Minor Haxs Additions for DMC

[Mister6ame6]

1- Sealing: Demons are able to create seals to bind their victims in place.


2- Accelerated Development (Skill, Battle, Intelligence, Physical and Abilities) and Reactive Evolution: (Demons can adapt to anything that doesn't kill them instantly, getting much more powerful, gaining new powers, abilities and resistances against corresponding threats in mere seconds, like when they are able to eventually keep up in power and skill after fighting Sparda and his descendants for longs period of time. Demons receive more demonic power if they hit their opponents or take damage[1], which allows them to improve their powers and abilities mid combat and also to easily adapt, evolve and heal from their injuries. If a demon lose or lacks a organ, they will evolve to have a way around that function and can adapt to the hazardous environment of the Demon World, as show that a lower tier demons like Nobody who is considered a failure by demons's standarts, including their own masters, was still able to adapt to survive on it. They are also able to survive, adapt, evolve and eventually heal from their injuries, after wistanding many attacks from Sparda and his descendants for longs period of time, which are able to develop the ability to negate and overcome their opponents's abilities to resist their attacks in middle of combat and even keep evolving even more further in combat if their opponents is still able to keep resisting and adapting to their attacks if necessary. Demons decide how their powers evolve. Demons are inherently tied to their desires, as is Demonic Power. This is seen in the Ascension Ceremony, where it’s outright stated their powers are related to their body and mind, which is why Credo is so powerful. The results were the manifestation of his resolve. Dante stated Credo’s Angelic Death was only possible because he imagined it that way. Demons evolves as a species-Based on their desires


3- Power Bestowal and Healing: Despite majority of Devil Arms are made by Demons themselves. Demons are stil beings capable of becoming Devil Arms by either crushing them and gaining power over them or becoming friends with them and they can also give the user incredible power if they are strong enough to wield them without getting possessed by it in the process. Can even awaken others latent potential, as show with Rebellion, Yamato and Devil Sword Sparda awakening Dante's and Nero's sleeping demonic powers, and the Devil Breakers, who are able to amplify Nero's own latent demonic power. Giving demonic power also heal other demons, as show with Malphas's stones healing V, Nightmare can heal V and the others familiars and also Trish healing Dante


4- Extrasensory Perception (Power Level Measurement and Magic Detection) and Enhanced Senses (Thermograpic Vision): Demons can sense the presence of demonic power and can figure out which power source of demonic power is stronger and Demons are able to track their prey via their heat/thermal temperatures.


5- Self-Sustenance (Type 1): Demons can live in the Mirror World, which is a place contamined by the Demon World, where it is impossible to breathe.


6- Invulnerability: Demons are immune to every weapon made in the Human World, which in order to hurt and kill then. you need materials made in the Demon World to do that. and as pointed by Gilver to Dante when they clash with each others swords, their metals are made from materials from the Demon World, which will not bend by simple brute force alone


7- Regeneration Losing their demonic power won't kill or make then lose their regeneration's abilities.


8- Possession: Demons can either possess humans that want to use their powers if they are not strong enough to wield then without getting possessed and completely losing their minds in the process


9- Accelerated Development and Reactive Evolution Negations (At least Low-Godly, Types 2, 3, 4, 6, 7 and 9: Demons can nullify each other's evolutionary skills, as pointed out that the Demon World is a world of survival of the most stronger one, as show that Dante was stated that he will be killed by the Neo Generator if he don't run faster enough to reach his destination quickly, was going to be killed by the Key of Ardor if Dante did not run fast enough to save his own life and was only still alive by holding it because of his sheer force of will, was stated to be able to be killed by Sin Scythe a lower class of demon species and later by Nightmare, who was stated to become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Nero was easily overpowered by Agnus and killed by a mere single stab in the stomach, which required Yamato to ressurect him

10- Empathic Manipulation, Fear Manipulation, Madness Manipulation (Type 3) and Aura: Can also crush the souls of others by being on them presence. If a person is possessed by a demon, he will completely lose his mind and is also required for the person to have a strong mind and body also soul to not get consumed by a demon if then wishes to uses their powers.


11- Explosion Manipulation: As mentioned by Dante, a Demon is 10 times more dangerous when he is in the brink of death, since he will seek destruction above anything else and will even explode himself to take his enemy down with him


12- Ressurection: Giving demonic power or turning people into demons can ressurect them. They can also materialize themselves when they die, once their rage and fury are mixed together to create the demons called Soul Eaters


13- Acausality (Type 1): Demons are unaffected by changes in the past and future, as show with the Demon World bringing back Phamtom from the past to the present while his present version was not affected by the time paradoxes happening in DMC2 events. Demons are unaffected by stoppage of time by the Demon World and they are physically unaffected by the creation and continuous warping of closed off space-time loops on top of them.] They can also leave and enter the loop casually.


14- Analytical Prediction and Instinctive Reaction: They are able to fight and keep up with Sparda and his descendants, who are able to easily notice patterns in their opponents's style and can adapt to fight then accordingly along with also learning to react instinctively from upcoming treats as show when Dante was having a hard time against Beowulf, but was eventually able to make him retreat from their fight, or when Dante fought against Hell Vanguard and eventually was also able to make him retreat from their fight, who was stated to be feared in the entire Demon World because of his combat prowess] and also when Tony fought against the demons inside the hospital that were powerful and smart enought to keep up with him. Nero was able to grow strong and skilled enough to match Demon Form Credo as his equal in power and skills and eventually surpassed him while Credo's skills with swords were previously unmatched in the Order of the Sword, later fought against Demon Form Agnus and eventually defeated him in combat, who some time before their fight was able to easily hold Red Queen with just his fingers in his human form and eventually was able to fight against Sanctus in his human form, even when he was inside the Incomplete Savior controlling it and using him skillfully. Sealed Sparda was able to make a permanent scar on Bolverk's face, who was stated to be a rival to him after they fought in numerous time before and after Sparda betrayed Mundus, Mundus was stated to be a tough fight for Sparda 2000 years before DMC events. Argosax on his weakest form, was able to fought Sealed Sparda for some time before getting sealed away. Nightmare was able to match DMC1 in the past multiple times and get stronger on each encounter, even stated to be become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Moreover, Nightmare was also able to match Urizen when he was born, who should be comparable to his Nelo Angelo Himself, since he should have all requirements necessary to wield the Devil Sword Sparda her fullest by being superior to his human half V, which was stated by Griffon to have the heart to use the Devil Sword Sparda just lack the body to use it and if he did not lost his half demon side, V would have been able to use it. Malphas was able to fight against Devil Breaker Nero and also Sparda and his descendents can fight each other to a standstill without being able to kill each other some times.


