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OFF, the incredibly hard to google French RPG Maker game, has had profiles for a while- it's not a terribly handled verse or anything, but it does have some big hiccups due to the age of the profiles.
Not only that, but the Nothingness in particular is very abstract. It's called "a place of transition outside of space itself", and the game isn't even sure if it's a world map or not. Getting size from it is pretty questionable.
As for the OTHER thing that's wrong with it, Zones aren't planets. Nothing in the game suggests this outside of them being circular in the Nothingness (and they could still be circular if they were countries), while there's a couple of things that go against it. Several characters refer to the world of OFF as a world, which wouldn't be evidence against it since "world" can mean universe, but with the world map calling itself that, that's a bit more suspicious.
There's more concrete evidence, though. The Batter refers to Zone 1 as a land multiple times, and proceeds to do so for the other Zones in the game. Zone 2's library says the city of Bismark is Zone 2. Finally, Dedan, talking about himself and the Guardians, says the Zones they will received will be countries. This (******* awesome) painting from Mortis Ghost also has a compass on the world map, which would be damn weird if it wasn't all on a single planet.
Anyway, point is, I recalculated it considering the Zones countries, and the result is 5-B. Also, this is a downgrade in range for the Batter's purification.
The Sun in The Room is very weird but it should be usable, however one issue I do have with the 4-B rating is that while the Zones were created with E=mc^2, we can't know if that's the same for the Queen, as the Guardians get their energy from the Sun, which obviously couldn't have been the case for the Sun's creating, since, uh, how're you gonna get that energy from it if it doesn't exist yet? Since we don't know if it was done in the same method, "4-C, possibly 4-B" should be safer- it might still be E=mc^2 since that's how OFF seems to do creation- but we can't say that for sure. However, the Room has at least three separate versions of itself as seen in Chapter 3 of The Room (the one with the fake-out Save Files), so the Queen is x3 4-C baseline or x3 the E=mc^2 of creating a sun for 4-B so that's an upgrade there.
That is, if we accept the Room as being created by the Queen. It only gets purified after Hugo is killed, and a lot of it is drawn in a childish artstyle, which makes me think the actual child created it, not to mention it features narration from Hugo in the chapter focused on the Guardians and in the battle between the Batter and the Queen. However, while the Room is only truly purified upon killing Hugo, it still drastically changes upon killing the Queen, so it might be that she's partially substaining it, so I'd say "At least 5-B, possibly 4-C or 4-B" for that key, as messy as that is.
I'm not done here, unfortunately. The Spectres' current tiering is based on a KE calculation for the Zone 2 whales. Not only does it use a really wonky Hypersonic+ speed rating for them and the Batter, but it calculates KE from their general movement speed, which is against our rules (it wasn't at the time). So, 8-B is bust too, although the same blog contains an 8-C feat for the Burnt Elsen which should be usable. This also downgrades Zacharie.
As for fodder Spectres/Non-Sugar-Deprived Burnt Elsen, we should downgrade them to 10-A, as that's all it takes to kill someone with relative ease, especially when that someone is too stupid to fight back, as all normal Elsen are.
The Pastel Burnt Elsen gets 5-B durability cause the Batter can't kill it normally, and if we do that then we're considering it a boss enemy thus 5-B in AP too.
FINALLY, as we no longer consider save files as timelines, The Player gets downgraded from Low 2-C to Unknown... is what I would say, but here's something I found. This is the description of the Batter on the now-defunct OFF website:
"Being a purificatory physical incarnation, the Batter is under the control of a soul from outside the world of Off. He exists for but a single mission: to destroy the spectres that overstep the divine laws and decide to sow discord among the living."
Being that the Player exists outside the world of OFF and is repeatedly called a puppeteer, implying superiority towards it, and that he can manipulate the save files in the Room, showing a level of control over the world of OFF as a whole, I think there's a legitimate argument for Low 1-C.
