One Piece: Egghead

[Kachon123]

I've been sitting these Egghead revisions for a while so here they are. There'll probably be more things in the future (powers and abilities-related things) so stay tuned

Primary Scaling Sandbox:

Kachon123/s

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Spoiler: New Profiles

Gorosei Sandbox:
Team:

Kachon123/Gorosei

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Individual:

Kachon123/m;kjdkqd

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Seraphim Sandbox:
Team:

Kachon123/Seraphim

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Individual:

Kachon123/Seraphim Pages

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Vegapunk, Pacifista, Sea Beast Weapons:

Kachon123/Vegapunk, Pacifista, and the Sea Beast Weapons

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Kuma and Bonney New Abilities:

Kachon123/Bonney and Kuma Abilities

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New Keys for certain characters. Refer to the Primary Scaling Sandbox for details

Egghead Island Size:

One Piece: Egghead Island Size

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Spoiler: Speed Calcs

One Piece: Luffy Eats a Beam of Light

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One Piece: Luffy Dawn Stamp

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One Piece: Giant Luffy Dodges Lasers

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One Piece: Sanji Saves Edison

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One Piece: Luffy Grabs Kizaru

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One Piece: Kuma's Attack Speed

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One Piece: Chopper Dodges Queen's Laser Beam

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Updated Verse Page:

Kachon123/Verse Page

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[KingTempest]

Good job. Like actually. Great initiative and I applaud the work done.

I'll read through everything to check to see what I agree with and what I don't in a sec

 

[That_moron2]

One question, I don't see any scaling to 5-C characters in Robin's justifications, so why is she 5-C?

 

[Bananossauro]

Why is that goober Lucci 2x stronger than soul amped Big Mom? I know he kinda scales to g5 but I think thats a bit wacky.
Also I also think its clunky to have sanji and Lucci to G5 speed (the 40c) cuz Gucci was figthing for his life against a not as serious G5 and in sanji justification its just a charged laser and that could be any speed higher than light, and garcia, whos scaling is sanji and eye thingy that might not scale to speed directly.

 

[KingTempest]

So first

Remove the "far higher up to Small Planet level" for people who are already Small Planet level.
Like Luffy who has Low 5-B with his gears, there's no reason to say "5-C. Low 5-B with Gears. Far higher, up to Low 5-B with Conquerors Infusion". It's redundant and it fills the place up.

Zoro's says "and and". Fix that

For Kuzan and Sakazuki

Fought Sakazuki equally for ten days

This happened two years ago, so right when the timeskip started. If this remains a justification, it should go in their pre timeskip key (which I'm not even a fan of them having).

Robin has no reason to be 5-C at that time via scaling to sea beast weapons and Lilith who have no reasonable justification. Definitely not due to being comparable to Zoro either.
Nevermind. I saw the reason on discord. Just make sure you add the scaling to her profile so people don't get confused, and it can be shortened when the Vegas get profiles.

Saturn took his own special abilities knocked back at him so idk how I feel about him being Moon level. Plus I don't even like him being weaker than
Base Kizaru, Base Zoro, Base Sanji, Base Lucci, and all of the seraphim.
Saturn was there fighting Sanji for a while. No reason to only scale the special abilities to em.

A large part of me doesn't even wanna split up all of their ratings seeing as their portrayal puts them all on relative levels (with some differences but I digress), but a gorosei and their abilities shouldn't vary too much as they're both powered by whatever Imu is juicing them. Just keep them all together.

Kaku scales to Zoro via the justification there yet base Kaku is Moon+ (376.724 Exatons) and base Zoro is Small Planet (753.448 Exatons). Not a fan of this.

Fix this parenthesis mess up.

Mars has no reason for an "up to" rating.

I recommend you place some justifications for the vegapunk peeps now just so we don't have to worry about it later. No issue handling scaling prior to creating profiles. Issues arise when we cram stats and abilities all at once.

On the verse page, the new value for the worldwide earthquake is 54.055 Exatons.



That's it for now.