15- Demons are more stronger in their demons forms compared to their human forms as mentioned by Lady.

 

[Minos_the_Judge]

It looks interesting, but...

9- Accelerated Development and Reactive Evolution Negations (At least Low-Godly, Types 2, 3, 4, 6, 7 and 9: Demons can nullify each other's evolutionary skills, as pointed out that the Demon World is a world of survival of the most stronger one)

I don't understand what point in this link proves that they Negation Skill each other. And what is Low-Godly?

10- Resistance Negation: They are able to hurt and eventually kill Sparda and his descendants with their attacks, as show that Dante was stated that he will be killed by the Neo Generator if he don't run faster enough to reach his destination quickly, was going to be killed by the Key of Ardor if Dante did not run fast enough to save his own life and was only still alive by holding it because of his sheer force of will, was stated to be able to be killed by Sin Scythe a lower class of demon species and later by Nightmare, who was stated to become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Nero was easily overpowered by Agnus and killed by a mere single stab in the stomach, which required Yamato to ressurect him

15- Analytical Prediction and Instinctive Reaction: They are able to fight and keep up with Sparda and his descendants, who are able to easily notice patterns in their opponents's style and can adapt to fight then accordingly along with also learning to react instinctively from upcoming treats as show when Dante was having a hard time against Beowulf, but was eventually able to make him retreat from their fight, or when Dante fought against Hell Vanguard and eventually was also able to make him retreat from their fight, who was stated to be feared in the entire Demon World because of his combat prowess] and also when Tony fought against the demons inside the hospital that were powerful and smart enought to keep up with him. Nero was able to grow strong and skilled enough to match Demon Form Credo as his equal in power and skills and eventually surpassed him while Credo's skills with swords were previously unmatched in the Order of the Sword, later fought against Demon Form Agnus and eventually defeated him in combat, who some time before their fight was able to easily hold Red Queen with just his fingers in his human form and eventually was able to fight against Sanctus in his human form, even when he was inside the Incomplete Savior controlling it and using him skillfully. Sealed Sparda was able to make a permanent scar on Bolverk's face, who was stated to be a rival to him after they fought in numerous time before and after Sparda betrayed Mundus, Mundus was stated to be a tough fight for Sparda 2000 years before DMC events. Argosax on his weakest form, was able to fought Sealed Sparda for some time before getting sealed away. Nightmare was able to match DMC1 in the past multiple times and get stronger on each encounter, even stated to be become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Moreover, Nightmare was also able to match Urizen when he was born, who should be comparable to his Nelo Angelo Himself, since he should have all requirements necessary to wield the Devil Sword Sparda her fullest by being superior to his human half V, which was stated by Griffon to have the heart to use the Devil Sword Sparda just lack the body to use it and if he did not lost his half demon side, V would have been able to use it. DMC1 Trish was able to keep up with DMC1 Dante multiple times and get stronger on each encounter to still keep up with him, was sended personaly by Mundus to kill Dante in the events of DMC1. Malphas was confirmed to be superior them DMC5 Trish and also Sparda and his descendents can fight each other to a standstill without being able to kill each other some times.

It seems to me that most of the indications that Dante could have died at the hands of ordinary demons are, well, outlier. Because such a Dante was a threat to the most powerful demon, and it would be strange if he could die at the hands of Scythe.

And did Nightmare really have the "heart" for using Sparda? As i remember, even the Shadows from DMS 1, according to the descriptions, could have “killed” Dante or injured him, but this is nonsense.

And it seems to me that the likes of Beowulf and so on could give Dante a tough fight not because of skill, but rather because of their enormous strength.

The rest looks great.

 

[Georredannea15]

9- Accelerated Development and Reactive Evolution Negations (At least Low-Godly, Types 2, 3, 4, 6, 7 and 9: Demons can nullify each other's evolutionary skills, as pointed out that the Demon World is a world of survival of the most stronger one)

Honestly, I don't understand this part.

But the rest is fine i guess.

 

[Pepsimanslover_69]

Demons can adapt, evolve and eventually keep up in power and skill after fighting Sparda and his descendants for longs period of time. If a demon lose or lacks a organ, they will evolve to have a way around that function. They are also able to survive, adapt, evolve and eventually heal from their injuries, after wistanding many attacks from Sparda and his descendants for longs period of time, which are able to develop the ability to negate and overcome their opponents's abilities to resist their attacks in middle of combat and even keep evolving even more further in combat if their opponents is still able to keep resisting and adapting to their attacks if necessary

There should be more scans here, As the only scan here suggests reactive evolution, Something demons already have. But it's fine considering the part where demons keep up with sparda descendants.

At least Low-Godly, Types 2, 3, 4, 6, 7 and 9: Demons can nullify each other's evolutionary skills, as pointed out that the Demon World is a world of survival of the most stronger one

This isn't nullification at all, It just establishes that a hierarchy exists in the demon world.

Giving demonic power or turning people into demons can ressurect them. They can also materialize themselves when they die, once their rage and fury are mixed together to create the demons called Soul Eaters

The first scan is a bit vague, I'm assuming it's referring to Sanctus, Which if then yeah it's fine.

As for the second, It looks fine.

