Slow Mo Calc Definition Revision

[Drite77]

So you basically just need peoploe to say wich version they think is better?

 

[CatLover313]

So you basically just need peoploe to say wich version they think is better?

Yes, I believe so. Mainly staff votes ofc. Counted you for revision 2 as that was mainly your advice if that was okay? I was told there just needs to be a size able amount of votes (I’ll probably just stop once a single revision gets 3 votes and ask if that’s enough).

 

[Drite77]

That's ok with me, ye

 

[Saqphire]

I may not be a CGM but why is snail speed even used in the first place as a reference point for slow-mo feats? There are countless examples of slow-mo feats happening when the slowed object would still be moving faster than a snail (0.048km/h or less than a decimetre an hour). A good example of a blatant slow-mo feat like this is in The Boys where A-Train moves at supersonic speed yet was slowed down to a normal walking speed which is obviously faster than a decimetre an hour.

The snail end just seems like a very highballed interpretation of slow-mo feats and as such, if there are only manga/comic/novel statements and showings, a higher speed should be used instead because a higher speed than snail speed can still convey the idea that a thing has been slowed except if the slow-mo is to the point of being seen as completely frozen (almost no static media proves this btw without straight up going into time stop territory)

 

[Damage3245]

Snail speed isn't used for just any slow motion feat. It should be only in cases where a direct "frozen" statement is given.

 

[Floxy178]

the slow motion formula with snail speed can be used (Rain is a common visual slowdown object, and a good example is here). Furthermore, the object of interest needs to be faster than the object of reference.

How we're going to use snail speed method for static media?

 

[Saqphire]

Snail speed isn't used for just any slow motion feat. It should be only in cases where a direct "frozen" statement is given.

Some calculations use snail speed when the object is completely statued, such as this one and this one, not knowing that just because the object was statued, that doesn't mean the object was moving at snail speed; statuing can be done at far lesser ratios.

How we're going to use snail speed method for static media?

You don't. That is w*nking lmfao

 

[CatLover313]

How we're going to use snail speed method for static media?

So for my revision, it’s a much stricter revision for the usage of snail speed. I can only think of two possible instances in Manhwa where it’s drawn something slowing down, the example I put in the definition and another example here. Hopefully, just by looking at the two examples, most people shouldn’t have issues calling it slow mo (?). Very different from any amount of copy paste frozen panels and the strictness of its usage really helps mitigate most instances of outliers.

Edit: Additionally, we could just treat these copy paste frozen panels as just regular blitz calculations instead of using snail speeds still. Snail speed should just be used only when something slows down which is definitely drawable if that was the actual artist/author intention.

 

[CatLover313]

So for my revision, it’s a much stricter revision for the usage of snail speed. I can only think of two possible instances in Manhwa where it’s drawn something slowing down, the example I put in the definition and another example here. Hopefully, just by looking at the two examples, most people shouldn’t have issues calling it slow mo (?). Very different from any amount of copy paste frozen panels and the strictness of its usage really helps mitigate most instances of outliers.

Edit: Additionally, we could just treat these copy paste frozen panels as just regular blitz calculations instead of using snail speeds still. Snail speed should just be used only when something slows down which is definitely drawable if that was the actual artist/author intention.

I just believe that if an author really wants to show slow motion in their manhwa/series, it is entirely doable (my two examples) and that we should really restrict snail speed usage for those instances. Which is why I want to advocate for revision 1 despite its extreme restrictedness (Though I’m still not against revision 2 either, any revision is fine by me at this point).

 

[Floxy178]

That's not what I'm talking about. I'm saying that snail speed method isn't applicable for static media in general.

 

[CatLover313]

That's not what I'm talking about. I'm saying that snail speed method isn't applicable for static media in general.

Oh, I can just change it to

“if a reference object with known speed can be visually confirmed to slow down either through statement indicators or panels indicating the object slowing down, preferably with different angles, one can figure out the timeframe, by saying that it must have been less than the timeframe that the object would have taken to move 1 pixel (Rain is a common visual slowdown object, and a good example is here).”

