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DEATH BATTLE! Accuracy Scale [Part 10, The more things change, the more they stay the same]

Oiguana2701 said:
How is Ultima's intelligence not a decisive factor here? He wouldn't just wait for Bruce/Hulk to build the machine, and even if it wasn't, DB downplaying it should still count as bad/incomplete research.
Click to expand...
Oh I meant it was not a factor for DB researchers. Ultima according to them Ultima had zero ways to stop Hulk from resurrecting from Below Place, since it was out of his reach. Smarts mean nothing if you cant actually kill someone.

I guess they didnt consider the fact that if it took long time to actually build the OD to stop Ultima, Godzilla should have eventually done something to prevent that, even just destroying universe would be massive since with no materials Bruce could end up in a scenario where he just could not build the OD. And they ignored important Ultima hax as well.
 
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TMaakkonen said:
I guess they didnt consider the fact that if it took long time to actually build the OD to stop Ultima, Godzilla should have eventually done something to prevent that, even just destroying universe would be massive since with no materials Bruce could end up in a scenario where he just could not build the OD.
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They actually mentioned in the QnA that Bruce could use things from the Below Place to build it, as it has a shit ton within it. And since Ultima can’t reach the Below Place, even if Banner was in a universe with literally nothing in it, he could still build a device to shut it down.
 
ZeedKZ said:
Banner would have to need at least 1-B with prep time to do so, and that would only reach the Omega Point given "It" wasn't portrayed correctly in the episode. Plus he has no resistance to 1-A absorption, and he'd likely just get assimilated the moment he reaches "It".
Click to expand...
Hulk has resistance to 1-A absorption through his resistance magic
TMaakkonen said:
It seems that HulkGodzilla is Wrong, Bad atm then. Hulk supporters, if you think DB is right with VSW logic too, you can argue it too.
Click to expand...
Since I don't know anything about Godzilla, the things they got wrong about Hulk were making him High 1-A, Mother of horrors > TOAA/TOBA, scaling Hulk above TOAA/TOBA and scaling him above Multi Eternity via the chain feat.

When creating the thread for the feat, i also made a note that the chain doesn't scale to First Firmament or Multi Eternity since the chain was made from First Firmament. It's not like The First Firmament lend the chain to The Eldest.

The feat is above Uni Eternity.

The battle should either be a draw or a win for Hulk.
DarkDragonMedeus said:
The implications about Hulk > TOAA were whack, especially since TOBA =/= TOAA. Not to mention, the recent 1-A version of Hulk would have made fully composite versions a stomp once the 1-A Marvel scaling from Skyfather get downgraded to High 1-B.
Click to expand...
Hulk still retains his 1-A via Franklin, chain feat and more other feats from this his current run.

Downgrading Skyfathers and possibly Hellords will go down alone. Thor might be the only exception because of Immortal Thor
 
That_moron2 said:
Elaborate on that
Click to expand...
That_moron2 said:
Hulk lacks the range to affect IT and also gets blitzed. Besides that, Godzilla has every type of immortality, so even killing an avatar would be difficult, let alone the actual thing
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iirc Godzilla is baseline 1-A?



Besides, Hulk not having the range and speed is arguable. If you agree with Hulk destroying Nightmare's Realm as not being just a mental battle, his Crossroads Feat and his scaling to Onslaught with Franklin powers who also has his own Immeasurable Speed feats.


Despite the fact that we accept Marvel Magic as 1-A, Gamma is actually High 1-A.


Hulk radiates high levels of Gamma during extreme rage. Hulk should have passive radiation.

That is enough to bypass Godzilla's Immorality and kill him.
 
Excellence616 said:
iirc Godzilla is baseline 1-A?
Click to expand...
Yes
Excellence616 said:
Besides, Hulk not having the range and speed is arguable. If you agree with Hulk destroying Nightmare's Realm as not being just a mental battle, his Crossroads Feat and his scaling to Onslaught with Franklin powers who also has his own Immeasurable Speed feats.
Click to expand...
Neither of those are accepted on the profile
Excellence616 said:
Despite the fact that we accept Marvel Magic as 1-A, Gamma is actually High 1-A.


Hulk radiates high levels of Gamma during extreme rage. Hulk should have passive radiation.