They are able to hurt and eventually kill Sparda and his descendants with their attacks, as show that Dante was stated that he will be killed by the Neo Generator if he don't run faster enough to reach his destination quickly, was going to be killed by the Key of Ardor if Dante did not run fast enough to save his own life and was only still alive by holding it because of his sheer force of will, was stated to be able to be killed by Sin Scythe a lower class of demon species and later by Nightmare, who was stated to become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Nero was easily overpowered by Agnus and killed by a mere single stab in the stomach, which required Yamato to ressurect him

This should be changed into a possibly as these could be considered as outliers.

Everything else looks fine.

 

[Mister6ame6]

It looks interesting, but...

I don't understand what point in this link proves that they Negation Skill each other. And what is Low-Godly?

The Demon World is a world of survival of the strongest and the most capable, demons aways crave for becoming stronger untill theu became the new DW

To get more power, they need to fight and kill eacth others to alchive that

It seems to me that most of the indications that Dante could have died at the hands of ordinary demons are, well, outlier. Because such a Dante was a threat to the most powerful demon, and it would be strange if he could die at the hands of Scythe.

That's is only works for Sin Scythe tho, all the others are on his level or above him

Still is proves that demons can be killed which is good

And did Nightmare really have the "heart" for using Sparda? As i remember, even the Shadows from DMS 1, according to the descriptions, could have “killed” Dante or injured him, but this is nonsense.

Nightmare don't have the heart to use DSS Urizen does

I don't rememver this being stated only by Nightmare, Nelo Angelo and Mundus in DMC1 events, do you have some scans to support that?

And it seems to me that the likes of Beowulf and so on could give Dante a tough fight not because of skill, but rather because of their enormous strength.

Knowing they have some pretty crazy skill feats, they would need to be able to keep up with them in skill or otherwise they should not have problem dealing with them

If they are signitifically stronger them Dante, the figth would be one sided by the other side as Dante would have not a chance to defeat them in combat

Honestly, I don't understand this part.

But the rest is fine i guess.

Demons have RE and they can negate that up to Low-Godly since it is their regen rn

There should be more scans here, As the only scan here suggests reactive evolution, Something demons already have. But it's fine considering the part where demons keep up with sparda descendants.

Is because they keep up with Sparda descendts is where their AD comes from

This isn't nullification at all, It just establishes that a hierarchy exists in the demon world.

It does because just like i said above

''The Demon World is a world of survival of the strongest and the most capable, demons aways crave for becoming stronger untill theu became the new DW

To get more power, they need to fight and kill eacth others to alchive that

The first scan is a bit vague, I'm assuming it's referring to Sanctus, Which if then yeah it's fine.

Yeap, it is Sanctus, is exactly the scene we see in the game where he got ressurected

This should be changed into a possibly as these could be considered as outliers.

Nah, is too consistent in the series to be outliers

Even Sparda is stated to be killed by Mundus and eventually came back thanks to the thougths of humans which i forgot to add it XD

There is alot of proof of demons even in the God Tier class being able to kill Sparda descendents

 

[Eseseso]

Point 6 should probably be "Limited Invulnerability" since they're not invulnerable to Demon Weapons, the rest seems fine.

 

[Pepsimanslover_69]

Is because they keep up with Sparda descendts is where their AD comes from

Still, Having one scan that only suggests RE is goofy and not helpful for anyone.

It does because just like i said above

''The Demon World is a world of survival of the strongest and the most capable, demons aways crave for becoming stronger untill theu became the new DW

To get more power, they need to fight and kill eacth others to alchive that

That's just Immortality negation, Furthermore it describes a hierarchy particularly well.

And you don't need RE and AD negation to be stronger or more capable.

Nah, is too consistent in the series to be outliers

Even Sparda is stated to be killed by Mundus and eventually came back thanks to the thougths of humans which i forgot to add it XD

There is alot of proof of demons even in the God Tier class being able to kill Sparda descendents

Pretty sure we saw the fight between sparda and Mundus in a comic and that didn't happen.

But regardless, How is this meant to be Resistance negation? What Resistance is being negated?

 

[Pepsimanslover_69]

Pretty sure we saw the fight between sparda and Mundus in a comic and that didn't happen.

Disregard this as I've checked and the comic is fanmade.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Disregard this as I've checked and the comic is fanmade.

Nah the comic is legit made by an American company, it just isn't canon.

Also I need to read slowly this thread but by a quick look there are things I disagree with.

 

[Minos_the_Judge]

The Demon World is a world of survival of the strongest and the most capable, demons aways crave for becoming stronger untill theu became the new DW

To get more power, they need to fight and kill eacth others to alchive that

But how does this force negation on their skills and adaptation? Why do you think that their enemies will not be physically able to adapt to them and develop their skills in combat with them?

That's is only works for Sin Scythe tho, all the others are on his level or above him

Still is proves that demons can be killed which is good

So you're ignoring the fact that Dante can die (that's DANTE) and consider the fact that they're supposed to be able to kill demons that way?

Nightmare don't have the heart to use DSS Urizen does

I don't rememver this being stated only by Nightmare, Nelo Angelo and Mundus in DMC1 events, do you have some scans to support that?

You misunderstood. I asked why you think Nightmare is as strong as Nelo Angelo?

Knowing they have some pretty crazy skill feats, they would need to be able to keep up with them in skill or otherwise they should not have problem dealing with them

If they are signitifically stronger them Dante, the figth would be one sided by the other side as Dante would have not a chance to defeat them in combat

Dante may be weaker, but not incredibly strong, but he makes up for it with enormous skills.

 

[marosuke]

1 3 4 5 6 8 11 12 13 14 looks fine.
2- This seems like biological evolution rather than AD. I know its strange to say for demons. They develop indeed. But this doesn't looks like accelerated development.
7- yeah humans live without demonic power, but V would die without it ig. im not sure because V is a exception. He is physically weakened.
9- im not sure about this. cuz this enemy file explains how the underworld looks like.
15- im assuming this should apply higher tier only.
16- yeah, you mean transformation? Or shapeshifting?

 

[Random-Helper323]

1- Sealing: Demons are able to create seals to bind their victims in place.

This seems fine.

