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There's a huge lacking in speed justification for Goku and I have no idea how fast he is.
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How fast is DBS Goku?
- Thread starter Zamasu_Chan
- Start date
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" Massively FTL+ (Fought with a suppressed Beerus, who should be moving at least as fast as his casual flight speed)"
"Massively FTL+ (Flew to a planet at 3/4th the speed of Whis)"
"Massively FTL+ (498 quadrillion times)"
What do you mean huge lacking in speed justification? Wot?
"Massively FTL+ (Flew to a planet at 3/4th the speed of Whis)"
"Massively FTL+ (498 quadrillion times)"
What do you mean huge lacking in speed justification? Wot?
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I'm just assuming, but a some people (A nice portion of the Dragon Ball community, I'm not trying to say all) think Jiren and Goku are infinitely fast. So he's just wondering what the jutification for Goku's current speed.
Note I said, I think
Note I said, I think
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I guess he meant how much fast Goku is so I guess Ultra Instinct GokuAwkguyDB said:
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- Thread starter
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Idk if it scales to base Goku or his God Forms.
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Beerus wasn't moving as fast as 75% of the 498e15c Whis feat.
It was specifically stated that Whis has never went so fast before.
The whole idea of Beerus being 75% Whis speed iirc came from the whole dinosaur planet thing in the Battle of the Gods arc iirc.
It was specifically stated that Whis has never went so fast before.
The whole idea of Beerus being 75% Whis speed iirc came from the whole dinosaur planet thing in the Battle of the Gods arc iirc.
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Goku's base form scales to that feat after his first round of training with Whis.
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that seems fair, I guess, though the source of the feat should be given as well in case anyone asks
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Ok.
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The thing is, they never mentioned the distance. Only the time, and Beerus' realm location is not mentioned. Correct me, if I'm wrong.
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Lol, I once did a speed scale scaling from Raditz to determine current Goku's speed, that didn't go well, considering that it ended up at 160 septendecillion times the speed of light as a massive lowball. I could copy and paste it if you want, I have it saved in a doc.
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Alright, here it is, keep in mind I'm not sure if there is a specific way powerscaling is done on this website, or just overall if I did it in a poor way. There were times where the power increase was unknown but should still be big, so I would just lowball the increase to 2x. Oh and the number I gave was for current DBS Goku in SSJB, not counting MUI.
Piccolo's attack that obliterated the moon was 29% the speed of light and was charged in a second.
Piccolo's Special Beam Cannon had a PL over 1,000 and wasn't done charging up, it should be almost 4 times higher than his base power level, and it took far more time to charge up than his moon busting attack.
Raditz dodged this attack, Piccolo stated in the English Dub that he's faster than light, which is supported by these calculations.
Raditz had a PL between 1,200-1,500, if it's 1,500, then Goku when he first turns SSJ is 100,000 times the speed of light.
After returning to Earth after a year in space, Goku should have received a Zenkai and trained for the entire year, he likely increased his power a lot, but I will just say he got 2 times stronger due to lack of info.
Goku is currently 200,000 times the speed of light.
Goku trains for 3 years for the androids arrival.
Unfortunately there is hardly any info to go off of for this. And Dragon Ball is inconsistent, Goku could've gotten 2 times stronger, or maybe 100 times stronger. I will just say 2 times again due to lack of info, but he should definitely have gotten far over that.
Goku is currently 400,000 times the speed of light.
Vegeta should be comparable to if not stronger than Goku when he fights 19.
Vegeta gets curb stomped by 18 who was toying around.
Android 17 is slightly stronger than 18.
Android 17 is around equal to Piccolo (Kami Merged).
Piccolo (Kami Merged) gets absolutely stomped by Imperfect Cell, without difficulty on Imperfect Cell's part (Piccolo's strongest possible attack at the time which scared 17 to the point of making him run away did absolutely nothing to Imperfect Cell in any way).
Android 16 is equal to if not slightly stronger than Imperfect Cell.
