Game Theory and Arceus

[The_real_cal_howard]

So, if Game Theory just happens to be right (and since speculation does happen on this site, it could be possible) and that each pokemon game is a seperate universe, and I mean each copy SOLD, what would that make Arceus, and possibly the Creation Trio and Lake Trio? Just out of curiosity

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Apparently 100 million pokemon games have been sold.

 

[SuperGokuMan]

Game Theory is always wrong.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

On the incredibly off chance that he is right, how strong would they be. That's the question I'm asking.

 

[SuperGokuMan]

2-B/Multiverse level.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Would that Arceus be able to contend with Zeed? Not that I'm implying that there should be a therad, because I'm not, but again, out of curiosity.

 

[SuperGokuMan]

What's a therad?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

My bad lol. And I'm usually the one to go back to check their grammar. The word I meant to use was thyroid, I mean thread. I feel so embarassed.

 

[Illuminati478]

he isn't always wrong, thats just mean to say, especially when he is speaking about stuff that is actually canonical like this, nintendo did elude to this very strongly in the game itself, so its actually very hard to be wrong about it. every copy sold is a parallel universe to all the other copies as eluded in the lore, however every copy has the potential of having its own Arceus, either via nintendo event or gamesharking it, so Arceus itself isn't that special if there is an equally strong version of him in each game, if there was only one Arceus then it could have been claimed to have been Multiverse level, but as it won't be the case, he isn't///

 

[KennethTL]

Each game is not a parallel universe. There is nothing backing that up and it is just silly speculation. Each pokemon game is simply the same game so any body can play it. I think people take this things to serious. Do you want only one copy of the game to be made and thats it?

 

[KennethTL]

Arceus is already multi universal, and is possible that he could be multiversal due to ORAS hinting multiple universes. But there is not enough information or feats to put him at that level now.

 

[Illuminati478]

its hinted at the game lore...you can't really deny that...obviously they are making more copies so more people can buy it, but they used it additionally in Omega ruby and Alpha Sapphire that each copy (aside from being a copy for people to play) is a parallel universe....it is implied in the game itself...

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

its hinted at the game lore...you can't really deny that...obviously they are making more copies so more people can buy it, but they used it additionally in Omega ruby and Alpha Sapphire that each copy (aside from being a copy for people to play) is a parallel universe....it is implied in the game itself...

Source?

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

On another note, why are we so sure this is the same Arceus anyway?

 

[Untedbear]

Hasn't it already been proven that Pokemon has multiple universes? In Pokemon Black the NPC's refer to Pokemon White as a parallel universe and vice versa. In Diamond and Pearl Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, and Arceus all have their own universe that they live in.

 

[Illuminati478]

its hinted at the game lore...you can't really deny that...obviously they are making more copies so more people can buy it, but they used it additionally in Omega ruby and Alpha Sapphire that each copy (aside from being a copy for people to play) is a parallel universe....it is implied in the game itself...

Source?

its in the game, if you played from start to finish you would have known that...there is literally an in game non-DLC character that explains how there is a version of Omega Ruby is different because of an event 3000 years ago (in-universe obviously) obviously refering to the original pokemon Ruby, also the deus ex machina mechanism that helps save the world in the game (by shifting the meteor to a different parralel universe) is called (by the characters in the game) a Link cable, now if your old as i am you would know that a link cable was what connected between different gameboy counsles in order to trade and do other stuff...

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

@Illuminati478

Thanks, just rewatched the video.A bit scatterbrained at the moment...

Oh. And by source I meant like a scan or link. Sorry for my blunder. I found this in the process of my search if aanybody's interested.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Hasn't it already been proven that Pokemon has multiple universes? In Pokemon Black the NPC's refer to Pokemon White as a parallel universe and vice versa. In Diamond and Pearl Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, and Arceus all have their own universe that they live in.

Yes but if this theoretical scenario is true, then there would be far more Parallel Universes than we thought. As for in Pokemon Black, well I don't know about that.

 

[KennethTL]

There are more parralel universes. But saying that each copy of the game is a different universe is just ridiculous. There is nothing supporting that. Remember that is just a theory made by a fan, and nothing else. And of course im not denying that other parallel universes exist.

 

[Illuminati478]

i will refer you back again to what i said :"also the deus ex machina mechanism that helps you save the world in the game (by shifting the meteor to a different parralel universe) is called (by the characters in the game) a Link cable, now if your old as i am you would know that a link cable was what connected between different gameboy counsles in order to trade and do other stuff..."

 

[ImagoDesattrolante]

Multiversal Arceus? This looks interesting. Though a Game Theory isn't really meant for a VS Debate, but it could work, I suppose.

 

[Untedbear]

Multiversal Arceus? This looks interesting. Though a Game Theory isn't really meant for a VS Debate, but it could work, I suppose.

I don't think we should use Game Theory in a VS Debate. I mean, part of debating fictional characters is to understand that real world logic doesn't always apply to them. Game Theory on the other hand, brings everything to the real world and assesses them that way.

If we were to use Game Theory as a legit source then Sonic can't pass the speed of sound, Link would die everytime he uses the hookshot, Ezio would barely be able to climb a wall, and minecraft diamond armor would shatter to a basic sword swing.