2- Accelerated Development (Skill, Battle, Intelligence, Physical and Abilities) and Reactive Evolution: (Demons can adapt, evolve and eventually keep up in power and skill after fighting Sparda and his descendants for longs period of time. If a demon lose or lacks a organ, they will evolve to have a way around that function. They are also able to survive, adapt, evolve and eventually heal from their injuries, after wistanding many attacks from Sparda and his descendants for longs period of time, which are able to develop the ability to negate and overcome their opponents's abilities to resist their attacks in middle of combat and even keep evolving even more further in combat if their opponents is still able to keep resisting and adapting to their attacks if necessary

More scans would help. There's more evidence for Reactive Evolution, like demons evolving based on their desires, and the Nobody adapting to survive in the Demon World, but the part about adapting to bad conditions is notable. I actually do think the abilities are correct, just more scans should be here.

3- Power Bestowal and Healing: Despite majority of Devil Arms are made by Demons themselves. Demons are stil beings capable of becoming Devil Arms by either crushing them and gaining power over them or becoming friends with them and they can also give the user incredible power if they are strong enough to wield them without getting possessed by it in the process. Can even awaken others latent potential, as show with Rebellion, Yamato and Devil Sword Sparda awakening Dante's and Nero's sleeping demonic powers, and the Devil Breakers, who are able to amplify Nero's own latent demonic power. Giving demonic power also heal other demons, as show with Malphas's stones healing V, Nightmare can heal V and the others familiars and also Trish healing Dante


4- Extrasensory Perception (Power Level Measurement and Magic Detection) and Enhanced Senses: Demons can sense the presence of demonic power and can figure out which power source of demonic power is stronger and Demons are able to track their prey via their heat/thermal temperatures.


5- Self-Sustenance (Type 1): Demons can live in the Mirror World, which is a place contaminated by the Demon World, where it is impossible to breathe.

All seems solid.

6- Invulnerability: Demons are immune to every weapon made in the Human World, which in order to hurt and kill then. you need materials made in the Demon World to do that. and as pointed by Gilver to Dante when they clash with each others swords, their metals are made from materials from the Demon World, which will not bend by simple brute force alone

If all we had was a statement about immunity to all weapons in the human world, I'd call this durability, but given that Gilver specifically said that damaging demonic materials requires "more than just force", I'm inclined to say this does seem like genuine invulnerability, which should also mean demons have invulnerability negation. Unless there's something I'm not understanding about what makes invulnerability limited, this isn't limited either.

7- Regeneration Losing their demonic power won't kill or make then lose their regeneration's abilities.


8- Possession: Demons can either possess humans that want to use their powers if they are not strong enough to wield then without getting possessed and completely losing their minds in the process

Seems fine.

9- Accelerated Development and Reactive Evolution Negations (At least Low-Godly, Types 2, 3, 4, 6, 7 and 9: Demons can nullify each other's evolutionary skills, as pointed out that the Demon World is a world of survival of the most stronger one)

Do you really need to negate their evolutions in order to outdo them? Seems like this is just general superiority.

10- Resistance Negation: They are able to hurt and eventually kill Sparda and his descendants with their attacks, as show that Dante was stated that he will be killed by the Neo Generator if he don't run faster enough to reach his destination quickly, was going to be killed by the Key of Ardor if Dante did not run fast enough to save his own life and was only still alive by holding it because of his sheer force of will, was stated to be able to be killed by Sin Scythe a lower class of demon species and later by Nightmare, who was stated to become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Nero was easily overpowered by Agnus and killed by a mere single stab in the stomach, which required Yamato to ressurect him

Isn't this just layers of hax based on power levels?

11- Empathic Manipulation, Fear Manipulation, Madness Manipulation (Type 3) and Aura: Can also crush the souls of others by being on them presence. If a person is possessed by a demon, he will completely lose his mind and is also required for the person to have a strong mind and body also soul to not get consumed by a demon if then wishes to uses their powers.


12- Explosion Manipulation: As mentioned by Dante, a Demon is 10 times more dangerous when he is in the brink of death, since he will seek destruction above anything else and will even explode himself to take his enemy down with him


13- Ressurection: Giving demonic power or turning people into demons can ressurect them. They can also materialize themselves when they die, once their rage and fury are mixed together to create the demons called Soul Eaters


14- Acausality (Type 1): Demons are unaffected by changes in the past and future, as show with the Demon World bringing back Phamtom from the past to the present while his present version was not affected by the time paradoxes happening in DMC2 events. Demons are unaffected by stoppage of time by the Demon World and they are physically unaffected by the creation and continuous warping of closed off space-time loops on top of them.] They can also leave and enter the loop casually.


15- Analytical Prediction and Instinctive Reaction: They are able to fight and keep up with Sparda and his descendants, who are able to easily notice patterns in their opponents's style and can adapt to fight then accordingly along with also learning to react instinctively from upcoming treats as show when Dante was having a hard time against Beowulf, but was eventually able to make him retreat from their fight, or when Dante fought against Hell Vanguard and eventually was also able to make him retreat from their fight, who was stated to be feared in the entire Demon World because of his combat prowess] and also when Tony fought against the demons inside the hospital that were powerful and smart enought to keep up with him. Nero was able to grow strong and skilled enough to match Demon Form Credo as his equal in power and skills and eventually surpassed him while Credo's skills with swords were previously unmatched in the Order of the Sword, later fought against Demon Form Agnus and eventually defeated him in combat, who some time before their fight was able to easily hold Red Queen with just his fingers in his human form and eventually was able to fight against Sanctus in his human form, even when he was inside the Incomplete Savior controlling it and using him skillfully. Sealed Sparda was able to make a permanent scar on Bolverk's face, who was stated to be a rival to him after they fought in numerous time before and after Sparda betrayed Mundus, Mundus was stated to be a tough fight for Sparda 2000 years before DMC events. Argosax on his weakest form, was able to fought Sealed Sparda for some time before getting sealed away. Nightmare was able to match DMC1 in the past multiple times and get stronger on each encounter, even stated to be become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Moreover, Nightmare was also able to match Urizen when he was born, who should be comparable to his Nelo Angelo Himself, since he should have all requirements necessary to wield the Devil Sword Sparda her fullest by being superior to his human half V, which was stated by Griffon to have the heart to use the Devil Sword Sparda just lack the body to use it and if he did not lost his half demon side, V would have been able to use it. DMC1 Trish was able to keep up with DMC1 Dante multiple times and get stronger on each encounter to still keep up with him, was sended personaly by Mundus to kill Dante in the events of DMC1. Malphas was able to fight against Devil Breaker Nero and also Sparda and his descendents can fight each other to a standstill without being able to kill each other some times.


