- 1,747
- 777
All the other Magic Gods can manipulate Fate, so I'm unsure as to why Othinus doesn't have it right now. Can we get that put back on real quick? I don't think I need to divulge why, do I?
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Othinus Fate Manip?
- Thread starter Accelerate420
- Start date
- Status
- 1,504
- 446
I don't know why she doesn't have it either. I mean she literally decided everyone's fate in the Omega world since she was the one to build that world but also as you pointed out the other Magic Gods also have Fate Manipulation so Othinus should have it to. I know Othinus is meant to be a weaker Magic God compared to the rest but this seems clear cut to me.
- 165,229
- 72,263
You should ask DontTalkDT and LazyHunter to comment here.
- 1,812
- 317
Yes, she should have it. From NT9:
Magic God Othinus could control everything. Without exaggeration, she controlled the world itself. If she wanted to, she could have galaxies collide to kill Kamijou Touma. Or she could break the bonds between the particles making up his body and cause his very existence to disperse. If she was the slightest bit dissatisfied with something, she could turn back time, re-lay the rails of fate that led to the future, and create the exact result she wanted.
This is a bit vague and can likely be interpreted as a flowery way of saying "can change the future via time traveling to the past. However High Priest confirmed destiny exists and magic gods can set it (in fact, they accidentally do it just by using their powers) and Lilith's whole plot deal is how Phases (the things Magic Gods create, edit and destroy) can impose unavoidable fate/destiny on the world, like dooming Lilith to die no matter what.
From NT13:
"It isn't something we could simply ignore," said the High Priest. "Kamijou Touma, do you believe in destiny?"
"Destiny?"
"Ha ha. That may be difficult for someone poisoned by science in Academy City, but you must have always felt that you were burdened with misfortune."
"…"
"There is such a thing as unavoidable destiny. There are powerful rails that cannot be overcome by an individual's decisions. But even that is ultimately nothing more than the result of an unseen clash between the opinions of Magic Gods. Of course, we have no intention of harming any specific individual. In fact, the individuals clinging to this puny planet never enter our field of vision. Still, our actions are constantly affecting the outside world and make great changes in the world. It can be quite a problem."
From NT18
"This world contains as many phases as there are divine legends and religions. And the distance between each phase is not even. The rise and fall of civilizations and traditions affect the power balance in the real world. When you get down to it, fortune is the sparks that failed to become miracles. The spray produced by the contact and collision between phases has a shockingly thin but widespread influence on people. It affects coin tosses, the order at which dishes are served at a restaurant, meetings and partings, marriages and divorces…and even people's deaths. If you see no direct cause for your daughter's death, you should assume it is a spontaneous event caused by a gathering of the influence that so many people are unwittingly affected by."
"You mean there is no such thing as a spontaneous accident or illness in this world?" asked the silver-haired young man. "You mean the small things that people accumulate are an issue of the overlapping phases and, as a result, the entire world will cause slightly unsanitary conditions to force a deadly illness onto my daughter? Is that what you are saying, teacher?"
"That is taking it a bit far. Your daughter is nothing special. Everyone is affected by it equally. But a unified theory like Hermeticism roughly grabs and gathers the overlapping phases, causing them to collide all the more. I imagine that would make the sparks more frequent. And this will influence more than just the present. The future is made from the present, after all."
Magic God Othinus could control everything. Without exaggeration, she controlled the world itself. If she wanted to, she could have galaxies collide to kill Kamijou Touma. Or she could break the bonds between the particles making up his body and cause his very existence to disperse. If she was the slightest bit dissatisfied with something, she could turn back time, re-lay the rails of fate that led to the future, and create the exact result she wanted.
This is a bit vague and can likely be interpreted as a flowery way of saying "can change the future via time traveling to the past. However High Priest confirmed destiny exists and magic gods can set it (in fact, they accidentally do it just by using their powers) and Lilith's whole plot deal is how Phases (the things Magic Gods create, edit and destroy) can impose unavoidable fate/destiny on the world, like dooming Lilith to die no matter what.
From NT13:
"It isn't something we could simply ignore," said the High Priest. "Kamijou Touma, do you believe in destiny?"
"Destiny?"
