The Shadow Monarch vs The one who walks in the darkness (6-12-0)

[AlternativePrinciple]

He has minor knowledge, which means he'd know about one of Sasuke's primary abilities.

So he knows Sasuke can cast illusions but doesn’t know how to counter them because he has surface level amount of knowledge on Sasuke abilities.

If Jinwoo is unsure if it will work on him or not, he can test it with a shadow soldier and avoid Sasuke, or just one-shot him, or even wipe him form existence

problem is he doesn’t do EE in character, which you keep bringing up.

 

[That_moron2]

So he knows Sasuke can cast illusions but doesn’t know how to counter them because he has surface level amount of knowledge on Sasuke abilities.

This is worse, because if he knows Sasuke can cast illusions and he's unsure of their potency, then he has an easy out

problem is he doesn’t do EE in character, which you keep bringing up.

He'll do it if that's the best bet. He isn't Sukuna who holds back his wincons to have fun

 

[Robo432343]

Jinwoo doesn't know Sasuke can cast illusions
OP did not specify that nor did his info analysis

 

[That_moron2]

Jinwoo doesn't know Sasuke can cast illusions

He specified minor knowledge

 

[Robo432343]

He specified minor knowledge

OP would need to be more specific because just saying 'minor knowledge' doesn't mean jinwoo knows about genjutsu

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

This is worse, because if he knows Sasuke can cast illusions and he's unsure of their potency, then he has an easy out

Why exactly?

He'll do it if that's the best bet. He isn't Sukuna who holds back his wincons to have fun

If it’s not in character then it’s not in character. I can just argue Sasuke uses izanami/izanagi on the entire battlefield and calls it a day insta ending the battle

 

[That_moron2]

OP would need to be more specific because just saying 'minor knowledge' doesn't mean jinwoo knows about genjutsu

I'd assume that he'd know about Sasuke's illusions because that's one of his main moves

Why exactly?

What do you mean why exactly I literally explained why it would make the most sense to just erase him or one-tap him instead of waiting to get caught in Genjutsu.

If it’s not in character then it’s not in character. I can just argue Sasuke uses izanami/izanagi on the entire battlefield and calls it a day insta ending the battle

Not the same thing. You can argue Sasuke uses Izanagi if you want but that's not a wincon. Izanami isn't something Sasuke can even use iirc. Jinwoo doesn't even need to use EE because he can just one-shot Sasuke, which is entirely in character

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

I ain't counting votes if y'all don't say "I vote for" after giving reasons, a simple FRA works too.

Just saying X dogwalks or Y one taps isn't enough >:v

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

I'd assume that he'd know about Sasuke's illusions because that's one of his main moves

What do you mean why exactly I literally explained why it would make the most sense to just erase him or one-tap him instead of waiting to get caught in Genjutsu.

That’s your issue, he doesn’t use this in character. His a frontline fighter that uses daggers to fight, so his always up close and personal. Furthermore your arguing that his gonna fight Sasuke blind while Sasuke has multiple step future-ish precog that would make it much harder for Jin woo to fight blind.

Not the same thing. You can argue Sasuke uses Izanagi if you want but that's not a wincon. Izanami isn't something Sasuke can even use iirc. Jinwoo doesn't even need to use EE because he can just one-shot Sasuke, which is entirely in character

So not only he doesn’t use EE in character but he has AP advantage which would make him fight Sasuke one on one completely making the EE argument an after thought, also it’s not one shot AP difference like others pointed out. Izanami is explained to him when izanagi was explained to him, he only needs a sharingan to use them so I don’t see why he wouldn’t be able to use them when uchihas were spamming this like it’s some E-rank ninjutsu. Moreover can he resist Sasuke fear hax? I might have missed it as I don’t see it on Jin’s profile if not than this match is a dud in sasuke favor. And can he sense Sasuke as his stealth mystery allows him to hide his bloodlust, hostile intentions, chakra aura and presence from Shinobi that extend their consciousness in to their surroundings to locate friend/foe.

 

[That_moron2]

That’s your issue, he doesn’t use this in character. His a frontline fighter that uses daggers to fight, so his always up close and personal. Furthermore your arguing that his gonna fight Sasuke blind while Sasuke has multiple step future-ish precog that would make it much harder for Jin woo to fight blind.

Your issue is arguing that he'll fight like an idiot instead of using any of his number of ways of just winning. Jinwoo can still win by fighting on the frontlines just by one-shotting Sasuke or sneaking him while he's distracted by the shadows

So not only he doesn’t use EE in character

Not using something most of the time is not a reason for why they'd never use it under any circumstances even when that's obviously the easiest and most viable way to win the fight.

which would make him fight Sasuke one on one

Or he just lets his shadow soldiers deal with hi

also is not one shot above AP.