16- Demons are more stronger in their demons forms compared to their human forms as mentioned by Lady.

This all seems reasonable, although I think at least some of it is already on the pages.

 

[Mister6ame6]

But how does this force negation on their skills and adaptation? Why do you think that their enemies will not be physically able to adapt to them and develop their skills in combat with them?

Because if they are able to adapt every single time, we won't see demons killing eacth other in the series

So you're ignoring the fact that Dante can die (that's DANTE) and consider the fact that they're supposed to be able to kill demons that way?

Dante, Nero and Sparda is demons which means that if demons can kill them, them should be able to kill eacth other too, so in that case, yeah, it works as suporting evidence for their being alble to kill eacth other

You misunderstood. I asked why you think Nightmare is as strong as Nelo Angelo?

Nightmare can macth Urizen when he was born, which is comparable to his Nelo Angelo self as stated by V in the scans

Dante may be weaker, but not incredibly strong, but he makes up for it with enormous skills.

If read some of my scans, Dante directly mentions that some of them is on his level in power and skill. Moreover, Nero and Sparda who scale to his level in power and skill in the respective keys along with also having their own skill feats, have problems delaing with some demons, even states that they are on their level

More scans would help. There's more evidence for Reactive Evolution, like demons evolving based on their desires, and the Nobody adapting to survive in the Demon World, but the part about adapting to bad conditions is notable. I actually do think the abilities are correct, just more scans should be here.

More scans would help. There's more evidence for Reactive Evolution, like demons evolving based on their desires, and the Nobody adapting to survive in the Demon World, but the part about adapting to bad conditions is notable. I actually do think the abilities are correct, just more scans should be here.

Yes, checking the scans you are rigth their help support the RE imo thanks!

Does anybody have problems adding the scans to the op that Ramdom mentioned here?

If all we had was a statement about immunity to all weapons in the human world, I'd call this durability, but given that Gilver specifically said that damaging demonic materials requires "more than just force", I'm inclined to say this does seem like genuine invulnerability, which should also mean demons have invulnerability negation. Unless there's something I'm not understanding about what makes invulnerability limited, this isn't limited either.

Agree, demons should invul negation since they can break demon stuff whitheout problems

Do you really need to negate their evolutions in order to outdo them? Seems like this is just general superiority.

nah, if demons can adapt to shit and they are not able to adapt to their attacks despite they having the ability to do so, is because they have to be able to pass their own RE abilities shenarignas

Isn't this just layers of hax based on power levels?

Negating layers falls in negating resistances, since well you are negating resistances in a layered scaling chain.

This all seems reasonable, although I think at least some of it is already on the pages.

Really? I remember checking and they are not in the but i'm could be wrong tho

 

[Minos_the_Judge]

Because if they are able to adapt every single time, we won't see demons killing eacth other in the series

Your text is too vague to interpret it as a biological and skill adaptation, and even more so as the fact that they magically remove each other's adaptations and skill. They might just be better than each other.

Dante, Nero and Sparda is demons which means that if demons can kill them, them should be able to kill eacth other too, so in that case, yeah, it works as suporting evidence for their being alble to kill eacth other

They are definitely not capable of killing the Sparda family, considering that they are able to resist the abilities and power of the Demon Gods.

Nightmare can macth Urizen when he was born, which is comparable to his Nelo Angelo self as stated by V in the scans

Perhaps I'm looking in the wrong place, but I don't see any text on the scans that Urizen was equal to Nelo Angelo at that time.

If read some of my scans, Dante directly mentions that some of them is on his level in power and skill. Moreover, Nero and Sparda who scale to his level in power and skill in the respective keys along with also having their own skill feats, have problems delaing with some demons, even states that they are on their level

I agree that the likes of Bolverek are not much lower than Sparda in skill, or Dante in the fight against Doppelganger.

I just disagree with scaling Beowulf to Dante. He's just a sloppy, destructive demon.

 

[Mister6ame6]

Your text is too vague to interpret it as a biological and skill adaptation, and even more so as the fact that they magically remove each other's adaptations and skill. They might just be better than each other.

The Demon World is literaly a world of survival of the strongest, demons aways strive to get stronger by any means, one of the most common means is literally by figthing, as they can get more power that way by either hiting or getting hit (Aka fighting each other)

They are also show to be able to kill Sparda Family meambers which are demons beings so if they can kill them, them they obviously can kill each other in combat.

They are definitely not capable of killing the Sparda family, considering that they are able to resist the abilities and power of the Demon Gods.

Is literally stated in the scans i'm linked that they can kill them, idk where you gotta the ideia they cannot kill the Sparda Family. They only can resist the ability and powers of Demon Kings on their Demon King level keys, they can't resist them on their lower tiers

Perhaps I'm looking in the wrong place, but I don't see any text on the scans that Urizen was equal to Nelo Angelo at that time.

Well is simple, that Urizen should should have all requirements necessary to wield the Devil Sword Sparda her fullest (Which rn requires you to be as strong and as powerfull as DMC1 Dante level characters) by being superior to his human half V, which was stated by Griffon to have the heart to use the Devil Sword Sparda just lack the body to use it and if he did not lost his half demon side, V would have been able to use it. And because he can macth Nightmare as stated by V, who was able to macth DMC1 Dante in the past.

I agree that the likes of Bolverek are not much lower than Sparda in skill, or Dante in the fight against Doppelganger.

I just disagree with scaling Beowulf to Dante. He's just a sloppy, destructive demon.