 

[Damage3245]

Why is the "Summoning" on the Five Elders profiles Limited? Also shouldn't it be listed as Portal Creation too? Saturn travelled from his ship to Egghead via it.


EDIT: Most of the speed calcs look okay but I have a couple questions. Will delve into them soon.

 

[Kachon123]

Saturn took his own special abilities knocked back at him so idk how I feel about him being Moon level

He got destroyed and needed to regenerate

Saturn was there fighting Sanji for a while. No reason to only scale the special abilities to em.

They didn't have a fight. Sanji deflecting Saturn's strike was their only meaningful interaction.

Kaku scales to Zoro via the justification there yet base Kaku is Moon+ (376.724 Exatons) and base Zoro is Small Planet (753.448 Exatons). Not a fan of this.

Zoro never fully went out until later in the arc when he fought Lucci. I'll let Emin elaborate when he gets here if you have any more questions on this.

 

[Eseseso]

Awesome! Just a few things:

1. Robin is 5-C via scaling to the Sea Beasts...except the Sea Beasts don't have any scaling.

2. Stussy used her seastone lipstick only on Lucci not Kaku, so if anything that indicates that Base Lucci >= Awakened Kaku (though IIRC they scale to the same value so it doesn't matter).

Rest looks great!

 

[Kachon123]

1. Robin is 5-C via scaling to the Sea Beasts...except the Sea Beasts don't have any scaling.

The Sea Beast weapons are stronger than the Satellites, who could harm Base Luffy.

 

[Eseseso]

The Sea Beast weapons are stronger than the Satellites, who could harm Base Luffy.

Is Atlas harming base Luffy legit?

 

[Kachon123]

Is Atlas harming base Luffy legit?

Yes. She's meant to be powerful considering her job is to beat up holograms and she could one-shot Lilith.

 

[Eseseso]

Yes. She's meant to be powerful considering her job is to beat up holograms and she could one-shot Lilith.

Makes sense, does Lilith have any scaling?

Also, how come Base Sanji's durability is only 5-C+ when his AP in base is 5-B?

Also for Awakened Lucci's buso, him one-shotting Sentomaru through his Haki defense could be added as an AP feat.

 

[Kachon123]

Also, how come Base Sanji's durability is only 5-C+ when his AP in base is 5-B?

Editing mistake.

 

[Eseseso]

Editing mistake.

Gotcha. Just 2 small things left:

1. How does Kuzan scale to Gear 5 level (24 zettatons)?

2. For Awakened Lucci's AP with Armament Haki, it's worth noting IMO that he pierced Sentomaru's haki defense which held up against Kizaru's normal attacks. Of course, this was Awakening + Buso Haki + Rokushiki Lucci and not his standard Awakened Form.

 

[KingTempest]

He got destroyed and needed to regenerate

They didn't have a fight. Sanji deflecting Saturn's strike was their only meaningful interaction.

Alright

Zoro never fully went out until later in the arc when he fought Lucci. I'll let Emin elaborate when he gets here if you have any more questions on this.

That's stupid but w/e

 

[Damage3245]

The Sea Beast weapons are stronger than the Satellites, who could harm Base Luffy.

Scan for the first part of this? The Sea Beast Weapons bring stronger than Atlas?

 

[Kachon123]

Scan for the first part of this? The Sea Beast Weapons bring stronger than Atlas?

The Pacifista Mark III and the Sea Beast weapons are considered the main military/defensive force of Egghead Island and both Saturn and Kizaru expressed that losing them would be a large loss of combat power.

 

[Eminiteable]

Kaku scales to Zoro via the justification there yet base Kaku is Moon+ (376.724 Exatons) and base Zoro is Small Planet (753.448 Exatons). Not a fan of this.

Zoro never fully went out until later in the arc when he fought Lucci. I'll let Emin elaborate when he gets here if you have any more questions on this.

Kaku's justifications should probably get revised to remove confusion as what Kachon said is true.

