Owl House Speed Downgrade

[Flashlight237]

So, I looked into it and I noticed that Luz has a rating of Supersonic with Massively Hypersonic reactions/combat speed. However... The calc that the speed rating came from had some contention.: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Oleggator/Eda's_lighting_feat

The key point is as follows: "Don't we have standards that require proof for this magic lightning to be as fast as real lightning? Sound/music magic was used to create a storm made of electricity that shoots electricity, it's not the same as a real storm or Weather Manipulation."

Ideally I recommend an investigation into the feat. Otherwise, combat/reaction speed should be downgraded to Subsonic based on this: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...ent/Various_Owl_House_Calcs#Hunter_flies_away

So yeah, have at it.

 

[Eficiente]

As far as investigation into the feat goes, it's the first & only time that magic was used. We only got visuals to go off, the feat is not usable.

Worst than that, it would be an outlier even if it was legit, everyone would scale to it, up to even Luz's mom. Any standard value at all on what anti-feats are ruins using it.

To be honest, I have an easy time thinking that this speed is only used out of a need to put the verse "up there" in power, rather than because it makes sense on its own, work could have been put to remove it since months, so I kindly ask some self-reflection because of it. Otherwise, please dismiss the comment & move on.

Titan Luz does have a feat in which she flies to atmosphere, and later down to surface, but it's clear that it's just Flight Speed, her reactions don't scale as she moves in a zig zag manner whenever she uses that flight for mobility.

 

[Flashlight237]

As far as investigation into the feat goes, it's the first & only time that magic was used. We only got visuals to go off, the feat is not usable.

Worst than that, it would be an outlier even if it was legit, everyone would scale to it, up to even Luz's mom. Any standard value at all on what anti-feats are ruins using it.

If that is the case, then that really doesn't give it any consistency points. I typically try and find consistency before going headlong on an upgrade or downgrade. The wiki's members are usually fine with two comparable feats, but I typically prefer three comparable feats for consistency.

To be honest, I have an easy time thinking that this speed is only used out of a need to put the verse "up there" in power, rather than because it makes sense on its own, work could have been put to remove it since months, so I kindly ask some self-reflection because of it. Otherwise, please dismiss the comment & move on.

I typically prefer to ask for investigation when doing these sorts of things, so you're good. Plus when typing this thing up, I didn't see an Owl House CRT pop up anywhere when putting in the title within a single month's range, so uhh...

Titan Luz does have a feat in which she flies to atmosphere, and later down to surface, but it's clear that it's just Flight Speed, her reactions don't scale as she moves in a zig zag manner whenever she uses that flight for mobility.

Got scans?

 

[Eficiente]

Got scans?

Here. She starts flying up, there are 2 cinematic cuts to see what her friends are doing and out of that, she keeps flying upwards and stops, having reached atmosphere. She was moving in a zig zag manner the whole time and there is no reason to believe she reacted to the whole thing, rather than vaguely across it. There isn't even a reason to believe she wanted to be at the exact place where she ended up, rather than vaguely following the hand upwards.

Then she aims herself & co. at the heart to clash there, again, w/o needing to react, just aiming preemptively. Belos does react, but as in, how a normal person would react to a meteor above their head taking 5 seconds to clash from a great distance to Earth, not in tandem with the meteor's speed but at their own speeds.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Seems fine at a glance

 

[Eficiente]

The Collector's speed should also be:

"[Whatever speed feats they have left], up to Sub-Relativistic+ Attack Speed via Telekinesis (Moved the moon this fast), Unknown Flight Speed (His race comes "from the stars", ie deep into outer space, the Collector initially arrived to the Boiling Islands before returning to space at the end of the show, both with an unknown timeframe & distance traveled)"

 

[Eficiente]

Ideally I recommend an investigation into the feat. Otherwise, combat/reaction speed should be downgraded to Subsonic based on this: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...ent/Various_Owl_House_Calcs#Hunter_flies_away

There are even issues with using that feat as their speed. The way they fly is used for travel due to being faster than how they can move themselves, they can collide with things (fail to react) if they're not careful, and will themselves to fly faster with a higher effort (like this), similar to how one accelerates with any vehicle.

• There is no reason to say Hunter flew at the average speed all this palisman staffs move, rather than he started fast because there was nothing in his way.
• There is no reason to say all palisman staffs are as fast, in Eda's Requiem there is a race and Luz loses with Eda's palisman, either via lack of travel speed, lack of reaction speed, or having it all to win but lacking skill.
• Even if they were all as fast, they lack feats of reacting at the peak flying speed the staffs can reach.

 

[Flashlight237]

There are even issues with using that feat as their speed. The way they fly is used for travel due to being faster than how they can move themselves, they can collide with things (fail to react) if they're not careful, and will themselves to fly faster with a higher effort (like this), similar to how one accelerates with any vehicle.

• There is no reason to say Hunter flew at the average speed all this palisman staffs move, rather than he started fast because there was nothing in his way.
• There is no reason to say all palisman staffs are as fast, in Eda's Requiem there is a race and Luz loses with Eda's palisman, either via lack of travel speed, lack of reaction speed, or having it all to win but lacking skill.
• Even if they were all as fast, they lack feats of reacting at the peak flying speed the staffs can reach.

Those are fair points, all this points to vehicle logic, so it's kinda like giving my step-grandfather Subsonic because he drove at 80 miles an hour on the freeway.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

So what would the Owl House characters be downgraded to?