Well he is a demon handipicked by Sparda to guard the tower and the only demon with the exception of Vergil and Arkham (With Sparda's powers) that Dante was show to be visili tired in combat, so i think him being able to keep up with Dante in skill is a fair enougth assuption

But i can see where you are coming from with that

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Imma comment here later tonight

 

[Random-Helper323]

Your text is too vague to interpret it as a biological and skill adaptation, and even more so as the fact that they magically remove each other's adaptations and skill. They might just be better than each other.

There are statements that clearly tell us that demons evolve both to match their desires (the Fury) and to survive (the Nobody). I don't know about negation though. Technically if the better demon adapts quicker and better it will survive and win. It also lines up with the power boosts that keep happening following wounds and struggles.

Perhaps I'm looking in the wrong place, but I don't see any text on the scans that Urizen was equal to Nelo Angelo at that time.

Given that Urizen was Vergil's entire demon side you'd think he'd be comparable, but there also might have been some of his power missing. Still, Nightmare and Trish together did give Dante some trouble, so...

I just disagree with scaling Beowulf to Dante. He's just a sloppy, destructive demon.

In terms of AP he should somewhat scale. In terms of skill he's still a skilled unarmed fighter, but his mindless pursuit of Dante tells me he isn't all that bright.

 

[Robo432343]

i agree with most stuff but can Dante have self sustenance for surviving in space??

 

[Minos_the_Judge]

There are statements that clearly tell us that demons evolve both to match their desires (the Fury) and to survive (the Nobody). I don't know about negation though. Technically if the better demon adapts quicker and better it will survive and win. It also lines up with the power boosts that keep happening following wounds and struggles.

He claims that they are able to turn off each other's adaptive abilities. This means that if you were a demon, and you were fighting against a stronger demon, you would either not be able to adapt to their abilities (like your own ability preventing others from adapting), or your already adapted abilities would be removed.

Given that Urizen was Vergil's entire demon side you'd think he'd be comparable, but there also might have been some of his power missing. Still, Nightmare and Trish together did give Dante some trouble, so...

On our wiki, Nightmare does not scale to Dante. Once upon a time, Nightmare on our wiki had a Low 2-C, Dante had a 2-C, and Nightmare could not scale to him, because Dante was considered a character of a different scale (Demon King).

Now everything is exactly the same.

In terms of AP he should somewhat scale. In terms of skill he's still a skilled unarmed fighter, but his mindless pursuit of Dante tells me he isn't all that bright.

I agree, AP and speed are scaled (Although, in my opinion, the speed should be lower, because it is positioned that Dante was much more agile in this battle). But he seems to compensate for his skills with insane destructive and energetic power.

 

[Random-Helper323]

He claims that they are able to turn off each other's adaptive abilities. This means that if you were a demon, and you were fighting against a stronger demon, you would either not be able to adapt to their abilities

I guess it's possible that they slow down adaptation or can prevent it, although it also might just be sheer superiority. If you have one layer of resistance but still get haxed, but then you adapt and instantly grow a second or even third layer of resistance, it won't mean much if the other guy's hitting you with hax that has twenty layers. He hasn't stopped you gaining those layers; he's just smashed right through them.

or your already adapted abilities would be removed.

I'd strongly disagree with this. Loads of demons come back stronger after losing. I guess the seals seem to prevent them getting stronger to overcome the seal, but that might mean the seal negates their adaptation via its general power null, not that it's part of anything else.

On our wiki, Nightmare does not scale to Dante. Once upon a time, Nightmare on our wiki had a Low 2-C, Dante had a 2-C, and Nightmare could not scale to him, because Dante was considered a character of a different scale (Demon King).

Now everything is exactly the same.

I agree, AP and speed are scaled (Although, in my opinion, the speed should be lower, because it is positioned that Dante was much more agile in this battle). But he seems to compensate for his skills with insane destructive and energetic power.

I guess it's due to Dante consistently and decisively beating him. I suppose Nightmare is designed specifically to counter Dante but still loses. Dante did seem to have issues when fighting Nightmare and Trish at once.

 

[Minos_the_Judge]

I guess it's due to Dante consistently and decisively beating him. I suppose Nightmare is designed specifically to counter Dante but still loses. Dante did seem to have issues when fighting Nightmare and Trish at once.

Trish definitely shouldn't scale to Dante, she's very weak compared to the generals. The murder of the Phantom by Dante is something incredible for Trish. But we can't scale Phantom to Dante, who scales to Mundus. This would mean that we scale it up to the Mundus Feats.

 

[Mister6ame6]

i agree with most stuff but can Dante have self sustenance for surviving in space??

I already giving demons self sustenance type 1 because you cannot breath in the DW

Is in the OP actually

Trish definitely shouldn't scale to Dante, she's very weak compared to the generals. The murder of the Phantom by Dante is something incredible for Trish. But we can't scale Phantom to Dante, who scales to Mundus. This would mean that we scale it up to the Mundus Feats.

She was keeping up with DMC1 Dante and Nigthamare multiple times in DMC1 events, even was stated that she was sended by Mundus to kill Dante because he was afraid of Dante's powers

If she was weak them Phantom them no reason to just send him instead of her to his shop

 

[Random-Helper323]

Trish definitely shouldn't scale to Dante, she's very weak compared to the generals. The murder of the Phantom by Dante is something incredible for Trish. But we can't scale Phantom to Dante, who scales to Mundus. This would mean that we scale it up to the Mundus Feats.

Agreed. We see when Trish attacks Dante at the start that Trish can't genuinely damage Dante (he gets up unharmed and not even bothered after her attack) but the current in her attacks does have the ability to cause spasms, perhaps in particular when he isn't ready for it. Inconvenient when he's busy fighting Nightmare.

I already giving demons self sustenance type 1 because you cannot breath in the DW

Is in the OP actually

Demons have special breathing already from being able to stay underwater without coming up (underwater missions in DMC1 and DMC2), and fighting in space (Dante vs Mundus), but this part about not being able to breathe in the mirror world clarifies that Dante doesn't actually need to breathe at all. He's probably more comfortable breathing, or at least does it out of habit, but he clearly can survive without doing it.