He upscales the value to one-shot levels

Izanami is explained to him when izanagi was explained to him, he only needs a sharingan to use them so I don’t see why he wouldn’t be able to use them when uchihas were spamming this like it’s some E-rank ninjutsu.

Hearing about it doesn't mean he can use it. Its not very viable anyway because its extremely complicated to set up

Moreover can he resist Sasuke fear hax? I might have missed it as I don’t see it on Jin’s profile if not than this match is a dud in sasuke favor

He can, and he has his own

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

Your issue is arguing that he'll fight like an idiot instead of using any of his number of ways of just winning. Jinwoo can still win by fighting on the frontlines just by one-shotting Sasuke or sneaking him while he's distracted by the shadows

99% of which are fodder with no way of catching up to his travel speed like Kuro said. Jin is also not taking Sasuke by surprise as he has the sharingan sensing capabilities/precog and can instinctively sense blood lust, auras and hostile intentions as well as see chakra. Moreover can Jin sense Sasuke as his stealth mastery allows him to hide from Shinobi that can sense the presence of someone by extending their consciousness into their surroundings as well as instinctively sense blood lust, negative intentions and auras

Not using something most of the time is not a reason for why they'd never use it under any circumstances even when that's obviously the easiest and most viable way to win the fight.

Does he ever use this? Cuz going off all the comments he never seems to use it ever and just has it cuz others do it

Hearing about it doesn't mean he can use it. Its not very viable anyway because its extremely complicated to set up

he has it cuz its an ability all uchiha posses that know of it’s existence like that EE of Jin’s that he never uses but has, see the problem here. And he can setup the jutsu while he fights Jin and Jin would never know

He can, and he has his own

I don’t see it on his profile and can he resist smth that is as potent as Sasuke one which causes fear and madness just by being in his presence

 

[Delusionaltx2]

not exactly covered by "minor information" but aight

Literally the Ultimate dojutsu feared for its genjutsu by shiniobi used to normal genjutsu

 

[That_moron2]

99% of which are fodder with no way of catching up to his travel speed like Kuro said.

There are still hundreds stronger than he is. The shadow soldiers are in no way irrelevant

His also not taking Sasuke by surprise as he has the sharingan sensing capabilities/precog and can instinctively sense blood lust, auras and hostile intentions as well as see chakra. Moreover can Jin sense Sasuke as his stealth mastery allows him to hide from Shinobi that can sense the presence of someone by extending their consciousness into their surroundings as well as instinctively sense blood lust, negative intentions and auras

Jinwoo's stealth skill negates the 5 senses, and Sasuke won't be able to do the extending his consciousness thing well enough to catch him while fighting hundreds of enemies who stat gap him

Does he ever use this? Cuz going off all the comments he never seems to use it ever and just has it cuz others do it

He only gets it at the end of the story and at that point he's fighting people resistant to it

he has it cuz its an ability all uchiha posses that know of it’s existence like that EE of Jin’s that he never uses but has. And he can setup the jutsu while he fights Jin and Jin would never know

Post scans that say all Uchiha can use it because its not on his profile. Wheter or not Jinwoo knows he's using it is irrelevant Sasuke is dying before he finishes the set-up

I don’t see it on his profile and is it as potent as Sasuke one which causes fear and madness just by being in his presence

Its under true shadow monarch, and yes its potent enough to resist Sasuke's aura considering that his shadows can make people faint, and monarchs can paralyze people with fear

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

There are still hundreds stronger than he is. The shadow soldiers are in no way irrelevant.

Which he can out speed and stealth around

stealth skill negates the 5 senses, and Sasuke won't be able to do the extending his consciousness thing well enough to catch him while fighting hundreds of enemies who stat gap him

He can still sense his intentions, bloodlust, chakra and aura, all which Sasuke can hide except his chakra

He only gets it at the end of the story and at that point he's fighting people resistant to it

Welp

Post scans that say all Uchiha can use it because it’s not on his profile. Wheter or not Jinwoo knows he's using it is irrelevant Sasuke is dying before he finishes the set-up

My guy this was basically banned and banished to the shadow realm cuz uchiha were spamming the shit out of. It’s not like smth super hard s-rank ninjutsu like the rasenshuriken that only a select few can use. Obito who was considered as talentless for an uchiha can use it, Danzo can use it just cuz he has the sharingans

Its under true shadow monarch, and yes its potent enough to resist Sasuke's aura considering that his shadows can make people faint, and monarchs can paralyze people with fear

