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A soul is something that makes a being what it is, meaning it is the essence (core identity) of the being, making it a type 3 concept. Thus, manipulation of a soul should also be conceptual type 3 manipulation, which would apply to resistance too, and every character would receive unconventional resistance to both soul and concept type 3 manipulations.



And now, some additions before I apply the stuff I proposed in this CRT.

Since the Afterlife is the world beyond death, beings who have ascended to it don’t age and can’t die. The only way for them to end is erasing them or turning them into nothing, which would give everyone in the Afterlife immortality type 1 and 5.




Akuto sai reconstructed the entire world (afterlife) in digital form, which should grant him Information Manipulation Type 2.




The void body will be, Acausality (Type 4) Transduality (Type 1) & Nonexistent Physiology (Type 2 - All Aspects, Becoming an entity of the Anti-Universe, a place where all stories end, involves not only stories but the being itself going beyond zero (nonexistence) and becoming a void. Gaining a void body is the first step toward becoming a being not of this world. Data exists as imaginary numbers, a space without time, a place where physical laws have ended, beyond causality and beyond reality. Stories and words do not merely define reality; they also define voidness, as even a void universe without stories still has a definition that allows it to be described as a story and a concept. The Anti-Universe, however, is a void within a void, a void without words. Thus, it cannot even be defined as a void because that would give it a definition, placing it beyond the qualities of existence and nonexistence.)




Currently, only Hiroshi Miwa is recognized as the new Law of Identity, but this is incorrect. It was not Hiroshi Miwa alone who became the new Law of Identity; rather, it was the hero who assumed this role, the hero who simultaneously is Hiroshi, Boichiro, Kento, and the author, sharing a single, unified self/existence with no distinction among them. Therefore, Boichiro and Kento should also acquire the Law of Identity key. All three would share each other’s abilities and a high 1A rating, since, ultimately, they are one and the same at the end.
One thing was left behind in the void universe. Just one thing. “Am I... am I left behind?” The voice of the hero. It was Hiroshi, and Boichiro, and Kento, and the author too. “Yes. As you were told already, you will be left behind,” the Law of Identity answered.

She’d looked like a goddess of salvation, but she was a cruel goddess as well.

“Why?!”

A scream.

A scream of pain.

He’d half-expected it. But he’d hoped there would be salvation for him too. That hope was betrayed.

“You must leave behind stories as stories. So that the next souls can go to that place as well.”

He shook his head, as if he found this impossible to believe.

“That’s so cruel...!”

“The concept of ‘cruel’ is only something you feel because you view things through stories. You will simply start over from the beginning. In the next instant, you’ll go to the void universe, and then you will shift to the faceless universe, and then the gravity universe. Though it may take tens of thousands of years.”

“Don’t say that! Am I starting the story over from scratch?”

“There’s nothing that can be done about it. Because you are you.”

“Because I am me? I can’t escape from that.”

“That is called the Law of Identity.”

“I’m going to become the Law of Identity?”

“You will be the next Law of Identity. If you are next to be saved, it will be when you become the guide for the next group of people. When you lead the stories that are trapped by gravity to lightness.”

Agree: @ExcelsisBerny Vietthai96
Neutral
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Disagree: @ExcelsisBerny, Vietthai96 and Deonment on type 3 concept
 
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I agree with everything except the type 3 concept soul. I’m not sure why you’re arguing that it’s a concept. The soul is simply what allows you to distinguish yourself from data, nothing more.
 
type 3 concept soul. I’m not sure why you’re arguing that it’s a concept. The soul is simply what allows you to distinguish yourself from data, nothing more.
Because essence is what we call a concept in vsbw, while something being called a concept should not be. From the scan, it is also what makes you you, which is what the essence/whatness of a being is.
 
Because essence is what we call a concept in vsbw, while something being called a concept should not be. From the scan, it is also what makes you you, which is what the essence/whatness of a being is.

What makes you you is the law of identity. The law of identity appears and “takes hold” in an individual if that individual has a body and a soul.

It is not the soul per se. The soul is only a step that allows the law of identity to manifest.
 
What makes you you is the law of identity. The law of identity appears and “takes hold” in an individual if that individual has a body and a soul.

It is not the soul per se. The soul is only a step that allows the law of identity to manifest.
There is a difference between a law that states you are you and the thing that actually makes you you (your whatness), and the scans say it is the soul itself, not the law of identity.
 
There is a difference between a law that states you are you and the thing that actually makes you you (your whatness), and the scans say it is the soul itself, not the law of identity.

You are not understanding what Bouichirou is saying.

I repeat, what determines that you are you is the law of identity. The soul is simply a step that allows a person’s individual identity to develop.

For example, the Computer Gods have no soul and no body, and therefore they have no identity.

You need the soul in order to determine that you are you, because without a soul you are no different from data.

