Gunvolt Vs Yhwach

[Hellscream]

Prevasion is an automatic intangibility defense that turns GV into electrons. It costs part of a resource called EP, the same resource as his Flashfield each time its used to evade an attack, hence "Pre"vasion. By default, he's practically unhittable. As for EP, that resource is rechargable, either on its own, or manually by Gunvolt himself. If he chooses the latter, all of his EP is instantly restored to its absolute max. Combine this with Prevasion, and Gunvolt can stall out anyone if he really wanted to. In character however, Gunvolt does not rely on Prevasion and actively tries to dodge attacks, but would also want to make sure that his EP is topped. Prevasion is disabled when Gunvolt uses his Flashfield, his main attack.

When he is out of EP, he goes into Overheat state, for a second or two, he becomes vulnerable and cannot use his Flashfield or Prevasion, making him vulnerable to any normal attack. However, in character, Gunvolt tries to keep his EP at full at all times via instant recharge and Split Second if needed, the both being spammable





And in Gunvolt 3, he gets even more things he can Prevade, such as Soul / Time / Space / Death / Concept killing attacks (Seven Slashes and Zero Blade), EE (Damnatio and Zero Blade), 2-A Power Nullification and Stats Reduction (Greed Snatcher does this to Moebius lol), and probably more I can't remember

Bleach has layered intangibility, so i don't think that's gonna do much
unless if their intangibility is even more layered.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Hellscream what if two yhwachs fought each other?

 

[TauanVictor]

Can Gunvolt interact with NEP?

 

[Hellscream]

I just read that the killing of concepts in their verse are type 3 concepts, while yhwach negates type 2 concept manipulation, so that's not gonna affect yhwach.

 

[Hellscream]

Can Gunvolt interact with NEP?

That's yhwach with sternritter abilities, this is soul king yhwach with the almighty, but without sternritters abilities.

 

[Smashtwig]

So it's not accepted that he resists 4-d power absorption?

Boutta get it accepted right now (or ASAP) lol

The potency of soul hax is not described through it's range, it's done by layers now, the 2-a is just its range of what it affects, and im pretty sure some of the bleach fanatics would be able to give you the exact amount of layers, im not sure exact how many it is either. basic human< shinigami < lieutenant < captain < head captain < aizen stuff like that.

I see- GV's resistance on the other hand is just 2-A in quality so it should be fine. I can't find it on the Shinigami abilities though. Unless you're gonna argue that EVERY single character has 2-A EE passively

In bleach, any basic quincy has soul EE hax.

I understand that at least, but GV's Prevasion is EE in general, doesn't really matter if it's specifically targeted at the soul or whatever- all of it would be gone, including the Soul- on a 2-A level, and GV just Prevades it. Damnatio Memorie would upscale from Tenjian's Soul killing anyways.

Is it stated to kill the concept of souls? and is it on his profile? even then, it'd have to be as layered as bleach for it be effective.

It's on the profile, yep- if it isn't it's probably because I just put "Prevaded Tenjian's Seven Slashes" and u can just look at Tenjian for that, either way, doesn't matter due to the above

Yhwach resisted Conceptual EE, and yhwach has 4-d powernull so that's not gonna do anything.

Power Null doesn't work, Prevaded (again Greed Snatcher)

Bleach has layered intangibility, so i don't think that's gonna do much
unless if their intangibility is even more layered.

I don't see how another person being intangible means that it nullifies the intangibility of another person, but yeah GV's Prevasion is actually kind of layered, certain Prevasions are straight up better than others.

 

[Smashtwig]

Ey reload ur page i made edits

 

[LordGinSama]

I don't see how another person being intangible means that it nullifies the intangibility of another person, but yeah GV's Prevasion is actually kind of layered, certain Prevasions are straight up better than others

What's the scaling chain look like? Also Yhwach can negate type 2 concepts so Gunvolt's type 3 conceptual manipulation wouldn't be much of an issue.



