MASSIVE UPGRADE TYLER DURDEN (COMIC)

[Jeeeeepil123]

There's so many canon in Fight Club Series that is not been explored seriously, because it seems like all of Chuck Palahniuk's work is related to one and another...
So i would like to explain a little bit about it;

First, in “Make Something Up: Stories You Can't Unread - Expedition” we get a detail about Tyler Durden is not just tingling arounds The Narrator's head, perhaps, more widen as Felix M experienced the same as him or maybe everyone else (As Tyler itself is a Mental Concept Virus, he's actually is everyone else)...

• Low 2-C Upgrade
First and foremost, there's this explanation about their “world” they are living, its the same as ours basically where mathematics contains the physical world, such as “time and space” and it would be atleast include mathematical dimension aswell[1]... not only that tho, it also have “words” which contains the invisible one (this could be the one that contains time and space, but i couldn't interpret it enough... so if i'm wrong, lmk) and to be specific, i think “words” here is supposed to be an information aspect.
[1] https://gyazo.com/dc471969885e71a9aebdda12be5ac38b
[2] https://gyazo.com/f926c75df2e7bb8aa6ab88e6308f93ab
Now those what about Tyler? Well, its simple... in an interview with Chuck (i forgot the web which they interviewed him), he says that Tyler have did his every “chaotic” work since the beginning of time... which kinda imply that he's already existed before time, and create time and space just to explore his more chaotic work

Gyazo

gyazo.com

(Because Chuck says, Tyler “runs” everything at exact time birth... and it wouldn't be possible because what person is already do such work in his first birth? Unless Tyler has existed before it, and create it just for his sake)
+ To strenghten the facts, i have another evidence;
[1] https://gyazo.com/3da5b43ef8bca9aadef6a6df06dd1818
[2] https://gyazo.com/f7b3754d9109566f926942fafe2076a3
Short Conclusion: Low 2-C Tier, Beyond-Dimensional Existence (Type 1), Mathematics Manipulation & Information Manipulation (Type 2)

• Low 1-C Upgrade
And after all of that, we know that Fight Club Cosmology supports 4-D atleast (Or higher because mathematics dimension? But its too reaching i guess)... and Real World which Chuck Palahniuk reside is absolute surpassed that said cosmology, as it also consist R>F Transcendence in it.
And to make it simply, Chuck Palahniuk is confidently saying he can control his fiction... but then stated that he can't control Tyler Durden[1] As Tyler is itself anti-authority rhetoric that can killed the author pf his very being without a flinch[2]
[1] https://gyazo.com/b79d10f5223b934f73b2ec38dde38cde
[2] https://gyazo.com/10e5457408f009444fba583112ad93fd
And after that he lived (actually lived) in the Real World as a citizen just like every Fight Club characters that have been brought by Chuck Palahniuk... Tyler's role now is as same as Chuck Palahniuk

Gyazo

gyazo.com

Another evidence that Tyler can actually destroys Chuck Palahniuk and any other existence

Gyazo

gyazo.com

+ to strengthen R>F Transcendence in Real World, its actually very simple... infact, i don't have to use this maybe because all of which i explain above is already R>F Indication.
The Real World is basically inaccessible, just like we ours can't be visited by mere fiction... and here they follow the same logic. But Chuck can ignore this logic and bring his fiction, up to his reality.

Gyazo

gyazo.com

Which you may say “Then Tyler is not Low 1-C, as Chuck brought him”... well, its wrong... so you see in Fight Club 2; Issues #10, after the chaos ended, Chuck Palahniuk get a massive backlash from readers and to be a surprise... Tyler is also there (Chuck bring Fight Club into reality is after the backlash)! Meaning, Tyler doesn't necessarily need his authors to begin with... and could progress on his own.
As then Chuck stated that Tyler can surpassed him, and he wants Tyler to surpass him

Gyazo

gyazo.com

Short Conclusion: Low 1-C (Of course)

Agree:
Disagree:
Neutral:

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

Bump

 

[Agnaa]

From the scans posted, this seems incorrect based on the information given.

A statement that someone "runs everything, and has since the beginning of time" is not justification for literally anything. Especially not Low 2-C, BDE, Math Manip, and Info Manip. It's just a flowery way of describing someone having been in control.

The Low 1-C stuff also seems to go against our standards. It looks like an author avatar that's placed as extremely weak, rather than as an actual transcendental figure; we don't give tier 1 to every feat of killing "the author". The WoG is something a fair few authors say about their characters, of feeling like the characters can direct the flow of the story to some extent, but that doesn't result in anything meaningful.

From a quick look at the profile, it also seems to make other weird leaps, i.e.