Imperfect Cell absorbs Android 17 becoming Semi-Perfect Cell.
Android 16 punches Semi-Perfect Cell in the face with all of his strength, Semi-Perfect Cell doesn't even flinch then proceeds to blast off half of 16's face with no difficulty.
Vegeta achieves SSJ Grade 2 and proceeds to stomp Semi-Perfect Cell with no difficulty.
Cell achieves his Perfect form, then shit stomps Super Vegeta with no difficulty while suppressed.
Goku achieves Mastered SSJ and far surpasses Super Vegeta.
If we assumed that each of the times someone surpasses someone here they are only 2 times stronger, then Goku would be 64 times stronger than the last time he was mentioned (this is an extremely massive lowball).
Goku is currently 25,600,000 times the speed of light (massive lowball).
Goku fights a suppressed Perfect Cell and gives up.
Gohan (who is stronger than Goku) fights Cell (Gohan was keeping up with Goku so easily while suppressed that he assumed Goku was holding back).
Gohan achieves SSJ2 (2 times increase).
Gohan stomps Cell who was far stronger than Goku.
7 years pass.
Goku achieves SSJ2 and SSJ3.
Majin Vegeta states that SSJ2 Goku is stronger than SSJ2 Teen Gohan.
If we assumed SSJ2 Teen Gohan was 10 times stronger than MSSJ Goku (lowball), then SSJ2 Buu Saga Goku would be over 256,000,000 times the speed of light.
SSJ3 is 4 times SSJ2. So SSJ3 Goku in the Buu Saga is 1,024,000,000 times the speed of light.
Goku is roughly equal to if not a little stronger than Fat Buu in SSJ3.
Kid Buu stomps Fat Buu with little difficulty.
SSJ3 Goku at his peak is slightly stronger than Kid Buu.
SSJ3 Goku at his peak in the Buu Saga should be over 2 times stronger than at the start, I will again lowball his increase to 2 times.
SSJ3 Goku end of Buu Saga should be 2,048,000,000 times the speed of light.
Goku trains for 3 months after Super, unfortunately it is completely impossible to determine how much stronger he got, so I won't add anything here.
Now we get to the biggest power jump Goku has in the series.
Goku becomes a Super Saiyan God.
With this power increase, Goku slowly gets stronger over the fight, at his peak in the fight, Goku is bare minimum universal, I will lowball him to universal for simplicity.
SSJ2 Gohan was solar system level as a teen, this is supported by Super Perfect Cell being solar system level (which is supported by statements, scaling, and a video game where he actually destroys the solar system) and Gohan being equal to him.
Let's say SSJ2 Goku is equal to Gohan (even though Vegeta said he's stronger), SSJ3 Goku is 4 times that. So lowballing Goku, he would be at least 4 times solar system level before becoming a SSJG (likely closer to 10 times solar system level).
There are over 100,000,000,000 solar systems in an average sized galaxy, and over 100,000,000,000 galaxies in the observable universe alone, the actual universe is estimated to be septillions of times larger. But let's assume there is 100,000,000,000 solar systems in each galaxy, and 100,000,000,000 galaxies in the universe.
SSJG Goku is at least 10 sextillion solar systems.
Divide 10 sextillion by 4 for 2.5 sextillion. This means SSJG is a 2.5 sextillion times increase at least. While it's true that SSJ3 Goku is likely above 4 times solar system level, SSJG Goku is FAR above 10 sextillion times solar system level, so this is still a massive lowball, this is also ignoring the fact that technically I should add 400 for the SSJ3 multiplier, so an even bigger lowball.
Multiply 2.5 sextillion by 2,048,000,000, SSJG Goku is AT LEAST 5,120,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 (5.12) nonillion times the speed of light.
Goku absorbs the God form's power into his base form, and is then able to stack SSJG on top of his base form which is equal to how powerful it was previously. So use the SSJG multiplier again, Goku is 12,800,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 (12.8 sexdecillion) times the speed of light.
Multiply that by 50 with SSJB.
Goku is now 640 sexdecillion times the speed of light.