Or should I make a third possible revision where it just doesn’t allow the usage of snail speed in static media? As I’ve seen other calculations that use snail speed for their “slow motion” calculations and have been accepted. I thought you were trying to find possible instances where it could be used. Got confused a bit.

 

[Dinozxd]

I side with Revision 1 more as it's pretty much Revision 2+the slow mo actually being confirmed by the author. While it may seem too strict, feats like these usually get really high values and I believe that the standards around feats that get higher results should have equally high restrictions and standards.

Common example: While a simple statement like "I couldn't see him!" generally qualifies for a Subsonic rating from the get-go, an equally simple and straight forward statement of "He punched at the speed of sound!" or "He outsped light just now!" are far less likely (more like straight up impossible) to qualify for Transonic or FTL speeds even though all three statements I listed are essentially the same thing.

 

[Agnaa]

Some calculations use snail speed when the object is completely statued, such as this one and this one, not knowing that just because the object was statued, that doesn't mean the object was moving at snail speed; statuing can be done at far lesser ratios.

Not familiar with those calcs, but using "moves at a snail's speed" as a lowball number for "appears not to move at all" seems fine to me.

The person being statued could be moving even slower than a snail's speed, but we ultimately have to pick something for it.

 

[MANOFGOD7]

From talks and specifically revision 2, three appears to be the minimum with multiple panels and angles preferred, it will also depend on the context of the scene too. So it's not guaranteed that said 3-panel scene will be slow mo but at least it won't be immediately rejected unlike purely 2 panel copy paste scenes.

Your answer is splendid.........

Understood. In this case too,it was pretty much shown that the opp had no chance to even think about competing in speed,so there is good evidence that it qualifies for the snail speed slow mo category(and the different angles proposal was also done).

You see, perception blitzes mostly happen in a way that, the character getting blitzed normally wasn't moving before the blitz happened. When that happens, the faster one definitely sees the slower one as completely frozen, since the slower one cannot react when the faster one blitzes. But when we look closely, if the slower one was moving or is given a chance to move, they would still be slow for the faster one, but not all cases will have the slower one being completely frozen or snail speed for the faster one. For example, a subsonic character can blitz the average human whether the human is in motion or not, but if the human was to be moving, the subsonic character is definitely not seeing the human as slow as a snail. Cases where a character after getting perception blitzed was given a chance to move exists in fiction even if rare, and looking at some of them prove my claim very well.

I don't know whether my vote counts, but I'm voting revision 2 over revision 1. This is because revision 1 may not work too well when I show you this case :

This is an MHA case. When you check this,I have used a purple/dark purple marker to indicate something. The something are the trails of a speeding bullet. The mangaka consistently drew the trails for the bullets when they were in motion. Then the time came for Deku to blitz the fastest one to save someone. The bullet got a nice headstart. When Deku started moving,the bullet was not in view until this panel. In a single panel, we can SEE that apparently there wasn't even a slight indication/showing/drawing of the bullet's speed trail. The rain drops also became frozen in the same panel(happened on a rainy day). Then on the panel below, everything returns to normal and Deku made it in time to save the guy. The anime supported the feat,the bullet came to a standstill in some few frames. This is a good demonstration of the snail speed slow motion feat without the use of multiple panels, right??

Also, I propose you raise the bare minimum to 4 panels. Three still seems too light, and a lot of the strong/solid snail speed feats I've seen in the static media regularly have 4 panels and beyond.

 

[CatLover313]

Your answer is splendid.........

Understood. In this case too,it was pretty much shown that the opp had no chance to even think about competing in speed,so there is good evidence that it qualifies for the snail speed slow mo category(and the different angles proposal was also done).

You see, perception blitzes mostly happen in a way that, the character getting blitzed normally wasn't moving before the blitz happened. When that happens, the faster one definitely sees the slower one as completely frozen, since the slower one cannot react when the faster one blitzes. But when we look closely, if the slower one was moving or is given a chance to move, they would still be slow for the faster one, but not all cases will have the slower one being completely frozen or snail speed for the faster one. For example, a subsonic character can blitz the average human whether the human is in motion or not, but if the human was to be moving, the subsonic character is definitely not seeing the human as slow as a snail. Cases where a character after getting perception blitzed was given a chance to move exists in fiction even if rare, and looking at some of them prove my claim very well.