Also what TheSmashor said about Gunvolt's regeneration being superior to Yhwach's Mid-Godly negation is also false, as Gerard's Regeneration is based on a Type 3 concept, that being fear and hope. Yhwach can easily negate Gerard's Mid-Godly regeneration is which based on type 3 concepts, and Yhwach can even nullify type 2 concepts coming from Ichibei so nullifying Gunvolt's arsenal shouldn't be an issue unless if Gunvolt's resistances cover nullification that is >>>> Conceptual power nullification (Type 2.)

 

[LordGinSama]

I just read that the killing of concepts in their verse are type 3 concepts, while yhwach negates type 2 concept manipulation, so that's not gonna affect yhwach.

Literally this.


Type 2 concepts >>>>> Type 3 concepts.

 

[LordGinSama]

GV nulls back GG

Conceptual power null (Type 2.) >>>> Gunvolt's type 3.

 

[Smashtwig]

Also what TheSmashor said about Gunvolt's regeneration being superior to Yhwach's Mid-Godly negation is also false, as Gerard's Regeneration is based on a Type 3 concept, that being fear and hope. Yhwach can easily negate Gerard's Mid-Godly regeneration is which based on type 3 concepts, and Yhwach can even nullify type 2 concepts coming from Ichibei so nullifying Gunvolt's arsenal shouldn't be an issue unless if Gunvolt's resistances cover nullification that is >>>> Conceptual power nullification (Type 2.)

I feel like the concept stuff doesn't really matter does it? 2-A Power Null should be better than a 3D Concept Power Null?

Honestly I don't care about Mid-G, I care about Prevasion lol

 

[Hellscream]

Boutta get it accepted right now (or ASAP) lol

I see- GV's resistance on the other hand is just 2-A in quality so it should be fine. I can't find it on the Shinigami abilities though. Unless you're gonna argue that EVERY single character has 2-A EE passively


I understand that at least, but GV's Prevasion is EE in general, doesn't really matter if it's specifically targeted at the soul or whatever- all of it would be gone, including the Soul- on a 2-A level, and GV just Prevades it. Damnatio Memorie would upscale from Tenjian's Soul killing anyways.

It's on the profile, yep- if it isn't it's probably because I just put "Prevaded Tenjian's Seven Slashes" and u can just look at Tenjian for that

Power Null doesn't work, Prevaded (again Greed Snatcher)


I don't see how another person being intangible means that it nullifies the intangibility of another person, but yeah GV's Prevasion is actually kind of layered, certain Prevasions are straight up better than others.

can't use something that's not accepted yet, so yhwach just absorbs him through the almighty.

Only yhwach and the soul king / Mimihagi have 2-A range in bleach, no other character has it.

And yeah, i saw that it's concept type 3, while yhwach negates concept manip type 2 so it's not gonna affect yhwach.

Elaborate as to why yhwach's powernull wouldn't work? Yhwach resist type 2 conceptual powernull with the almighty.
Any ability yhwach sees yhwach understands and anything yhwach understands will be unable to harm him in any way possible. This powernull is done through his 2-A precognition which allows him to see an infinite amount of futures, and affect all/ alter all of them at once. while anything affected by the almighty is also not possible to be undone, even with causality manipulation, the only possible way is by altering the past to create a future that yhwach didn't change yet, and even then yhwach saw all of this and simply stated that he allowed them to do it.



Intangibility can be layered as well, in bleach you have a shinigami, which normal humans can't interact with, those same shinigami's can't interact with lille barro.

 

[LordGinSama]

I feel like the concept stuff doesn't really matter does it? 2-A Power Null should be better than a 3D Concept Power Null?

Conceptual manipulation doesn't give a shit about dimensionality. 2-A null that works on type 3 concepts still wouldn't work on type 2 concepts which are fundamentally more abstract.
.

Honestly I don't care about Mid-G, I care about Prevasion lol

Agree fra since that's a dope ass ability name lol.

