MHA Chojuro Kon (Chimera) Revision

[Dual_Binoculars]

Currently Chimera's durability is listed as "At least Large Building level+ (Can withstand the recoil of his own attacks), City Block level with Chimera, Multi-City Block level against heat/cold (Was unfazed by Shoto's fire, and could break out of his ice)"

When it should be: At least Large Building level+ (Can withstand the recoil of his own attacks), City Block level with Chimera, Town level against heat/cold (Was unfazed by Shoto's fire, and could break out of his ice)

I would also like to propose upgrading Chimera's other stats to 7-C due to him overpowering Shoto's fire with his own fire (1:20) and even physically overpowering it with air pressure (0:34). Later Chimera also easily melted large ice structures created by Shoto (0:08) and forced Shoto to use his ice side to its limit (1:15).

If that's accepted then I propose his stats should be changed to 7-C, Higher with Chimera.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

I agree for his durability, and at least his fire breath should definitely scale to Todoroki’s own fire.

Whether his physicals should scale is another question, and I will wait for input from others.

 

[Sparkive]

Is it level 7-C every time Todoroki makes ice or fire? It is something that is not clear to me about how they treat Todoroki MHA / VS Battles wiki.

About the general upgrade:

Shoto's fire with his own fire (1:20)

but at minute 1:27 he fails to break the ice of Todoroki, even when the ice is scaling the fire

Later Chimera also easily melted large ice structures created by Shoto (0:08)

It took him a few seconds to destroy it (he hits at 0:15 and almost 0:18 is that it pierces the ice)
Also, at minute 1:07 unbreakable Kirishima survives him

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Is it level 7-C every time Todoroki makes ice or fire? It is something that is not clear to me about how they treat Todoroki MHA / VS Battles wiki.

About the general upgrade:

but at minute 1:27 he fails to break the ice of Todoroki, even when the ice is scaling the fire


It took him a few seconds to destroy it (he hits at 0:15 and almost 0:18 is that it pierces the ice)
Also, at minute 1:07 unbreakable Kirishima survives him

The calc used for Todoroki’s fire is one based on the energy he produces, where he melted a glacier. So it’s more about the amount of heat energy his flames have rather than their kinetic force. So actually, Chimera overpowering his flames doesn’t mean much, but that requires some of the calc group and people that know rules better to weigh in.

The very small amount of time it took him to break through his ice doesn’t quite disprove that he is above Todoroki’s fire in terms of potency. And again, idk what the rules for heat to kinetic really are, so Todoroki could just be incorrectly labeled.

 

[Therefir]

Todoroki's feats come from ice and freezing calcs, there's no way Chimera can scale from that.

This isn't like Geten who actually has 7-C kinetic energy ice, and this Todoroki doesn't scale from Dabi.

 

[Dual_Binoculars]

Todoroki's feats come from ice and freezing calcs, there's no way Chimera can scale from that.

This isn't like Geten who actually has 7-C kinetic energy ice, and this Todoroki doesn't scale from Dabi.

Some of his higher end ice feats are low 7-B, but he's listed as 7-C with half-cold and half-hot. The calc listed on his profile for his fire is 7-C so is he just mislabeled or am I missing something here?

 

[Therefir]

There was a thread about it, Todoroki's ice and fire have 7-C freezing/heat energy but this energy can't really scale to anyone else outside of their durability against fire/ice attacks.

Chimera with 7-C durability against fire/ice should be fine though, but him overpowering Todoroki's flames doesn't necessarily mean his attacks have the same amount of heat energy.

 

[Dual_Binoculars]

There was a thread about it, Todoroki's ice and fire have 7-C freezing/heat energy but this energy can't really scale to anyone else outside of their durability against fire/ice attacks.

Chimera with 7-C durability against fire/ice should be fine though, but him overpowering Todoroki's flames doesn't necessarily mean his attacks have the same amount of heat energy.

Oooooh ok that makes sense.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Chimera with 7-C durability against fire/ice should be fine though, but him overpowering Todoroki's flames doesn't necessarily mean his attacks have the same amount of heat energy.

That isn't how temperature works either.

Fire/Heat melts and damages things with their high temperature, and not with the level of energy it has as a whole. Todoroki's flames are around iron melting level at most, which is 1510 C. That is the temperature of flames Chimera and Todoroki can resist, the 7-C value is utterly pointless.

His flames reach that energy level due to how much space that 1510 C flame occupies.

A 5000 C flame, that only covers a room would have a far lower tier, but would be far hotter. So despite being a lesser tier, these flames would still easily burn Chimera/Todoroki. Being 7-C against heat means literally nothing, that doesn't tell me about strong his resistance is.

 

[Therefir]

And 1510 C fire would never be able to melt a giant ice glacier (nor even steel, otherwise the pans would be melted by the stove fire) in a few minutes and the temperature is irrelevant when it comes to durability ratings.

Bakugo's nitroglycerine explosions in theory have a much higher temperature than Dabi's blue fire attacks but that doesn't mean they carry the same amount of energy or they would be able to accomplish the same feats.

So yeah, I don't see why Chimera's durability wouldn't scale from Todoroki's fire feats, he is scaling from the fire's power, not the temperature.

 

[Therefir]

And we don't even know what temperature Shoto's fire is at, why assume 1510 C? Dabi's blue fire can burn carbon fibers even though blue fire is not hot enough to do that, and Shoto's Flashfire is still orange even when the temperature is much higher than before.

 

[TheRustyOne]

I was talking about that version of Todoroki's flames, not his current self.

And energy output does not always correlate to temperature, can you tell me how hot Todoroki's flames are in all of his keys? That way I know how good their fire resistance is. We need more standards on this stuff, because the current way of doing this is wrong.

A 7-A fire that takes 1 hour to melt some steel, would be inferior to a 9-A fire that vaporizes steel in 1 second. The tier/energy the fire generates, the numbers we currently use, are pointless to anything without a shared energy source.

7-C fire doesn't tell me how high their resistance is, that is the problem I have here.

 

[Dual_Binoculars]

Bump

 

[Insert_creative_name_here_12]

I was talking about that version of Todoroki's flames, not his current self.

And energy output does not always correlate to temperature, can you tell me how hot Todoroki's flames are in all of his keys? That way I know how good their fire resistance is. We need more standards on this stuff, because the current way of doing this is wrong.

A 7-A fire that takes 1 hour to melt some steel, would be inferior to a 9-A fire that vaporizes steel in 1 second. The tier/energy the fire generates, the numbers we currently use, are pointless to anything without a shared energy source.

7-C fire doesn't tell me how high their resistance is, that is the problem I have here.

I’m in agreement with that, it might even be better to list what temperatures they can reach on their profile for characters like him but then how would we tier characters like Todoroki?

 

[Therefir]

I’m in agreement with that, it might even be better to list what temperatures they can reach on their profile for characters like him but then how would we tier characters like Todoroki?

We can't, that's why Rusty's doesn't work, it's pointless to take temperature into account.

If you want to delete "X durability against heat/cold" from all profiles I understand, but that isn't what we agreed in the last ice threads revisions, in which multiple people said they were fine with how we rated our temperature feats.

 

[Dual_Binoculars]

Bump

 

[Therefir]

I already put Town level durability against heat/cold in Chimera's profile, that's about as far as you can get with our current treatment for these kind of feats.

 

[Dual_Binoculars]

I already put Town level durability against heat/cold in Chimera's profile, that's about as far as you can get with our current treatment for these kind of feats.

oh thank you. This thread can be closed then.