Izuku Midoriya vs Naruto Uzumaki

[TheRustyOne]

Time to bite the bullet here.

We had Tomura vs Sasuke, it's only natural to do Izuku vs Naruto.

This is Birth of the Ten-Tails’ Jinchūriki Naruto vs Final War Arc Izuku

Naruto starts with Kurama Mode and Izuku starts with One For All.

Naruto's AP/Dura: 98.35 Teratons with Kurama Mode and 100 Teratons with Kurama Sage Mode, 200 Teratons with Rasengan Variants

Izuku's AP/Dura: 53.50 Teratons with OFA, up to 267.5 Teratons with Fa Jin

Speed is Equalized

Starting Distance = 50 Meters

Location = Abandoned Nabu Island (Both are aware the island is empty)

Who wins?

Deku: Kingofwolves999, Nierre, ReaperAndBlues, EnderLord8, MintyBoi1, SODAKU, That_moron2, TheRusytOne, Mapl3Sy4up, Spinoirr, ShigarakiShimura, KaydeeX, Danny33wise, (13)

Naruto: XSOULOFCINDERX, karo_senpaii, Kazuma_kuwabara, Robo432343, (4)

Inconclusive: (0)

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Izuku is in for a rough fight here since he only has the raw power advantage with Fa Jin which Naruto can avoid thanks to his precog, ability to sense the power of his opponents and Substitution Jutsu, which conveniently also negs any attempts to grapple him since we've seen it work on those too from lesser characters. That being said, Izuku is so hard to even tag due to his own amps and precog that Naruto will be struggling here too, though it's possible that Frog Kata could be extremely useful here due to it being impossible to detect without Sage Mode sensory capabilities not to mention all of Naruto's clones which are only marginally weaker than the original at this point in the series and all of his massive AOE attacks. I don't think Naruto would actually use those unless he had no other choice though seeing as he can tell Izuku is a good person due to his emotion and intent sensing abilities on top of Izuku just not being an asshole.

 

[Smashtwig]

You're telling me that sage mode is only a 1.67% Boost to Narutos AP? Wack

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

You're telling me that sage mode is only a 1.67% Boost to Narutos AP? Wack

That's only because there are no hard multipliers given for it. Even though it's massively implied to be superior to the Curse Mark amps since Orochimaru made those specifically to try and replicate Sage Mode to a degree since he can't use it.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

A wild matchup, but I guess it was inevitable with both being 6-B+.

Naruto definitely has versatility in the bag for this fight. Substitution, clones, extendable arms, Low-Mid regen, durability negation and this gets even wilder in Sage Mode. In sheer abilities, he’s got this made, on top of the near 2x stat gap. His main priority in this fight is probably engaging in hand to hand, figuring out what Deku is capable of, then setting up to blast him with a Rasengan variant to the chest with his typical clone trickery. He might go for chakra arm grabs, but Deku would dodge or break out of those with ease via Blackwhip coating. His typical tricks are all things Deku could either see coming or be able to react to in time thanks to Danger Sense, but overwhelming his senses with thousands of clones would do the trick to catch Deku with something.

On Deku’s side, his abilities are lesser but do a single thing very well. His precog and analytical prediction will help him avoid basically any problems in close quarters as well as help him not get messed up by clones. The issue with Danger Sense (which Deku thankfully understands enough to know to deal with) is that enough attacks can overwhelm his senses, so in response to a clone army, his best bet would be building up Fa Jin in his muscles and nuking the lot of them with a Delaware Smash. His Blackwhip counters any grapple attempts from Naruto, though in response, he won’t be catching the real Naruto easily with how slippery he is. He has the higher mobility since Naruto can’t fly in this key I believe.

Both of them can sense ahead of time and avoid the others attacks, with Naruto having an advantage by just overwhelming how much Deku is sensing. On the other hand, if Deku clears out the clones with Fa Jin or massive sweeping Blackwhip attacks, he can sense where the real Naruto is and won’t get tricked or caught off guard. Both of their inner voices (vestiges and Kurama) are going to be putting in overtime with advice and call outs, so ultimately, until Sage Mode/Kurama mode comes out, the fight is practically a stalemate unless Naruto manages to pull a really crazy plan, which would be difficult considering how little info he has on how Deku’s abilities work.