Goku uses 10 Times Kaioken against Hit and still loses.
Goku fights Hit again after the Goku Black arc, keep in mind that Hit didn't have his full abilities in the tournament, since he couldn't kill.
Goku wins without Kaioken, so Goku got over 10 times stronger during the Goku Black arc.
640 sexdecillion times 10 for 6.4 septendecillion.
Now onto the ToP
Goku, during his fight with Jiren, uses the Genki Dama, he stays in base form at first and is surprised when Jiren forces it back, meaning he thought it would be enough to beat him, even though previously, Jiren was EASILY stomping SSJBKKX20 Goku, meaning this Spirit Bomb is stronger than SSJBKKX20 Goku.
SSJ Kefla was stated to be equal to the previous Spirit Bomb, meaning Kefla is stronger than the previous SSJBKKX20 Goku.
During Goku's fight with Caulifla, Kale, and Kefla, he is extremely exhausted.
Goku at the start of the fight can't even turn SSJ, even though he mastered SSJ to such an extent in the Cell Saga alone to the point where it didn't even exhaust his Ki.
When Goku finally uses SSJBKK again against Kefla, he is so exhausted he could only use two attacks before being done, even though previously in the tournament he was using it without much difficulty at all.
Goku at this point should be tens of times stronger than before, but I'll lowball it to 5 times
Goku is now 32 septendecillion times the speed of light at a bare minimum.
Goku continues to get stronger over the course of the tournament, and increases his power significantly between then and the Broly movie, I'll just lowball it to another 5 times increase (would be much higher).
Goku is now 160 septendcillion times the speed of light in current DBS (if you massively lowball him).
But now I'll talk about MUI.
MUI's multiplier is unknown, different sources will scale it differently. For simplicity though, I will say it's 500 times Blue (some scales support this, and you could argue this is actually downplay).
So Goku at his absolute peak in DBS is 80 octodecillion times the speed of light (if you massively lowball him).
Piccolo's attack that obliterated the moon was 29% the speed of light and was charged in a second.
Piccolo's Special Beam Cannon had a PL over 1,000 and wasn't done charging up, it should be almost 4 times higher than his base power level, and it took far more time to charge up than his moon busting attack.
Raditz dodged this attack, Piccolo stated in the English Dub that he's faster than light, which is supported by these calculations.
Raditz had a PL between 1,200-1,500, if it's 1,500, then Goku when he first turns SSJ is 100,000 times the speed of light.
After returning to Earth after a year in space, Goku should have received a Zenkai and trained for the entire year, he likely increased his power a lot, but I will just say he got 2 times stronger due to lack of info.
Goku is currently 200,000 times the speed of light.
Goku trains for 3 years for the androids arrival.
Unfortunately there is hardly any info to go off of for this. And Dragon Ball is inconsistent, Goku could've gotten 2 times stronger, or maybe 100 times stronger. I will just say 2 times again due to lack of info, but he should definitely have gotten far over that.
Goku is currently 400,000 times the speed of light.
Vegeta should be comparable to if not stronger than Goku when he fights 19.
Vegeta gets curb stomped by 18 who was toying around.
Android 17 is slightly stronger than 18.
Android 17 is around equal to Piccolo (Kami Merged).
Piccolo (Kami Merged) gets absolutely stomped by Imperfect Cell, without difficulty on Imperfect Cell's part (Piccolo's strongest possible attack at the time which scared 17 to the point of making him run away did absolutely nothing to Imperfect Cell in any way).
Android 16 is equal to if not slightly stronger than Imperfect Cell.
Imperfect Cell absorbs Android 17 becoming Semi-Perfect Cell.
Android 16 punches Semi-Perfect Cell in the face with all of his strength, Semi-Perfect Cell doesn't even flinch then proceeds to blast off half of 16's face with no difficulty.
Vegeta achieves SSJ Grade 2 and proceeds to stomp Semi-Perfect Cell with no difficulty.
Cell achieves his Perfect form, then shit stomps Super Vegeta with no difficulty while suppressed.
