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1.1 - TV Viltrumite-tier upgrade
Mark's moon jump has been calculated and accepted and it's the highest AP feat yet.
To begin with, why did it take so long to name his keys after the seasons ? It should be Season 1 | Season 2 | Season 3
Mark performed this feat during his training after Season 2 and before Donald details his growth at the beginning of Season 3 so while we can't quite use the multiplier for this it's safe to say he should be stronger than this by that point. On that topic, here's a brief rundown on why the multipliers aren't that straight-forward to be used anyway
Regardless, despite his growth in strength upgraded Reanimen ganging up on him could still noticeably damage him while he couldn't fight back. Later on, during the Invincible War an alternate Invincible finds himself in the same situation and gets absolutely destroyed, however he was still strong enough to one-shot them and him dying to that leads Donald to say that he "definitely wasn't as strong" as Prime Invincible so it stands to reason that by the end of Season 3 the Reanimen + Equilibrium-disrupting frequency strategy wouldn't be as effective as it was at the beginning if at all. At the end of the season Mark endured a brutal beatdown and managed to put down a guy who they drop like 5 times in the episode could take Omni-Man out, so they're relative to each other right now, so Season 3 Mark and all major viltrumites so far should be "At least High 6-A", as well as Battle Beast, Hail Mary, Allen Post-Recovery and...
- Agree: Maverick_Zero_X, LephyrTheRevanchist
- Disagree:
- Neutral:
Continuing this thread where about three mods agreed Immortal really shouldn't scale to Omni-Man. He's been killed way too many times in pretty gory ways to say he consistently scales and he even conceded to being weaker than Mark mid-Season 2 prior to all his training and the events of Season 3
As said above Mark and Omni-Man are comparable to each other right now. Future Immortal, who shouldn't be any weaker than before and should in fact be going all out as he wants to give Mark no choice but to kill him, did quite literally nothing to him and was killed rather easily, when it should've been S1E7 all over again if he consistently scaled (which also has to be pointed out that the only lasting damage Immortal left with all the struggle were bloodshot eyes).
Most arguments for him still scaling is him drawing blood from them but the series is infamous for how everyone can take hits from everyone no matter how big the gap is. Most egregious examples are Titan, Monster Girl and Robot harming Battle Beast and this latest season Capes' members drawing blood from Mark. Honorary mention to the Maulers being able to draw blood from Oliver when he can literally rip them apart
A higher tier can still be argued for him tho, as he could still be reasonably above all the weaponry Earth is capable of producing over being pretty much unkillable in the future, such as these bombs, which also could barely hurt viltrumites. Basically:
I'd rather a "likely far higher" than "At most viltrumite value" because, seriously, Omni-Man can easily kill them with one attack, that's way too much for a clear cut downscale. Another argument that was brought up was that it's normal for comparable characters in the series to gore each other like that, but even then, while Lucan and Vidor were messed up pretty bad by Nolan they still dealt way more damage to him than Immortal ever could on his own and he couldn't outright punch through them with a single attack and split them in half.
Also like, if you were to put him in a match how much lower than the viltrumite value should his opponent be to not rip him apart after getting in a couple hits lol. He barely has anything else going for him in terms of abilites.
Sort of related to that, the "Likely Country level with bombs" should be removed, because it is just bombs and they should be featured in a Future Immortal key and not as it currently is, except that would be really redundant as the only difference between them is those bombs that he only uses in a flashback and he upscales anyway. Overall pointless addition
In the thread above it was also mentioned that downgrading Immortal would also mean downgrading Season 2 Mark, and looking at the current calculations and fights I'm now inclined to agree. He should still downscale from Nolan as, despite the good fight he put up against Thula, by the end of their fight he was notoriously much more injured than her in a series where common attacks can leave a permanent nose bleed throughout a fight, and she was promptly oneshotted by Omni-Man. The main argument for her being relative to Nolan is the fact that she was sent (alongside other 2) to detain him, but that's not necessarily the case as it's simply about who's available at the time (there's only about 50 viltrumites left), for example one of the viltrumites executioners could fend off both Nolan AND Allen (who's notably stronger than Anissa, who in turn stomped Season 2 Mark) and he wasn't sent to Thraxa
So Mark's Season 2 key should reflect Immortal's and mention he upscales
- Agree: Maverick_Zero_X, LephyrTheRevanchist
- Disagree:
- Neutral:
Following upon the mentions of downscaling and the proposed scaling above for Season 2 Mark and Immortal, Immortal's LS would be downgraded to "At least Class G, likely far higher", same for Season 2 Mark, whose "At least Class T, possibly Class Z" would be moved to his Season 3 key
- Agree: Maverick_Zero_X, LephyrTheRevanchist
- Disagree:
- Neutral:
To begin with the ability itself got a revision to clarify it as a user tried to argue for it for a character getting angry then pushing someone off of them who was previously restraining them, which is literally what's happening in the current justification for Mark having it.