Once they both understand what it is they’re dealing with, they will go for their biggest moves… at which point Naruto gets absolutely murderblitzed out of existence by Gearshift and punched in the chest and face several times by attacks nearly 3x stronger than his Sage Mode at a speed he literally cannot react to.

And that’s kinda how the fight will end up regardless of who is pressing and winning in the early stages: the second Deku gets threatened enough to use Gearshift, it’s basically over. Naruto doesn’t really have anything in his arsenal that lets him endure those hits in such quick succession, and he’s going to get yoinked by Blackwhip during it as well so he can’t escape. A very dangerous fight for Deku where one mistake and a good rasenshuriken will take him out, but the final resort Gearshift button is the one thing that Naruto doesn’t have a counter for.

So High-Diff fight turns into murder blitz once Deku understands the gravity of the situation.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

A wild matchup, but I guess it was inevitable with both being 6-B+.

Naruto definitely has versatility in the bag for this fight. Substitution, clones, extendable arms, Low-Mid regen, durability negation and this gets even wilder in Sage Mode. In sheer abilities, he’s got this made, on top of the near 2x stat gap. His main priority in this fight is probably engaging in hand to hand, figuring out what Deku is capable of, then setting up to blast him with a Rasengan variant to the chest with his typical clone trickery. He might go for chakra arm grabs, but Deku would dodge or break out of those with ease via Blackwhip coating. His typical tricks are all things Deku could either see coming or be able to react to in time thanks to Danger Sense, but overwhelming his senses with thousands of clones would do the trick to catch Deku with something.

On Deku’s side, his abilities are lesser but do a single thing very well. His precog and analytical prediction will help him avoid basically any problems in close quarters as well as help him not get messed up by clones. The issue with Danger Sense (which Deku thankfully understands enough to know to deal with) is that enough attacks can overwhelm his senses, so in response to a clone army, his best bet would be building up Fa Jin in his muscles and nuking the lot of them with a Delaware Smash. His Blackwhip counters any grapple attempts from Naruto, though in response, he won’t be catching the real Naruto easily with how slippery he is. He has the higher mobility since Naruto can’t fly in this key I believe.

Both of them can sense ahead of time and avoid the others attacks, with Naruto having an advantage by just overwhelming how much Deku is sensing. On the other hand, if Deku clears out the clones with Fa Jin or massive sweeping Blackwhip attacks, he can sense where the real Naruto is and won’t get tricked or caught off guard. Both of their inner voices (vestiges and Kurama) are going to be putting in overtime with advice and call outs, so ultimately, until Sage Mode/Kurama mode comes out, the fight is practically a stalemate unless Naruto manages to pull a really crazy plan, which would be difficult considering how little info he has on how Deku’s abilities work.

Once they both understand what it is they’re dealing with, they will go for their biggest moves… at which point Naruto gets absolutely murderblitzed out of existence by Gearshift and punched in the chest and face several times by attacks nearly 3x stronger than his Sage Mode at a speed he literally cannot react to.

And that’s kinda how the fight will end up regardless of who is pressing and winning in the early stages: the second Deku gets threatened enough to use Gearshift, it’s basically over. Naruto doesn’t really have anything in his arsenal that lets him endure those hits in such quick succession, and he’s going to get yoinked by Blackwhip during it as well so he can’t escape. A very dangerous fight for Deku where one mistake and a good rasenshuriken will take him out, but the final resort Gearshift button is the one thing that Naruto doesn’t have a counter for.

So High-Diff fight turns into murder blitz once Deku understands the gravity of the situation.

You're forgetting that the Kurama Chakra cloaks function as forcefields and that without being seen as an ally by Kurama or Naruto that just touching his Chakra acts like a dangerous poison.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

You're forgetting that the Kurama Chakra cloaks function as forcefields and that without being seen as an ally by Kurama or Naruto that just touching his Chakra acts like a dangerous poison.

Gloves.

Also I’m pretty sure people that are enemies to him have been touched before by the cloak and not insta died.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Gloves.

Also I’m pretty sure people that are enemies to him have been touched before by the cloak and not insta died.

