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Pit vs Demiurge (Overlord)
- Thread starter The_man_with_the_Midas_touch
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Unless Pitt immediately starts with Power Thief, Demiurge would be able to see what's he's capable of with info analysis and use something along the lines of Hellfire Wall or Hellfire Mantle to obliterate Pitt's soul before he can destroy Demiurge with the AP gap.
That or he notices Pitt's lack of mental resistances and tells Pitt to slit his own throat.
Gonna give a very, very decisive vote for Demiurge, as in every situation but one where Pitt starts with Power Thief does he lose.
That or he notices Pitt's lack of mental resistances and tells Pitt to slit his own throat.
Gonna give a very, very decisive vote for Demiurge, as in every situation but one where Pitt starts with Power Thief does he lose.
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Command Mantra only works on the weak-willed/people under level 40 though.Dargoo Faust said:
Since Pit is stronger then Demiurge stat wise, who is level 100, would it still work on him?
ApiesDeathbyLazors
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Not really how that works. Pit would need actual mental resistance for it to not effect him. Gonna vote Frog-Face for Dargoo's reasons.The man with the Midas touch said:
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I'm going to go with Demiurge. Info Analysis will tell him that what he needs to know and he'll just immediately take Pit out with his soul incinerating attacks. Which, given that Demiurge is the type to use his abilities in the most efficient manner, given his devious/insidious/pragmatic nature and his only goal is to win this fight.
As for the Command Mantra, while it has conditions we have to think of what that really means. Pit has no actual resistance to Mind Manipulation whatsoever. One could make the argument that Pit qualifies as 'Weak Willed'. We have to remember that CM has two different conditions that affect things:
1. Weak willed beings are completely under Demiurge's control.
2. Even if you're not weak willed, Demiurge can still give you commands and make you do what he wants if you're under LvL 40.
We have to remember that resistances are a thing in Overlord both in YGGDRASIL and in the New World. I would think that the 2nd condition only applies if you have resistance to CM. But them's just my thoughts.
As for the Command Mantra, while it has conditions we have to think of what that really means. Pit has no actual resistance to Mind Manipulation whatsoever. One could make the argument that Pit qualifies as 'Weak Willed'. We have to remember that CM has two different conditions that affect things:
1. Weak willed beings are completely under Demiurge's control.
2. Even if you're not weak willed, Demiurge can still give you commands and make you do what he wants if you're under LvL 40.
We have to remember that resistances are a thing in Overlord both in YGGDRASIL and in the New World. I would think that the 2nd condition only applies if you have resistance to CM. But them's just my thoughts.
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Demiurge - 3 (Dargoo, Apies, C2)
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Demiurge - 4 (Dargoo, Apies, C2, Pixel)
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Demiurge - 5 (Dargoo, Apies, C2, Pixel, DFry)
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Demiurge FRA.
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Demiurge - 6 (Dargoo, Apies, C2, Pixel, DFry, Pheonix)
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Demiurge FRA.
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Demiurge - 7 (Dargoo, Apies, C2, Pixel, DFry, Pheonix, Death)
Grace begins.
Grace begins.
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Demiurge's Coamnnd Mantra will fail on Pit.
Command Mantra has two ways that it will fail:
1. If the target is above level 40, the command will fail.
2. If the target is strong-willed, the command will fail.
The second point is proven when the intelligent/strong willed Emperor Jerkniv resisted it despite his low level. Failing on powerful individuals is a limitation several Yggdrasil spells have for balance sake, and because of Pit's power, it will fail on him, mental resistance or otherwise.
As for Hellfire Wall, Demigure absolutely wouldn't try to kill Pit with it. He didn't even intend for it to the Blue Roses who are hilariously weak compared to Pit.
Command Mantra has two ways that it will fail:
1. If the target is above level 40, the command will fail.
2. If the target is strong-willed, the command will fail.
The second point is proven when the intelligent/strong willed Emperor Jerkniv resisted it despite his low level. Failing on powerful individuals is a limitation several Yggdrasil spells have for balance sake, and because of Pit's power, it will fail on him, mental resistance or otherwise.
As for Hellfire Wall, Demigure absolutely wouldn't try to kill Pit with it. He didn't even intend for it to the Blue Roses who are hilariously weak compared to Pit.
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Actually the Emperor has a Medallion that protects his mind.
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Helfire wall would absolutely work on Pitt if he doesn't resist Soulhax.
It just means Evileye would have had some way to deal with it, even then, he could have just been overestimating her power.
Pit would need mental resistances as we can't apply YGGDRASIL's level system on him, especially since most of the NPCs and players from the game have basic resistances to begin with.
It just means Evileye would have had some way to deal with it, even then, he could have just been overestimating her power.
