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Luke Cage Upgrade

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Izreldan

Izreldan

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So, I've been having doubts that Luke Cage is only Low 7-C and after some research, I discovered that Luke Cage is indeed far above Spider-Man Tier

He's defeated Iron Fist on two seperate occasions: once in Cage Volume 1 Issue #12 and once in Thunderbolts Volume 1 Issue #137 (Sorry, no scans were uploaded for these comics, I searched and searched, but ask someone with knowledge of these comics and they can confirm what happened)

And he fought against Shadowland Daredevil, who tanked a blast from Restricted Ghost Rider

Also, both Marvel.com and the Marvel Wiki place Luke Cage on the same level as Restricted Ghost Rider in both strength and speed

Proposed Revisions: Luke Cage be upgraded to 7-A and Hypersonic+
 
I will ask Matthew to comment here.
 
Isn't that a low end?

If he's defeated Iron Fist on multiple occasions then he's 7A.
 
Yes, but we have Luke Cage defeat him twice.

Luke Cage being 7A would also be a high end.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
Even Low 7-C is pushing it since he almost died from the blast. 7-A is just no.
Click to expand...
1. Marvel characters have gotten a lot weaker in recent years, Luke in Age of Ultron was just weak compared to Luke in other comics, like for example, World War Hulk by feats alone was really only 7-B for destroying New York in a fight with The Sentry

2. Luke actually has feats that would put him at much higher levels but I didn't include them because I considered them outliers, Luke has fought Class 100's like Namor, he's one-shotted The Thing, and he's even stalemated Wonder Man and Green Hulk, 7-A is a minumum for Luke Cage, I was originally considering to push for a higher tier but I thought that 7-A was a fair minimum
 
I don't personally mind scaling Luke from Iron Fist. He is supposed to be considerably stronger than Spider-Man as far as I am aware.
 
However, if Matthew disagrees, I will not push the issue.
 
I disagree. I think it is too uncertain.

Also World War Hulk has a High 5-A feat so that comparison is factually incorrect.

Secondly, even Spider-Man has hurt 4-Bs in Marvel.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
I disagree. I think it is too uncertain.

Also World War Hulk has a High 5-A feat so that comparison is factually incorrect.

Secondly, even Spider-Man has hurt 4-Bs in Marvel.
Click to expand...
I'm not talking about Worldbreaker Hulk, I'm talking about Base Green Scar Hulk, before he used Worldbreaker
 
Well, area of effect is not a good indicator of power, especially as he overpowered the Sentry.
 
Antvasima said:
I don't personally mind scaling Luke from Iron Fist. He is supposed to be considerably stronger than Spider-Man as far as I am aware.
Click to expand...
Actually, I intended him to be scaled primarily from Restricted Ghost Rider, as I stated in my third point, Luke Cage was officially listed as being in the same strength class as Restricted Ghost Rider
 
Antvasima said:
Well, area of effect is not a good indicator of power, especially as he overpowered the Sentry.
Click to expand...
Hulk was equal to Sentry, they both exhausted each other in the fight and reverted back to their human forms, it was more of a stalemate than Hulk overpowering Sentry
 
Well, Luke Cage is usually presented as stronger than Spider-Man nowadays. For example, he stomped Norman Osborn.
 
Of course, defeating Proxima Midnight (and the like) is a massive outlier, but I do think that he is consistently shown as above Spider-Man's league.
 
Well, he is supposed to be stronger than Captain America, but as you know, I am not sure about scaling from the feat of moving the Hulk at massively hypersonic speed.
 
^^^ to be honest, I don't like scaling from that feat either, I feel like it could be considered an outlier for Spider-Man
 
I don't agree with scaling Luke Cage to Ghost Rider, as the Stats Guide is unreliable and we have stopped using them.

I also agree with downgrading Spider-Man and other characters to At least 8-A, as it is much more consistent.

I agree the Low 7-C feat being an outlier. Plus, it is the High-End of the feat, the feat also has 8-B and High 8-C ends. So I think Low 7-C being downgraded to At least 8-A.
 