Literally only three, two of which are walking corpses and the other one has Hashirama Cells and Wood Style which hard counters Kurama's Chakra. Also if Deku's fit gets ****** up at all or Naruto manages a clean hit on his face then that poison is gonna get to work considering it's some of the most damaging poison in Naruto.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Literally only three, two of which are walking corpses and the other one has Hashirama Cells and Wood Style which hard counters Kurama's Chakra. Also if Deku's fit gets ****** up at all or Naruto manages a clean hit on his face then that poison is gonna get to work considering it's some of the most damaging poison in Naruto.

Wait so why would Pain being a corpse not mean the poison ***** him up, don’t the paths still get bodied by poison?

Also Blackwhip coating. Deku’s gear only gets messed up when he pushes the absolute limit and intentionally breaks it, he can use Gearshift + Fa Jin without breaking his gear.

And his Iron Soles don’t get broken no matter what he does.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Wait so why would Pain being a corpse not mean the poison ***** him up, don’t the paths still get bodied by poison?

No? That was never a thing.

Also Blackwhip coating. Deku’s gear only gets messed up when he pushes the absolute limit and intentionally breaks it, he can use Gearshift + Fa Jin without breaking his gear.

Fair, but Deku has no reason to assume this unless he's already been hit by Naruto and starts having his skin eat itself alive.

And his Iron Soles don’t get broken no matter what he does.

Also fair.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

No? That was never a thing.

Fair, but Deku has no reason to assume this unless he's already been hit by Naruto and starts having his skin eat itself alive.

Also fair.

So do the Paths have a resistance to poison? I’m pretty sure their nervous systems and such still function while they’re operating as Paths, otherwise they shouldn’t be killable or bleed like a normal person.

True, or when he gets massive danger sense pings and realizes Naruto is stronger than him like how Shigaraki got massive danger sense pings in response to Fa Jin. So he’ll just always assume he needs to Blackwhip coating his body to not get hit. And if the poison isn’t fast acting, he can use Blackwhip inside his flesh to remove it before it reaches too far.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

So do the Paths have a resistance to poison? I’m pretty sure their nervous systems and such still function while they’re operating as Paths, otherwise they shouldn’t be killable or bleed like a normal person.

The Paths are just really weird and hard to explain but they're literally just corpses being piloted remotely by a Rinnegan user.

True, or when he gets massive danger sense pings and realizes Naruto is stronger than him like how Shigaraki got massive danger sense pings in response to Fa Jin. So he’ll just always assume he needs to Blackwhip coating his body to not get hit. And if the poison isn’t fast acting, he can use Blackwhip inside his flesh to remove it before it reaches too far.

Fair, though that's still gonna be agonizing if it happens given Sakura would've lost her entire arm in mere moments if she wasn't a literal god tier medical genius.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

The Paths are just really weird and hard to explain but they're literally just corpses being piloted remotely by a Rinnegan user.

Fair, though that's still gonna be agonizing if it happens given Sakura would've lost her entire arm in mere moments if she wasn't a literal god tier medical genius.

I mean yeah I know that, but that doesn’t inherently give them a resistance to poison or something. They still die like normal people so I don’t see why poisons would be exempt from that. Also kid Sasuke was getting thrashed by KCM1 and didn’t get poisoned but has no resistance.

According to the scan explaining the poison, Sakura got bodied by it because it entered through her wounds (slashes caused by the tail smack). So I don’t think just touching Naruto insta-kills you, it has to actually enter your bloodstream. So he’d have to cut Deku then touch his cut, then Deku/the vestiges would have to react quickly to remove it via Blackwhip. Or Deku just uses Low Gear on the poison.

 

[Nierre]

the poison is only a thing prior to Naruto learns Kyubi Mode. It's because of Kurama's hate that his bubbly chakra has corrosion and poison Inducement. But due to Naruto subduing Kurama after training with Bee, it becomes a cloak which loses that effect, especially after bonding with Kurama. So that's a nonfactor in this fight.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

the poison is only a thing prior to Naruto learns Kyubi Mode. It's because of Kurama's hate that his bubbly chakra has corrosion and poison Inducement. But due to Naruto subduing Kurama after training with Bee, it becomes a cloak which loses that effect, especially after bonding with Kurama. So that's a nonfactor in this fight.

That's not how his profile treats it.