 

[ImagoDesattrolante]

Multiversal Arceus? This looks interesting. Though a Game Theory isn't really meant for a VS Debate, but it could work, I suppose.

I don't think we should use Game Theory in a VS Debate. I mean, part of debating fictional characters is to understand that real world logic doesn't always apply to them. Game Theory on the other hand, brings everything to the real world and assesses them that way.
If we were to use Game Theory as a legit source then Sonic can't pass the speed of sound, Link would die everytime he uses the hookshot, Ezio would barely be able to climb a wall, and minecraft diamond armor would shatter to a basic sword swing.

Basically this.

 

[Verivici]

But this IS kinda hinted at, so it should at least be mentioned on his page.

He doesn't really apply real world logic in this paticular video, I don't think.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

But this IS kinda hinted at, so it should at least be mentioned on his page.

It is actually. It's why he's "at least" Multi-Universal (though I would have preferred it if they set it to Multi-Universal, likely higher but that's just me).

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

well OBD has already put him at Multiverse(not like it matters here.) so some agree he is. but it depends how admins decipher it.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

well OBD has already put him at Multiverse(not like it matters here.) so some agree he is. but it depends how admins decipher it.

OBD's system is different from ours. In their case: Multi-Universe=Multiverse while we separate the two.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

well OBD has already put him at Multiverse(not like it matters here.) so some agree he is. but it depends how admins decipher it.

OBD's system is different from ours. In their case: Multi-Universe=Multiverse while we separate the two.

ah..i see.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

The ORAS games arent the only hints of a multiverse. The anime has it too (Im not sure if it's accepted as canon or not here but i'll still mention it)

The anime has shown or stated to have multiple different universes/worlds in it OTHER than the universes that the trio and Arceus live in. There's the universe we're the unown come from, the Togepi Paradise which is an alternate dimension where Togepi live in, the spirit world, the dimensions where the lake trio reside in, but most of all in the current series, XY, there's reflection cave where Ash and Pikachu go to an alternate universe called the Mirror World where all the XY characrers have completely opposite personalities to that of regular ashes universe and the alternate clemont from the Mirror World brings up a legend about Reflection Cave that states for every mirror the cave has within it's boundaries is actually a portal to an alternate world...


And if we count other game adapations like Pokepark, Mystery Dungeon, composite wise, the number of universes grows even more.

Im not really sure if this helps but shouldnt this somewhat bump him up more? Not neccedarily to multiversal lvl but maybe casually multi universal? Or even low multiversal?

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Multiverse level requires at least 1001 universes.

As long as there aren't any solid proof for a set number of universes (Not just "a lot") I don't think he should be upgraded.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

shouldnt pokemon have nearly that many? IIRC a seprate timeline counts as a universe and assuming if Time in the pokemon world goes on forever, would that count or no?

 

[LordXcano]

Well, as said above there'd be multiple Arceus(es) with this, so it wouldn't really yield a difference. Plus how many game copies were sold is a pretty arbitary number and would be subject to change all the time.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Arceus, Palkia, Dialga and Giratina are the god tiers of the verse. There's no such thing as multiple to them. Technically, they are the same.

 

[LordXcano]

Do we have proof that they are all omnipresent though? It seems a bit weird for the same Arceus to be fighting itself.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

they each represent the concepts of existence such as Time Space and Antimatter, as well as embody it. Arceus created and transcends all 3


if anything, if there really was multiple versions of them, they'd all just be clones. Like how Dialga could technically create Temporal clones of itself like it did in Mystery Dungeon for example. There's no such thing as a completely different version of the god pokemon

 

[FictionalBlade101]

Arceus, Palkia, Dialga and Giratina are the god tiers of the verse. There's no such thing as multiple to them. Technically, they are the same.

What about Hoopa and the Lake trio? Hoopa WAS able to make the creation trio it's slaves in the movie, being so strong that it required Arceus's power to put it down inside the prisom bottle. And the fact that Hoopa's rings can open portals to different universes and dimensions, even realms like the temporal and spatial realms where Time and Space as a whole flow in throughout the whole verse, should kinda suggest there's only one Hoopa in the pokemonverse, not multiple. Same for the Lake trio since they govern knowledge, emotion and willpower

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Mind control=/= attack potency. Hoopa's mind control is just extremely powerful

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Hoopa is not a god tier. His strength lies in his hax whilst physically he's around town level. As Dragonmasterxyz stated, Hoopa just has good mind control.

 

[FictionalBlade101]

True but the fact that Arceus's power was needed to seal it away should give hints about how powerful it is. And didn't Hoopa forcefully summon the trio from their own realms? He'd need more than just good mind control in order to do something like that. Forcing the trio out of their realms with his power seems to rival the power of the Red Chains team galactic used to overpower Dialga and Palkia and those chains hold portions of Arceus's own energy in it that can even open holes to the Spatial and Temporal universes

 

[FictionalBlade101]

Also didnt Hoopa one shot the shiny black Mega Rayquaza who physically overpowered Giratina? And Giratina's capable of surparsing both Dialga and Palkia in strength that can tear apart the frabric of the universe