 

[Eficiente]

As I don't see any other calc here, they have nothing really. Here are some noteworthy feats with context:

• Belos as a monster moves super fast in short periods of time, but this is shown to be faster than other characters around him. It unfortunately really seems like he can only do this for a short bit before moving at slower speeds;
  • In the second fight against Luz he chases her across a bridge-like place, presumably going from under the bridge to appear behind her once she turns around, moving at what seem to be superhuman speeds.
  • Before possessing the Titan, a weakened Belos drags himself some unreal distance in a very short amount of time, which Raine was slower than as Belos seemed to have already crossed that distance when Raine tried to.
• The attack speed of Luz's own staff could be superhuman.

 

[TheShape03]

What about this?

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

What about this?

I remember a Google Doc that had an FTL calc of the feat, but tbh it's more likely an outlier even if it were accepted

 

[Eficiente]

I don't think it's an outlier in the sense that I don't think the light was moving at lightspeed. This idea that light always moves at lightspeed in fiction is wrong, light is like any other element manipulated or created by a user and shot as an attack; it moves at whatever speed the user threw it. This light in particular has an uneven shape when shot, unlike real light, and is used as a solid attack blocked as if it were made of mass, unlike real light.

When illuminating it makes sense to believe it moves at the speed of light, but not like this. It's so much more light concentrated it goes from harmless to an attack, why would it still coordinately move a lightspeed rather than have its properties changed?

 

[Flashlight237]

Here. She starts flying up, there are 2 cinematic cuts to see what her friends are doing and out of that, she keeps flying upwards and stops, having reached atmosphere. She was moving in a zig zag manner the whole time and there is no reason to believe she reacted to the whole thing, rather than vaguely across it. There isn't even a reason to believe she wanted to be at the exact place where she ended up, rather than vaguely following the hand upwards.

Then she aims herself & co. at the heart to clash there, again, w/o needing to react, just aiming preemptively. Belos does react, but as in, how a normal person would react to a meteor above their head taking 5 seconds to clash from a great distance to Earth, not in tandem with the meteor's speed but at their own speeds.

That's gonna be tricky to calculate, I guarantee that. The least exaggerated way would be scaling each movement based on how fast Luz and Eda moved relative to the skeleton's fingers. The most exaggerated way is basing things on the curvature of the planet, which I personally think is ill-advised given you can see the skeleton the whole dang time.

Update: Done. Currently waiting for evaluation: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Flashlight237/Owl_House_Calc:_Titan_Luz's_Flight

 

[Eficiente]

Nice calc, please add the "The Owl House" category.

 

[Flashlight237]

Nice calc, please add the "The Owl House" category.

Can't; the wiki needs us to wait for an evaluation before we can add verse categories to calcs.

 

[Eficiente]

Aah, ok.

 

[Flashlight237]

Aah, ok.

Okay, NOW I got it through..!: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Flashlight237/Owl_House_Calc:_Titan_Luz's_Flight

Still can't say they're doing too hot, though. Titan Luz only managed Subsonic.

 

[Lynieryz]

Are there no feats of characters[not using a palisman] reacting to others while they are in a palisman?

 

[Eficiente]

They don't weaponize it like that, so no.

 

[Flashlight237]

So basically these guys are going from the speed ratings currently on their profiles to this?:

 

[Eficiente]

So, how much support would this need to be applied? I don't see much staff listed to support this show.

 

[Flashlight237]

So, how much support would this need to be applied? I don't see much staff listed to support this show.

Basically two of any kind. Might be a bit harder to get there since the verse hardly had any maintenance in general, though.

 

[Eficiente]

I never know whom to tag, but some staff should be tagged.

 

[Ped2018]

I never know whom to tag, but some staff should be tagged.

@Lonkitt @KingTempest @Qawsedf234

Some cool dudes

 

[Eficiente]

Bump.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

So what are the new speed ratings going to look like? I'm guessing most of the characters will just be "Average Human" or something?

Belos as a monster moves super fast in short periods of time, but this is shown to be faster than other characters around him. It unfortunately really seems like he can only do this for a short bit before moving at slower speeds;

• In the second fight against Luz he chases her across a bridge-like place, presumably going from under the bridge to appear behind her once she turns around, moving at what seem to be superhuman speeds.
• Before possessing the Titan, a weakened Belos drags himself some unreal distance in a very short amount of time, which Raine was slower than as Belos seemed to have already crossed that distance when Raine tried to.

So Superhuman short-burst speed?

The attack speed of Luz's own staff could be superhuman.

Seems like Hunter reacts to and dodges it?

 

[Eficiente]

Yes.

Watching it at 0.25 speed again, he most likely reacts to it that loading before it's fired, at least it's indistinguishable from that. In any case, it moves at the speed of a ball being thrown very fast and the way he reacts is rather simple (Triggering a move that let's him move faster), so I don't think it would have been anything either way.

 

[Eficiente]

Bump.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

What's left to do before the downgrade can be applied?

 

[Eficiente]

I think nothing.

 

[Eficiente]

Bump.

 

[Cropfist]

I think nothing.

So will it be applied then?

 

[Eficiente]

Idk if it needs more approval.

 

[ImmortalDread]

A CRT requires a minimum of two staff moderators (or a staff member with evaluation rights) if it is not self-evident/minor CRT. You have the ping privileges, you can probably ping the staff members that @Ped2018 have mentioned here.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

@Lonkitt @KingTempest @Qawsedf234

Some cool dudes

@Lonkitt @KingTempest @Qawsedf234 can you give input here please?

 

[Lonkitt]

The downgrade looks good

 

[Qawsedf234]

Well the YouTube video is no longer up so I can't see the feat, but if people who watch the show agree that it doesn't qualify for CtG lightning then you have my agreement to make the changes.

 

[Eficiente]

Here's the feat.

 

[ImmortalDread]

Ya this is not real lightning, the fact it is even slow to rate it as such. I agree with the thread, and thanks for presenting the feat for us. I could not access it either.