Sasuke one causes all the above plus makes the person kill themselves

 

[Robo432343]

lets talk about how jin woo's low godly regeneration doesn't qualify for low godly regeneration

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

lets talk about how jin woo's low godly regeneration doesn't qualify for low godly regeneration

---

Wut

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Literally the Ultimate dojutsu feared for its genjutsu by shiniobi used to normal genjutsu

this

my idea was "Sauce knows Sung can summon an army, uses shadows and is comparable to him" while "Suggs knows sauce can cast illusions, uses lightning and fire, is comparable to him and can summon shit"

Like, I don't think "minor" information translates to "hey that's the sharingan, one of the most powerful limit bloodlines in the whole universe and has a bunch of abilities that can range from casting powerful illusions that can go beyond normal genjutsu along with abilities like summoning a giant etereal war avatar, fire that kinda ignores durability and is hotter than the sun + never stops burning but the eye also evolves giving a boost in power, speed and who knows what"

Or maybe it does... personally I don't think so but keep going at each other I like the discussion

 

[karo_senpaii]

Its speed of light with higher perceptions vs Relativistic and FTL with Shunshin and a bunch of unquantifiable amps, some of which he doesn't even have here.

Read the O.P fully, its specifically against Kabuto

There are hundreds of titans, and probably more at that level. Millions of ants is not a pleasant thing either, they'd get in the way and restrict his movements.

Looking not directly at their eyes? That's not that hard if you have 100+ other guys to back you up and huge EE blasts faster than Sasuke's physicals as well

He'll use an illusion, to trick the guy into an illusion...

I did and Jinwoo's is higher

OP specifies its against Kabuto

Good thing he
a. doesn't have a susano'o you can jump with
b. Jinwoo's giants can also jump

Him blocking a TSO aimed at someone else is not the same as being able to counter EE

Why would he test it though? At worst he can let a Shadow Soldier test Sasuke's genjutsu and come to the conclusion it can affect him and avoid it from there.

Assuming you're right, that's only marginally better because what stops Jinwoo from sneaking him while he's occupied and simply erasing him? That seems far easier than Sasuke fighting through 100s of people relative to him and then Jinwoo staring into his eyes

Scans?

Good thing he also one-shots because of how badly he himself upscales the value

1. No none of the shadows are sol. Jinwoo ftl feat is literally intercepting an attack his general could not dodge. Sasuke is rel with ftl reactions and then higher with shunshin and far higher with his susanoo.

2. Kabuto fight is not a key. He has one key, fourth shinobi war that's all. If it was separate you would have seen 6c higher with susanoo, 6c high 6b with susanoo..but no you see one thing 6c, H6B with susanoo. Kabuto fight is not a key.

3. He literally speed runs all of them in a go.

4. I'm not arguing for the shadows, I'm arguing for jinwoo himself. Also no Sasuke physicals is faster than all of them. What do you think shunshin is?

5. No he'll use an illusion to trick the guy into looking at him to mind control him. Do you just think illusions and mind manipulation is same thing?

6. Value?

7. Against kabuto is not a key. That's not possible.

8. He does have the susanoo, the giants jumping is irrelevant, he is jumping at ftl speeds to reach jinwoo. None of them can do that.

9. If he could truly counter EE he would have resistance but he doesn't. What I'm saying is he could allow his susanoo take a hit for him. His susanoo can stop EE from passing through after it comes in contact with it howbeit that part would still be erased.

10. No the shadows don't have same resistance as jinwoo . Again jinwoo has no reason to believe mind manipulation which he resists would work on him.

11. With all Sasuke sensory abilities jinwoo is never sneaking up on him unless he got some layered shit I don't know about.

12. Someone might have to help me with that.

13. Yeah bro he ain't one shotting no susanoo

 

[Delusionaltx2]

this

Like, I don't think "minor" information translates to "hey that's the sharingan, one of the most powerful limit bloodlines in the whole universe and has a bunch of abilities that can range from casting powerful illusions that can go beyond normal genjutsu along with abilities like summoning a giant etereal war avatar, fire that kinda ignores durability and is hotter than the sun + never stops burning but the eye also evolves giving a boost in power, speed and who knows what"

The giant ethereal war avatar stuff is for the MS All the stuff tied to genjutsu is related to how ppl perceive the normal sharingn half of the verse isn't even aware of the idea of MS existing, so yeah, SJW wouldn't know about that stuff.

