Legend of Zelda downgrades. Part 2.

[Antvasima]

Continued from here, due to that the thread was too long.

 

[ShadMorgen]

Is there anything left to address or discuss? I feel all points have gotten across by now.

I hope people will fully read the thread before continuing here.

 

[The_great_ZZ]

It is over finally.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Is there anything left to address or discuss? I feel all points have gotten across by now.

I hope people will fully read the thread before continuing here.

I just read the Death Battle analysis by their research team and saw that you were a guest. Proud of ya, man. Along with homestuck. After reading through it, I'm understanding where you're coming from.

 

[The_great_ZZ]

I just read the Death Battle analysis by their research team and saw that you were a guest. Proud of ya, man. Along with homestuck. After reading through it, I'm understanding where you're coming from.

Does that mean that this thread has concluded?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Seeing how I'm not the only dissenter, and I only understand, not agree yet, no.

 

[UncleSpaceman]

• ToC Link is still Multi-Continent Level via powerscaling from Faro

• Demise is still Planet Level via power-scaling from Gano, the Hyrule Hystoria also states that Demise can destroy the world.

• Anybody who reads the calculatiowill find out why Link has to be flipping the planet.

 

[XxFNAFCraft911xX]

It's a blatant hypebole though, for Demise.

 

[UncleSpaceman]

It's a blatant hypebole though, for Demise.

Even if it's hyperbole, Demise is still Planet Level via power-scaling from Gano.

 

[SeiryuShin]

" Complete full Triforce is a single planet wide reality warping wish, that's about all you can get from it."

- Just going to answer this is completely disproven in ALttP where a world literally falls apart if the complete Triforce is removed. Other than that I don't care for Hyrule Warriors and the Master Sword is not as powerful as the Full Triforce.

 

[Xolon]

" Complete full Triforce is a single planet wide reality warping wish, that's about all you can get from it."
- Just going to answer this is completely disproven in ALttP where a world literally falls apart if the complete Triforce is removed. Other than that I don't care for Hyrule Warriors and the Master Sword is not as powerful as the Full Triforce.

A complete triforce supporting a world doesn't prove that it passively boosts whoever has it. From what we've seen they have to make a wish to make use of it.

 

[SeiryuShin]

The Triforce piece protected Link from the Twilight Realm in Twilight Princess so it kinda does

 

[ShadMorgen]

At this point I'm just nearly tired of this thread, I've consistently made all of my points as clear as I can. Spent most of last week on this, and I don't have the time anymore, lol.

Just going to wait for a verdict at this point.

Thanks to everyone who contributed. Just want you guys to know that it's not like I'm spiting the verse, or that this even has anything to do with Death Battle in anyway. I'm a HUGE LoZ fan(if ya hadn't guessed already), I just hate seeing verses I like get wanked beyond all reason. I prefer verses I like to stay at their actual tiers and powers. I'm saying this because I remember one or two people in the previous thread accusing me of bias because of the DB or something, which I ignored.

If anyone has any legit questions, that haven't been addressed at least five times I'll likely reply and address them. Otherwise, I'm just going to wait for the verdict.

 

[ShadMorgen]

The Triforce piece protected Link from the Twilight Realm in Twilight Princess so it kinda does

This is a new one. It's a passive ability of the individual pieces of the Triforce, Zelda's protected her too. In no way, shape or form does this mean that the full triforce provides a boost of any kind. In fact, when the Triforce gets full assembled we never actually see anyone in "possession" of it. It becomes physical, at which point you must touch it and make a wish.

 

[SeiryuShin]

Ganon has the Full Triforce in the Downfall timeline after killing both other holders of it. The... roughly two times Link has it he almost immediately wishes on it, if i recall correctly

 

[Antvasima]

@ShadMorgen Well, I am starting to lean in the direction of agreeing with you, but given that this is an important revision thread, you really should place messages on the message walls of all the administrators and moderators, asking for input here in this thread. You can tell them that I asked for it.