RECAP: Boss characters are gonna be 5-B before the Room, then those in the Room are gonna be At least 5-B, possibly 4-C or 4-B. Hugo's gonna be 4-C, possibly 4-B with his powers. The Player is gonna be Low 1-C if that's accepted otherwise Unknown. Fodder's gonna be 10-A to 8-C, with Zacharie scaling to 8-C
Secondly, I've thought about it and I do think SoL reactions being based off moving in the Nothingness is a bit questionable. Again, with the Nothingness being a weird void that's outside of space, I doubt you'd need to react to many things to move around, nevermind that the Batter's movement speed in it isn't any different from his normal speed. I can see an argument for it staying and I could even be convinced to agree, but right now I think it should be axed. Also, the Add-Ons' attacks aren't light-based, at least not as far as we know.
Now, I've said the sun in the Room should be legit, the map in that section of the game is FAR too symbolic and abstract to get speed from. Besides, while it seems the Batter is going through it, he's just reliving Hugo's memories in that chapter. So, if anything, Hugo gets High Hypersonic for flying to the Sun, and while it is true that the Batter did kill him, he was just sitting there, making no attempt to run away.
The Hypersonic+ ratings on the Spectres' profile is also very wack as detailed in the AP section. This, again, also downgrades Zacharie.
So, speed should unfortunately be changed to Subsonic+ | At least Subsonic+, likely higher, unless better feats are found.
The Player's speed should be comparable to the Batter as he can easily perceive his battles.
Here's a supporting feat of baby Japhet lifting Enoch with a couple of friends.
"The Spectres" should be renamed to just "Spectres"
The Pastel Burnt gets a key of its own in the Elsen page
Several profiles use fanart while there is perfectly good official art available, I'll replace that.
Stats
Attack Potency
Alright, the current calculation for the stats before The Room is 4-C off calculating the Zones' sizes based off the speed of the Batter in the Nothingness, since everything moves at Light Speed in there, and then treating them as spheres. There's a couple things wrong with that. First off, using a world select is always very iffy to begin with, especially since this is RPG Maker we're talking about, and character speed is always the same unless the creator goes out of their way to change it, which Mortis Ghost didn't. It's also the same movement speed he has in normal gameplay- in fact, it's literally just normal gameplay.Not only that, but the Nothingness in particular is very abstract. It's called "a place of transition outside of space itself", and the game isn't even sure if it's a world map or not. Getting size from it is pretty questionable.
As for the OTHER thing that's wrong with it, Zones aren't planets. Nothing in the game suggests this outside of them being circular in the Nothingness (and they could still be circular if they were countries), while there's a couple of things that go against it. Several characters refer to the world of OFF as a world, which wouldn't be evidence against it since "world" can mean universe, but with the world map calling itself that, that's a bit more suspicious.
There's more concrete evidence, though. The Batter refers to Zone 1 as a land multiple times, and proceeds to do so for the other Zones in the game. Zone 2's library says the city of Bismark is Zone 2. Finally, Dedan, talking about himself and the Guardians, says the Zones they will received will be countries. This (******* awesome) painting from Mortis Ghost also has a compass on the world map, which would be damn weird if it wasn't all on a single planet.
Anyway, point is, I recalculated it considering the Zones countries, and the result is 5-B. Also, this is a downgrade in range for the Batter's purification.
The Sun in The Room is very weird but it should be usable, however one issue I do have with the 4-B rating is that while the Zones were created with E=mc^2, we can't know if that's the same for the Queen, as the Guardians get their energy from the Sun, which obviously couldn't have been the case for the Sun's creating, since, uh, how're you gonna get that energy from it if it doesn't exist yet? Since we don't know if it was done in the same method, "4-C, possibly 4-B" should be safer- it might still be E=mc^2 since that's how OFF seems to do creation- but we can't say that for sure. However, the Room has at least three separate versions of itself as seen in Chapter 3 of The Room (the one with the fake-out Save Files), so the Queen is x3 4-C baseline or x3 the E=mc^2 of creating a sun for 4-B so that's an upgrade there.