Pit would need mental resistances as we can't apply YGGDRASIL's level system on him, especially since most of the NPCs and players from the game have basic resistances to begin with.
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@TheC2
Interesting. I didn't know that.
@Dargoo
1. Yes, it will, but would Demiurge use it against a foe of equal power? In Yggdrasil, hax are generally resisted by most powerful opponents. Even if Pit doesn't resist, Demiurge won't know that and after seeing his massive HP and MP from info analysis why would he use an attack made to crowd control weak enemies?
2. When the ability has a specific limitation of "fails at a certain level" we can absolutely apply verse equalization to infer that Pit, who is stronger in raw power and survivability than Demiugre, would be over the level needed to resist it.
Interesting. I didn't know that.
@Dargoo
1. Yes, it will, but would Demiurge use it against a foe of equal power? In Yggdrasil, hax are generally resisted by most powerful opponents. Even if Pit doesn't resist, Demiurge won't know that and after seeing his massive HP and MP from info analysis why would he use an attack made to crowd control weak enemies?
2. When the ability has a specific limitation of "fails at a certain level" we can absolutely apply verse equalization to infer that Pit, who is stronger in raw power and survivability than Demiugre, would be over the level needed to resist it.
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Command Mantra failed on Jircniv because he had a pendant that protects against mind control, so it's still up in the air as to whether it works on Pit or not. As for the Hellfire, Demiurge probably has higher tier hellfire spells, but that is not a sure thing either. I'm leaning towards inconclusive.
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Demiurge's Information Analysis should be able to tell him Pitt's powers and weaknesses/resistances. Even if he could only see the former, the huge gap in power would have him at least try it as his first move as he would know that physical attacks would be useless.
Fair enough.
Fair enough.
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@Dargoo
Has an info user of Overlord been able to see resistances? Info Analysis comes from Life/Mana Essence I thought.
If Demiurge doesn't know, he may use something like Hellfire Mantle or bust out his big gun in Meteor, but Demiurge usually uses his Aspect of the Devil transformations to brawl someone around his physical strength.
Has an info user of Overlord been able to see resistances? Info Analysis comes from Life/Mana Essence I thought.
If Demiurge doesn't know, he may use something like Hellfire Mantle or bust out his big gun in Meteor, but Demiurge usually uses his Aspect of the Devil transformations to brawl someone around his physical strength.
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If he's able to see the difference in strength he'd know that physical attacks would be meaningless. Therefore he'd go for hax as it would logically be the only other thing that would work on Pitt.
He wouldn't use ineffective attacks on purpose.
I remember Ainz having something that could sense resistances.
He wouldn't use ineffective attacks on purpose.
I remember Ainz having something that could sense resistances.
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@Dargoo
"He wouldn't use ineffective attacks on purpose." A fair point, but it cuts both ways. While Pit may be superior in power and he will know this pretty early on, he also knows that people such as Ainz (or any of the 41) or even Evileye will prove resistant to attacks like Hellfire wall. His only chance is to try and break out something like Hellfire Mantle, which Pit can avoid being hit by, and use his superior tactical to beat Pit.
He won't try and use hax abilities that he knows full well fail on people of his level. Trying to beat Pit with higher intelligence and strategy is going to be his only chance.
"He wouldn't use ineffective attacks on purpose." A fair point, but it cuts both ways. While Pit may be superior in power and he will know this pretty early on, he also knows that people such as Ainz (or any of the 41) or even Evileye will prove resistant to attacks like Hellfire wall. His only chance is to try and break out something like Hellfire Mantle, which Pit can avoid being hit by, and use his superior tactical to beat Pit.
He won't try and use hax abilities that he knows full well fail on people of his level. Trying to beat Pit with higher intelligence and strategy is going to be his only chance.
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Wouldn't the fact that he was aware Evileye could resist it before he made the attack proof that he'd be able to deduce the same from Pit?
Even then Hellfire Mantle would have the same effect; just that he'd need to close distance with a teleport and touch Pit.
Even then Hellfire Mantle would have the same effect; just that he'd need to close distance with a teleport and touch Pit.
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He knew because strength = resistances for most Overlord characters. He would think that, because of Pit's power, he will resist it. Of course if he actually does have a spell that can spot lack of hax resistances then Demiurge wins easily. But as of now I don't think he'll abuse the advantage he doesn't know he has.
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Strength does not necessarily equal resistance for Overlord characters. Ainz mockingly warned the workers that they needed to get resistance to time manipulation before level 70, and it doesn't make much sense for him to say that if that resistance comes naturally at that level. Likewise, instant death spells have only been resisted by passive racial skills and enchanted gear so far.
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Grace is finished, so I'll add this.
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