 

[Nierre]

That's not how his profile treats it.

the profile is wrong. I mean hell, Naruto literally gives the whole alliance a kyubi cloak, and none of them suffer the effects. the stronger Kuramas hate = the stronger the effect is

yeah the profile says otherwise, but let's not act disingenuous

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

the profile is wrong. I mean hell, Naruto literally gives the whole alliance a kyubi cloak, and none of them suffer the effects. the stronger Kuramas hate = the stronger the effect is

yeah the profile says otherwise, but let's not act disingenuous

We literally give a shit ton of characters resistance to those hax powers via them being unaffected by it, like when Blind Madara just steps on a dude with a Kyūbi Cloak and doesn't get harmed by it. If you want to argue otherwise then make a CRT for it.

 

[Nierre]

anyway I think Deku takes this high difficulty. KoWs dissection was pretty accurate imo

If you want to argue otherwise then make a CRT for it.

maybe another day

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I personally think Naruto is beating him barely before Gearshift gets busted out, an ability that I'm unsure Deku would even use on someone he's not trying to tear limb from limb like Shigaraki.

 

[Therefir]

Deku wasn't really trying to kill Shigaraki but still went all out and made him a donut.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Deku wasn't really trying to kill Shigaraki but still went all out and made him a donut.

He knew Shigaraki could regenerate from something like that, here he has no reason to assume this and will be very unlikely to try and punch a whole through Naruto, which will be vastly more difficult regardless due to both the higher durability Naruto has compared to Shigaraki as well as the Chakra Cloak and Kurama Avatar acting like layered forcefields.

 

[karo_senpaii]

A wild matchup, but I guess it was inevitable with both being 6-B+.

Naruto definitely has versatility in the bag for this fight. Substitution, clones, extendable arms, Low-Mid regen, durability negation and this gets even wilder in Sage Mode. In sheer abilities, he’s got this made, on top of the near 2x stat gap. His main priority in this fight is probably engaging in hand to hand, figuring out what Deku is capable of, then setting up to blast him with a Rasengan variant to the chest with his typical clone trickery. He might go for chakra arm grabs, but Deku would dodge or break out of those with ease via Blackwhip coating. His typical tricks are all things Deku could either see coming or be able to react to in time thanks to Danger Sense, but overwhelming his senses with thousands of clones would do the trick to catch Deku with something.

On Deku’s side, his abilities are lesser but do a single thing very well. His precog and analytical prediction will help him avoid basically any problems in close quarters as well as help him not get messed up by clones. The issue with Danger Sense (which Deku thankfully understands enough to know to deal with) is that enough attacks can overwhelm his senses, so in response to a clone army, his best bet would be building up Fa Jin in his muscles and nuking the lot of them with a Delaware Smash. His Blackwhip counters any grapple attempts from Naruto, though in response, he won’t be catching the real Naruto easily with how slippery he is. He has the higher mobility since Naruto can’t fly in this key I believe.

Both of them can sense ahead of time and avoid the others attacks, with Naruto having an advantage by just overwhelming how much Deku is sensing. On the other hand, if Deku clears out the clones with Fa Jin or massive sweeping Blackwhip attacks, he can sense where the real Naruto is and won’t get tricked or caught off guard. Both of their inner voices (vestiges and Kurama) are going to be putting in overtime with advice and call outs, so ultimately, until Sage Mode/Kurama mode comes out, the fight is practically a stalemate unless Naruto manages to pull a really crazy plan, which would be difficult considering how little info he has on how Deku’s abilities work.

Once they both understand what it is they’re dealing with, they will go for their biggest moves… at which point Naruto gets absolutely murderblitzed out of existence by Gearshift and punched in the chest and face several times by attacks nearly 3x stronger than his Sage Mode at a speed he literally cannot react to.

And that’s kinda how the fight will end up regardless of who is pressing and winning in the early stages: the second Deku gets threatened enough to use Gearshift, it’s basically over. Naruto doesn’t really have anything in his arsenal that lets him endure those hits in such quick succession, and he’s going to get yoinked by Blackwhip during it as well so he can’t escape. A very dangerous fight for Deku where one mistake and a good rasenshuriken will take him out, but the final resort Gearshift button is the one thing that Naruto doesn’t have a counter for.

So High-Diff fight turns into murder blitz once Deku understands the gravity of the situation.

I'm curious as to why gear shift would blitz naruto?