That is, if we accept the Room as being created by the Queen. It only gets purified after Hugo is killed, and a lot of it is drawn in a childish artstyle, which makes me think the actual child created it, not to mention it features narration from Hugo in the chapter focused on the Guardians and in the battle between the Batter and the Queen. However, while the Room is only truly purified upon killing Hugo, it still drastically changes upon killing the Queen, so it might be that she's partially substaining it, so I'd say "At least 5-B, possibly 4-C or 4-B" for that key, as messy as that is.
I'm not done here, unfortunately. The Spectres' current tiering is based on a KE calculation for the Zone 2 whales. Not only does it use a really wonky Hypersonic+ speed rating for them and the Batter, but it calculates KE from their general movement speed, which is against our rules (it wasn't at the time). So, 8-B is bust too, although the same blog contains an 8-C feat for the Burnt Elsen which should be usable. This also downgrades Zacharie.
As for fodder Spectres/Non-Sugar-Deprived Burnt Elsen, we should downgrade them to 10-A, as that's all it takes to kill someone with relative ease, especially when that someone is too stupid to fight back, as all normal Elsen are.
The Pastel Burnt Elsen gets 5-B durability cause the Batter can't kill it normally, and if we do that then we're considering it a boss enemy thus 5-B in AP too.
FINALLY, as we no longer consider save files as timelines, The Player gets downgraded from Low 2-C to Unknown... is what I would say, but here's something I found. This is the description of the Batter on the now-defunct OFF website:
"Being a purificatory physical incarnation, the Batter is under the control of a soul from outside the world of Off. He exists for but a single mission: to destroy the spectres that overstep the divine laws and decide to sow discord among the living."
Being that the Player exists outside the world of OFF and is repeatedly called a puppeteer, implying superiority towards it, and that he can manipulate the save files in the Room, showing a level of control over the world of OFF as a whole, I think there's a legitimate argument for Low 1-C.
RECAP: Boss characters are gonna be 5-B before the Room, then those in the Room are gonna be At least 5-B, possibly 4-C or 4-B. Hugo's gonna be 4-C, possibly 4-B with his powers. The Player is gonna be Low 1-C if that's accepted otherwise Unknown. Fodder's gonna be 10-A to 8-C, with Zacharie scaling to 8-C
Speed
First off, here's a brief Subsonic+ movement speed calculation.Secondly, I've thought about it and I do think SoL reactions being based off moving in the Nothingness is a bit questionable. Again, with the Nothingness being a weird void that's outside of space, I doubt you'd need to react to many things to move around, nevermind that the Batter's movement speed in it isn't any different from his normal speed. I can see an argument for it staying and I could even be convinced to agree, but right now I think it should be axed. Also, the Add-Ons' attacks aren't light-based, at least not as far as we know.
Now, I've said the sun in the Room should be legit, the map in that section of the game is FAR too symbolic and abstract to get speed from. Besides, while it seems the Batter is going through it, he's just reliving Hugo's memories in that chapter. So, if anything, Hugo gets High Hypersonic for flying to the Sun, and while it is true that the Batter did kill him, he was just sitting there, making no attempt to run away.
The Hypersonic+ ratings on the Spectres' profile is also very wack as detailed in the AP section. This, again, also downgrades Zacharie.
So, speed should unfortunately be changed to Subsonic+ | At least Subsonic+, likely higher, unless better feats are found.
The Player's speed should be comparable to the Batter as he can easily perceive his battles.
Lifting Strength
Ay, finally an upgrade. The Burnt Elsen blocking the subway car in Zone 3 is Class M and scales to literally everyone except for Hugo and the Player, and possibly the very weakest of Spectres as that Burnt Elsen is actually fairly durable, it just refuses to attack.Here's a supporting feat of baby Japhet lifting Enoch with a couple of friends.
Abilities
The Batter
- The Batter and other characters are said to be able to hit abstracts. They... can't. Couldn't find anything on it at least.
- Self-Sustenance is likely based on him flying to the Sun in the Room, which again, I'd rather not use.
- Magic... I mean, Competences aren't necessarily magic, are they? As far as we know at least.
- Purification is currently treated as "Limited Text and Information Manipulation, Existence Erasure, and Reality Warping via Purification", but it actually has no Information Manipulation showings, so that's gotta go.