"Ha ha. That may be difficult for someone poisoned by science in Academy City, but you must have always felt that you were burdened with misfortune."
"…"
"There is such a thing as unavoidable destiny. There are powerful rails that cannot be overcome by an individual's decisions. But even that is ultimately nothing more than the result of an unseen clash between the opinions of Magic Gods. Of course, we have no intention of harming any specific individual. In fact, the individuals clinging to this puny planet never enter our field of vision. Still, our actions are constantly affecting the outside world and make great changes in the world. It can be quite a problem."
From NT18
"This world contains as many phases as there are divine legends and religions. And the distance between each phase is not even. The rise and fall of civilizations and traditions affect the power balance in the real world. When you get down to it, fortune is the sparks that failed to become miracles. The spray produced by the contact and collision between phases has a shockingly thin but widespread influence on people. It affects coin tosses, the order at which dishes are served at a restaurant, meetings and partings, marriages and divorces…and even people's deaths. If you see no direct cause for your daughter's death, you should assume it is a spontaneous event caused by a gathering of the influence that so many people are unwittingly affected by."
"You mean there is no such thing as a spontaneous accident or illness in this world?" asked the silver-haired young man. "You mean the small things that people accumulate are an issue of the overlapping phases and, as a result, the entire world will cause slightly unsanitary conditions to force a deadly illness onto my daughter? Is that what you are saying, teacher?"
"That is taking it a bit far. Your daughter is nothing special. Everyone is affected by it equally. But a unified theory like Hermeticism roughly grabs and gathers the overlapping phases, causing them to collide all the more. I imagine that would make the sparks more frequent. And this will influence more than just the present. The future is made from the present, after all."
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #6
Nice. I'll see if I can get DT in here then to unlock the profile if he can.
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #8
Seems it's been done, you can lock it now.
- 10,502
- 11,574
Why was Othinus tier edited in a revision regarding Fate Manipulation?
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #10
Oh, that's weird. Not sure why that happened. Othinus should be able to produce High 1-C things even in her 50/50 probability stage but this isn't what it was about, so I'm okay if anyone wants to edit that.
- 10,502
- 11,574
This is another addition to DestinyDude0's list of rule breaks, together with adding the results of a non-accepted CRT to Accelerator on October 25 and the insults I warned him about some time ago.
What's your take on this Antvasima?
What's your take on this Antvasima?
- 266
- 189
The October 25th example was a geniune mistake. I was too hasty and didn't realize it was false. Regardless, I'm taking an indefinite break from VS Battles anyways to cool off. You can do what you want. Adios XD
- 10,502
- 11,574
Ok. Then I will leave it at that for now.
In regards to fixing the page (for those knowledgeable on the verse): I'm uncertain regarding High 1-C, though it should in any case be specified that this is with her 50/50 power only and doesn't apply to her other abilities.
However, I don't think the justification works. Othinus is explained to have tossed aside her original power at some point long ago, meaning when she altered her original world she was more powerful than in her 50/50 state.
Which is perfectly plausible seeing that rewriting her original world in 50/50 state just wouldn't work properly.
In regards to fixing the page (for those knowledgeable on the verse): I'm uncertain regarding High 1-C, though it should in any case be specified that this is with her 50/50 power only and doesn't apply to her other abilities.
However, I don't think the justification works. Othinus is explained to have tossed aside her original power at some point long ago, meaning when she altered her original world she was more powerful than in her 50/50 state.
"In a later era, you wanted the lance and you wanted to alter the world. That must have been because your unease came back. You were concerned that your supposedly perfectly-made world was not so perfect after all. You wanted to work some more on the artwork you had already presented to the public. I don't know what you did to regain the power you had cast aside, but something must have happened for that know-it-all Ollerus to hate you so much. ...You longed for the next world because you wanted to add another layer of paint to the canvas. That would explain your internal conflict." |
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #15
It wouldn't work possibly due to the 50/50 probabiltiy factor. If the action lands on the negative, she might just kill herself. I don't see why she can't do it, she just likely /wouldn't/ do it because it's like an RNG of either absolute victory or an instant death. So either way I don't think it's necessary to put since 50/50 shouldn't even be a key to begin with personally. 'Luck lol' keys are kinda dumb if I'm gonna be honest.