 

[Kingofwolves999]

I'm curious as to why gear shift would blitz naruto?

Speed is equal, and against people equal to him in speed, he literally freeze frames them, moving so fast that he will land 5 punches on Naruto before Naruto even realizes what is happening. Gearshift is an absolutely absurd speed amp with just its initial Second Gear, getting even faster with Third Gear and Top Gear.

While using Gearshift to blitz his enemies, Deku stores every single attack with Fa Jin, meaning he is constantly, at speeds they cannot perceive, building up and throwing out attacks 5x stronger than him in between the 5 normal attacks that are also amped from Gearshift.

 

[Metalballrun]

He knew Shigaraki could regenerate from something like tha

Shigaraki still had his Quirks erased around the time Deku donutted him IIRC.
Not saying Deku would try to donut Naruto. But Deku doesn't really hold back on using 100% on strong opponents.

 

[Tatsumi504]

I mean yeah I know that, but that doesn’t inherently give them a resistance to poison or something. They still die like normal people so I don’t see why poisons would be exempt from that. Also kid Sasuke was getting thrashed by KCM1 and didn’t get poisoned but has no resistance.

According to the scan explaining the poison, Sakura got bodied by it because it entered through her wounds (slashes caused by the tail smack). So I don’t think just touching Naruto insta-kills you, it has to actually enter your bloodstream. So he’d have to cut Deku then touch his cut, then Deku/the vestiges would have to react quickly to remove it via Blackwhip. Or Deku just uses Low Gear on the poison.

Nah, Orochimaru got bodied just by touching it

 

[MintyBoi1]

Naruto gave his chakra to everyone in the war, if it were poisonous, how could that happen? I think it was just something to do with Naruto’s lack of control over Kurama’s hatred

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Nah, Orochimaru got bodied just by touching it

Orochimaru punched him in the face with his weird snake clone and his fist was fine.

 

[karo_senpaii]

Speed is equal, and against people equal to him in speed, he literally freeze frames them, moving so fast that he will land 5 punches on Naruto before Naruto even realizes what is happening. Gearshift is an absolutely absurd speed amp with just its initial Second Gear, getting even faster with Third Gear and Top Gear.

While using Gearshift to blitz his enemies, Deku stores every single attack with Fa Jin, meaning he is constantly, at speeds they cannot perceive, building up and throwing out attacks 5x stronger than him in between the 5 normal attacks that are also amped from Gearshift.

That's cool but naruto speed is not equal with his.
He has statistics amplification and can amp his speed more with kurama chakra, up next is shunshin which is able to blitz and freeze people with already comparable speed with him. And third and finally is sage mode which is an even higher speed amp than shunshin.
I'm not exactly seeing the blitz. Also both naruto and deku can both easily destroy each other seeing as both of them attacks are over 2x the other's durability. The difference here is naruto go to move is shadow clone jutsu which deceives the opponent. How is deku managing that?
What's even worse is that naruto double rasengan and his odama rasengan scales to twice his ap which is already more than twice deku own. Sorry I'm seeing naruto with the edge here.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

That's cool but naruto speed is not equal with his.
He has statistics amplification and can amp his speed more with kurama chakra, up next is shunshin which is able to blitz and freeze people with already comparable speed with him. And third and finally is sage mode which is an even higher speed amp than shunshin.
I'm not exactly seeing the blitz. Also both naruto and deku can both easily destroy each other seeing as both of them attacks are over 2x the other's durability. The difference here is naruto go to move is shadow clone jutsu which deceives the opponent. How is deku managing that?
What's even worse is that naruto double rasengan and his odama rasengan scales to twice his ap which is already more than twice deku own. Sorry I'm seeing naruto with the edge here.

He’s already in KCM mode here, literally at the strongest and fastest he can go. Sure, he can specifically amp the chakra in his legs to go faster, but that’s not going to blitz Deku nor has he shown the ability it to blitz people on par with this level of speed by doing so. Danger Sense precognition also directly counters blitzes as it can keep up with Gearshift level speed differences.

This isn’t a “blitz” in the sense that Deku is moving fast enough to reach Naruto before he can react. This is a “blitz” in the sense that to Deku, Naruto will not even be moving. You know those Quicksilver moments from X-Men? That’s what Deku is partially doing. In Naruto’s perception, he will be standing normally or attacking, and then in the next instant he has five punches in his chest, has been launched into the air, and then gets hit with an almost 3x his durability attack to the face. A process that will repeat over and over again.