 

[UncleSpaceman]

The Triforce piece protected Link from the Twilight Realm in Twilight Princess so it kinda does

This is a new one. It's a passive ability of the individual pieces of the Triforce, Zelda's protected her too. In no way, shape or form does this mean that the full triforce provides a boost of any kind. In fact, when the Triforce gets full assembled we never actually see anyone in "possession" of it. It becomes physical, at which point you must touch it and make a wish.

iirc it's been stated multiple times that Ganon gets power from the ToP.

 

[ShadMorgen]

@ShadMorgen Well, I am starting to lean in the direction of agreeing with you, but given that this is an important revision thread, you really should place messages on the message walls of all the administrators and moderators, asking for input here in this thread. You can tell them that I asked for it.

Oh all of them? Will do so later. I only left messages on around 5 or so, I will leave messages for all of them this evening, thanks.

 

[ShadMorgen]

iirc it's been stated multiple times that Ganon gets power from the ToP.

Absolutely no one is arguing that the ToP doesn't give him power.

 

[Gwynbleiddd]

Although i don't know anything about said verse (again) ,but i think that what the OP says sounds reasonable and if other members support said statements about the weapons being non-cannon etc. i have no problem with the changes.

Note: I haven't nor will i read the previous comments.

 

[Promestein]

There's a lot to read through.

I agree with the OP on the things established on the old thread. No problem with the changes.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay then. I would prefer more staff comments before clearing him to start revising the Zelda pages though.

 

[UncleSpaceman]

Okay then. I would prefer more staff comments before clearing him to start revising the Zelda pages though.

• While Majora is likely > than ToC, the ToC can still be scaled to Multi-Continent Level via Faro.

• The fact that Ganon is Planet Level makes the statment that Demise can destroy the planet not hyperbole. Also Demise could just be scaled to Planet Level via Gano.

• The golden gauntlets calculation clearly explains why Link is flipping the planet.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

I noticed no one actually argued it being non-canon and the only canon information implies the characters, even when amped, are less than or comparable to multi-continent characters. This seems reasonable.

 

[Antvasima]

What makes Ganon Planet level specifically?

 

[UncleSpaceman]

What makes Ganon Planet level specifically?

He was in possession of the full Triforce, which is capable of at least Planet-wide reality warps.

 

[ShadMorgen]

He was in possession of the full Triforce, which is capable of at least Planet-wide reality warps.

Man, have you not been following the thread? This does NOT mean he scales in any way. We have already determined that being in possession of the full Triforce does not mean that is a stat boost to planet level. It's a single wish. In no way, shape or form does this make the Demise statement less hyperbolic.

 

[UncleSpaceman]

He was in possession of the full Triforce, which is capable of at least Planet-wide reality warps.

Man, have you not been following the thread? This does NOT mean he scales in any way. We have already determined that being in possession of the full Triforce does not mean that is a stat boost to planet level. It's a single wish. In no way, shape or form does this make the Demise statement less hyperbolic.

Ganon is in possession of an "omnipotent" power that is at-least Planet Level. The ToP gives Ganon strength and power, so i see no reason why the full Triforce does not do the same.

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

Okay so i actually don't have any particular care in somethign like this but i'll bite for a few comments.

Can someone kindly tell me a summary of what's the problem here?

 

[ShadMorgen]

Okay so i actually don't have any particular care in somethign like this but i'll bite for a few comments.
Can someone kindly tell me a summary of what's the problem here?

I'll quote myself.

"Composite Link's base AP to be changed to city-island level, as this is where he is correctly placed, through consistent scaling to characters that have displayed this power. Firmly island. For Fierce Deity to be put at the next bracket of AP, at multi continetal, due to it defeating Majora, who no one else scales to.

Obviously similar changes to other characters would be completely necessary."

From about halfway down the last thread. When I asked Alakabamm for input at the very end of the last thread, I addressed all his questions, which may also help. Lemme know if need anything else.

 

[UncleSpaceman]

I'll quote myself.

"Composite Link's base AP to be changed to city-island level, as this is where he is correctly placed, through consistent scaling to characters that have displayed this power. Firmly island. For Fierce Deity to be put at the next bracket of AP, at multi continetal, due to it defeating Majora, who no one else scales to.

Obviously similar changes to other characters would be completely necessary."

From about halfway down the last thread. When I asked Alakabamm for input at the very end of the last thread, I addressed all his questions, which may also help. Lemme know if need anything else.