- 1,504
- 446
I agree that Othinus 50/50 Shouldn't have a key to begin with, there is nothing to indicate if she will win or if she will lose so most of her battles in this key probably end up as inconclusive since you have no idea if she will have a good day or a bad day.
- 13,731
- 3,682
Well, we are an indexing site mostly and foremost, so we shouldn't get rid of keys just because they dont work well on Versus
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #18
Then the match up should just be banned? Because it's literally something where any random person can say "I think it will work" because it's 50/50. It's just an inconclusive because it's either auto-stomp or auto-stomped since she'd kill herself upon an actual action.
It's like: Imagine if I have a coin. I flip it and it lands on heads, so I say "Othinus pulls out Gungnir and wins." Anyone else can just say "Well I don't think she will because negative probability" and it goes nowhere whatsoever. It's just a meme match for either a free victory or a free inconclusive.
It's like: Imagine if I have a coin. I flip it and it lands on heads, so I say "Othinus pulls out Gungnir and wins." Anyone else can just say "Well I don't think she will because negative probability" and it goes nowhere whatsoever. It's just a meme match for either a free victory or a free inconclusive.
- 13,731
- 3,682
I dont think a ban should be necessary
Just a notable note in the profile regarding the problem should be good
Just a notable note in the profile regarding the problem should be good
- 1,504
- 446
I agree with Accelerate, a ban or removal of the 50/50 key should be the ideal approach, it's not really needed in the first place.
- 13,731
- 3,682
>"Removal"
I've already adressed that above
I've already adressed that above
- 1,504
- 446
And? What's your point?
This is just your opinion which I disagree with. Keys have been removed before and they can be removed again.
This is just your opinion which I disagree with. Keys have been removed before and they can be removed again.
- 13,731
- 3,682
>My opinion
Lol no, thats literally how the site works. Its even in the rules
Just because a key doesnt fit for Versus, it shouldnt be removed, since its still part of the main history
Lol no, thats literally how the site works. Its even in the rules
Just because a key doesnt fit for Versus, it shouldnt be removed, since its still part of the main history
- 1,504
- 446
Yes, your opinion, you stated an opinion. You don't think the key should be removed that is fine but there will be people, like me, who will disagree with that opinion.
What are you going on about? Main history of what? You aren't making any sense here.
Also again, keys have been removed in the past or just straight up not added.
I can't speak for Accelerate but I was just expressing my opinion that was all. We are allowed to do that you know without someone jumping on it. I don't expect Othinus' key to be removed nor am I going to make a CRT on it, I was just merely giving my opinion but I guess that's not allowed,
What are you going on about? Main history of what? You aren't making any sense here.
Also again, keys have been removed in the past or just straight up not added.
I can't speak for Accelerate but I was just expressing my opinion that was all. We are allowed to do that you know without someone jumping on it. I don't expect Othinus' key to be removed nor am I going to make a CRT on it, I was just merely giving my opinion but I guess that's not allowed,
- 13,731
- 3,682
Easy there bud, dont need to get yourself heated
What Im trying to say is, the 50/50 key inflicts literally no harm whatsoever to the profile nor to the wiki. It should stay in Othinus's profile because its a thing that happened in the series
Some keys being removed in the past is mostly a case by case basis, so the argument can vary
The key is only a problem in Versus, which shouldnt be a reason to outright delete the key. Just ban the key from Versus or write a note in the profile explaining the problem with it
What Im trying to say is, the 50/50 key inflicts literally no harm whatsoever to the profile nor to the wiki. It should stay in Othinus's profile because its a thing that happened in the series
Some keys being removed in the past is mostly a case by case basis, so the argument can vary
The key is only a problem in Versus, which shouldnt be a reason to outright delete the key. Just ban the key from Versus or write a note in the profile explaining the problem with it
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #26
The key should just be straight up banned if not removed then, because it produces nothing and it's literally up to whatever the person debating it wants to go with. Othinus has a 50/50 chance of doing whatever she wants or producing Gungnir to go to 100%. It's not fair for either sides, so for the sake of future matchups, I just think it shouldn't be used whatsoever. This isn't even bringing up her third key which is literally just her but dying.