Gearshift makes Deku so much faster than his normal speed it is insane. Sage mode increases speed but it does not let him just blitz people that were contesting with him before. See the fight with Pain or Obito, gaining Sage Mode doesn’t make him straight up blitz people. And that’s assuming he even gets to Sage Mode since Deku is more likely to activate Gearshift well before then, and even then it doesn’t help him.

The Shunshin speed amp is only for a single movement to my knowledge, so he can’t just activate shunshin and permanently be faster. And even then, shunshin is an inferior speed amp to Deku freeze framing Naruto enough to clear the distance and land 5 punches on him without even being perceived.

Also I already explained that Deku can Fa Jin nuke tens of kilometers of area, the clones are not an issue. His normal air attacks in this state can destroy storms larger than islands and he has no civilians he’s worrying about, the clones get poofed well before reaching his position in the air as he flies above them. Tens of Kilometers range is useful here.

The Rasengans get dodged thanks to Danger Sense immediately picking up where Naruto is attacking him from. A quick flick of his foot and he can fly away from any attacks he senses. And the second he activates Gearshift no attack is going to hit him at all.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Deku speed >is completely imperceptible > 2nd Gear > 3rd Gear > Top Gear > Overdrive

Naruto, while already at his strongest form, does not have any speed amps in his arsenal that long term increase his reactions to the point that he can react to Deku moving so fast that he can punch him five times in an instant. Deku quite literally breaks the laws of physics, ignoring inertia and warping the laws of reality, to speed up this fast. If Naruto when fighting Obito or Madara could just blitz them into oblivion with his shunshin and hit them with 5 Rasengans before they could even react, I feel like he would have activated the ability that does that.

 

[karo_senpaii]

He’s already in KCM mode here, literally at the strongest and fastest he can go. Sure, he can specifically amp the chakra in his legs to go faster, but that’s not going to blitz Deku nor has he shown the ability it to blitz people on par with this level of speed by doing so. Danger Sense precognition also directly counters blitzes as it can keep up with Gearshift level speed differences.

This isn’t a “blitz” in the sense that Deku is moving fast enough to reach Naruto before he can react. This is a “blitz” in the sense that to Deku, Naruto will not even be moving. You know those Quicksilver moments from X-Men? That’s what Deku is partially doing. In Naruto’s perception, he will be standing normally or attacking, and then in the next instant he has five punches in his chest, has been launched into the air, and then gets hit with an almost 3x his durability attack to the face. A process that will repeat over and over again.

Gearshift makes Deku so much faster than his normal speed it is insane. Sage mode increases speed but it does not let him just blitz people that were contesting with him before. See the fight with Pain or Obito, gaining Sage Mode doesn’t make him straight up blitz people. And that’s assuming he even gets to Sage Mode since Deku is more likely to activate Gearshift well before then, and even then it doesn’t help him.

The Shunshin speed amp is only for a single movement to my knowledge, so he can’t just activate shunshin and permanently be faster. And even then, shunshin is an inferior speed amp to Deku freeze framing Naruto enough to clear the distance and land 5 punches on him without even being perceived.

Also I already explained that Deku can Fa Jin nuke tens of kilometers of area, the clones are not an issue. His normal air attacks in this state can destroy storms larger than islands and he has no civilians he’s worrying about, the clones get poofed well before reaching his position in the air as he flies above them. Tens of Kilometers range is useful here.

The Rasengans get dodged thanks to Danger Sense immediately picking up where Naruto is attacking him from. A quick flick of his foot and he can fly away from any attacks he senses. And the second he activates Gearshift no attack is going to hit him at all.

Both the first and second blitz are exactly the same thing usually in fiction
If you move faster than someone can even react yes the person would look frozen to you.
Him being in kcm doesn't stop him from amping himself more.

Do you even know what shunshin is? Shunshin is literally just high speed movement by focusing more chakra on your feet. So as long as the chakra stays there yes you'd remain that fast.

Once again shunshin is so fast that you completely blitz people with relative speed to you.

You can't quantify a blitz and punching someone 5times before they can counter is actually less impressive than blitzing someone several meters away.