Spoiler: Zoro & Kaku

• Base Zoro destroyed Base Kaku's strongest Rokushiki technique with one sword
• An off-sceeen fight where "Base" Zoro matched "Base" Kaku
• CoA Zoro blocked Awakened CoA Kaku's Rokushiki strike and overpowered it with no named attacks
• CoA Zoro's Named Attack and base Kaku's Rokushiki sent S-Hawk flying

Based on their various interactions it shows Zoro's strength doesn't remain consistent, we also see this with the seraphim where Kaku got destroyed by two Seraphim and was bandaged up for the rest of the arc where as Zoro held his own and if the anime is to be believed was the one who defeated them.

 

[Damage3245]

The Pacifista Mark III and the Sea Beast weapons are considered the main military/defensive force of Egghead Island and both Saturn and Kizaru expressed that losing them would be a large loss of combat power.

I don't think that this is a good enough justication to be honest. There is no direct comparison between Atlas and the Pacifista/Sea Beast Weapons; the satellites aren't military weapons that the WG would be able to use.

Also the scan you've used for justification doesn't actually say that Zoro or Robin could take out the Sea Beast Weapons (though I'm sure Zoro could). What Shaka is saying is that Zoro and Robin have detirmined that they need to take out Lilith (the one controlling the Sea Beast Weapons). Both of them possess abilities that could take her out quickly.


Also, regarding the speed calcs. Can you walk me through this calc please? Please explain the method you used for it.

 

[Eseseso]

Kaku's justifications should probably get revised to remove confusion as what Kachon said is true.

Spoiler: Zoro & Kaku

• Base Zoro destroyed Base Kaku's strongest Rokushiki technique with one sword
• An off-sceeen fight where "Base" Zoro matched "Base" Kaku
• CoA Zoro blocked Awakened CoA Kaku's Rokushiki strike and overpowered it with no named attacks
• CoA Zoro's Named Attack and base Kaku's Rokushiki sent S-Hawk flying

Based on their various interactions it shows Zoro's strength doesn't remain consistent, we also see this with the seraphim where Kaku got destroyed by two Seraphim and was bandaged up for the rest of the arc where as Zoro held his own and if the anime is to be believed was the one who defeated them.

While most of this makes sense, didn't Zoro use an Iai attack to destroy the Rankyaku? Also, the Amane Dachi was aimed at the ship, not any of the Straw Hats (though why Kaku was using his strongest move on a ship is beyond me) and was done without any charge up.

Personally, I think Base Kaku is below Zoro but not to the point of being a different AP value from him, but as long as Base Kaku is at least on the same relative tier as Base Zoro (like the sandbox has him), then it's fine by me, since we know his Awakening at the minimum is superior to Base Zoro by forcing him to use Buso which the sandbox's value also reflects.

 

[Eminiteable]

While most of this makes sense, didn't Zoro use an Iai attack to destroy the Rankyaku? Also, the Amane Dachi was aimed at the ship, not any of the Straw Hats (though why Kaku was using his strongest move on a ship is beyond me) and was done without any charge up.

He didn't, he used a regular sword slash. The Sky Slicer is always done with charge up (that's the mechanism of it's strength, otherwise it would be a standard tempest kick) however Oda doesn't always draw this for the sake of panel space.

 

[KingTempest]

While most of this makes sense, didn't Zoro use an Iai attack to destroy the Rankyaku? Also, the Amane Dachi was aimed at the ship, not any of the Straw Hats (though why Kaku was using his strongest move on a ship is beyond me) and was done without any charge up.

Personally, I think Base Kaku is below Zoro but not to the point of being a different AP value from him, but as long as Base Kaku is at least on the same relative tier as Base Zoro (like the sandbox has him), then it's fine by me, since we know his Awakening at the minimum is superior to Base Zoro by forcing him to use Buso which the sandbox's value also reflects.

This

Half the things said by Emin was COA. We aren’t referencing COA. Even in EL Zoro cut up rankakyus but still matched his pace. He just used a stronger move

 

[Eseseso]

Considering Base Kaku fought Base Zoro off-screen without visible harm (since he simply goes Awakened right after), having him at only half the AP value of Base Zoro doesn't make sense.