Reality Warping & Time Travel (Tyler can make the world instantly goes into destruction with his consent detail... As Tyler then stated that the world is just a game as his consent can chose any events. And with that, he can also travel to the future aswell)

Time Travel might work, it's hard to tell due to the sparse context, but Reality Warping is unjustified; those scans don't demonstrate what you say they do. One shows Tyler talking about potential future plans with some evocative imagery being drawn, that doesn't seem to literally be occurring, and the other one just shows relevant visuals while they're talking about philosophy.

In fact, you were told exactly that when you tried to add that to his page a few days ago, yet you added it to the profile anyway? You've flagrantly violated our rules for applying revisions.

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

A statement that someone "runs everything, and has since the beginning of time" is not justification for literally anything. Especially not Low 2-C, BDE, Math Manip, and Info Manip. It's just a flowery way of describing someone having been in control.

I already gave the evidence which supports these claims, the mathematic is based on Felix M statement about Physical World around him and the information that puts on the Invisible one...
As about Tyler scale, i also gave backup evidence for that above... Tyler has run this thing for the entire creation (It is also stated by Chuck Palahniuk interview in Comic Con 2015, you can check that up)

The Low 1-C stuff also seems to go against our standards. It looks like an author avatar that's placed as extremely weak, rather than as an actual transcendental figure; we don't give tier 1 to every feat of killing "the author". The WoG is something a fair few authors say about their characters, of feeling like the characters can direct the flow of the story to some extent, but that doesn't result in anything meaningful.

I mean, generally, if you drag your fiction into reality... wouldn't it also make you entirely weak? Tho Chuck Palahniuk isn't necesseraly that weak, he can turn "his reality" into fiction and vice versa, he have full control over it (I mean, the interview scan i gave also stated that... right?)

Time Travel might work, it's hard to tell due to the sparse context, but Reality Warping is unjustified; those scans don't demonstrate what you say they do. One shows Tyler talking about potential future plans with some evocative imagery being drawn, that doesn't seem to literally be occurring, and the other one just shows relevant visuals while they're talking about philosophy.

I planned to remove Reality Warping.
As about Time Travel, it ends there as Tyler said “The Future”... its the only scans, it skipped to Marla if i'm not mistaken (I don't intend to buried any context by any means)

In fact, you were told exactly that when you tried to add that to his page a few days ago, yet you added it to the profile anyway? You've flagrantly violated our rules for applying revisions.

There's no much to say, Lephyr isn't fully disagreed... he's giving me suggestion on what should be put on the profile, as i reply to him and didn't respond further i just take that as a yes... anyway, if i'm in the wrong position i apologies

I also asked Ant about Tier with Standard Equipment and he said that its okay, so i think it will not be a problem

 

[Agnaa]

For most of those, it's hard to know exactly what you're referencing, but I looked through all the scans in the OP and found them unsatisfactory.

If you want to remind me about a particular one, please re-link it when discussing it.

There's no much to say, Lephyr isn't fully disagreed... he's giving me suggestion on what should be put on the profile

He disagreed with it being reality warping, but he said some nukes were fine as optional equipment, and suggested a more proper tier for them.

as i reply to him and didn't respond further i just take that as a yes... anyway, if i'm in the wrong position i apologies

You shouldn't do that; you should wait for explicit confirmation.

I also asked Ant about Tier with Standard Equipment and he said that its okay, so i think it will not be a problem

You asked him about a generic formatting question (and yeah, you can list tiers for standard/optional equipment); he doesn't actually know enough about the context to agree with the specifics.

And the stuff which you added was at odds with what was agreed with on the thread; Lephyr said you could add it as optional equipment, not standard equipment because of one scan showing a few missiles. You misinterpreted that and incorrectly gave Tyler access to every single weapon and missile on the planet and put it down as standard equipment.

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

For most of those, it's hard to know exactly what you're referencing, but I looked through all the scans in the OP and found them unsatisfactory

Its the first and second scan of the thread

He disagreed with it being reality warping, but he said some nukes were fine as optional equipment, and suggested a more proper tier for them

I already remve Reality Warping from the profile

You shouldn't do that; you should wait for explicit confirmation.

I don't want the thread to become dead and abandon like other threads, sorry

And the stuff which you added was at odds with what was agreed with on the thread; Lephyr said you could add it as optional equipment, not standard equipment because of one scan showing a few missiles. You misinterpreted that and incorrectly gave Tyler access to every single weapon and missile on the planet and put it down as standard equipment.

Because it is his Standard Equipment, Tyler uses this numerous time and j already discuss this with Lephyr but he seem to ignore that part and i take that as he agree...
As for misinterpret part, i just followed what he said about "using every weapon across the world" or something in thread

 

[Agnaa]

Its the first and second scan of the thread

So this scan and this scan? There is absolutely nothing in those that would result in any tier or ability for any character. It's just fanciful talk about people learning about reality.