 

[Smashtwig]

can't use something that's not accepted yet, so yhwach just absorbs him through the almighty.

I mean I'm willing to wait lol, cuz Yhwach has some things that need to be added to before we can get any results in

Only yhwach and the soul king / Mimihagi have 2-A range in bleach, no other character has it.

Yuh, so GV should be good

And yeah, i saw that it's concept type 3, while yhwach negates concept manip type 2 so it's not gonna affect yhwach.

Elaborate as to why yhwach's powernull wouldn't work? Yhwach resist type 2 conceptual powernull with the almighty.
Any ability yhwach sees yhwach understands and anything yhwach understands will be unable to harm him in any way possible. This powernull is done through his 2-A precognition which allows him to see an infinite amount of futures, and affect all/ alter all of them at once. while anything affected by the almighty is also not possible to be undone, even with causality manipulation, the only possible way is by altering the past to create a future that yhwach didn't change yet, and even then yhwach saw all of this and simply stated that he allowed them to do it.

Conceptual manipulation doesn't give a shit about dimensionality. 2-A null that works on type 3 concepts still wouldn't work on type 2 concepts which are fundamentally more abstract.

Oh. Guess I'll die lmao. Lemme see if I can argue for a Conceptual Type 2 in a later CRT and I could be back here

Intangibility can be layered as well, in bleach you have a shinigami, which normal humans can't interact with, those same shinigami's can't interact with lille barro.

Oh you mean like that, like NPI, it's weird, you'd have to be able to hit electrons anyways

 

[Smashtwig]

Agree fra since that's a dope ass ability name lol.

I know it's so cool


Also the fact that this matchup is even a discussion means that GV is actually pretty broken.

We get clout so we win lol

 

[Hellscream]

When he is out of EP, he goes into Overheat state, for a second or two, he becomes vulnerable and cannot use his Flashfield or Prevasion, making him vulnerable to any normal attack. However, in character, Gunvolt tries to keep his EP at full at all times via instant recharge and Split Second if needed, the both being spammable

Yhwach is able to manipulate an infinite amount of futures at once, and powernulls anything he sees in those futures being used. Like you said, any point in the infinite amount of futures that yhwach sees and at any point where it's not activated, yhwach just fate haxes him and absorbs him.
Yhwach also negs mid-godly so he could also just straight out kill him if he wanted to

 

[Smashtwig]

When he is out of EP, he goes into Overheat state, for a second or two, he becomes vulnerable and cannot use his Flashfield or Prevasion, making him vulnerable to any normal attack. However, in character, Gunvolt tries to keep his EP at full at all times via instant recharge and Split Second if needed, the both being spammable

Unfortunate because that's only GV1 and 2 GV, GV3 just does it without any need to recharge as he has infinite EP

That's my bad I used a old Copypasta that was before GV3 came out

 

[Smashtwig]

Actually holup guys help me out

I just read that the killing of concepts in their verse are type 3 concepts, while yhwach negates type 2 concept manipulation, so that's not gonna affect yhwach.

2. Dependent Concepts: Such concepts are abstract and govern all reality within their area of influence. These concepts shape everything, and changing them would either require the alteration of every object of the concept or, if manipulated directly, change all objects of the concept alongside the concept itself. These concepts, however, exist simultaneously with and are bound by the object of the concept. In this way, an abstract dependent concept can be destroyed by destroying all objects of the concept, restored by re-making an object of a previously existent concept, or changed by changing all objects of the concept across reality. This, however, does not qualify for this form of conceptual manipulation, and is rather treated as a by-product of another action akin to a "domino effect". This type of conceptual manipulation can only be obtained if the abstract concept itself is changed directly, and not by indirect methods. For example, destroying humanity and thus "ending the concept of humanity" would not qualify, while directly "ending the concept of humanity" and thus destroying humanity would qualify.

