Kamijou Touma vs Morrigan Aensland

[Zhaoshuais]

After considered Morrigan's strong points,I think she need an opponent who has perfect resistance against soul attack and enough tier to fight against a god.

And I feel strange that no one open a battle for Kamijou Touma.

Of course,if Morrigan knows Touma's ability and battle record, the best choice is to avoid this battle, but for Touma, he has reason to fight,as his imagine breaker may be able to save the soul of Morrigan's victims.

 

[LazyHunter]

Sorry, but if you check Morrigan's stats you'll see that Touma gets stomped really hard, even if you accept IB being 3-A for negating Gungnir.

I think you're misunderstanding something, NT9's match of Othinus vs Touma had some unique circumstances, in no way it gives Touma a special ability/experience to fight gods, especially considering how much a "god" can vary in power even in the same verse. Touma doesn't have any innate resistance to soul attacks, much less perfect, though depending on the mechanics IB could likely interfere with them.

 

[Gemmysaur]

What's Touma gonna do anyway? She punches him at relativistic+ speeds. Even if you count her entire existence as a whole as magic, his precog is still MHS+, a far cry from her speed.

Then there's this.

Of course,if Morrigan knows Touma's ability and battle record

Stomp.

 

[Cropfist]

Due to the reasons mentioned above, the guy in my profile pic gets stomped.

 

[Andykhang]

Sorry, but if you check Morrigan's stats you'll see that Touma gets stomped really hard, even if you accept IB being 3-A for negating Gungnir.
I think you're misunderstanding something, NT9's match of Othinus vs Touma had some unique circumstances, in no way it gives Touma a special ability/experience to fight gods, especially considering how much a "god" can vary in power even in the same verse. Touma doesn't have any innate resistance to soul attacks, much less perfect, though depending on the mechanics IB could likely interfere with them.

Guess you forgot the only reason Kamijou could still stand against her is because she fall for him a little bit. Then after that she fall for him hard and unconciously hitting on him (according to my headcanon at least)

 

[Gemmysaur]

I think that's what LazyHunter meant with "unique circumstances".

Is it true Othinus turned to the size of a doll though?

 

[LazyHunter]

She didn't fall for him until after she killed him and realized he was what she had been looking for all that time, but this doesn't really matter, the novels made perfectly clear that Touma can't fight a Magic God that's actually trying to kill him.

Yep, she's now 15 cm tall, which is what little of her existence True Gremlin gathered before she completely disappeared at the end of NT10.

 

[Andykhang]

^Don't break my dream like that, you know

Jk. Well, without the love thing, she's ironically the one closest to him without being a love interset.

 

[Zhaoshuais]

Sorry, but if you check Morrigan's stats you'll see that Touma gets stomped really hard, even if you accept IB being 3-A for negating Gungnir.
I think you're misunderstanding something, NT9's match of Othinus vs Touma had some unique circumstances, in no way it gives Touma a special ability/experience to fight gods, especially considering how much a "god" can vary in power even in the same verse. Touma doesn't have any innate resistance to soul attacks, much less perfect, though depending on the mechanics IB could likely interfere with them.

I should point out that all other Magic Gods including Aleister Crowley bet on Touma beat Othinus!

And later Touma beat Kamisato,so my opinion is that you completely misjudged Touma's real level.

 

[Zhaoshuais]

Sorry, but if you check Morrigan's stats you'll see that Touma gets stomped really hard, even if you accept IB being 3-A for negating Gungnir.
I think you're misunderstanding something, NT9's match of Othinus vs Touma had some unique circumstances, in no way it gives Touma a special ability/experience to fight gods, especially considering how much a "god" can vary in power even in the same verse. Touma doesn't have any innate resistance to soul attacks, much less perfect, though depending on the mechanics IB could likely interfere with them.

And if you check Touma's history,you will find out that he has defeated opponents with higher stats.In fact,he know he can really kill a god from beginning-before he lost his momory!

 

[Zhaoshuais]

She didn't fall for him until after she killed him and realized he was what she had been looking for all that time, but this doesn't really matter, the novels made perfectly clear that Touma can't fight a Magic God that's actually trying to kill him.
Yep, she's now 15 cm tall, which is what little of her existence True Gremlin gathered before she completely disappeared at the end of NT10.