I don't know whether my vote counts, but I'm voting revision 2 over revision 1. This is because revision 1 may not work too well when I show you this case :

This is an MHA case. When you check this,I have used a purple/dark purple marker to indicate something. The something are the trails of a speeding bullet. The mangaka consistently drew the trails for the bullets when they were in motion. Then the time came for Deku to blitz the fastest one to save someone. The bullet got a nice headstart. When Deku started moving,the bullet was not in view until this panel. In a single panel, we can SEE that apparently there wasn't even a slight indication/showing/drawing of the bullet's speed trail. The rain drops also became frozen in the same panel(happened on a rainy day). Then on the panel below, everything returns to normal and Deku made it in time to save the guy. The anime supported the feat,the bullet came to a standstill in some few frames. This is a good demonstration of the

Also, I propose you raise the bare minimum to 4 panels. Three still seems too light, and a lot of the strong/solid snail speed feats I've seen regularly have 4 panels and beyond.

The rain is frozen for that one panel, but it wasn’t really shown to slow down like with the examples I gave. I'm also unsure of calling that scene a slow motion of a bullet, as I feel like this example is a much better instance of "slow motioning" a bullet, where the character completely freezes the bullet, showing him just walking past them, and the difference in the panels. I also don't want to change revision 2, especially since it was the one recommended by the CGM, but I’ll still put you as a vote for that.

 

[Floxy178]

Oh, I can just change it to

“if a reference object with known speed can be visually confirmed to slow down either through statement indicators or panels indicating the object slowing down, preferably with different angles, one can figure out the timeframe, by saying that it must have been less than the timeframe that the object would have taken to move 1 pixel (Rain is a common visual slowdown object, and a good example is here).”

Or should I make a third possible revision where it just doesn’t allow the usage of snail speed in static media? As I’ve seen other calculations that use snail speed for their “slow motion” calculations and have been accepted. I thought you were trying to find possible instances where it could be used. Got confused a bit.

Nah, seems fine now. Yeah I also saw accepted snail speed calcs, that's why I asked how it works for static media in the beginning of the thread.

I'm currently leaning towards 2nd revision. Visually slowing down seems like an unnecessary restriction to me.

 

[MANOFGOD7]

The rain is frozen for that one panel, but it wasn’t really shown to slow down like with the examples I gave. I'm also unsure of calling that scene a slow motion of a bullet

Understood.

You are entirely talking about the snail speed slow mo category, that is why I'm bringing this up. There are other versions of the slow mo feats,and the page gave examples(for example,slowed down time feats).

as I feel like this example is a much better instance of "slow motioning" a bullet, where the character completely freezes the bullet, showing him just walking past them, and the difference in the panels.

Yeahhhh that is a blatant and good example. If I remember correctly, his mentor even affirmed that he had become that fast with a statement.

I also don't want to change revision 2, especially since it was the one recommended by the CGM, but I’ll still put you as a vote for that.

Ah well, I'll propose it to the CGM myself and we'll see..........

 

[MANOFGOD7]

Snip

Hello

since I'll be drunk when I'm home again

I'm quite interested in this, if you are interested to tell me more, please do so.

I am now available to comment here, I personally think it should be a case by case basis, perhaps being better suited to supporting feats but I think self evident feats can be used if they don't conflict with other verse stablished things, such as Outliers or other things, such as stated multipliers.

The 1st feat fits in the latter, as it has an approved modifier, the 2nd feat doesn't fully work because we see one of the thugs visually react to the kick.

I'll say, the 3rd feat, in my opinion works in a vacuum for multiple reasons imo. The panels are repeated and when the attacks are shown affecting those two men, nothing really changed about them, they stayed frozen in the air while she monologued. I think that would be enough evidence for a slow mo calculation to be used there.

Of course, the media itself shows that they are very much slower than that calc given what the OP said, so I think that would fit into an Outlier in this case.