You keep calling stuff inferior without proof. You repeating it doesn't make it so.
Clones are for a distraction buddy. And if they fire bijuu bombs it would cancel out the attacks deku throw out.

What's worse is deku amp has a time limit. All naruto has to do is survive for that long and it is wraps.
And he is not dodging a sage mode odama rasengan barrage which is big enough to cover an entire forest made with wood release.

Deku speed >is completely imperceptible > 2nd Gear > 3rd Gear > Top Gear > Overdrive

Naruto, while already at his strongest form, does not have any speed amps in his arsenal that long term increase his reactions to the point that he can react to Deku moving so fast that he can punch him five times in an instant. Deku quite literally breaks the laws of physics, ignoring inertia and warping the laws of reality, to speed up this fast. If Naruto when fighting Obito or Madara could just blitz them into oblivion with his shunshin and hit them with 5 Rasengans before they could even react, I feel like he would have activated the ability that does that.

This is just straight up wrong.
1. Naruto is not in his strongest form.
2. Punching 5 times in a instant scales to nowhere
3. Madara and obito are not only faster than him most of the time, guess what? They both also have shunshin. Every shinobi does so you cannot just blitz them.

Naruto speed amp is increase in kurama chakra<shunshin <sage mode< shunshin in sage mode. Yeah i don't see a speed advantage for deku

 

[Godernet]

it's not on this naruto's keys statline since it's a bit outdated but his greater rasengan variants like Super Massive and Rasenshuriken are accepted to be at least 2x greater than his physicals.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

my intermediate thoughts is that Naruto dominates very early on until Deku starts to cliff him with his speed increases, naruto's sensory abilities and his own speed amps with body flicker will prevent him from completely being clapped in a one sided affair but i do still think he will be overwhelmed.

that being said Naruto has a ton of options that go beyond just hurting someone and can very much put deku out of the game before gearshift.

will come back to this a bit later with more formulated thoughts .

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Both the first and second blitz are exactly the same thing usually in fiction
If you move faster than someone can even react yes the person would look frozen to you.
Him being in kcm doesn't stop him from amping himself more.

Do you even know what shunshin is? Shunshin is literally just high speed movement by focusing more chakra on your feet. So as long as the chakra stays there yes you'd remain that fast.

Once again shunshin is so fast that you completely blitz people with relative speed to you.

You can't quantify a blitz and punching someone 5times before they can counter is actually less impressive than blitzing someone several meters away.

You keep calling stuff inferior without proof. You repeating it doesn't make it so.
Clones are for a distraction buddy. And if they fire bijuu bombs it would cancel out the attacks deku throw out.

What's worse is deku amp has a time limit. All naruto has to do is survive for that long and it is wraps.
And he is not dodging a sage mode odama rasengan barrage which is big enough to cover an entire forest made with wood release.
This is just straight up wrong.
1. Naruto is not in his strongest form.
2. Punching 5 times in a instant scales to nowhere
3. Madara and obito are not only faster than him most of the time, guess what? They both also have shunshin. Every shinobi does so you cannot just blitz them.

Naruto speed amp is increase in kurama chakra<shunshin <sage mode< shunshin in sage mode. Yeah i don't see a speed advantage for deku

Why did Naruto not blitz Obito and kill him instantly? Or why not blitz Pain when he was in Sage Mode and kill all the paths instantly?

“Blitzing someone several meters away”

Ah so you don’t read Deku’s profile.



In the very first showing of Gearshift, he blitzed across the distance he tossed Shigaraki with Blackchain, punches him five times in the chest, launches him into the sky dozens of meters, and only THEN does Shigaraki question what is even happening to him or recognize that he is being attacked.

The next instant, right after having an Overdrive shoved into his chest and crashing him into the ground from the sky, he can’t even finish bouncing off of the floor before he is again blitzed as Deku rushes down the dozens of meters in the air he, uses Quintuple Detroit Smash, then sends him flying AGAIN before he recognizes that he was hit. He’s moving so fast that AFO thinks that he’s being hit once.

Time limit? He has 5 minutes of Gearshift, but can activate it four separate times, as his supernatural willpower lets him basically ignore the oxygen deprivation for a while. And even then, he can use Overlay and move at Gearshift speeds anyway.

