don't understand the large size stat

I explained it already. The impact throughout the entire cycle, higher dimensional plane, etc.

 

[Comiphorous]

Some of his dialogues indicates he is aware of her as a being. There's even a theory that Death is the one who sent the Visitors.

Am I missing something? None of his dialogue even imply he knows of death’s existence. And, couldn’t care less what a theory says. Profiles shouldn’t use theories.

? That was just a threat, nothing more. His interest is on Death's presence, not on the building.

Yeah a threat to burn the thing down that Death supposedly has a connection to. Deadass it shows the guy is just a crazy person.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

The existance of Death is not something 100% confirmed and many people disagree with such. I really would prefer if it didn't had a profile at all

 

[Hawktaro]

Am I missing something? None of his dialogue even imply he knows of death’s existence. And, couldn’t care less what a theory says. Profiles shouldn’t use theories

? I didn't link his profile to the theory, i just talked about it. And yeah you're missing a lot. The game is not going to throw everything at your face, you need to connect the dots.

Yeah a threat to burn the thing down that Death supposedly has a connection to. Deadass it shows the guy is just a crazy person

?? Again: Hes interested in the entity, the shelter was for his peons. burning the house down is a consequence, just like they did to the rest of people they crossed.

 

[Hawktaro]

The existance of Death is not something 100% confirmed and many people disagree with such. I really would prefer if it didn't had a profile at all

You just ignored everything i said earlier.

 

[Comiphorous]

? I didn't link his profile to the theory, i just talked about it. And yeah you're missing a lot. The game is not going to throw everything at your face, you need to connect the dots.

But you won’t tell me the interactions you’re talking about hmmm? The ones I’ve been shown so far have been complete misunderstanding of the context of the interactions.z

?? Again: Hes interested in the entity, the shelter was for his peons. burning the house down is a consequence, just like they did to the rest of people they crossed.

He’s interested in the house and says that it has a connection to the entity.

He threatens to burn said house down that has a connection to the entity he worships the second you refuse to house his peons. Deadass it’s not that hard to connect the dots that he’s completely full of shit about what he’s talking about.

 

[Hawktaro]

But you won’t tell me the interactions you’re talking about hmmm? The ones I’ve been shown so far have been complete misunderstanding of the context of the interactions.z

"I'm just telling you what I was told.

That's all.

Do you feel it? Death creeping closer and closer?"

- Later we find Death down on your house. Coincidence?

"Everything's been decided for us.

A blessing, wouldn't you say?

Or do you want to fix it all by yourself?"

- This decision is death, just like the cultists worship her as salvation. Fixing it all by ourselves is killing everyone we let in.

He’s interested in the house and says that it has a connection to the entity.

He threatens to burn said house down that has a connection to the entity he worships the second you refuse to house his peons. Deadass it’s not that hard to connect the dots that he’s completely full of shit about what he’s talking about

He only threatens us if we ignore him, and he doesn't even burn our house at all. He's clearly bluffing and trying intimidation. He didn't say they have a connection; he thinks Death has taken a liking to our house because many have died there.

"Some were burned. Some dragged out and executed.

Death's taken a liking to you, yesss"

I dont think hes full of shit if the things he say actually happens later in the game.

"Death spoke to me not long ago. She hopes to meet you when the time comes.

She may offer you a place to hide. From everything. ...Even from the end itself."

- Maybe it's just a coincidence again? Yeah.