Goku achieves Mastered SSJ and far surpasses Super Vegeta.
If we assumed that each of the times someone surpasses someone here they are only 2 times stronger, then Goku would be 64 times stronger than the last time he was mentioned (this is an extremely massive lowball).
Goku is currently 25,600,000 times the speed of light (massive lowball).
Goku fights a suppressed Perfect Cell and gives up.
Gohan (who is stronger than Goku) fights Cell (Gohan was keeping up with Goku so easily while suppressed that he assumed Goku was holding back).
Gohan achieves SSJ2 (2 times increase).
Gohan stomps Cell who was far stronger than Goku.
7 years pass.
Goku achieves SSJ2 and SSJ3.
Majin Vegeta states that SSJ2 Goku is stronger than SSJ2 Teen Gohan.
If we assumed SSJ2 Teen Gohan was 10 times stronger than MSSJ Goku (lowball), then SSJ2 Buu Saga Goku would be over 256,000,000 times the speed of light.
SSJ3 is 4 times SSJ2. So SSJ3 Goku in the Buu Saga is 1,024,000,000 times the speed of light.
Goku is roughly equal to if not a little stronger than Fat Buu in SSJ3.
Kid Buu stomps Fat Buu with little difficulty.
SSJ3 Goku at his peak is slightly stronger than Kid Buu.
SSJ3 Goku at his peak in the Buu Saga should be over 2 times stronger than at the start, I will again lowball his increase to 2 times.
SSJ3 Goku end of Buu Saga should be 2,048,000,000 times the speed of light.
Goku trains for 3 months after Super, unfortunately it is completely impossible to determine how much stronger he got, so I won't add anything here.
Now we get to the biggest power jump Goku has in the series.
Goku becomes a Super Saiyan God.
With this power increase, Goku slowly gets stronger over the fight, at his peak in the fight, Goku is bare minimum universal, I will lowball him to universal for simplicity.
SSJ2 Gohan was solar system level as a teen, this is supported by Super Perfect Cell being solar system level (which is supported by statements, scaling, and a video game where he actually destroys the solar system) and Gohan being equal to him.
Let's say SSJ2 Goku is equal to Gohan (even though Vegeta said he's stronger), SSJ3 Goku is 4 times that. So lowballing Goku, he would be at least 4 times solar system level before becoming a SSJG (likely closer to 10 times solar system level).
There are over 100,000,000,000 solar systems in an average sized galaxy, and over 100,000,000,000 galaxies in the observable universe alone, the actual universe is estimated to be septillions of times larger. But let's assume there is 100,000,000,000 solar systems in each galaxy, and 100,000,000,000 galaxies in the universe.
SSJG Goku is at least 10 sextillion solar systems.
Divide 10 sextillion by 4 for 2.5 sextillion. This means SSJG is a 2.5 sextillion times increase at least. While it's true that SSJ3 Goku is likely above 4 times solar system level, SSJG Goku is FAR above 10 sextillion times solar system level, so this is still a massive lowball, this is also ignoring the fact that technically I should add 400 for the SSJ3 multiplier, so an even bigger lowball.
Multiply 2.5 sextillion by 2,048,000,000, SSJG Goku is AT LEAST 5,120,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 (5.12) nonillion times the speed of light.
Goku absorbs the God form's power into his base form, and is then able to stack SSJG on top of his base form which is equal to how powerful it was previously. So use the SSJG multiplier again, Goku is 12,800,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 (12.8 sexdecillion) times the speed of light.
Multiply that by 50 with SSJB.
Goku is now 640 sexdecillion times the speed of light.
Goku uses 10 Times Kaioken against Hit and still loses.
Goku fights Hit again after the Goku Black arc, keep in mind that Hit didn't have his full abilities in the tournament, since he couldn't kill.
Goku wins without Kaioken, so Goku got over 10 times stronger during the Goku Black arc.
640 sexdecillion times 10 for 6.4 septendecillion.