(That's literally why it's said that the Faceless Universe allows the Law of Identity to exist in the first place)

"But in the next instant, there's no telling who's who. However, what should be a single being is instead filled with a voice inside. Who! Who! Who! In the Faceless Universe, there is a single instant of 'You', followed by an eternity of terrible 'Who!'."

"When another is found, they cease to be another. However, others make you realize, whether you want to or not, that you yourself exist."

Akuto whispered to himself as he gathered his thoughts. And then he had a realization, and let out a sharp gasp.

"The awfulness felt when you realized that you are you... The Law of Identity!"

When he realized this, another voice appeared.

"The Faceless Universe allows the Law of Identity to exist."
 
Agree with what Bern does, but on the matter of concept stuff, in addition to what berny is saying, I'll just quote what I said last time this topic came up
That clearly isn't referring to concepts in the way we use them, considering it specifically says "but we still need to treat it as something real.", which indicates that it's talking about concepts-as-ideas, and not concepts as Forms. In addition to how it can be developed, which if you want to argue that the soul is a concept rather than a sense of self, would be another knock against the idea that it is form like given that it can somehow come into existence not just after its particular, but as a result of it's particular existing.

Tldr; No this isn't the type of concept we use for concept manip, this is clearly using concept in the sense of an idea, and even if it were somehow a concept, it wouldn't even be type 3, it would be what the old type 4 was
So mark me down as disagree on concept manip also
 
I would like to add one thing.

I think the Void Body could qualify for Acausality type 5.

The Void Body does not operate within a different acausality system; rather, it transcends causality as a whole, such that the component that defines what exists under a causal system (narrative) ceases to exist on a conceptual level, which is why it constitutes “salvation" in the first place.

Also, there are no anti feats for that, so well, I think it's fair.
 
I'll just quote what I said last time this topic came up

So mark me down as disagree on concept manip also
The argument is different this time. Yeah, when they talked about concepts, they were talking about an idea. While a soul exists and is independent of the mind, it is what makes a being what it is. The argument isn't about it being called a concept but rather a soul being used interchangeably with whatness. Type 3 concepts can be dependent on their particular; in that context, it wouldn't count as high-godly regen. And lastly, being 's self (essential being) and sense of self are different things.
I would like to add one thing.

I think the Void Body could qualify for Acausality type 5.

The Void Body does not operate within a different acausality system; rather, it transcends causality as a whole, such that the component that defines what exists under a causal system (narrative) ceases to exist on a conceptual level, which is why it constitutes “salvation" in the first .

Also, there are no anti feats for that, so well, I think it's fair.
It is possible or not due Acausality type 5 being strict due to requiring a statement or evidence of being unchangeable.
 
I still disagree with that conceptual manipulation type 3 argument. It is honestly a reach and also useless in a battleboarding scenario.

It is possible or not due Acausality type 5 being strict due to requiring a statement or evidence of being unchangeable.

I would say that is an incredibly stupid requirement, considering how literally EVERY acausal type 5 non tier 0 character is not unchangeable or immutable in the true sense of the word, but rather exhibits a “relative immutability” which, since it is not an absolutist term, ends up losing its meaning and amounts to basically nothing.

The ability’s description is to transcend the causal system, and that is exactly what the void body does. It is not independent of causality; rather, conceptually it cannot exist under any system of cause and effect in the verse because it's devoid of the property that allows causality in the first place.

Note: Being completely independent of space, time, laws, or similar forces does not make you completely independent of causality without the relationship between these forces and causality being clarified, with it only being considered as evidence for an irregular relationship with causality otherwise
 
I would say that is an incredibly stupid requirement, considering how literally EVERY acausal type 5 non tier 0 character is not unchangeable or immutable in the true sense of the word, but rather exhibits a “relative immutability” which, since it is not an absolutist term, ends up losing its meaning and amounts to basically nothing.
The ability’s description is to transcend the causal system, and that is exactly what the void body does. It is not independent of causality; rather, conceptually it cannot exist under any system of cause and effect in the verse because it's devoid of the property that allows causality in the first place.
Ok, can you write the justification with scans needed? I will add it to the proposal.
 
The argument is different this time. Yeah, when they talked about concepts, they were talking about an idea. While a soul exists and is independent of the mind, it is what makes a being what it is. The argument isn't about it being called a concept but rather a soul being used interchangeably with whatness. Type 3 concepts can be dependent on their particular; in that context, it wouldn't count as high-godly regen. And lastly, being 's self (essential being) and sense of self are different things.
I disagree, it reads as the soul being the self (which can quite easily be said to make someone who they are), the fact that it's directly stated to be in relation to the Law of Identity, whose nature is that you are who you are, only reinforces that idea in my mind
It isn't a concept that defines a person's metaphysical existence, but their subjective one
 
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