Faron, Eldin, & Lanayru together are weaker than Demise. This is evident by how Faron, Eldin, & Lanayru were unable to stop Demise. However the Triforce was able to stop Demise. Hence any of the 3 pieces of the Triforce should be stronger than Faro, who is Continent Level.

So, the ToC and ToP can be scaled to Multi-Continent Level via Faro

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

Alright i'm back. Had to sleep due to a rough day in college.

• Cough* Okay besides that.

@Shadmorgan: So Link should be changed to Island level which has been his most consistant level of power, with Fierce Deity as Multi-Continent. Hmm alright.

 

[UncleSpaceman]

@CrossverseCrisis

As i said before

"Faro, Eldin, & Lanayru together are weaker than Demise. This is evident by how Faron, Eldin, & Lanayru were unable to stop Demise. However the Triforce was able to stop Demise. Hence any of the 3 pieces of the Triforce should be stronger than Faro, who is Continent Level."

So Link with the ToC should be Multi-Continent Level via power scaling from Faro. None of the stats really need to be changed, only the reasoning.

As for Demise, it should be added that he is comparable to Gano, to make the Planet destruction statement not hyperbole.

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

@Uncle: But then we lead to Link being Multi-Continent by scaling from Faron. Okay.

And finally Demise being comprable to Ganon. Hmm.

 

[Metabro]

I'm seeing Faron being brought up a lot now. The calc revolving around her feat relies entirely on scaling from this [map]. I understand video games maps are not always to scale, but this one just takes the cake. Not only are the distances between each region completely obscured and unknown, the small town of Skyloft would take up huge chunks of these areas!

This isn't the same as using logical pixel scaling like the kind we see in Chrono Trigger's calcs. In those instances we get a very clear grasp of the areas of the CT world's landmasses and continents. Here? This map might as well be pretty pictures. Nothing to base a supposedly indisputable calc on

If that wasn't enough, just look at the [Faron Woods] for yourselves. It certainly doesn't appear like an area hundreds of kilometers wide. Hell, there are cities larger than this area if we compare the Tree's size to its surroundings. And you can't argue that Faron's flood would extend past the horizon either, as the mountains in the distance would surely contain the water

 

[UncleSpaceman]

I'm seeing Faron being brought up a lot now. The calc revolving around her feat relies entirely on scaling from this [map]. I understand video games maps are not always to scale, but this one just takes the cake. Not only are the distances between each region completely obscured and unknown, the small town of Skyloft would take up huge chunks of these areas!
This isn't the same as using logical pixel scaling like the kind we see in Chrono Trigger's calcs. In those instances we get a very clear grasp of the areas of the CT world's landmasses and continents. Here? This map might as well be pretty pictures. Nothing to base a supposedly indisputable calc on

If that wasn't enough, just look at the [Faron Woods] for yourselves. It certainly doesn't appear like an area hundreds of kilometers wide. Hell, there are cities larger than this area if we compare the Tree's size to its surroundings. And you can't argue that Faron's flood would extend past the horizon either, as the mountains in the distance would surely contain the water

What you said here is just wrong...

 

[Metabro]

I would certainly like to know why...

 

[A6colute]

"Composite Link's base AP to be changed to city-island level, as this is where he is correctly placed, through consistent scaling to characters that have displayed this power. Firmly island. For Fierce Deity to be put at the next bracket of AP, at multi continetal, due to it defeating Majora, who no one else scales to.

Obviously similar changes to other characters would be completely necessary."

Well, I, personally, don't have a problem with it.

 

[ShadMorgen]

Just gonnna adress a few things quickly. (Been busy lately so haven't had much time to check the thread)

Scaling Demise to Ganon, which is planet off a bunk theory is just pure folly that has been debunked. Aside from that, why would Demose scale to a wish, when he himself sought the Triforce?

Metabro has explained why Faron is derpy, so I don't need to say more. However. The calc itself yielded continent level iirc, so why are you saying it puts Link at multi continental? That's just wank breh.

Thanks to everyone who has checked the thread and given their input by the way.

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

Well in any case, i'm just gonna go with what's reasonable and say that your reasons are alright to go by, Shad.