That is enough to bypass Godzilla's Immorality and kill him.
Click to expand...
You're saying that Hulk passively irradiates Godzilla and kills him with High 1-A radiation manipulation? When has Hulk ever been shown to do anything even remotely similar to that?
 
Excellence616 said:
Besides, Hulk not having the range and speed is arguable. If you agree with Hulk destroying Nightmare's Realm as not being just a mental battle, his Crossroads Feat and his scaling to Onslaught with Franklin powers who also has his own Immeasurable Speed feats.
Click to expand...
Well, about that, we have to use the stats that are present on the profiles, and what That Moron2 said about Hulk's range and speed is true, as Godzilla is way superior to him in those stats.

Hulk's stats:

Speed: Varies from Massively FTL+ combat speed, up to Infinite

Range: Extended Melee Range due to his size, Varies from Kilometers to Planetary with thunderclaps (Thunderclaps can reach up to Kilometers in every direction, by attacking the ground he can impact an entire planet), At least Interdimensional with Multilocation (Gamma Powered individual exist in the below place and the real world at same time)
Click to expand...

Godzilla's stats:

Speed: Immeasurable ("It" is a being qualitively superior to countless-dimensional beings, views the past, future and present as dreams)

Range: Outerversal
Click to expand...

Excellence616 said:
Despite the fact that we accept Marvel Magic as 1-A, Gamma is actually High 1-A.


Hulk radiates high levels of Gamma during extreme rage. Hulk should have passive radiation.
Click to expand...
Are you aware that Godzilla could absorb Hulk's Gamma Radiation? By following Death Battle's logic, Godzilla could reach the Below Place by doing so.

Excellence616 said:
That is enough to bypass Godzilla's Immorality and kill him.
Click to expand...
You have to elaborate on that, as Composite Godzilla has every type of immortality plus high regeneration.
 
Apex_Predator_GX said:
Are you aware that Godzilla could absorb Hulk's Gamma Radiation? By following Death Battle's logic, Godzilla could reach the Below Place by doing so.
Click to expand...
and what's stopping Hulk from draining him?
Apex_Predator_GX said:
You have to elaborate on that, as Composite Godzilla has every type of immortality plus high regeneration.
Click to expand...
If we use Composite Godzilla, might as well use TOBA possessed Hulk.
That_moron2 said:
Neither of those are accepted on the profile
Click to expand...
Because the speed part have an ongoing thread.
That_moron2 said:
You're saying that Hulk passively irradiates Godzilla and kills him with High 1-A radiation manipulation? When has Hulk ever been shown to do anything even remotely similar to that?
Click to expand...
World Breaker Hulk did and it's not exclusive to him only but the other persona (possibly excluding Grey Hulk)
 
That_moron2 said:
If he does get Immeasurable speed, then its still largely irrelevant because he'll lack the range to actually touch IT even if he isn't getting horrendously blitzed
Click to expand...
Hulk not having 1-A range isn’t even consistent with his profile, since you would need 1-A range to actually affect 1-A beings in the first place (such as the First Firmament). So his profile is just outdated.
 
That_moron2 said:
If he does get Immeasurable speed, then its still largely irrelevant because he'll lack the range to actually touch IT even if he isn't getting horrendously blitzed
Click to expand...
And IT is weaker than Hulk, Hulk has better hax and hax resistance.
That_moron2 said:
He showed 1-A range, High 1-A potency passive death aura?
Click to expand...
He did destroy Dark dimension with it.

It is something that he does when there are no innocent people around him of which he explicitly stated before doing it.


Most of his battles are on earth. I can't see Hulk pulling that kind of stuff consistently.
Osemere said:
Hulk not having 1-A range isn’t even consistent with his profile, since you would need 1-A range to actually affect 1-A beings in the first place (such as the First Firmament). So his profile is just outdated.
Click to expand...
Yeah. Hulk's profile need a massive update. Planning on doing that next year when I am doing with University.
 
Kiryu-MG3 said:
I'm not sure that's quite right.
Click to expand...
1-A magic and his 1-A resistance. Hulk's power is pretty much above Baseline 1-A and Magic that is above his own 1-A with plenty of hax related to Basic magic, NPI of Astral forms and Nature of magic.
 
Excellence616 said:
Hulk still retains his 1-A via Franklin, chain feat and more other feats from this his current run.