I don't want the thread to become dead and abandon like other threads, sorry

Please be more patient, those threads were only up for a few days, sometimes this stuff takes weeks or months.

Because it is his Standard Equipment, Tyler uses this numerous time and j already discuss this with Lephyr but he seem to ignore that part and i take that as he agree...
As for misinterpret part, i just followed what he said about "using every weapon across the world" or something in thread

Evidence was only provided for him using it once, so it doesn't really seem standard.

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

So

I know, that's the base of the cosmology.
As for scale, i use that "runs everything since the beginning lf time" and it is consistent because the comic is also pointing evidence like that

Please be more patient, those threads were only up for a few days, sometimes this stuff takes weeks or months.

Okay

Evidence was only provided for him using it once, so it doesn't really seem standard.

He uses it multiple time, even in the thread i gave Lephy the scan (The one that Tyler pointing every missiles to God)

 

[Agnaa]

I know, that's the base of the cosmology.
As for scale, i use that "runs everything since the beginning lf time" and it is consistent because the comic is also pointing evidence like that

That statement is way too vague to be taken as AP or any ability.

He uses it multiple time, even in the thread i gave Lephy the scan (The one that Tyler pointing every missiles to God)

That's the one piece of evidence I was talking about.

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

That statement is way too vague to be taken as AP or any ability

At first glance it might seem vague, but i gave suppprting evidence to make it more valuable... Tyler depicted as a very, very strong character that he can defeat God who is the creator of all creation (which is currently in Heaven) and also kills Chuck Palahniuk

I even gave interview statement above to strengthen the fact.

That's the one piece of evidence I was talking about.

I thought its different case at the very start (Tyler destroy the world and Tyler defeat God), and then i noticed itd actually the same

 

[Agnaa]

At first glance it might seem vague, but i gave suppprting evidence to make it more valuable... Tyler depicted as a very, very strong character

Not sufficient.

that he can defeat God who is the creator of all creation (which is currently in Heaven)

Why does that matter? What are God's durability feats?

and also kills Chuck Palahniuk

Similar question here.

I even gave interview statement above to strengthen the fact.

Which seemed insufficient for reasons I gave above.

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

Why does that matter? What are God's durability feats?

Implied to be the creator of reality (i guess?)

 

[Agnaa]

Implied to be the creator of reality (i guess?)

This contradicts part of your argument (the idea that Tyler created reality), doesn't actually imply that God created reality, and even if it did, that wouldn't actually have a direct impact on durability.

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

This contradicts part of your argument (the idea that Tyler created reality)

Well yeah, but notice that Tyler is the existence that is created by Chuck to destroy all of existence... he can use Chuck ability by this, he probably can do similiar thing like God (Chuck is above God, as Chuck brought everything in his fiction to the real world and that include God)

doesn't actually imply that God created reality, and even if it did, that wouldn't actually have a direct impact on durability.

Isn't Creation Feats counts as Durability by using Newton Law?

 

[Agnaa]

Well yeah, but notice that Tyler is the existence that is created by Chuck to destroy all of existence... he can use Chuck ability by this, he probably can do similiar thing like God (Chuck is above God, as Chuck brought everything in his fiction to the real world and that include God)

That doesn't logically follow, and still seems a bit contradictory (with you saying that Tyler can kill Chuck).

Also, if there is that context behind Tyler killing Chuck and God, that makes the feats seem a whole lot weaker. You typically need some sort of relation to lower worlds to get big tiers like that; if Chuck turned Tyler and God into humans on his level of reality, and so they were able to kill each other, that doesn't mean that Tyler can nuke characters of the world he was originally in, and it makes Tyler killing Chuck far less impressive.

Isn't Creation Feats counts as Durability by using Newton Law?

No. For creation feats to scale to other stats, there needs to be an established underlying energy for the characters' abilities, where the creation feat takes less energy than some sort of physical empowerment which includes durability.

 

[Jeeeeepil123]

That doesn't logically follow, and still seems a bit contradictory (with you saying that Tyler can kill Chuck).

Also, if there is that context behind Tyler killing Chuck and God, that makes the feats seem a whole lot weaker. You typically need some sort of relation to lower worlds to get big tiers like that; if Chuck turned Tyler and God into humans on his level of reality, and so they were able to kill each other, that doesn't mean that Tyler can nuke characters of the world he was originally in, and it makes Tyler killing Chuck far less impressive.

Hmmm, make sense.
I guess there's no need to continue this debate, you can close it

Oh yeah, last question... can Chuck get Low 1-C by that? Or God, is he qualified by what i proposed (Low 2-C, Math, Info, BDE)?

 

[Agnaa]

I'm not sure, I haven't seen enough to really say either way.