TLDR, I'm not against non-animated media using slow-motion calculations, I just think the standards for them should be a bit higher, repeating two panels wouldn't be enough, but I think something like the third example, where the slashes have effect and the enemies didn't even react or move for multiple panels, to the point of the other person monologuing, would be enough proof for me to have it be approved as Slow Motion.

Agreed.

"In the case of non-animated visual media, such as Comics, Mangas, and Manwas, the standards for slow motion are more strict. In this case, if a reference object with known speed can be visually confirmed to not have moved even 1 pixel, with multiple panels of the reference object not moving and preferably different angles of the attack being shown, one can figure out the timeframe, by saying that it must have been less than the timeframe that the object would have taken to move 1 pixel, only two panels is generally not enough to warrant the use of this method".

I propose you raise the bare minimum to 4 panels. Three still seems too light, and a lot of the strong/solid snail speed feats I've seen in the static media regularly have 4 panels and beyond.

The thread creator said I should contact you about this.

 

[Drite77]

I'm quite interested in this, if you are interested to tell me more, please do so

I don't remember, I was drunk

I propose you raise the bare minimum to 4 panels. Three still seems too light, and a lot of the strong/solid snail speed feats I've seen in the static media regularly have 4 panels and beyond.

Well, there wasn't really a set number, just 'multiple' panels. I feel like a slow-mo feat can happen with just a handfull of panels (Like the 3rd example here), but if I'm being honest, outside of these Manwas, slow motion feats rarely happen in non-animated visual media

 

[CatLover313]

Technically, the revision just says multiple panels and that only two panels is basically disqualifying. Probably best to leave it be instead of enforcing a minimum panel rule? Just have an underlying understanding that the more panels of “freezing”, the likelier it is to be slow motion.

 

[MANOFGOD7]

I don't remember, I was drunk

Ah I see...

Well, there wasn't really a set number, just 'multiple' panels. I feel like a slow-mo feat can happen with just a handfull of panels (Like the 3rd example here), but if I'm being honest, outside of these Manwas, slow motion feats rarely happen in non-animated visual media

Understood

 

[MANOFGOD7]

Technically, the revision just says multiple panels and that only two panels is basically disqualifying. Probably best to leave it be instead of enforcing a minimum panel rule? Just have an underlying understanding that the more panels of “freezing”, the likelier it is to be slow motion.

That's fine then.

 

[CatLover313]

Bump (One more staff vote seems good?)

 

[CatLover313]

Bump.

Voting Results so far:

• Revision 1: 2 Votes (0 staff)
• Revision 2: 3 Votes (2 staff)

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

 

[Agnaa]

Bump.

Voting Results so far:

• Revision 1: 2 Votes (0 staff)
• Revision 2: 3 Votes (2 staff)

This doesn't include my vote.

 

[CatLover313]

This doesn't include my vote.

Oh, I thought you were just advocating for a change in static mediums and wanted more high effort. I know I did originally only have my revision on the original content but I didn’t know for sure if you were voting for that, so I didn’t want to just assume. Should I put you in as a vote for revision 1? I feel like that’s the closest to high effort instead of just copy and paste.

 

[Agnaa]

Could just add a new option for what I said.

 

[CatLover313]

Could just add a new option for what I said.

Alright, added a possible revison 3, changed some of the wording around but kept it essentially the same and explained the differences between the three revisions. Added you to the vote count towards revision 3.

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

Current Vote Count:
Votes for Revision 1: 2

Votes for Revision 2: 3 (2 Staff)

Votes for Revision 3: 1 (1 Staff)

 

[Black_Cat49]

Bump

Current Vote Count:
Votes for Revision 1: 2

Votes for Revision 2: 3 (2 Staff)

Votes for Revision 3: 1 (1 Staff)

Actually, I agree with points 1 and 2, not just point 1.

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

Current Vote Count:
Votes for Revision 1: 2

Votes for Revision 2: 4 (2 Staff)

Votes for Revision 3: 1 (1 Staff)

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

 

[MANOFGOD7]

Bump

Try asking @Therefir to vote.

 

[MANOFGOD7]

I'll take a look when I get the chance.

All possible revisions are laid out.

Your vote would be greatly appreciated.

 

[CatLover313]

Bump

 

[CatLover313]

Bump