Just have him be 753 exatons like Base Zoro, with his Awakened Form remaining the same at 753 exatons but higher into it.

Base Kaku = Base Zoro =< Hybrid & Awakened Kaku

 

[Kachon123]

I don't think that this is a good enough justication to be honest. There is no direct comparison between Atlas and the Pacifista/Sea Beast Weapons; the satellites aren't military weapons that the WG would be able to use.

That's sort of the point. The satellites aren't fighters or combat weapons. The Sea Beast Weapons specifically are the main weapon they used outside of the Frontier Laser Dome to protect Egghead Island. Lilith and York even use it as they leave the island to protect themselves.

Also the scan you've used for justification doesn't actually say that Zoro or Robin could take out the Sea Beast Weapons (though I'm sure Zoro could). What Shaka is saying is that Zoro and Robin have detirmined that they need to take out Lilith (the one controlling the Sea Beast Weapons). Both of them possess abilities that could take her out quickly.

Lilith then asks about the Sea Beast Weapons surrounding them and Shaka replied saying that they would deal with them after killing her.

Also, regarding the speed calcs. Can you walk me through this calc please? Please explain the method you used for it.

Which part specifically?

 

[Kachon123]

Considering Base Kaku fought Base Zoro off-screen without visible harm (since he simply goes Awakened right after), having him at only half the AP value of Base Zoro doesn't make sense.

Just have him be 753 exatons like Base Zoro, with his Awakened Form remaining the same at 753 exatons but higher into it.

Base Kaku = Base Zoro =< Hybrid & Awakened Kaku

He scales with his stronger Rokushiki techniques. We're not scaling Kaku to any version of Zoro when he easily blocked Kaku's strongest attack with one sword without applying any Haki after just waking up. Zoro was so unimpressed with the attack that he was more focused on the fact that he had to wake up from his nap. The way Kaku is rated in the sandbox is fine.

 

[Damage3245]

That's sort of the point. The satellites aren't fighters or combat weapons. The Sea Beast Weapons specifically is the main weapon they used outside of the Frontier Laser Dome to protect Egghead Island. Lilith and York even use1 it as they leaves the island to protect themselves.

Well, out of all of them Atlas has shown to be a fighter. I agree that the likes of York and Lilith aren't.

I don't think there's any scaling link between Atlas and the Sea Beast Weapons.

Lilith then asks about the Sea Beast Weapons surrounding them and Shaka replied saying that they would deal with them after killing her.

I don't think Shaka is really saying that. And even if he is, his statement alone isn't enough to guarantee that Nico Robin could beat the Sea Beast Weapons; he doesn't know her full capabilities personally.

Which part specifically?

Sanji's movement and the distance he travelled.

 

[Kachon123]

Well, out of all of them Atlas has shown to be a fighter. I agree that the likes of York and Lilith aren't.

I don't think there's any scaling link between Atlas and the Sea Beast Weapons.

The issue with this is that Atlas is still considered one of the Satellites and a Vegapunk, the smartest man of the world, not a force herself. That force are the Sea Beast Weapons and Pacifista.

I don't think Shaka is really saying that. And even if he is, his statement alone isn't enough to guarantee that Nico Robin could beat the Sea Beast Weapons; he doesn't know her full capabilities personally.

Perhaps, but she should also be relative to Brook and other crewmates. The statement is enough to at least note her as a main fighter of the crew.

Sanji's movement and the distance he travelled.

I found the distance from Edison to S-Hawk, and then the distance between Sanji and S-Hawk.

 

[Damage3245]

I found the distance from Edison to S-Hawk, and then the distance between Sanji and S-Hawk.

So which distance did Sanji travel in the time it took the laser to cross 3.53874723 m? Where was his starting point and ending point in that timeframe.

 

[Kachon123]

Lowballed to Edison, even though it would be a bit before that.

 

[Damage3245]

To be clear; I don't think that calc in its current form is accurate which is why I'm asking for details on why it was calced the way it was and what the underlying assumptions are.

