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Nanatsu no Taizai Retcon Downgrade

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Peter1129

Peter1129

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So basically like the title said this is gonna be a downgrade thread due to the recent retcon Nakaba made multiple times in the series. We will pretty much be discussing whether or not we should ignore this retcon.

In the extra chapter we see that the Meliodas from 10 years ago had his Prime Demon Mark.

In chapter 317 we also see another flashback of Prime Demon Mark Meliodas fighting Escanor.

In the Escanor gaiden we see Prime Assault Mode Meliodas one shotting The One Escanor.

This calc that all the 6-C+ and some of the High 6-C scale to is no longer usable for scaling. The Meliodas that performed the Danafor pulverization has been retconned from Unsealed Meliodas to Prime Meliodas. So now all 6-C+s and some of the High 6-Cs are getting downgraded to just 6-C scaling from Drole's earthquake.

Arguments for the downgrade: These retcons are the most recent chapters which should take precedence over previous chapters and events.

Arguments against the downgrade: These retcons are inconsistent with what was previously established in the story and should therefore be ignored.
 
Escanor being weaker wouldn't really make any sense. Throughout the series it's been shown that Mid-Morning Escanor starts around the 50k range. Prime Base Meliodas is at the very least over 60k. So it makes absolutely no sense for Dawn Escanor to be stronger than Prime Base Meliodas.
 
Prime Mel being in the flashback doesn't make sense either tbh and it contradict many story elements through the story so pick your poison.
 
Pretty sure we use the most recent stuff. So since Nakaba retconned the Meliodas before the start of the series than that's what we are using now. Also just remembered that Base Galand struggled to lift up Rhitta so Dawn Escanor should still be 6-C.
 
This recton absolutely ruin nearly every fight Mel had since he got his power back and refuse to accept it tbh.

Anyway I will wait fir everyone opinion tbh.
 
More than a retcon, this is just an inconsistency, because everytime there is a flashback Nakaba ends up screwing up. Meliodas can't be at his Prime, since he had become considerably weaker during the course of the 3000 years after the holy war, which the DK stated.

https://i2.**********.com/nanatsu-no-taizai/183/nanatsu-no-taizai-7840363.jpg

https://i8.**********.com/nanatsu-no-taizai/183/nanatsu-no-taizai-7840375.jpg

We already know that Meliodas maximum strenght when he recovered his power was 56k of PL, being considerably weaker than Zeldris. And we know that all the power Merlin stole was given back in Istar. Which means that if Mel was that much weaker than his prime is because he had been losing power over the course of time, just like what the DK said. This gaiden also contradicted a few other things like how in Corand it was implied Escanor and Mel had never fought before, or how Escanor got surprised about Mel's AM, also implying it was the first time he had seen it. This also contradicts Escanor's power, from being one shoted by Prime Mel to fighting the DK?

This is just plain ridiculous by this point, Nakaba should stop making flashbacks if he doesnt remember his own manga. I vote for just ignoring this, it greatly contradicts the manga, and important details too.
 
Well there has been hints that Nakaba was retconning the Meliodas in the past to Prime Meliodas multiple times throughout the story. The first time was in the extra chapter flashback they showed Prime Meliodas' Demon Mark. The second time was during the fight against the baby Indura, Escanor was shown to be getting destroyed by Prime Demon Mark Meliodas in his brief flashback. And now the Escanor Gaiden officially confirmed that Nakaba has retconned Meliodas' power to his Prime. So yeah whether we like it or not a retcon is a retcon.

Also The One Escanor being one shot by Prime AM Meliodas is actually consistent with him being far weaker than Mael. Escanor fighting Full Power DK Zeldris is the inconsistent one that contradicts his previously established power.
 
Peter1129 said:
Well there has been hints that Nakaba was retconning the Meliodas in the past to Prime Meliodas multiple times throughout the story. The first time was in the extra chapter flashback they showed Prime Meliodas' Demon Mark. The second time was during the fight against the baby Indura, Escanor was shown to be getting destroyed by Prime Demon Mark Meliodas in his brief flashback. And now the Escanor Gaiden officially confirmed that Nakaba has retconned Meliodas' power to his Prime. So yeah whether we like it or not a retcon is a retcon.
Click to expand...
That extra chapter is already an inconsistency in itself, as Meliodas was supposed to use Wrath Mark. Meliodas problem in Liones and Danafor wasnt having or not his full power, it was losing control of it and going berserk, and the demon mark for it is the wrath one. Chapter 317 isnt even worth mentioning, as the ones fighting in the flashback were not The One and AM, like in the Gaiden.

Like i said, this greatly contradicts the manga, in many things. This contradicts all the Vaizel arc and the next arcs when Mel has lost his emotions in order to regain his power. Im not on favor of even considering this as a retcon when it looks more of a screw up, you cant just contradict many important story arcs for a single flashback.
 
Well guess we should probably contact some staff about whether or not we should ignore a retcon than.
 
We should also here more opinions, i do agree that is a delicate subject as it greatly affects the scaling chain. No need to rush things, lets let others give their opinions too.
 
Personally, given the massive number of inconsistencies in this final arc I think we really need to wait and see what other information the series will give us before it ends.

Trying to decide what we accept and make explanations for will take time and effort as a whole community to settle. This is important to note as it impacts a ton of scaling, but I think that we should hold off on downgrades for now.
 
@Peter1129; would you be able to provide links to each of the cases supporting Meliodas' retconned level of power?
 
I agree, we should wait until the end so that we have everything accounted for and Nakaba can't add more things that don't make sense.
 