Or maybe it does... personally I don't think so but keep going at each other I like the discussion

personally, you should have specified this if this was what you meant by minor info, but whatever ig (ur op)

Anyways, assuming SJW has no idea of genjutsu, he might actually just sell and push Sasuke directly so I might change it to sasuke ig

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

2. Kabuto fight is not a key. He has one key, fourth shinobi war that's all. If it was separate you would have seen 6c higher with susanoo, 6c high 6b with susanoo..but no you see one thing 6c, H6B with susanoo. Kabuto fight is not a key.

Fair enough, I hate the way his profile is structured because he clearly becomes much stronger during the war as he becomes used to his new eyes, evolving his susano'o and fighting alongside Naruto against Obito and the ten tails.

Keep his ass to 6-C, the H6B key is for Senjutsu Susano'o which he can't do alone.

 

[karo_senpaii]

By the way I'm voting Sasuke incase it wasn't clear

 

[karo_senpaii]

Fair enough, I hate the way his profile is structured because he clearly becomes much stronger during the war as he becomes used to his new eyes, evolving his susano'o and fighting alongside Naruto against Obito and the ten tails.

Keep his ass to 6-C, the H6B key is for Senjutsu Susano'o which he can't do alone.

"Higher with perfect susanoo". His perfect susanoo scales above that senjutsu susanoo

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Yeah, you should have made that clear >:v

The giant ethereal war avatar stuff is for the MS All the stuff tied to genjutsu is related to how ppl perceive the normal sharingn half of the verse isn't even aware of the idea of MS existing, so yeah, SJW wouldn't know about that stuff.

True but even people with knowledge of the sharingan get ducked by it (Kurenai and Asuma in part 1) and they are konoha nins, they should have the most knowledge of it

personally, you should have specified this if this was what you meant by minor info, but whatever ig (ur op)

Anyways, assuming SJW has no idea of genjutsu, he might actually just sell and push Sasuke directly so I might change it to sasuke ig

True. Social Justice Warrior knows about genjutsu, he just doesn't know it's layered or whatever.

 

[Delusionaltx2]

Yeah, you should have made that clear >:v


True but even people with knowledge of the sharingan get ducked by it (Kurenai and Asuma in part 1) and they are konoha nins, they should have the most knowledge of it

Well yeah...they have basic knowledge of the Sharingan while the guy they were fighting had an MS

True. Social Justice Warrior knows about genjutsu, he just doesn't know it's layered or whatever.

This just came to me

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Well yeah...they have basic knowledge of the Sharingan while the guy they were fighting had an MS

he didn't use it in their short fight tho, only to put kakashi in a coma

This just came to me

Same and you can't imagine the time I spent trying to come up with a dumb name for Sung, like Sasuke is called Sauce and stuff like that but there is nothing for Sung

 

[Delusionaltx2]

he didn't use it in their short fight tho, only to put kakashi in a coma

ah, guess that akes sense then, change my vote to sasuke

Same and you can't imagine the time I spent trying to come up with a dumb name for Sung, like Sasuke is called Sauce and stuff like that but there is nothing for Sung

Tbh, there should have been a dumb name for bro a long time ago

 

[Delusionaltx2]

Op is meant to specify that he shouldn't use it

Oh yeah to end this convo rq

@Tony_di_bugalu is sasuke 6C or low 6B

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

6C

I know he gets stat checked here by Sung if it comes to it but that's what makes it fair... kinda

 

[Delusionaltx2]

6C

I know he gets stat checked here by Sung if it comes to it but that's what makes it fair... kinda

Ehhh sasuke does have hax so it dosen't really matter

Also change my vote rq to sasuke

 

[DavidTPPM]

Literally the Ultimate dojutsu feared for its genjutsu by shiniobi used to normal genjutsu

I mean, is it tho? Kakashi was probably the most famous sharingan user and he never used it and neither did kid Sasuke. Shin who was obsessed with Itachi didn't even use it despite having an MS and neither did his clones. Hell even when people did know about the genjustu threat (Deidara, Orochimaru twice, Danzo, etc) they didn't consider it THAT threatening and ended up getting caught offguard by it despite being highly intelligent and waaaayyyy more knowledgeable on genjutsu than SJW would be.

So "minor information" definitely isn't enough to know Sasuke can literally one tap him with a glance. Arguably "minor information" in Sasukes era would mostly just cover power mimicry and precog

 

[DavidTPPM]

You can count me as voting for Sasuke for the reasons I already kinda mentioned (genjutsu gg and all) but I'm pretty sure that makes it a stomp. Genjutsu is kind of a double edged sword where it's either useless or results in a stomp.