- 13,731
- 3,682
I understand you guys point, really
The key is a major problem on Versus, yes, but thats it, only on Versus.
The profile itself doesnt care at all if the key is good or not on battles, its just for the sake of making an accurate profile of Othinus
Just ban the key from Versus or write a note on her profile about it
The key is a major problem on Versus, yes, but thats it, only on Versus.
The profile itself doesnt care at all if the key is good or not on battles, its just for the sake of making an accurate profile of Othinus
Just ban the key from Versus or write a note on her profile about it
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #28
Yeah, that's why I'd rather ban it or write a note saying it's not versus-applicable due to the mechanics.
- 1,504
- 446
I don't get the third key either. Wouldn't this also be an inconclusive match or a loss for Othinus due to the fact she dies?Accelerate420 said:
But anyway I just went on Othinus' page, I thought it was agreed that Fate Manipulation should be added? I can't see it anywhere.
- 1,747
- 777
- Thread starter
- #30
It's right after Creation on the profile, it got moved for some reason.
- 288
- 137
Othinus has 50% chance of using 100% power. Also actions resulting in the negative seem to vary depending on the amount of power required to perform tasks. hence she didn't just try make gungnir, lose a arm, reattach it and try again until she gets it.
She holds back alot, enough that the backlash doesn't harm her much or in a noticeable fashion, otherwise Othinus would be extremely easy to defeat, just send numbers at her and eventually her power fails and she loses regardless of how powerful the enemy is. However we know that is not possible, as it is stated only a few people can match her whilst holding back enough to not noticeably harm herself (Fiamma, Ollerus) which also adds credit to the unknown rating.
TL;DR: Othinus holds back her power to avoid big backlash, which puts her around the planet level mark where he power can't harm her much
the key should stay. it's not as clear as 50/50 i win i lose as people think.
She holds back alot, enough that the backlash doesn't harm her much or in a noticeable fashion, otherwise Othinus would be extremely easy to defeat, just send numbers at her and eventually her power fails and she loses regardless of how powerful the enemy is. However we know that is not possible, as it is stated only a few people can match her whilst holding back enough to not noticeably harm herself (Fiamma, Ollerus) which also adds credit to the unknown rating.
TL;DR: Othinus holds back her power to avoid big backlash, which puts her around the planet level mark where he power can't harm her much
the key should stay. it's not as clear as 50/50 i win i lose as people think.
- 1,504
- 446
I see it now.Accelerate420 said:
- 1,504
- 446
@XDragnoir
No one even said that so I don't even know where that even came from.
Also the keys aren't going to be removed anyway, so let's just move on from this.
No one even said that so I don't even know where that even came from.
Also the keys aren't going to be removed anyway, so let's just move on from this.
- 1,504
- 446
I mean personally I think all unknown matches should be banned and if one key is pretty much the same as the other one of the keys should be removed. Again this is just my opinion and I am no way arguing that we should change it but rather just giving my opinion on it.
I mean I never get why we have two High 1-C keys for the Magic Gods where there isn't anything different except the fact they don't exist in non-existent phrases.
Of course all this is a moot point and I don't think anything will change here nor do I want to actually write a CRT on it. It's more, I just don't get it personally.
I mean I never get why we have two High 1-C keys for the Magic Gods where there isn't anything different except the fact they don't exist in non-existent phrases.
Of course all this is a moot point and I don't think anything will change here nor do I want to actually write a CRT on it. It's more, I just don't get it personally.
- 266
- 189
- 1,504
- 446
I know the difference -_-
I was more referring to the power and abilties being essitally the same. Of course FP Magic Gods are above Nerfed by Zombie's Magic spell Magic God.
Speaking of baseline I know it's a thing but why isn't it added to the profiles? It seems that some do take the whole baseline seriously although that's seems to be more during Tier 1 fights.
I was more referring to the power and abilties being essitally the same. Of course FP Magic Gods are above Nerfed by Zombie's Magic spell Magic God.
Speaking of baseline I know it's a thing but why isn't it added to the profiles? It seems that some do take the whole baseline seriously although that's seems to be more during Tier 1 fights.
- 266
- 189
While it is indeed a passive ability, his 2nd key also changes his Dura, Lifting, and Striking.
- Status