Now onto the ToP
Goku, during his fight with Jiren, uses the Genki Dama, he stays in base form at first and is surprised when Jiren forces it back, meaning he thought it would be enough to beat him, even though previously, Jiren was EASILY stomping SSJBKKX20 Goku, meaning this Spirit Bomb is stronger than SSJBKKX20 Goku.
SSJ Kefla was stated to be equal to the previous Spirit Bomb, meaning Kefla is stronger than the previous SSJBKKX20 Goku.
During Goku's fight with Caulifla, Kale, and Kefla, he is extremely exhausted.
Goku at the start of the fight can't even turn SSJ, even though he mastered SSJ to such an extent in the Cell Saga alone to the point where it didn't even exhaust his Ki.
When Goku finally uses SSJBKK again against Kefla, he is so exhausted he could only use two attacks before being done, even though previously in the tournament he was using it without much difficulty at all.
Goku at this point should be tens of times stronger than before, but I'll lowball it to 5 times
Goku is now 32 septendecillion times the speed of light at a bare minimum.
Goku continues to get stronger over the course of the tournament, and increases his power significantly between then and the Broly movie, I'll just lowball it to another 5 times increase (would be much higher).
Goku is now 160 septendcillion times the speed of light in current DBS (if you massively lowball him).
But now I'll talk about MUI.
MUI's multiplier is unknown, different sources will scale it differently. For simplicity though, I will say it's 500 times Blue (some scales support this, and you could argue this is actually downplay).
So Goku at his absolute peak in DBS is 80 octodecillion times the speed of light (if you massively lowball him).
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Man, that really was bad, worse than I remember. I made so many assumptions. And on Vs. Battle Wiki, the SSJ multipliers are considered invalid (aside from SSJ1), not to mention power levels not being used here. Furthermore, the increase I gave SSJG might have been a bit of a stretch, to say the least. Lol, maybe I should redo it but with less assumptions, smaller estimations for the SSJG increase, and not taking power levels into account.
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My suggestio
Don't scale Goku to being actually Universal but rather scale him to Vegito.
SSJ3 Goku: 1 = 2,048,000,000x Speed of Light
Base Vegito: 2
Super Vegito: 100
BoG SSJG Goku: 200
BoG SSJ Goku Post god ki: 400
RoF Base Goku: 400
RoF SSJ3 Goku (hypothetically): 160,000
RoF SSJG Goku (hypothetically): 32,000,000
RoF SSJB Goku: 1,600,000,000
. Okay with this just simply times all forms by 2x so you can account for the 3 years of training in the HTC in prep for the Universe 6 Tourney.
. Then Give Goku's Blue form a 2x and a 10x increase for Kaioken and that will cover the Champa Arc.
. For the Goku Black arc give Goku a 10x increase on all forms due to him being able to defeat Hit without his Kaioken technique.
. Finally if you want for safe measure you can give an extra 2x Goku for his training and intense battles leading up to his first encounter with Jiren in the ToP.
Don't scale Goku to being actually Universal but rather scale him to Vegito.
SSJ3 Goku: 1 = 2,048,000,000x Speed of Light
Base Vegito: 2
Super Vegito: 100
BoG SSJG Goku: 200
BoG SSJ Goku Post god ki: 400
RoF Base Goku: 400
RoF SSJ3 Goku (hypothetically): 160,000
RoF SSJG Goku (hypothetically): 32,000,000
RoF SSJB Goku: 1,600,000,000
. Okay with this just simply times all forms by 2x so you can account for the 3 years of training in the HTC in prep for the Universe 6 Tourney.
. Then Give Goku's Blue form a 2x and a 10x increase for Kaioken and that will cover the Champa Arc.
. For the Goku Black arc give Goku a 10x increase on all forms due to him being able to defeat Hit without his Kaioken technique.
. Finally if you want for safe measure you can give an extra 2x Goku for his training and intense battles leading up to his first encounter with Jiren in the ToP.
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He probably is quintillions FTL in reaction speed and quadrillions in flight.
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