1. For this key, Naruto is 100% at his strongest form besides adding sage mode, a form that does not let him blitz people on par with him.

2. Blitzing someone dozens of meters, then punching them 5 times, then sending them flying through the air and catching up to them at the same time they realize “oh I just got punched” absolutely scales somewhere.

3. Awesome, show me a shunshin blitz from two comparable speed opponents where the one doing the blitzing can hit the other several times, send them flying then catch up to them before they even recognize that they’ve been hit. Then we’re going somewhere.

Also, that means Shunshin is literally what I already said, he focuses chakra to move faster. Deku’s Danger Sense can detect and let him dodge differences in speed comparable to his own Gearshift. So Shunshin is not catching Deku.

Naruto’s speed in KCM LITERALLY comes from him being comparable to Edo Madara, if he could blitz Edo Madara from dozens of meters away and hit him several times before he could even perceive the attacks coming, he would have done that. You adding arbitrary speed amps does not make up the lack of showings.

Naruto clones are getting one tapped by Deku’s massive AoE clearing out several kilometers of land, they can fire back if they wish but clones are not going to last long when their opponent can fly and throw out enough range to nuke the island they’re fighting on. Deku has options to dodge Bijuu bombs but his Fa Jin is able to hit Shigaraki who had Danger Sense precog + his Quirks back. Clones cannot fly so there’s no escaping if Deku decides to gouge out the land to destroy them all.

 

[Metalballrun]

As per how the wiki works, its best to stick with what the profiles say about the characters. Best if it is explained clearly and coherently.
If there is some inconsistency or outdated aspects of a profile, that can be taken to a CRT.

 

[Godernet]

I'm not really trying to get in the middle of your argument but,

Why did Naruto not blitz Obito and kill him instantly?

Obito has the Sharingan, which lets the user perceive blitz-level amps greater than the user, that's why it's the only way to use Chidori, and has allowed people like Sasuke to contend with people much much faster than him like when he fought Bee and the Raikage.

Or why not blitz Pain when he was in Sage Mode and kill all the paths instantly?

Rinnegan gives a shared vision between the paths and enhanced perception.

Naruto’s speed in KCM LITERALLY comes from him being comparable to Edo Madara, if he could blitz Edo Madara from dozens of meters away and hit him several times before he could even perceive the attacks coming, he would have done that. You adding arbitrary speed amps does not make up the lack of showings.

Madara has the Rinnegan + Sensory abilities + his own Shunshin.

pretty much every person Naruto fights past the Pain Arc (Pain, Itachi, Ay, Obito, Madara, Kaguya, Momoshiki, Sasuke, etc; have crazy enhanced perception abilities + some other kind of sensory ability.

 

[Godernet]

As per how the wiki works, its best to stick with what the profiles say about the characters. Best if it is explained clearly and coherently.
If there is some inconsistency or outdated aspects of a profile, that can be taken to a CRT.

what if its already accepted in a CRT just not on the profile?

 

[Therefir]

14 years since the creation of VSBattles and Naruto's profiles still can't get their shit together.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

I'm not really trying to get in the middle of your argument but,

Obito has the Sharingan, which lets the user perceive blitz-level amps greater than the user, that's why it's the only way to use Chidori, and has allowed people like Sasuke to contend with people much much faster than him like when he fought Bee and the Raikage.

Rinnegan gives a shared vision between the paths and enhanced perception.

Madara has the Rinnegan + Sensory abilities + his own Shunshin.

pretty much every person Naruto fights past the Pain Arc (Pain, Itachi, Ay, Obito, Madara, Kaguya, Momoshiki, Sasuke, etc; have crazy enhanced perception abilities + some other kind of sensory ability.

That’s fine then, his opponents have methods of reacting to his blitz.

However, I would still like to understand where this belief that the Shunshin Jutsu lets you not only completely blitz anyone who is normally comparable to your speed (I understand it does that), but lets you hit them five times in a row AND launch them dozens of meters away before they have even perceived that they have taken damage at all, only for the user to then surpass the speed they launched their enemy to hit them again and repeat the process over and over again.

 

[TheRustyOne]

what if its already accepted in a CRT just not on the profile?

Irrelevant, please to stick to what's on the character's profile.

That goes for everyone here.

If something is true, best to do whatever you can to get it added.