But Aleister Crowley seems have different opinion,as he never worry Touma may die or defeated,even when Touma is fighting against some strong opponents, including Aureolus Izzard´╝îFiamma of the Right and Othinus´╝îit seems that Aleister believes Touma is unbeatable.

 

[LordAizenSama]

Most of his toumas victories were circumstancial and have nothing to do with a versus fight.

Izzard was toying with touma until he got defeated by the Dragon arm

Accelerator was too cocky/stupid, all he had to do was keep using his gravel shotgun (his signature move at the time) and he would of won.

Fiamma needed Touma around and got screwed over by plot requiring him to take Touma's right arm. He defeats touma earlier on too iirc

Othinus literally defeated herself mentally when she threw Gungnir out of mental fatigue from killing touma billions of times. She still physically beat him in the end though, she only lost to his ideals. 50/50 Othinus owned Touma and destroyed the invisible thing too.

 

[Andykhang]

^True on all of that, a bit of add-on: That's thanks to his right hand that cancel out his luck, good or bad, along with any other Death-related destiny, so he's technically too out of luck to die.

 

[Zhaoshuais]

Most of his toumas victories were circumstancial and have nothing to do with a versus fight.
Izzard was toying with touma until he got defeated by the Dragon arm

Accelerator was too cocky/stupid, all he had to do was keep using his gravel shotgun (his signature move at the time) and he would of won.

Fiamma needed Touma around and got screwed over by plot requiring him to take Touma's right arm. He defeats touma earlier on too iirc

Othinus literally defeated herself mentally when she threw Gungnir out of mental fatigue from killing touma billions of times. She still physically beat him in the end though, she only lost to his ideals. 50/50 Othinus owned Touma and destroyed the invisible thing too.

If toumas victories were circumstancial then Aleister Crowley would not allow the most important part of his plan take this risk. I'm afraid that Aleister Crowley know Touma's real hidden power, and he clearly know that Touma's victories were not circumstancial.

We labeled Imagine breaker 3-A,but then he should have a higher tier considering he still have stronger hidden power in his body.Not only the dragon head from broken arm,but the real strong power which appear from his head.

 

[LazyHunter]

Except they are circumstancial and you're the one completely misjudging Touma's capabilities here. There's a reason Touma could go from facing Othinus, to facing a boss rush, to facing St. Germain without enemies after Othinus being any less dangerous to him. Kamachi's MCs are not shonen heroes who constantly grow in power and use that raw power + new forms/techniques the beat the next strong bad guy, who's stronger than the previous villain and weaker than the next one. Kamachi prefers to have weaker protagonists that use a limited power/set of skills to defeat the enemy with their smarts, environment and cooperation with allies, which leaves them hanging in this kind of versus fights which are more about how much power/speed or hax abilities you have. Their victories are mostly one-time things that likely wouldn't be replicated in other scenarios. They don't work that well in most universes outside their own, and Touma is the same as the others in that regard. Really, the only exceptions are Accelerator, Beatrice and Boo Boo. Accelerator would hilariously stomp all other Kamachi protagonists in an hypothetical crossverse battle royal.

If you really want to make a battle with Touma, find an enemy that's similar to normal magicians in Toaru. It has to be an enemy that uses mostly ranged supernatural powers, not ridiculously above Touma's precog and whose Durability doesn't make it impossible for Touma to win (so human durability, maybe with supernaturally enhanced durability that Touma can break). Not many around here, but maybe you could try with Voldemort.

Otherwise, you're wanking Touma and missing the point of his character and Kamachi's MCs in general. Side-note, Touma negating Gungnir is probably an outlier, as Touma struggles with much weaker attacks. Yeah, there's also matters of compatiblity, regenerating powers and all that, but the difference in power should probably make that irrelevant.

This isn't really the best place to discuss Touma's strength, you can use the Toaru Thread if you want to ask questions, make suggestions or ask why people are rated like they are. This thread should be closed since it's an obvious stomp.