Downgrading Skyfathers and possibly Hellords will go down alone. Thor might be the only exception because of Immortal Thor
Click to expand...
Via the old reasons that now qualify as Low 1-A at best, not saying it applies to Ruin King Thor, but it would effect Hulk or TOBA.

It is now a strict rule that if they lack BDE, they cannot be 1-A or above.
 
Excellence616 said:
If we use Composite Godzilla, might as well use TOBA possessed Hulk.
Click to expand...
Qo0hLkr.jpeg
 
Reading the magic page, I don't see how Hulk is countery "It"'s assimilation. "It" is not absorbing specific aspects of someone's being (Energy, Powers, Essence), "It" is absorbing the entirety of your being, it doesn't even kill you directly, it makes you part of "It", it had absorbed countless of being of the same nature as it. That scenario wouldn't even be possible by our current standards since Hulk still has no range to reach "It", but he kinda have no answer other than being assimilated.
 
TMaakkonen said:
Hulk vs Godzilla | Hulk's AP and Green Door have potential to have more layers in Outerversal thanks to Marvel cosmology, but it seems he cannot counter all of Godzilla Ultima's hax like absorption, on top DB of missing out on Composite Godzilla abilities and missing important Ultima abilities too. Wrong, Bad
Click to expand...
Also don't forget about Marvel Godzilla in the latest run

But, does Bruce Banner matter here?
 
TMaakkonen said:
Uhh not about HulkGoji but other ones instead?

Saw Sephiroth mentions, not a FF guy. You can list all them in one post again. Maybe someone else can help.
Click to expand...
Sephiroth's 2-A key comes from a crossover with Final Fantasy Tactics that is accepted here thanks to side materials explaining its validity. However, Death Battle explicitly mentions they don't consider such crossovers valid for scaling (a black box in Cloud vs Link 2 mentions they don't consider them). Don't know how that affects our own standing to be fair.
 
TartaChocholate said:
Sephiroth's 2-A key comes from a crossover with Final Fantasy Tactics that is accepted here thanks to side materials explaining its validity. However, Death Battle explicitly mentions they don't consider such crossovers valid for scaling (a black box in Cloud vs Link 2 mentions they don't consider them). Don't know how that affects our own standing to be fair.
Click to expand...
iirc in the old Q&A Ultra did for Link vs Cloud 2 they do think it should be fine for it as a high end (Albeit I don't think they were fully sold on it at the time) it was just they didn't use it or HW since they wanted to keep it mainline for simplicity and it wouldn't change the results since Dissidia does a lot more for Cloud then Warriors does for Link (Which is funny since HW's best feat is like mid tier in the mainline series lmao).

Unforutently the Q&A isn't quite as easy to find anymore so it's hard to confirm 100%, either way shouldn't affect much since we're judging by VSBW's profiles.
 
Ruby vs Maka: Right, Good.

BY THE PROFILES WE HAVE(no names...) Maka stomps Ruby into the dirt via 2-C AP, and the only changes from current scaling for Ruby was that her feat got a higher Calc than we have. It's to the point where neither are missing anything from their PnA.

Right, Decent is also fine, they explicitly didn't use Fire Force here so that's several scaling points gone, but go with whatever makes ya happy.
 
In hindsight if we do punish not using highest tier possible, some other verdicts might be Decent only.

Anyone else think it would be fine to use RightGood?
 
TMaakkonen said:
Uhh not about HulkGoji but other ones instead?

Saw Sephiroth mentions, not a FF guy. You can list all them in one post again. Maybe someone else can help.
Click to expand...
Hey I just noticed that Sephiroth has possible 2-A scaling even in his FF7 key while Vergil Even with Sin Devil Trigger is only 2-C we should update it’s rating?

These Need to be looked at again and adjust what you have for their ratings

Cable vs Booster Gold
Natsu vs Ace
Vader Vs Doom(And all Star Wars character matches by extension?)
Lucario Vs Rennemon
 
Cable vs BG should be iffy or wrong due to the stat diff in incredibly specific wincon that probably wouldn’t work via technopathic abilities

Lucario vs Renamon should be right due to
the upgrades Lucario got and Rennemon not having access to the other forms

I heard that star wars Legends verse might be getting tier 0 Via Force? So that should be looked at.

Seems that one piece got an upgrade so reviewing and updating the past matchup descriptions to reflect where each are at now ATT and to determine if the Fairy Tail Matchups are correct ATT or just wrong/Right
 
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