What even is the logic for Mark having it and not other viltrumites ? Robert Kirkman himself debunks their biology being any different
Refer to what I said above of everyone harming each other in this series
That isn't Rage Power, that's just not holding back.
While we're at it, these are other abilities that have no reason to be:
That's not Supernatural Willpower, that's just the standard stamina that comes with his viltrumite physiology
Acrobatics is for maneuvers physically performed with the body and he's literally never done any of those. I'm assuming it's because of these scenes but those are just flight tricks
Sequids control people by penetrating their skin, that's why everyone with super strength is immune to them, not some kind of biological resistance viltrumites happen to have
Sort of related to Mark, Red Rush has this in his profile:
And Mark pulls a similar feat, except apparently none of these give Afterimage creation, so it should be removed from Red Rush's profile
- Agree: Maverick_Zero_X, LephyrTheRevanchist
- Disagree:
- Neutral:
Rex Splode
Let's start with his physicals, whose justifications are really bad
He literally got his teeth punched out, face disfigured and suit all messed up
They're not somewhat comparable, they're not comparable at all. His arm cannon oneshotted a guy who was barely scratched by all his other explosions, it's far above all his arsenal, that's why he says he should lead with it.
Also, seriously, who's the guy who applied this because how could you miss the circular scaling ? He's physically 9-A because of the arm cannon's calculation and the logic that it's equiparable to his other explosives (which they aren't), except those same explosives are also rated Tier 6 over oneshotting Komodo Dragon and Octoboss (scaling them to instances where Mark and Immortal where very much holding back). WHAT ? Which is it ? Shouldn't he be Tier 6 physically then ?
Here we have two instances of him tanking his own explosions point-blank so these should be calculated and used instead
Either that or all these other instances of him being near explosions should be properly calculated, whichever the case. And, he should be given Damage Boost of course.
I don't know what rating could be given to his coins/bars so I'd like some input on that
Shapesmith would also be affected by this, which by the way, why does he even have a 9-C lower end ? He can take hits from someone who can easily rip apart Rex Splode and Dupli-Kate, he should just be whatever the above yields
Powerplex
How tf do you screw such an easy profile ? His whole deal is enery absorption, which was then enhanced by the discs. It should be: Varies, up to viltrumite value
- Agree: Maverick_Zero_X, LephyrTheRevanchist
- Disagree:
- Neutral:
War Woman, Red Rush and Martian Man profiles were made out of nowhere
First, War Woman performs about the same as Immortal, if not a bit worse
Easily overpowered and borderline knocked out in that clip lol. I wouldn't mind leaving her stats as "Comparable to The Immortal"
Second, if I get it right Red Rush is rated like that as the current Omni-Man calc is really close to base Low 6-B and High 6-C+ is the next best for downscaling so I'm not sure where he would end up with this upgrade. I disagree he's that strong anyway, if he had anywhere near those stats he would've staggered and even beaten the Mauler Twins on his own instead of being relegated to evacuating civilians and only joining in when they're already being defeated, tho they are being affected by his attacks, so perhaps "Possibly 7-A" ? He doesn't really have showings besides the fight with Omni-Man, and that's more meant to showcase he's so fast he can progressively deal damage while being much weaker rather than him being anywhere close to Omni-Man
Third, I could see Martian Man measuring up Durability-wise but certainly not on AP lol, he would've joined in to attack Omni-Man if that was the case instead of acting like a rubber band, also, same deal as with Red Rush, he would've solo'd the operation if that was the case. Best I can think of is his tank throw is properly calculated for AP, and for his durability "At least High 6-A, likely far higher", if not outright the viltrumite value
On a secondary note, Allen and The Maulers got an "At least 7-A" over their fights with Mark. Allen should probably stay 7-A, since he's unquantifiably above Mark and Nolan thinks he's strong enough to take him at that point. The Maulers could get upgraded to High 7-A since they could draw blood from s2 Mark who should be significantly above his 7-A feat at this point (and the difference is less than 1.2x)
- Agree: Maverick_Zero_X, LephyrTheRevanchist
- Disagree:
- Neutral:
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