 

[Eseseso]

He scales with his stronger Rokushiki techniques. We're not scaling Kaku to any version of Zoro when he easily blocked Kaku's strongest attack with one sword without applying any Haki after just waking up. Zoro was so unimpressed with the attack that he was more focused on the fact that he had to wake up from his nap. The way Kaku is rated in the sandbox is fine.

Still not fond when he has other stuff supporting that level such as off-screen fighting Zoro and pressuring S-Hawk.

Would his hybrid scale above his strongest Rokushiki, btw? And where would his Tekkai and Lucci's Tekkai scale in durability (since in Enies Lobby their Tekkai was equal to the AP of their Rokushiki IIRC)

Also:

1. How does Kuzan scale to Gear 5 level (24 zettatons)?

2. For Awakened Lucci's AP with Armament Haki, it's worth noting IMO that he pierced Sentomaru's haki defense which held up against Kizaru's normal attacks. Of course, this was Awakening + Buso Haki + Rokushiki Lucci and not his standard Awakened Form.

In addition, this should be removed from Awakened Kaku's durability:

Stussy needed to use sea stone prism in order to incapacitate him as she would not have been able to win otherwise.

She only uses the Seastone lipstick on Base Lucci, not Awakened Kaku (which if anything implies that Base Lucci is superior).

 

[Damage3245]

She only uses the Seastone lipstick on Base Lucci, not Awakened Kaku (which if anything implies that Base Lucci is superior).

I don't think that proves Awakened Kaku is superior to base Lucci. The circumstances were slightly different; Kaku was taken completely by surprise by a sneak attack. Lucci was aware of Stussy's betrayal and actively in combat against her.

 

[Eminiteable]

Still not fond when he has other stuff supporting that level such as off-screen fighting Zoro and pressuring S-Hawk.

He has one off-sceeen fight where the one panel shown we don't know the outcome of said clash (he could have been overpowered) or if it was even truly "base" Kaku as he could have used a Rokushiki technique to perform that.

There's two feats, the sky slicer as Kachon described and the off-sceeen clash, two contradicting feats but just looking at Zoro's past opponents (not even for this arc like with Base and Awakened Lucci) we have seen him choose to clash with his opponent despite having the strength to finish them with a single attack;

Spoiler: Zoro Clashes

1. Zoro Vs Hody Jones
2. Zoro Vs Hyouzou
3. Zoro Vs Monet
4. Zoro Vs Pica
5. Zoro Vs Hawkins
6. Zoro Vs Apoo

Sorry for the lack of links as I'm unable to do so at this time, but in the fights listed Zoro has clashed "equally" against said opponents and later shown that said clashes weren't a true display of his power (this is excluding power ups obviously as we are talking about base Zoro solely)

Kaku's feats against S-Hawk are already listed on the sandbox.

 

[Kachon123]

The way Kaku is rated in the sandbox is fine.

 

[Eseseso]

I don't think that proves Awakened Kaku is superior to base Lucci. The circumstances were slightly different; Kaku was taken completely by surprise by a sneak attack. Lucci was aware of Stussy's betrayal and actively in combat against her.

Fair enough, hence why I said it was more of an implication. Base Lucci and Awakened Kaku scale to the same value in the sandbox so it doesn't really matter.

 

[Kachon123]

To be clear; I don't think that calc in its current form is accurate which is why I'm asking for details on why it was calced the way it was and what the underlying assumptions are.

What would you change?

 

[FinePoint]

Other than the issues already brought up by KingTempest and Damage, this all looks good to me.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Borsalino's light clones can harm Gear 5 Luffy and pressure him into retreating momentarily

which allowed him to deal significant damage to Gear 5 Luffy

Non of these are from attack potency, they are from Kizaru's heat, which is dura neg as it says on the profile... So either remove those or add those in the dura neg justification (Also add scans for his dura neg section)