3. Lesser Fundamental Concepts: Concepts that don't meet the same standards as Type 1 or Type 2, such as personal concepts that continue to govern the object in question, merely on a more specific scale, or concepts whose nature is not elaborated upon. Case-by-case specifications and explanations are necessary for such concepts and examples, and they are likely not going to meet the same standards for abilities such as High-Godly regeneration that other concepts may. Conceptual manipulation of this type can be resisted by those who resist sufficiently similar abilities, even if the exact mechanics may differ.



Wouldn't this qualify as a a Type 2? The guy directly destroys the concepts, which is what causes the death of the opponent- isn't that the description of type 2?


Also going to class won't be back in a bit

 

[Hellscream]

No, destroying the soul of a singular person would be concept type 3, unless if that attack were to wipe out the "concept of souls" in its totality from the verse then it doesn't count as type 2

 

[Smashtwig]

Oh I see. Rip then unfortunate. If it had worked out maybe we could have squeezed an incon out of this

Whatever we still got clout

 

[Smashtwig]

One more question about this

Conceptual manipulation doesn't give a shit about dimensionality. 2-A null that works on type 3 concepts still wouldn't work on type 2 concepts which are fundamentally more abstract.

Does this mean that so long as its Concept manip, Yhwach can say, null Tier 1s and 0s? Because dimensionality doesn't matter?

 

[Hellscream]

One more question about this

Does this mean that so long as its Concept manip, Yhwach can say, null Tier 1s and 0s? Because dimensionality doesn't matter?

No, dimensionality does matter pretty sure dimensionality matters with pretty much all hax, otherwise yhwach would be one of the most busted characters

But don't take my word for this, im not 100% sure either

 

[Smashtwig]

No, dimensionality does matter pretty sure dimensionality matters with pretty much all hax, otherwise yhwach would be one of the most busted characters

Oh so it only works on GV here because it's also 2-A?

Damn I really wonder how this would go if it GV had a Type 2 instead of a 3


...was this a 4-C Yhwach this whole time bruh?

 

[Bobsican]

Dimensionality applies to any ability ever, anyone that says otherwise has some weird NLF thinking.

 

[Hellscream]

Oh so it only works on GV here because it's also 2-A?

Damn I really wonder how this would go if it GV had a Type 2 instead of a 3


...was this a 4-C Yhwach this whole time bruh?

Yeah, yhwach himself is 4-c it's just that he has busted hax

 

[Smashtwig]

Bruh I thought we were dealing with H6A this entire time man

was the difference between H6A and 4C just the Almighty btw? Does the Concept 2 Power Null come from Almighty?

 

[Hellscream]

Bruh I thought we were dealing with H6A this entire time man

was the difference between H6A and 4C just the Almighty btw? Does the Concept 2 Power Null come from Almighty?

Yeah, the concept 2 powernull comes from his h6A key

Yhwach from 4C gains a stronger almighty, and gains precognition resistance and some other stuff ofc

 

[Smashtwig]

oh so we couldnt even restrict Astral Order and Almighty to make a H6A match, unfortunate

just wait for the CRTs and hopefully a Type 2 Prevasion we'll be back

 

[The_Smashor]

At least GV can probably maybe beat Aizen

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

At least GV can probably maybe beat Aizen

 

[The_Smashor]

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Kyoka Suigetsu gg

 

[Smashtwig]

Aizen will just make GV accidentally pick the wrong future lmao

Kyoka Suigetsu gg

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Aizen will just make GV accidentally pick the wrong future lmao

Kyoka Suigetsu gg

Chair

 

[The_Smashor]

Aizen will just make GV accidentally pick the wrong future lmao

Kyoka Suigetsu gg

Counterpoint: Lack of Mid-Godly regeneration negation means GV has all the time in the world to pick the right one.

 

[Smashtwig]

Is this an incon moment?

 

[Robo432343]

bump...

 

[Smashtwig]

I wish I can make incon work but the Concept 2 screws over the Concept 3 Prevasion GV has. If not neither can kill each other