And if we give Jinwoo major knowledge specifically on genjutsu then he just stat-checks Sasuke with gajillion troops so either way it'd say it's a mismatch

 

[Delusionaltx2]

I mean, is it tho? Kakashi was probably the most famous sharingan user and he never used it and neither did kid Sasuke. Shin who was obsessed with Itachi didn't even use it despite having an MS and neither did his clones. Hell even when people did know about the genjustu threat (Deidara, Orochimaru twice, Danzo, etc) they didn't consider it THAT threatening and ended up getting caught offguard by it despite being highly intelligent and waaaayyyy more knowledgeable on genjutsu than SJW would be.

So "minor information" definitely isn't enough to know Sasuke can literally one tap him with a glance. Arguably "minor information" in Sasukes era would mostly just cover power mimicry and precog

yea I talked with OP about this and I agreed Jin Woo wouldn't know about it and would just jump him in cqc with his shadows only to get genjutsu'd, so I changed my vote to Sasuke

 

[Delusionaltx2]

Also, we hit grace for sasuke btw (just realized)

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

No way the first SJW matchup going up on profiles is a loss for him

 

[Delusionaltx2]

He has minor knowledge, which means he'd know about one of Sasuke's primary abilities. If Jinwoo is unsure if it will work on him or not, he can test it with a shadow soldier and avoid Sasuke, or just one-shot him, or even wipe him form existence

So here's the problem with this if it wasn't clear enough...

SJWs standard battle tactics: Immediately upon entering a battle, Sung Jin-Woo will summon all of his soldiers from his shadow to overwhelm his opponent with numbers, and activate 'Monarch's Territory' to spread his shadow over the battlefield and increase the statistics of every soldier by 50%. Jin-Woo utilizes the strength and abilities of every Shadow Soldier while simultaneously engaging in close-quarters-combat, primarily dual-wielding the 'Demon King's Shortswords' which add to his attack power. His method of attack is similar to before, using his skills to increase his speed and avoid detection, while attacking weak and vital points he perceives in his enemies to end battles as quickly as possible. He will use 'Ruler's Authority' to telekinetically bind, crush, and throw opponents around; block or deflect oncoming projectile attacks; and launch himself through the air. His sword skills are far more profound in this key, as he's able to predict oncoming attacks by perceiving every minute movement his opponents make in slow motion and read the trajectory of every attack used against him. Against armies or hoards of opponents, he will resurrect those that fall using 'Shadow Extraction' to turn them into his soldiers, turning the tides against the enemy.

He isn't gonna sit back and let the soldiers die like Naruto does with clones, he'd jump in with them, also Sasuke would likely just blitz the soldiers since from his pov, they would be like reanimated Edo Tensei or puppets, which genjutsu doesn't work on.

 

[Delusionaltx2]

No way the first SJW matchup going up on profiles is a loss for him

JBT could never (I'm still glazing)

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

No way the first SJW matchup going up on profiles is a loss for him

his against itachi’s brother, tis is expected

 

[Delusionaltx2]

@Tony_di_bugalu yo change my vote to sasuke

 

[Tatsumi504]

Sung Jinwoo FRA. Sasuke isnt fighting his way through millions of shadows let alone the hundreds that out stat him, even fighting against Naruto's clones he deals with them as they come for him. He definitely doesn't have FTL travel speed even with shunshin so he isn't making a beeline straight for Jinwoo either, how would he even find him amongst millions of soldiers unless Jinwoo is at the front?

Can we also talk about how genjutsu isn't a first move for Sasuke? It's something he can use, might occasionally use but it's definitely not his first choice.

 

[Delusionaltx2]

Sung Jinwoo FRA. Sasuke isnt fighting his way through millions of shadows let alone the hundreds that out stat him, even fighting against Naruto's clones he deals with them as they come for him. He definitely doesn't have FTL travel speed even with shunshin so he isn't making a beeline straight for Jinwoo either, how would he even find him amongst millions of soldiers unless Jinwoo is at the front?

Because Jinwoo literally makes it a standard to jump in with them in the front lines, so Sasuke won't need to fight through much of them (he also skill diffs and blitzes them without issue), SJW will approach bro and try to blitz him, only to fail because Sharingan Perception Amp is broken. With this in mind, Sasuke would analyze Jinwoo while playing around him with skill advantage + far better perception and either eventually use genjutsu or just immediately use genjutsu to take advantage of Jinwoo's lack of chakra.

Can we also talk about how genjutsu isn't a first move for Sasuke? It's something he can use, might occasionally use but it's definitely not his first choice.

Yeah, but here his opponent clearly isn't using chakra (which he'd immediately pick up on with his sharingan), outstats him, and is fighting him head-on while completely oblivious to the fact genjutsu exists