For Laser Acceleration justification you can use this

which allowed him to defeat and take out Sentomaru

Was more than an even match for Gear 5 Luffy

This statement is for Luffy not Kizaru... Meaning Kizaru is less than an even match, this being a justification for Kizaru makes no sense

being able to clash with him for an extended period of time

There's no proof here that they actually clashed with each other... What we literally see in the panel is luffy hitting kizaru's lasers, trying to keep him at bay and that's all so remove this justification

Rob Lucci believed that he could kill the Straw Hat Crew with Borsalino's help despite having witnessed Luffy's power firsthand

Zoro himself says he doesn't know what he's talking about in that same page, and they were factually unable to kill everyone, debunking whatever Lucci believed... So remove this

Lifting strength justification for kizaru makes no sense as well, kicking Sanji away could be a possible justification for that

Withstood getting squeezed and thrown by a Gigantified Gear 5 Luffy

Luffy wasn't squeezing him here, being thrown by someone isn't a durability feat as well... So remove this

Conqueror's Haki Infusion (His Huhuva Hunt quickly dispatched Awakened Lucci)

This isn't Conqueror's Haki Infusion, the lightning isn't coming from his swords so until there's perhaps more proof in the future this is just Armament Haki spark/Advanced Armament Haki

even higher with Conqueror's Haki Infusion (Knocked Borsalino down for an extended period of time with Star Gun)

This also isn't Conqueror's Haki Infusion, there's no lightning coming from Luffy's hand, there's only armament haki

higher reactions (Countered strikes from Diable Jambe Sanji. Easily dodged Awakened Lucci's Hand Pistol Spots technique)

These are combat speeds... So just remove higher reactions and put the justification on his combat speed section

Lifting Strength: Class Z (Superior to Awakened Rob Lucci)

Can use these feats for justification

even higher with enhanced speed (Allows Sanji to move at vanishing speeds)

Remove this, this is Sanji using his base speed and doing a technique of always moving, appearing to be invisible

Withstood an eye blast from St. Jaygarcia Saturn

Idk about withstood.. He got literally taken out, laying on the floor in pain

Got bit by Full Bakotsu form St. Ethanbaron V. Nusjuro and got back up without issues

Here as well, "no issues" just isn't true... His bones literally broke from the bite and was also taken out by the attack

For now these are the only adjustments for Luffy, Kizaru, Zoro and Sanji otherwise they seem somewhat fine, I'll check later if there's any other issues and improvements to implement... I also agree with most of Kingtempest's improvements as well

 

[KingTempest]

Non of these are from attack potency, they are from Kizaru's heat, which is dura neg as it says on the profile... So either remove those or add those in the dura neg justification

For Laser Acceleration justification you can use this


This statement is for Luffy not Kizaru... Meaning Kizaru is less than an even match, this being a justification for Kizaru makes no sense

There's no proof here that they actually clashed with each other... What we literally see in the panel is luffy hitting kizaru's lasers, trying to keep him at bay and that's all so remove this justification

Zoro himself says he doesn't know what he's talking about in that same page, and they were factually unable to kill everyone, debunking whatever Lucci believed... So remove this

Lifting strength justification for kizaru makes no sense as well, kicking Sanji away could be a possible justification for that

Luffy wasn't squeezing him here, being thrown by someone isn't a durability feat as well... So remove this

This isn't Conqueror's Haki Infusion, the lightning isn't coming from his swords so until there's perhaps more proof in the future this is just Armament Haki spark/Advanced Armament Haki

This also isn't Conqueror's Haki Infusion, there's no lightning coming from Luffy's hand, there's only armament haki

These are combat speeds... So just remove higher reactions and put the justification on his combat speed section

Can use these feats for justification

Remove this, this is Sanji using his base speed and doing a technique of always moving, appearing to be invisible

Idk about withstood.. He got literally taken out, laying on the floor in pain

Here as well, "no issues" just isn't true... His bones literally broke from the bite and was also taken out by the attack

For now these are the only adjustments for Luffy, Kizaru, Zoro and Sanji otherwise they seem somewhat fine, I'll check later if there's any other issues and improvements to implement... I also agree with most of Kingtempest's improvements as well

Oh

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Oh

I always forget how much time it takes to go through sandboxes and scans fr