I see. And originally we were led to believe that Meliodas only had his Prime Demon Mark 3,000 years ago, and after he had his emotions stolen by the Demon King, right?
 
Also I'm not exactly sure what you guys mean by this affects a lot of the scaling. The only thing that is getting affected because of this retcon is the High-Mid and Low-High Tiers of the verse. It contradicts the story but it doesn't really affect the scaling. All it does is it will drop them from 6-C+ to 6-C. The scaling is still the same it's just the AP that gets lowered.
 
You guys do realize that the scaling doesn't get affected at all right? Prime Assault Mode Meliodas being stronger than The One Escanor was something that was implied a long time ago.
 
I don't think that escanor was weak or something unless we know "sunshine get stronger overtime"
 
There is literally no evidence of Escanor being weaker in the past. And power lvls, powerscalings, statements, and lore all point towards Prime Meliodas and Sunshine Mael being far more powerful than Escanor. So Prime Assault Mode Meliodas one shotting The One Escanor was something everybody should've seen coming. And yes this thread is basically talking about Prime Meliodas destroying Danafor and not Unsealed Meliodas which therefore downgrades the Mid Tiers of the verse. So can we please stop going off topic.
 
How is it not obvious to you that Escanor was weaker in the past? Escanor has literally been doing but getting stronger in this final arc.

The One got one shot by AM Meliodas in the past. The One beats AM Meliodas in the present. The One struggles with Ominous Nebula Zeldris and Mael with Sunshime says he cant fight Demon King in Zeldris body (weakened mind you) with all 10 Commandments. Yet here is Pre-Noon Escanor fighting a stronger version of Demon King Zeldris and his current The One is holding the advantage in the strongest version of the Demon King we've seen now that surpasses even the Demon King in AM Meliodas' body with all 10 Commandments.
 
Because he might not have gotten stronger for all we know it could be plot induced stupidity, inconsistency, and outlier or a mix of them considering how many of them are in this arc. So until there is straight up confirmation that he got stronger I'm leaning towards PIS. And we might be getting it next chapter or Escanor might just be getting a new form.

Prime Assault Mode Meliodas was the one that beat The One Escanor and Post-Revival Assault Mode Meliodas was the one that got beaten by The One Escanor. Like I said before it's either PIS, inconsistency, outlier or a mix of them all. We have confirmation that Escanor's power lvl is lower than Mael's via scaling. We've had multiple statements that imply both Mael and Meliodas is more powerful than Escanor. One from Zeldris and one from Ludoshel. Feats also show that Near-Noon Escanor got stomped by Original Demon while Near-Noon Mael can one shot a stronger Original Demon.

And like I said can we please stop going off topic. This thread is for discussing whether or not we should downgrade characters due to the retcon or ignore the retcon altogether. This isn't a Escanor was weaker or got stronger thread.
 
I might feel that this is irrelevant, but when Escanor was frustrated in the Gaiden chapter (after believing he killed Meliodas and Ban) He was punching an mountain while also going into The One form and the mountain wasn't fully destroyed. Present Escanor should have no problem destroying a mountain mid-high noon, but Escanor in the past couldn't completely destroy it. It might be because of what was going through his head and maybe inexperience with his Sunshine. That's just what I think.
 
Demon King also isn't supposedly able to destroy Diane's battlefield to get back to lake. 4C Mael's Lightball of Love needed two hits to destroy a small floating island even though Base Zeldris w/ God completely destroyed one with one attack. And I'm pretty sure there are other examples of characters being super powerful and yet not completely destroying their surroundings with their attacks. That scene with Escanor just seemed like he needed something to be his punching bag.
 
When he Dies Irae'd the sky island Gilthunder, Hendrickson, Dreyfus, and Ludoshel were on after he got Arc blasted by Ludoshel.
 
I mean, I feel like we are giving Mel so much slack for what? Being the main character? So we accept the recton of Mel to be stronger than he is originally but Escanor is a plot hole now?

Escanor went from one shotting AM Mel, to struggling a little with Zel, to statement the DK. Mael says he is helpless against the DK but Escanor can fight him, yes this is stupid, but how is this more stupid than Mel dying to the ******* TC despite having his AM mode this whole time? How is this more stupid than Mel losing control for a full ******* arc for a form he apparently had full control all this time?

This recton contradicts so many story elements it's ridiculous.

I am with the side of ignoring this flashback if Nakaba can't remember his own manga like @Siegfried10 said.
 
Well the difference is Meliodas being stronger than he was before the series began doesn't affect the scaling. Escanor on the other hand does.

The One Escanor is much more consistently shown to be a top tier. He was able to one shot a high tier (Post-Revival Assault Mode Meliodas), struggled against a top tier (Full Power Zeldris), and one shot by a stronger top tier (Prime Assault Mode Meliodas). Also even if Unsealed Meliodas was capable of using Assault Mode I doubt it would've changed much since he was still really weak back than. Zeldris would've just destroyed him with God.

I'm really not sure if we can just ignore a retconned story element.
 
yes because as many have said already prime mel being the one who destroyed danafor makes no sense whatsoever.
 
It contradicts the story but like I said before a retcon is a retcon. Pretty sure you can't just write off a retcon as PIS.
 
"PIS, short for "Plot-Induced Stupidity" is a term used to refer to events in a story that contradict a character's normal capabilities for the purpose of the plot."

i'm pretty sure the retcon is the perfect example of PIS, nakaba doesn't even try to explain on how or why prime mel was used in that fight hell make up some BS about merlin giving back mel his prime power just for the fight but no absolutely no explanation for this major inconsistency.
 
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