She was keeping up with DMC1 Dante and Nigthamare multiple times in DMC1 events

More accurate to say that she hit him by surprise and then used her electricity to down him. Problem is he got up without any problems after she went all out trying to kill him. Thing with electricity, especially where organic muscles are involved, is that it has two forms of power, its current and its charge. The charge clearly did nothing to him, but the current makes his muscles convulse, hence why it knocks him down without genuinely damaging him.

, even was stated that she was sended by Mundus to kill Dante because he was afraid of Dante's powers

If she was weak them Phantom them no reason to just send him instead of her to his shop

Trish attempted to kill Dante, but when she failed to end him there she lured him to the island, which was her true purpose all along. Lure him to the island where Mundus can make multiple attempts to get him. Phantom would never have been able to achieve that.

In Phantom's case, I suspect he was in charge of Mallet Island prior to his death, because we know Griffon was sent to hunt Dante, and Nelo and Nightmare were both in the demon world. In addition, we're shown multiple signs of, and hear multiple references to, people who've come to the island in the past, likely due to it appearing all over the world at different times, and when Phantom sees Dante he dismissively says he's "another small one". He also doesn't figure out what Dante is until he's killed by him. This tells me that Phantom did not know Dante was coming, and that he is responsible for at least some of the dead people on the island. Thus, he's positioned on the island, the guy in charge there. And yet no-one told him Dante was coming. I suspect Mundus saw Phantom as quite expendable. Useless, even.

It so happens we know which demons Mundus expected would be effective against Dante; after Nelo was beaten he told Trish that with Vergil's defeat he's wanting Trish to help Nightmare kill Dante. After than fails he uses her as his hostage so he can do it himself. It's clear he thought that Nelo and to a lesser extent Nightmare had a chance. It's also clear that the thing that made Trish useful was her ability to backstab Dante.

 

[Tanin_iver]

i agree with most stuff but can Dante have self sustenance for surviving in space??

I think Space Survival should be added.
Also, I haven't kept up with the discussion, I will look into the thread later.

 

[Mister6ame6]

Agreed. We see when Trish attacks Dante at the start that Trish can't genuinely damage Dante (he gets up unharmed and not even bothered after her attack) but the current in her attacks does have the ability to cause spasms, perhaps in particular when he isn't ready for it. Inconvenient when he's busy fighting Nightmare.

Well he kinda fell damaged from her eletricity considering is the only time in the séries that Dante get show to be affected by eletricity in the verse

Every other time we see Dante or Nero brushing it off like it was nothing special like in the case with Nevan and Blitz for example

She also was keeping up with DMC1 Dante so that still should count for something since well she should not be able to keep up with them at their speeds they going tho

Demons have special breathing already from being able to stay underwater without coming up (underwater missions in DMC1 and DMC2), and fighting in space (Dante vs Mundus), but this part about not being able to breathe in the mirror world clarifies that Dante doesn't actually need to breathe at all. He's probably more comfortable breathing, or at least does it out of habit, but he clearly can survive without doing it.

Yes, but is only for some time as you can see in the page

I making permanently since where demons live you cannot breath in the DW

More accurate to say that she hit him by surprise and then used her electricity to down him. Problem is he got up without any problems after she went all out trying to kill him. Thing with electricity, especially where organic muscles are involved, is that it has two forms of power, its current and its charge. The charge clearly did nothing to him, but the current makes his muscles convulse, hence why it knocks him down without genuinely damaging him.

She was the only person that knowked him down with eletricity if you compare to the other examples nothing happens with him when the likes of Blitz try on him

Trish attempted to kill Dante, but when she failed to end him there she lured him to the island, which was her true purpose all along. Lure him to the island where Mundus can make multiple attempts to get him. Phantom would never have been able to achieve that.

In Phantom's case, I suspect he was in charge of Mallet Island prior to his death, because we know Griffon was sent to hunt Dante, and Nelo and Nightmare were both in the demon world. In addition, we're shown multiple signs of, and hear multiple references to, people who've come to the island in the past, likely due to it appearing all over the world at different times, and when Phantom sees Dante he dismissively says he's "another small one". He also doesn't figure out what Dante is until he's killed by him. This tells me that Phantom did not know Dante was coming, and that he is responsible for at least some of the dead people on the island. Thus, he's positioned on the island, the guy in charge there. And yet no-one told him Dante was coming. I suspect Mundus saw Phantom as quite expendable. Useless, even.

Well, yeah you are rigth there

It so happens we know which demons Mundus expected would be effective against Dante; after Nelo was beaten he told Trish that with Vergil's defeat he's wanting Trish to help Nightmare kill Dante. After than fails he uses her as his hostage so he can do it himself. It's clear he thought that Nelo and to a lesser extent Nightmare had a chance. It's also clear that the thing that made Trish useful was her ability to backstab Dante.

Other them being able to keep up with DMC1 Dante and Nigthamare, which obsiuly a fodder demons would never be able to do it

She also was abe to intercept Mundus's attack that was suppose to kill Dante so of course she would need to react to speed on similar level to Dante anyway

 

[Mister6ame6]

I think Space Survival should be added.
Also, I haven't kept up with the discussion, I will look into the thread later.

They already have that in the page iirc

So noo need to add unless it is not there

 

[Tanin_iver]

They already have that in the page iirc

Didn't see that Hypertornado already added them.

 

[Minos_the_Judge]

She was keeping up with DMC1 Dante and Nigthamare multiple times in DMC1 events, even was stated that she was sended by Mundus to kill Dante because he was afraid of Dante's powers

If she was weak them Phantom them no reason to just send him instead of her to his shop

We later saw that Trish and Lady are not very different in characterization. She is definitely much weaker than Dante.