- Several characters have Resistance to "Resistance to Mind, Soul, Spatial, and Void Manipulation" I... have no idea what this is from. Maybe from resisting his own Purification? In which case it should be changed to resistance to the above hax. As for the rest... yeah I got no clue.
- His second key has "As before, plus Flight, and Resistance to Information Manipulation, Time Manipulation, and Reality Warping via The Player" which the exception of Flight, which comes from flying to the Sun, I think this is about the save file stuff? No idea, but either way I can't think of any showings for it.
- Chain Manipulation - ??? I think this comes from Alpha's "- String" attacks, but not only are they likely not literal, but Alpha's attack names are based off programming.
- Extrasensory Perception - Sensed the presence of Spectres before being able to see them.
- Resistance to Poison, Blindness and Power Negation - (The Secret Day prevents the one it is equipped to from suffering of Poison, Blind or Mute)
- Resistance to Madness and Empathic Manipulation - (Thursday grants resistance to Furious and Madness)
- Resistance to Biological Manipulation - Can survive the Judge's Competences, which are based around inflicting Sclerosis and Aneurysms
The Player
- Flight has no basis. Idk about you, but I can't fly. Same for Invisibility,
- Possession isn't correct- The Batter and The Judge keep their free will when under the Player. It should be Minor Plot Manipulation instead- after all, the one you side with at the end wins, with the Judge treating your support as something tangible and important. To add to this, the player is said to be guiding the Batter at a few points.
- Higher-Dimensional Existance should be added if Low 1-C is accepted.
- Resistance to the abilities Purification is should be removed- even if Low 1-C isn't accepted, the Player still lives outside the world of OFF and would not be reached by the Purification.
Bosses
- Dedan should have Teleportation- he does it at one point in Zone 1, after confronting the Batter for the first time.
- I have no idea what Dedan's Conceptual Manipulation comes from.
- Dedan should get Matter Manipulation cause he turns energy into matter
- Dedan's attacks can inflict Furious or Sleep, his 笑 can Mute though, so Empathic Manipulation should be added (Cause of Furious)
- The status effects Japhet can inflict are Mute and Poison, so Empathic Manipulation should be removed and replaced with Power Nullification.
- Enoch should get Body Control, as he fit through his Zone's pipes to chase the Batter. I mean, he already has it, but the current explaination is wrong.
- Enoch's Dramatic Crescendo doesn inflict Sleep, it drains CP, so it's Absorption of Stamina or something idk.
- Considering he created a new element, Elemental Manipulation should fit Enoch perfectly.
- Sugar/Sucre shouldn't have NPI, as she never fights Spectres nor would she have the ability lore-wise due to being a Guardian... cause she isn't. However, since literally everything else in the verse has it, I think it should stay, just with a "possibly" on front.
- Sugar should also lose Purification-related Resistances as she has no showings of resisting it.
- No idea what her Mind Manipulation and Electricity Manipulation are from. Seriously, none.
- The Queen loses Flight and I don't have to repeat myself as to why.
- No idea about her Information Manipulation comes from.
- However one of her Add-Ons has Healing so that's nice.
- Her "Appearance seemingly changes based on the perspective of the individual" should link to Perception Manipulation, same as the Batter.
Species
- Burnt Elsen get:
- Power Nullification (Mute, through Murmur of the Flies)
- Empathic Manipulation and Poison Manipulation (Through Inhuman Decadence) for Sugar-Deprived Burnt
- Healing (Through Aspiring Suzerain), Empathic Manipulation and Poison Manipulation (Through Inhuman Decadence) for the Pastel Burnt
- Ghosts get:
- All status effects in the game (through various moves), Flight, Absorption (of stamina), Sound Manipulation and Summoning (of laughs)
Other Profile Stuff
The Batter's profile should be split into tabbers to make it clear what abilities are his and what abilities belong to the Add-Ons. Same story for the Queen."The Spectres" should be renamed to just "Spectres"
The Pastel Burnt gets a key of its own in the Elsen page
Several profiles use fanart while there is perfectly good official art available, I'll replace that.
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