Antvasima said:
Well, he is supposed to be stronger than Captain America, but as you know, I am not sure about scaling from the feat of moving the Hulk at massively hypersonic speed.
Click to expand...
At least 8-A would be good for Spider-Man, yes.

But I need Darkanine to calc Spidey and Electro's feats.
 
I don't think Low 7-C Luke Cage is an outlier since he is FAR more durable than Spider-Man and his feat is very straightforward, i.e, being hit in the face with a nuclear explosion.
 
It only damaged his skin, his body's outermost layer. He was left with severe burns and knocked unconscious and put on life support, but it still failed to damage his body internally. This means that you can apply Backwards Scaling to the explosion. A human can be killed by attacks in the Thousands of Joules, Luke Cage should logically endure attacks 10s - 100s of times weaker than the explosion
 
@Matthew

Yeah, we need some Electro feats calculated first, to avoid creating a mess.
 
TeenAngel101 said:
I don't agree with scaling Luke Cage to Ghost Rider, as the Stats Guide is unreliable and we have stopped using them.

I also agree with downgrading Spider-Man and other characters to At least 8-A, as it is much more consistent.

I agree the Low 7-C feat being an outlier. Plus, it is the High-End of the feat, the feat also has 8-B and High 8-C ends. So I think Low 7-C being downgraded to At least 8-A.
Click to expand...
I actually think Spider-Man should go back to High 8-C, but I wouldn't mind a 8-B Spider-Man, 8-A still seems to high for Spidey in my opinion, on that subject, I disagree with Captain America and other Enhanced Level characters in Marvel being 8-A, I think they should go back to 9-B
 
@Izreldan

So you think they should all be 9-B despite the numerous Tier 8 feats from the likes of Deadpool, Captain America, Black Panther, Wolverine, Spider-Man, etc...

But you also think that Luke Cage should be Mountain level?
 
Also, "Enhanced Level" is totally meaningless. A fictional Super Soldier is as strong as his feats show him to be, him being "Merely a supersoldier" is not a valid argument to ignore feats. It's purely incredulity.
 
Dude, calm down. He brought up Mountain level because of a scaling issue. He no longer thinks so and agrees with the downgrade.

Also, I kinda have to agree. Characters like Captain America and Black Panther being 8-A seems a bit iffy.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
@Izreldan
So you think they should all be 9-B despite the numerous Tier 8 feats from the likes of Deadpool, Captain America, Black Panther, Wolverine, Spider-Man, etc...

But you also think that Luke Cage should be Mountain level?
Click to expand...
They're all 8-A by scaling from Deadpool's durability, you do realize that Deadpool is a joke character right? His durability cannot be taken seriously, that would be like taking Tom from Tom and Jerry's durability seriously.

Plus, Luke Cage should be Mountain Level by feats, not just scaling, he beat Iron Fist twice and fought someone who no-selled attacks from Ghost Rider, I personally don't like being heavily reliant on scaling alone, that's why I included feats alongside scaling.
 
Well, we tend to scale from the higher feats, not the average showings.
 
It also brings up scaling issues. Daredevil fought Captain America, and drew blood from him. Should Daredevil be 8-A? And from scaling characters like Black Widow, Hawkeye, Electra, and Punisher?

IMG 0564
 
Deadpool is not 100% a joke character, people exagerate that. Specially in the 90s he used to be semi-serious.

And Deadpool's joke is that he is comical and breaks the 4th Wall. He doesn't have toon force. If he had he wouldn't be losing limbs and being eviscerated every other issue.
 
Captain America rolfstomped Daredevil.

You people need to understand that there's a big gap between the likes of Daredevil and Captain America, but everyone fights everyone in comics all the time, and to not make either character pathetic to not annoy the fans, fights tend to be equal.

Regardless, Captain America was completely unharmed by Gambit's explosives which always easily destroy sentinels. He's held buildings from falling on him by sheer strength, survived large explosions, easily beats Deadpool, etc.

By feats he is far beyond Wall level.

And I am sorry, I spend months researching Captain America and writing a 49,010 byte sized Blog about him to reach this conclusion.
 
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