She is <<<< Phantom <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< (infinite) Mundus, which Dante scales to.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

This is the 6th time you are trying to scale nightmare to Dante, heck now Trish too

 

[Random-Helper323]

Well he kinda fell damaged from her eletricity considering is the only time in the séries that Dante get show to be affected by eletricity in the verse

Every other time we see Dante or Nero brushing it off like it was nothing special like in the case with Nevan and Blitz for example

We haven't seen those demons hit them in cutscenes, but we do see Dante get struck by lightning in DMC1, so I'll acknowledge that Trish's lightning does more than all of that. All the same, current and charge are different. The charge is the energy that generally kills, the current is the energy that allows it to travel through things. Given that Dante convulsed as is realistic with electrocution, but was completely fine, not even bothered, as soon as the current stopped, tells me that the electricity wasn't damaging him; the current was just making his muscles react. This tells us that Trish's lightning has a stronger current than the other electricity, but clearly getting Dante's muscles to spasm via electric current is a great deal easier than actually damaging him with it.

It's sort of like being able to move someone with your attacks versus actually damaging them.

She also was keeping up with DMC1 Dante so that still should count for something since well she should not be able to keep up with them at their speeds they going tho

She shot Dante in the back when he wasn't looking and while he was already fighting Nightmare.

Yes, but is only for some time as you can see in the page

I've never noticed that. All the same, the mirror world scan helps clarify things.

She also was abe to intercept Mundus's attack that was suppose to kill Dante so of course she would need to react to speed on similar level to Dante anyway

That attack is Mundus' particle beam. It's clearly a powerful attack but ironically not his fastest, since we see that the energy spears he'd just shot Dante with are faster, given that they're the opening attack, they're harder to dodge in gameplay and finally they get used later to tag Sparda DT Dante. He didn't attempt the particle beam until Dante was already crippled by the spears. So this does prove Trish faster than the particle beam, which is certainly a feat, but the spears Mundus used were faster, and that was what tagged Dante. So this can't be used as a one to one measurement between her and Dante.

 

[Random-Helper323]

We later saw that Trish and Lady are not very different in characterization.

Trish was holding back, in fairness.

She is definitely much weaker than Dante.

She is <<<< Phantom

We can't ignore that after Trish had already seen Dante effortlessly shrug off her attempt to kill him, she was still in disbelief after he defeated Phantom. She wouldn't have responded with such disbelief if she herself was vastly stronger than Phantom.

 

[Mister6ame6]

Well, since Trish is the only the thing that people are agasit here rn

I going to remove it so we can move on since is not worth dying on a hill for it.

This is the 6th time you are trying to scale nightmare to Dante, heck now Trish too

I never tried to scale Nightmare to Dante before tho?

 

[MysticBrawler]

14- Acausality (Type 1): Demons are unaffected by changes in the past and future, as show with the Demon World bringing back Phamtom from the past to the present while his present version was not affected by the time paradoxes happening in DMC2 events. Demons are unaffected by stoppage of time by the Demon World and they are physically unaffected by the creation and continuous warping of closed off space-time loops on top of them.] They can also leave and enter the loop casually.

Shouldn't this be Acausality(Type 2)?

 

[Mister6ame6]

Shouldn't this be Acausality(Type 2)?

Type 2 is for not existing in the past and future

Demons still have a past and future, they are just not affected by changes on it

 

[Netoriman]

@Mister6ame6 what is 16 proposing ability wise?

 

[Mister6ame6]

@Mister6ame6 what is 16 proposing ability wise?

Basically what Lady said

Demons are more powerfull in their demon forms (True Form) them on their human forms

Transformation and statistic amplification basically

 

[Tanin_iver]

Also, I haven't kept up with the discussion, I will look into the thread later.

As promised, I have finally come, although it was a bit too late. I have taken a look at the thread.
I share the same thoughts as Minos_the_Judge regarding 9, 10 & 15. For the rest my thoughts are the same as Random-Helper323
As for 11, it is already indexed somewhat in Demon phys, but maybe it can work as more scans or elaboration, idk.

 

[chosen]

1- Sealing: Demons are able to create seals to bind their victims in place.

Looks good

So does 3-5

Demons are immune to every weapon made in the Human World, which in order to hurt and kill then. you need materials made in the Demon World to do that. and as pointed by Gilver to Dante when they clash with each others swords, their metals are made from materials from the Demon World, which will not bend by simple brute force alone

First scan is eh, can Just be talking about dura

Materials part should be fine, but i don't see why that applies to any profiles besides one that use dw material instead is a generap thing

Resistance Negation: They are able to hurt and eventually kill Sparda and his descendants with their attacks, as show that Dante was stated that he will be killed by the Neo Generator if he don't run faster enough to reach his destination quickly, was going to be killed by the Key of Ardor if Dante did not run fast enough to save his own life and was only still alive by holding it because of his sheer force of will, was stated to be able to be killed by Sin Scythe a lower class of demon species and later by Nightmare, who was stated to become so powerful in their last encounter that he is able to kill Dante now. Nero was easily overpowered by Agnus and killed by a mere single stab in the stomach, which required Yamato to ressurect him

That's not even Resistance neg

And for 15, fighting someone who has those =/= you have thkse, take for exemple how jiren could fight ui Goku despite nit having instinctive reactions

 

[Mister6ame6]

Well, gonna remove the Resistance Neg since is what people are complaining here

It still good enougth to support RE Neg so i'm happy with that

Materials part should be fine, but i don't see why that applies to any profiles besides one that use dw material instead is a generap thing

Well, because demons materials and their skins is the same thing in universe, so it should work imo

We even see in BtN demons like the Enpuza being unaffected by the military's weapony in DMC5 events

And for 15, fighting someone who has those =/= you have thkse, take for exemple how jiren could fight ui Goku despite nit having instinctive reactions

Well, there is more them 10 demons that can figth on par with the Sparda boys, so they either get instinctive reactions or the skill to figth them

I'm fine with either anyway

 

[chosen]

We even see in BtN demons like the Enpuza being unaffected by the military's weapony in DMC5 events

Can just be dura , again.

Well, there is more them 10 demons that can figth on par with the Sparda boys, so they either get instinctive reactions or the skill to figth them

Sure but not enough to warramt a upgrade for demons as a whole cuz alot of demons also get washed or Something